The vaccines | vaxxed boosted unvaxxed? New poll

[berbatrick]

Anyone has a detailed insight on what's going in the US with the restrictions regarding patents and is it hampering vaccine manufacturing in other parts of the world?

Also is it true that there are 40 mn AZ doses lying still in the US which they are never going to be using? If that's the case then they should export it to a country like India or the Covax initiative and let those who want to use them vaccinate their own people.

SII wanted to import raw materials for the Novavax vaccine, which they are planning to start manufacturing next month. US refused, so I don't know if they can make the vaccine. They said they don't need imports for the AZ vaccine, which is the only one they're making now.

And yes US is sitting on a few million AZ doses.

 

[christinaa]

Next Monday morning i'm due for my 2nd dose of the Moderna vaccine.

Anyone who had it - what am i to expect please?

 

[jojojo]

Anyone has a detailed insight on what's going in the US with the restrictions regarding patents and is it hampering vaccine manufacturing in other parts of the world?

Also is it true that there are 40 mn AZ doses lying still in the US which they are never going to be using? If that's the case then they should export it to a country like India or the Covax initiative and let those who want to use them vaccinate their own people.

I'm not sure if it's what you're thinking of, but there is a patent owned by the US government (the NIH to be precise) for a technique used to stabilise the spike proteins. Moderna, Pfizer, J&J and Novavax use it - AZ doesn't.

Is it hampering production? Not so far - and it's unlikely that it will be allowed to. There are various other patents owned by the individual companies but mostly the limit is manufacturing capacity/knowledge, and there's a lot of collaboration between companies underway.

The Defense Production Act is currently playing a bigger role with export bans on raw materials and manufacturing equipment as well as completed vaccines from the US. With the US approaching the "anyone can have a vaccine" point, they're expected to open the doors for exports soon. They do have AZ stockpiled and are likely to have surplus J&J and Novavax by Q3.

The worry would be if they immediately lock the doors again to produce autumn booster doses. Again, I'm hoping that they'll be confident enough about Moderna, Pfizer + an alternate (Novavax or J&J probably) to let all the stuff that those three companies don't need for US supply export freely again.

 

[Kasper]

Nice visual risk contextualization for the AZ vaccine regarding different age groups and different infection rate scenarios from EMA:

Annexto Vaxzevria Art.5.3 -Visual risk contextualisation

 

[jojojo]

Nice visual risk contextualization for the AZ vaccine regarding different age groups and different infection rate scenarios from EMA:

Annexto Vaxzevria Art.5.3 -Visual risk contextualisation

I'm a bit confused by those graphics. Am I correct in interpreting them as comparing covid deaths to VITT cases (rather than VITT deaths)? And similarly for covid ICU admissions v VITT cases?

Anyone know if that's because we don't yet have a trusted survival rate stat or is it something else?

 

[Kasper]

I'm a bit confused by those graphics. Am I correct in interpreting them as comparing covid deaths to VITT cases (rather than VITT deaths)? And similarly for covid ICU admissions v VITT cases?

Anyone know if that's because we don't yet have a trusted survival rate stat or is it something else?

Yes that's the only thing I wondered as well and I think they didn't segment it for the reason you mentioned.

 

[zing]

They said they don't need imports for the AZ vaccine, which is the only one they're making now.

What is the reason for supplies running out for AZ then? Seems pretty hard to get the AZ jab anywhere here in Chennai. Half the week the centres are turning people away. Quite stop start

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I'm a bit confused by those graphics. Am I correct in interpreting them as comparing covid deaths to VITT cases (rather than VITT deaths)? And similarly for covid ICU admissions v VITT cases?

Anyone know if that's because we don't yet have a trusted survival rate stat or is it something else?

I think that’s it.

Hospitalisations is the best/fairest comparison as every VITT case will end up in hospital.

 

[11101]

Nice visual risk contextualization for the AZ vaccine regarding different age groups and different infection rate scenarios from EMA:

Annexto Vaxzevria Art.5.3 -Visual risk contextualisation

That's a good document and perfectly illustrates the reasoning behind restricting the vaccine to the over 60s.

 

[jojojo]

What is the reason for supplies running out for AZ then? Seems pretty hard to get the AZ jab anywhere here in Chennai. Half the week the centres are turning people away. Quite stop start

SII are believed to producing around 60m doses per month. That's a lot, in one month they produce more than the total used by the UK and the EU so far (the UK plants produce about 8m doses/month in total for example)

In pandemic times though, and with India's current desperate need, it seems tiny. Increasing capacity relies on free flowing supply chains (which don't currently exist for some items) and increased supply of those raw materials/equipment. Increasing supply is very difficult. You can't just add a new supplier or order an existing company to make things faster. Plastic tubing for example might not sound specialised, but the absence of contaminants, resistance to leeching or degradation is not only different to achieve, it's tough to demonstrate.

It's agonising, but by any normal standards these companies have already produced better vaccines and ramped up far faster than seemed plausible a year ago.

 

[Striker10]

I do have to ask. When these thing usually occur and that have human testing - the persons paid. I'm wondering why anyone would have got one early and is it right that they didn't get paid even? It seems people taking a big risk but for what reward?

 

[jojojo]

I do have to ask. When these thing usually occur and that have human testing - the persons paid. I'm wondering why anyone would have got one early and is it right that they didn't get paid even? It seems people taking a big risk but for what reward?

To save their lives in the middle of a pandemic?

Take a look at UK deaths, how many more thousands would we have had without the vaccine rollout.

Personally I'm on a vaccine clinical trial. I was probably vaccinated in November. I was not paid to participate. The trials of that particular vaccine include around 60,000 people - and that numberstill wouldn't reveal the kind of problem we've seen on AZ since rollout. How many millions of people would you like to pay to see if any of them have adverse reactions?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

EU going all in with Pfizer.

The European Commission said it expects to seal the world’s biggest vaccine supply deal within days, securing up to 1.8 billion doses of Pfizer’s (PFE.N) COVID-19 vaccine for the next few years as a debate rages over unfair access to shots for the world’s poorest people.

The vaccines from the U.S. drugmaker and its German partner BioNTech would be delivered over 2021-2023, Commission President Ursula von der Leyen said during a visit to Pfizer's vaccine plant in Puurs, Belgium.

The agreement, which is to include 900 million optional doses, would be enough to inoculate the 450 million EU population for two years and comes as the bloc seeks to shore up long-term supplies.

Looks like lessons have been learned from being slow off the mark securing initial supplies (also looks like they’re making a point to AZ re spotty supplies over last fee months)

 

[jojojo]

EU going all in with Pfizer.



Looks like lessons have been learned from being slow off the mark securing initial supplies (also looks like they’re making a point to AZ re spotty supplies over last fee months)

I think even Pfizer Biontech must be surprised by how smoothly it's gone.

The other good news this week is that preliminary observations on taking the mRNA vaccines during pregnancy show that they look safe - for mother and baby. Still more data needed (9 months+ at least) but reassuring so far.

As standard, the advice had been that the vaccine was untested - so these are all women where the medical risk either outweighed any concern about the vaccine, or who didn't know they were pregnant, or became pregnant soon after getting the vaccine.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2104983

 

[jojojo]

An article for the enthusiasts. A not too techie insight into the problems of increasing vaccine supply globally and the reason why it's not as easy as just sharing the recipe.

https://endpts.com/as-fears-mount-over-jj-and-astrazeneca-novavax-enters-a-shaky-spotlight/

 

[Ødegaard]

Still no side-effects apart from the sore arm, which is fine now.
I am hoping my bloodsugar levels is down to the vaccine, but i'm certain it's just me getting diabetes.

 

[christinaa]

2nd dose of Moderna vaccine tomorrow morning.

Anyone who had it can tell us the side-effects encountered please?

 

[DM07]

SII wanted to import raw materials for the Novavax vaccine, which they are planning to start manufacturing next month. US refused, so I don't know if they can make the vaccine. They said they don't need imports for the AZ vaccine, which is the only one they're making now.

And yes US is sitting on a few million AZ doses.

I'm not sure if it's what you're thinking of, but there is a patent owned by the US government (the NIH to be precise) for a technique used to stabilise the spike proteins. Moderna, Pfizer, J&J and Novavax use it - AZ doesn't.

Is it hampering production? Not so far - and it's unlikely that it will be allowed to. There are various other patents owned by the individual companies but mostly the limit is manufacturing capacity/knowledge, and there's a lot of collaboration between companies underway.

The Defense Production Act is currently playing a bigger role with export bans on raw materials and manufacturing equipment as well as completed vaccines from the US. With the US approaching the "anyone can have a vaccine" point, they're expected to open the doors for exports soon. They do have AZ stockpiled and are likely to have surplus J&J and Novavax by Q3.

The worry would be if they immediately lock the doors again to produce autumn booster doses. Again, I'm hoping that they'll be confident enough about Moderna, Pfizer + an alternate (Novavax or J&J probably) to let all the stuff that those three companies don't need for US supply export freely again.

Thanks. Some part of the media in India seem to be suggestion that the US blocking the exports of this tech/raw materials is going to have a massive impact in the short term to India. But I see its another case of the Indian government messing up its vaccination policy. Novovax will anyway take a long time to start administering doses in India. What we need in the short term is to scale up the production of AZ/Covaxin and import as much as possible of the other leading vaccines from around the world.

 

[Snowjoe]

2nd dose of Moderna vaccine tomorrow morning.

Anyone who had it can tell us the side-effects encountered please?

The potential side effects will be the same as they potentially were for the first one. Whether you’ll experience them or not who knows, seems to be a toss up with all of them.

 

[zing]

Thanks. Some part of the media in India seem to be suggestion that the US blocking the exports of this tech/raw materials is going to have a massive impact in the short term to India. But I see its another case of the Indian government messing up its vaccination policy. Novovax will anyway take a long time to start administering doses in India. What we need in the short term is to scale up the production of AZ/Covaxin and import as much as possible of the other leading vaccines from around the world.

Novavax can start administering sooner than you think. It is being reviewed and expected to be approved soon in UK, I think.

 

[christinaa]

The potential side effects will be the same as they potentially were for the first one. Whether you’ll experience them or not who knows, seems to be a toss up with all of them.

Except for a hurting arm i had nothing else with the first one but i was told that the second can give you fever, chills headaches etc.

 

[golden_blunder]

Except for a hurting arm i had nothing else with the first one but i was told that the second can give you fever, chills headaches etc.

If you’re unlucky. No guarantee though so no point worrying about it

 

[Snowjoe]

Except for a hurting arm i had nothing else with the first one but i was told that the second can give you fever, chills headaches etc.

It can but the first one can do that too, seems a toss up, as @golden_blunder says nothing is guaranteed and I felt shocking after my first but was nothing a day in bed couldn’t fix

 

[christinaa]

If you’re unlucky. No guarantee though so no point worrying about it

It can but the first one can do that too, seems a toss up, as @golden_blunder says nothing is guaranteed and I felt shocking after my first but was nothing a day in bed couldn’t fix

Yes, you are both right.
Thank you for your replies.

 

[Dumbstar]

2nd dose of Moderna vaccine tomorrow morning.

Anyone who had it can tell us the side-effects encountered please?

You will be fully cured of this horrible disease. So you may naturally start humming Y.NWA.

 

[christinaa]

You will be fully cured of this horrible disease. So you may naturally start humming Y.NWA.

That's another disease so i leave it to you.

 

[Ajr]

Getting my vaccine on Thursday, I'm under 30 so surely should be Pfizer even though it's reserve list

 

[zing]

You will be fully cured of this horrible disease. So you may naturally start humming Y.NWA.

How’s your daughter doing?

 

[Dumbstar]

How’s your daughter doing?

She's better thanks. As the symptoms have been related to inflammation caused by the over active immune system I've been trying to get her to "eat" anti-inflammatories. So basically first fixing her gut with a good dose of fibre and cultures (Shreddies and Kefir for example). And supplementing with good quality omega 3 and vitamin D.

She's been able to go to school again in the last few months and even concentrate. Still gets headaches, fatigue, brain fog as well as other minor symptoms but more manageable now. No word from the long covid clinic that was supposed to contact us though. It's been 12 weeks.

 

[Grinner]

Can anyone explain to me why the vaccines have to be manufactured in those tiny little bottles? Surely with such demand that can do it in big jugs or whatever.

@Dumbstar it's good to hear that she is improving. I remember you being one of the first posters to mention problems early last year so it's been an awful slog for your family. Best of luck.

 

[Carolina Red]

Can anyone explain to me why the vaccines have to be manufactured in those tiny little bottles? Surely with such demand that can do it in big jugs or whatever.

I'd imagine it has something to do with the temperature the vaccine must be kept at. Too big of a vial and you'll have not used it all before it is too warm.

 

[Grinner]

I'd imagine it has something to do with the temperature the vaccine must be kept at. Too big of a vial and you'll have not used it all before it is too warm.

I'd guess it was more to do with being expensive to retool all of the machinery that is used to make that stuff. But yours sounds good too. But we are able to keep a pint of milk cold so you may be talking bollocks.

 

[Carolina Red]

I'd guess it was more to do with being expensive to retool all of the machinery that is used to make that stuff. But yours sounds good too. But we are able to keep a pint of milk cold so you may be talking bollocks.

I double checked with the spousal unit. She said the Covid vaccine has a 6 hour use window once opened so it’s in small vials to prevent wastage.

We definitely need to apply milk technology to our vaccines.

 

[Pexbo]

I double checked with the spousal unit. She said the Covid vaccine has a 6 hour use window once opened so it’s in small vials to prevent wastage.

We definitely need to apply milk technology to our vaccines.

 

[Grinner]

I double checked with the spousal unit. She said the Covid vaccine has a 6 hour use window once opened so it’s in small vials to prevent wastage.

We definitely need to apply milk technology to our vaccines.

Good stuff. Just thinking of billions of vials, syringes and whatnot. After Italy I'm feeling guilty about the crap level of recycling that goes on in the US.

 

[Dumbstar]

@Dumbstar it's good to hear that she is improving. I remember you being one of the first posters to mention problems early last year so it's been an awful slog for your family. Best of luck.

Thanks Grinner. And everyone else too. Being able to vent on here while picking up tips has helped that stressful journey.

 

[RoyH1]

My parents have finally had their second shot of Pfizer. No side effects except feeling very tired.
Words cannot describe how relieved I am. I’ve been living with an existential dread over the last year that I’d never be able to see them again. Now fingers crossed, it’s just a question of borders opening up again at one point.

 

[DM07]

Novavax can start administering sooner than you think. It is being reviewed and expected to be approved soon in UK, I think.

I wouldn't bet on it. The Indian government has some wierd obsession with only using made in India vaccines. So we have no pre orders for Pfizer, Moderna or any of the foreign manafactured vaccines. The two vaccines currently being used AZ and Covaxin are being manafactured locally. The other vaccine which has been granted approval is the Sputnik V from Russia but it will be manafactured locally in India and only then be used which will take another couple of months.

As far as Novovax is concerned, it's going to be manafactured by the same Serum Institute of India which is making the AZ vaccines and is already lagging behind on orders and overworked. So even if the vaccine is approved in the US/UK I expect atleast a timeline of two to three months before the vaccine can be administered in quantity in India.

 

[christinaa]

She's better thanks. As the symptoms have been related to inflammation caused by the over active immune system I've been trying to get her to "eat" anti-inflammatories. So basically first fixing her gut with a good dose of fibre and cultures (Shreddies and Kefir for example). And supplementing with good quality omega 3 and vitamin D.

She's been able to go to school again in the last few months and even concentrate. Still gets headaches, fatigue, brain fog as well as other minor symptoms but more manageable now. No word from the long covid clinic that was supposed to contact us though. It's been 12 weeks.

So sorry about that.
Hope she will be in order very soon.

 

[Raoul]