Tom Cleverley | 2012-14 Performances

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Doubt it. He's 25 soon and hasn't shown anything to suggest he'll make it here, don't think any manager coming in will change that. Should be sold to a lower half Prem side. A player more likely to interest LVG would be Powell.
 
Kostur said:
He's been very poor player for us, not just this season. Only time when he looked remotely good was when he played with Anderson in midfield ( what the feck ). Then it was averageness at it's best. If he wasn't a homegrown, local player then he would get his ass ripped just like Anderson. His biggest highlight of recent must be that street dancing really.

Having said that, I wish him good luck if he's really about to leave and hope he does well wherever he goes.

Edit: euphemismed a little there because some people were losing their shit.
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I think this is a very harsh and inaccurate assessment. I fully understand your reasoning, however. Cleverley is by no means a brilliant footballer, but every side needs squad players and that's the role that I'd want him to play next season. I disagree with your point about him only looking good next to Anderson. It can be debated for years which partner has seen the best out of him, but that doesn't mean he's not done well next to Carrick or whoever. Personally I would argue that his best partner was Carrick and that's largely down to the balance that's embedded between them. With Anderson, though they played attractive football, the defending from the pair was average at best and it contributed to our mediocre defending in 11/12. What should be mentioned is why he's gone from looking like a good player to someone who resembles a mediocre footballer, and I don't believe it has anything to do with who has partnered him. It's a mixture of lacking the ability to make a key contribution and the lack of short options available to him IMO.

Re Anderson: he's better than Cleverley on the ball, but IMO the reason he's received more criticism is because he's not fulfilled his potential. He's not improved on weak points such as defensive positioning whereas Cleverley has improved defensively from last season, for example. I personally think it's a myth that players like Welbeck and Cleverley receive less criticism because they're "local players". In his short time in the Premier League with us, he's had one promising season (don't know what else to label it), one good season, and one poor season. My opinion on Cleverley is simple. He's a good player, but he's not someone I'd want to see starting for us. If he showed the same form as the first half of 12/13 with a different partner (we need to replace Carrick) then why not, but currently he's mentally fragile. This is a good season for him to learn from and improve on weak points, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was sold. If he is sold to Everton, Martínez would probably get the best version of Cleverley, but I don't think that's solely down to the system they deploy. It would be down to less expectations and a manager who rates him at a high level mostly.
 
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Considering the reaction Everton Fans had to United's bids for their players last summer...I fully expect them to offer £26 million! for Tom.

Anything less and i will feel sick and disgusted. ;)
 
MoneyMay said:
I think this is a very harsh and inaccurate assessment. I fully understand your reasoning, however. Cleverley is by no means a brilliant footballer, but every side needs squad players and that's the role that I'd want him to play next season. I disagree with your point about him only looking good next to Anderson. It can be debated for years which partner has seen the best out of him, but that doesn't mean he's not done well next to Carrick or whoever. Personally I would argue that his best partner was Carrick and that's largely down to the balance that's embedded between them. With Anderson, though they played attractive football, the defending from the pair was average at best and it contributed to our mediocre defending in 11/12. What should be mentioned is why he's gone from looking like a good player to someone who resembles a mediocre footballer, and I don't believe it has anything to do with who has partnered him. It's a mixture of lacking the ability to make a key contribution and the lack of short options available to him IMO.

Re Anderson: he's better than Cleverley on the ball, but IMO the reason he's received more criticism is because he's not fulfilled his potential. He's not improved on weak points such as defensive positioning whereas Cleverley has improved defensively from last season, for example. I personally think it's a myth that players like Welbeck and Cleverley receive less criticism because they're "local players". In his short time in the Premier League with us, he's had one promising season (don't know what else to label it), one good season, and one poor season. My opinion on Cleverley is simple. He's a good player, but he's not someone I'd want to see starting for us. If he showed the same form as the first half of 12/13 with a different partner (we need to replace Carrick) then why not, but currently he's mentally fragile. This is a good season for him to learn from and improve on weak points, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was sold. If he is sold to Everton, Martínez would probably get the best version of Cleverley, but I don't think that's solely down to the system they deploy. It would be down to less expectations and a manager who rates him at a high level mostly.
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Good post.

I'd love to keep him though, as a squad player.
 
Apparently Everton want Cleverley and Welbeck in the summer. If i'm Woodward, i would tell Everton to feck off. I don't want either player to leave until a better manager gives them a chance, but if they really want to leave, Everton would be the last club i would sell to.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
I have a feeling Cleverley will shine under Giggsy. I can imagine Scholes and Butt be giving him some great advice in training too.
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We'll see if that will be the case. I think Cleverley will definitely play in a more confident manner than he has done, this season. Giggs and co. seem to really inspire our players and make them believe in themselves judging by what Giggs said in the press conference and on the pictures of our last training session.
 
I think a lot of these posts claiming they'd be sad to see him go, are because its Everton & Martinez that are after him. Same as when people get excited when we are interested in a young player and Arsenal are too. "Hmmm, if Wenger likes him, he must be good."

Let's face it, Cleverley isn't and never will be good enough for United.
 
Donut said:
I think a lot of these posts claiming they'd be sad to see him go, are because its Everton & Martinez that are after him. Same as when people get excited when we are interested in a young player and Arsenal are too. "Hmmm, if Wenger likes him, he must be good."

Let's face it, Cleverley isn't and never will be good enough for United.
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We will wait and see what he does under LVG. My personal opinion he is better than Jordan Henderson.
 
Reading back through my posts in this thread is like summing up the entire season! I think this season was a write off for much of our squad in terms of development. Seems like our Central Midfielders were instructed not to push forward (which we know Tom likes doing), you're trying to rewire a players natural instinct and I don't like that. So lets see what happens when we get a decent manager back, it's too early to write Tom off, I think he's shown glimpses that he can be a very good player for us if given proper instruction. It'd be interesting to see what Van Gaal would do with him for example.

Quoted my posts below.

1st September:
RedSky At Night said:
I agree with this, but I also think our movement at times is extremely static and doesn't help our CM's one bit. It's no surprise we looked better with Nani in the team, either way. CM imo wasn't the main issue, it's our terrible wingers and our tactics of trying to put crosses into the box against teams that can knock em out all day long. Play it on the floor ffs.
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RedSky At Night said:
The alternative argument is that both teams know that our wingers are so out of form, that they can allow our CM's to have room knowing that the wingers won't produce anything. Jones for example was continually in a position to cross the ball and the Chelsea CB's cleared everytime with ease. The same thing today.

It's easy to point the blame at the midfield, but if our wingers and forwards aren't moving and providing space then what exactly are they meant to do? Play a Gerrard Hollywood pass that may/may not come off? The one player that might be able to do that is left on the bench. The winger that imo would make things happen (Zaha) hasn't got a sniff. So therefore we're stuck with Young whos returning to fitness (and got unfair stick) and Giggs (who in a game of high pressure was pretty useless). We were basically relying on our fullbacks to do something.

It's shit tactics. I honestly haven't got a scoobies what our plan was. But this scapegoating of Cleverely is utter bullshit. It's Darren Fletcher all over again.
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RedSky At Night said:
Even the best Creative Midfielders will struggle if there is no movement up top Cina. It's easy to say "sign this player", it's not that simple. The players have to make the runs to free up space for the CM's to be able to make the passes.

It's one area I think Cleverley does need to improve though, his positioning can at times be a bit crap. He's fine when the ball is in midfield, but he struggles to open himself up for the pass when the balls with the CB's.
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RedSky At Night said:
I think Cleverley can be creative (as seen at the start of last season) but he's been told to sit in midfield which imo hampers his style. You're suggesting our play will improve if we sign a creative player to play alongside Carrick. I don't think it will because the issue is with the teams movement. We'll improve no doubt, but it's not a magic wand fix which the majority of the forum seems to think.

Fellaini for example will not solve this issue at all. But to throw shit at Cleverley and scapegoat him (not saying you are, but there are plenty who have been) is a bit laughable. It's exactly what happened when Fletcher broke through into the squad.

FYI, Hernandez is one of our best players when it comes to movement, second to Rooney imo. So it's no surprise we looked better with him in the team.
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12th November:
RedSky At Night said:
He's more disciplined but by doing that I think he's lost his edge somewhat. He's playing well though imo. Has a higher pass completion than Carrick this year. But it entirely depends on what job Dave has given him, if he's meant to be creating then he's not doing that great. But if he's meant to be disciplined and keeping the ball moving then he's doing very well.
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1st December:
RedSky At Night said:
Indeed, it's scary how similar it is.

I thought he was decent enough, played everything simple and kept the midfield ticking. I'd be interested to know if its instructions given to Cleverley to keep it all simple and play the percentages, or whether his confidence is just low.
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RedSky At Night said:
To be fair, that Sandro goal was utter class. Can't really pin blame on Clev for that imo, just a very good goal.

I just think the way our team is setup and the tactics we're using is making most of our attacking players look shit. Only Rooney and perhaps Carrick have had a run of good form so far this season. Our other attacking players have all really played below their normal standards. It's worrying.
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7th January:
RedSky At Night said:
He's tired, as LR7 said, Toms played far too many games over a crammed Christmas schedule.

He's been rested for one game since the Newcastle game which was the CL game when he came on the pitch anyway. So that's, 9 games started and 1 sub appearance in a month.
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RedSky At Night said:
He played his way into some form mid December, but imo the number of games have caught up with him. The problem for Cleverley is that he needs time and games and the right personal around him to perform at his best. In a team that's struggling with movement and confidence his game just doesn't work.

We just don't have anyone else available to fill the void with Jones being injured and Fletcher being slowly brought in to the squad. It's the one area we couldn't afford an injury crisis.
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I have a feeling Tom thinks he's some kind of spanish flavor in the team, he should really take a hard look at himself because his season along with his interviews have been an embarrassment. Home grown and all that, but he should go if he doesn't show any sign of progress in the next couple of months.
 
Hellboy said:
I have a feeling Tom thinks he's some kind of spanish flavor in the team, he should really take a hard look at himself because his season along with his interviews have been an embarrassment. Home grown and all that, but he should go if he doesn't show any sign of progress in the next couple of months.
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Disagree totally. He was playing to Daves tactics and did pretty well imo. Was way overused during December and was made the scapegoat by Dave himself (considering Clev was dropped and didn't play much after the Spurs game on the 1st Jan. Is it a coincidence that our form has been awful this year? Or perhaps that Cleverley was actually playing on the whole pretty well in central midfield and once removed from the equation our tiny bit of balance in the middle was removed?

I'm not suggesting he's a brilliant player, but I still think he and Carrick is currently our best midfield partnership. I wouldn't call his season embarrassing at all.
 
They are also looking for a long term successor to Mikel Arteta and Wenger wants to bring in a powerful player with a physical presence in midfield.

Wenger is also keeping tabs on Manchester United’s Tom Cleverley who is a target for Everton this summer but his future is now unclear with a new manager set to come in at Old Trafford.
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Mirror had this the other day. Give us Aaron, you can have Thomas.
 
Hellboy said:
I have a feeling Tom thinks he's some kind of spanish flavor in the team, he should really take a hard look at himself because his season along with his interviews have been an embarrassment. Home grown and all that, but he should go if he doesn't show any sign of progress in the next couple of months.
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You have a feeling..... good on you mate...
 
Stack said:
You have a feeling..... good on you mate...
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Cleverley has stated in interviews that he views his style of play as Spanish. However he's only adopted the sideways passing, not the intelligent movement or incisive through balls.
 
MoneyMay said:
I think this is a very harsh and inaccurate assessment. I fully understand your reasoning, however. Cleverley is by no means a brilliant footballer, but every side needs squad players and that's the role that I'd want him to play next season. I disagree with your point about him only looking good next to Anderson. It can be debated for years which partner has seen the best out of him, but that doesn't mean he's not done well next to Carrick or whoever. Personally I would argue that his best partner was Carrick and that's largely down to the balance that's embedded between them. With Anderson, though they played attractive football, the defending from the pair was average at best and it contributed to our mediocre defending in 11/12. What should be mentioned is why he's gone from looking like a good player to someone who resembles a mediocre footballer, and I don't believe it has anything to do with who has partnered him. It's a mixture of lacking the ability to make a key contribution and the lack of short options available to him IMO.

Re Anderson: he's better than Cleverley on the ball, but IMO the reason he's received more criticism is because he's not fulfilled his potential. He's not improved on weak points such as defensive positioning whereas Cleverley has improved defensively from last season, for example. I personally think it's a myth that players like Welbeck and Cleverley receive less criticism because they're "local players". In his short time in the Premier League with us, he's had one promising season (don't know what else to label it), one good season, and one poor season. My opinion on Cleverley is simple. He's a good player, but he's not someone I'd want to see starting for us. If he showed the same form as the first half of 12/13 with a different partner (we need to replace Carrick) then why not, but currently he's mentally fragile. This is a good season for him to learn from and improve on weak points, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was sold. If he is sold to Everton, Martínez would probably get the best version of Cleverley, but I don't think that's solely down to the system they deploy. It would be down to less expectations and a manager who rates him at a high level mostly.
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Good post......
 
I am laughed at when I claim he's technically one of our superior players, but just watch this video and tell me you cannot see bits of Scholes in him when he controls the ball on the turn to get into space.

 
If there's a manager that can salvage a top-level career out of Cleverely, its probably Martinez. He spoke of him very fondly when that petition circulated to have him banned from the England squad and he has a previous working relationship with him. He'd probably have the patience and interest in bedding him in and slowly rebuild his confidence so selling him to Everton might do the guy a world of good.

I can't see him getting many squad appearances next season either if Carrick, Fellaini & Fletcher end up being squad players after our summer business.
 
Ekeke said:
As if Everton would be willing to part with Barkley just to get a CM who isn't good enough to start for us.
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I didn't mean it in that way, more that we could use the opening to get talks going, plus £25M and Cleverley would be a decent deal for them.
 
Blue always red said:
I am laughed at when I claim he's technically one of our superior players, but just watch this video and tell me you cannot see bits of Scholes in him when he controls the ball on the turn to get into space.
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Perhaps now, under proper player management and some discipline, he'll make it. We can only hope.

Good vid and good point.
 
Devil may care said:
I didn't mean it in that way, more that we could use the opening to get talks going, plus £25M and Cleverley would be a decent deal for them.
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You'd take that if you were Everton chairman/manager would you?

I'd demand £40 million for Barkley. Once we cave, I'd offer £6 million for Cleverley
 
Ekeke said:
You'd take that if you were Everton chairman/manager would you?

I'd demand £40 million for Barkley. Once we cave, I'd offer £6 million for Cleverley
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Well you have to factor in a number of things, for starters how Martinez rates Cleverley and how their own deals are shaping up. If they can get Lukaku for £25M for example maybe a chance to do the deal the moment the season ends would be beneficial for them.

My guess is Barkley will stay another season at Everton in truth, but I was just shooting the shit.
 
I'd much rather he stay but if he is to leave then I hope he goes to Everton and proves what a very good player he is. This thread has been full of complete bollocks for most of this season. There were people questioning whether he was premier league player ffs.
 
Blue always red said:
I am laughed at when I claim he's technically one of our superior players, but just watch this video and tell me you cannot see bits of Scholes in him when he controls the ball on the turn to get into space.

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I think that Van Gaal won't be so eager to ship him out of the team. Pretty sure Cleverley will considerably improve after him, and while won't become ever a great player IMO, I expect that next season he'll be as good (or better) than in the previous season under Fergie.

Considering how you like Cleverley and adore United playing with wingers, you should be delighted if Van Gaal is chosen as our manager.
 
Poor performance this season though I've seen a few great games from him this season against Sunderland (A), Aston Villa (A), Arsenal (A) and Chelsea (H). But overall are just not good enough. However If Anderson got 5 seasons then why can't we give Cleverley another chance. They say midfield's fully potential is between 28-33 years old.
 
Blue always red said:
I am laughed at when I claim he's technically one of our superior players, but just watch this video and tell me you cannot see bits of Scholes in him when he controls the ball on the turn to get into space.

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I love Cleverley, and feel he still has a massive part to play in our team. Hope he stays.
 
Think he'll do well elsewhere, another victim of our style of play i think.
 
Revan said:
I think that Van Gaal won't be so eager to ship him out of the team. Pretty sure Cleverley will considerably improve after him, and while won't become ever a great player IMO, I expect that next season he'll be as good (or better) than in the previous season under Fergie.

Considering how you like Cleverley and adore United playing with wingers, you should be delighted if Van Gaal is chosen as our manager.
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I can only hope! I wouldn't be surprised if Giggs and the other lads get the full time role and I reckon they'd be all for a United team focussing on wing play. Either way, exciting times once again to be a United fan and not know what the future holds.
 
There's a good player there somewhere. His technique is fine, his passing is fine, he's pretty quick and has a good shot on him. On the other hand I don't think he's put anywhere near the effort into developing himself since his breakthrough. I would give him one more season, working under a manager like van Gaal could be a make or break for him and either he's going to fall off the radar altogether or improve himself greatly. Up to him.
 
Even our bad players had a few short streaks of good form here and there this season but Cleverley and Anderson are likely one of the very few who consistently disappointed and its not like he lacked opportunity to start the season either. Atleast Welbeck seems to like him though!
 
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