The Trump Presidency | Biden Inaugurated

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Carolina Red said:
One argument we get here is that there won't be any doctors if we go to single payer because they won't be able to get rich off of it.
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Of course there will be. It's a highly appealing profession. Around here doctors income have dwindled considerably and it's no longer a guaranteed job for life, yet it's still, by a wide margin the most competitive graduation to get.

I frequent some American doctors forums, so I know what the wages are like. In my specialty, I've seen plenty who make an yearly salary that is roughly 10-15 times what I will be making after residency, and many times with privileges such as 12 weeks of paid vacation. There is a lot of room for loss of income and it still being an incredibly rewarding profession.

As a resident I make €1350 per month, if you wan't to put that into context (of course that's meaningless without cost of life considerations - the mortgage of my comfortable two-bedroom apartment only costs 250 per month). If I double that when I become a consultant I'll be pretty happy, as I'm not even sure if it will be reachable.
 
Arruda said:
Also @MTF my explanation of how our NHS works isn't directly related to the post of yours I quoted, it was more because I got the perception that you were a bit puzzled about how can a system like this provide the same level of care for more people and still cost less. This is actually a situation where the "for everyone" solution is the better solution for everyone, to the point that even people who could afford a private insurance chose not to do so and keep their money for other things. Many people will indeed have private insurance, but they are usually there for the small stuff, i.e., to dodge waiting lists for simpler problems, etc, so they are a lot cheaper than what an insurance with full coverage for everything would cost. For serious illness, the sort that can bankrupt even a middle class family, people just use the public system.
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Your post was really good. I'm not opposed to a public health system. I'm always suspicious of waste and corruption in government run anything. I know that many health systems across western Europe work in a matter that seems satisfactory to most citizens.

I just come back to my original point that I don't want it to be a discussion around morality, because that can't possibly justify any of the necessary limitations to any system.
 
Ramshock said:
The last President who fired and pissed off intel heads got whacked...just sayin.
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Dulles was head of the CIA. Yes. He was behind what happened.

Comey is the head of the FBI.
Trump is safe in terms of his personal safety. So the similarities are only fleeting.

Think Trump will only be in serious trouble politically should the GOP lose the house.
 
Donovan_red7 said:
Another argument I've seen peddled is that single payer healthcare is basically resigning a doctor to a life of slavery :confused:

I really love America. Each time I went I always enjoyed it, and I always met loads of great people, but there's something wrong with the mentality of too many people in America when it comes to helping out others. I'm talking more on a bigger scale here. Not many things seem to really be about helping other people, all it ever seems to be about is money and maximizing profits. I know money is the most important thing to live in the world today, but there's something about America seems to drive that to new levels.

The best example of it is of course every time the healthcare topic comes up. "I can afford health insurance for me and my family, so balls to whoever can't."
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You're quite right, and it is depressing. So many times I've heard people ask "why should I pay for someone else's healthcare?" Which is infuriating on two levels... 1) because it's the right thing to do, because they're paying for yours too... and 2) I don't hear them complaining about paying for someone elses police, fire department, lifeguards (example used in the previous video), paramedics, roads, schools, etc. etc. It's the height of hypocrisy.
Arruda said:
Of course there will be. It's a highly appealing profession. Around here doctors income have dwindled considerably and it's no longer a guaranteed job for life, yet it's still, by a wide margin the most competitive graduation to get.

I frequent some American doctors forums, so I know what the wages are like. In my specialty, I've seen plenty who make an yearly salary that is roughly 10-15 times what I will be making after residency, and many times with privileges such as 12 weeks of paid vacation. There is a lot of room for loss of income and it still being an incredibly rewarding profession.

As a resident I make €1350 per month, if you wan't to put that into context (of course that's meaningless without cost of life considerations - the mortgage of my comfortable two-bedroom apartment only costs 250 per month). If I double that when I become a consultant I'll be pretty happy, as I'm not even sure if it will be reachable.
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People just seem to only look at the dollar signs here and think that there won't be people. Heck, if we convert to single payer, I ask this... Where are they going to flee to???

We're the only developed country in the world without a universal healthcare system. Where are they going to run to to practice medicine and still make 7 figure salaries? And if some do leave, by all means, you're welcome to come to SC!
 
One of the things I'm really starting to see and enjoy is that Trump by rallying his ignoramous loud mouth haters has ignited the opposition. I am starting to think that the tide has turned and while they individually shout louder. The general public even if they all just speak will drown out the shouts with an hurricane of voices.
 
Billy Blaggs said:
One of the things I'm really starting to see and enjoy is that Trump by rallying his ignoramous loud mouth haters has ignited the opposition. I am starting to think that the tide has turned and while they individually shout louder. The general public even if they all just speak will drown out the shouts with an hurricane of voices.
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Damn Billy. That's deep.
 
Carolina Red said:
You're quite right, and it is depressing. So many times I've heard people ask "why should I pay for someone else's healthcare?" Which is infuriating on two levels... 1) because it's the right thing to do, because they're paying for yours too... and 2) I don't hear them complaining about paying for someone elses police, fire department, lifeguards (example used in the previous video), paramedics, roads, schools, etc. etc. It's the height of hypocrisy.
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TBH, I don't think that's the height of hypocrisy. Hypocrisy yes but not the height.

The height of hypocrisy is that most people with such opinions consider themselves good Christians. In my book, that's the height of hypocrisy. Whenever I've asked this breed of Americans 'if alive, would Jesus had approved of your stance and why', I've never observed anything else than incoherent Twitler-like rambling, red faces, uneasy body language and a quick change of the subject.
 
Ubik said:
Was just about to post the vid:



It will genuinely be impressive if he manages to last four years without getting impeached, he's just an imbecile with no awareness of what he's saying and the implications.
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I wouldn't use the word impressive. It's appalling because it would show that the GOP is entirely morally bankrupt. All the checks and balances fail to work if a relevant portion of voters are stupid and deporable enough to give a party as corrupt and hypocritical as the GOP a majority in Congress and Senate.

Bannon and The Vlad were smart enough to figure that out a long time ago.
 
MTF said:
That gets into the tax simplification question too. I'd like everything to be just taxes and outlays. The cross subsidies I'm talking about is for example the fact that I'm mandated to have healthcare at risk of penalty, in order to make the entire business of insuring other higher risk people viable. And my employer gets a tax deduction for providing me part of that insurance, which makes it automatically the most viable option for all involved.

And to close this mess, I just mean: I'd rather face no incentives and restrictions when making my health insurance decisions, and the government straight pay from my takes for insurance or care for other people in need.
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Well, from what I can see, a single-payer (alternatively, NHS) model will be simple. I don't think there are any restrictions on you buying pvt insurance under either model. These will be on top of your access to healthcare via the government, and should get past whatever limits the govt system sets. I don't think there should be any regulations on pvt insurance companies if single-payer passes, but reading the bill there seems to be one- "no pvt company may sell coverage that duplicates that provided by the act."

The penalty, etc. comes in when you have a government mandate to go through private insurance, which is not what the current bill has proposed.
 
So he straight up said on national TV that he was firing him because of the 'russia trump stuff'?

Is that not a confession of premeditated obstruction of justice? It sounds like it to me.
 
Nogbadthebad said:
So he straight up said on national TV that he was firing him because of the 'russia trump stuff'?

Is that not a confession of premeditated obstruction of justice? It sounds like it to me.
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I'm beginning to wonder if he sees impeachment and a subsequent pardon as the only viable way out of this mess.
 
MTF said:
I can live with that. But then a person can't tell me that the problem with the current system is that it's immoral, because a capped public system is too. At some point someone will be left to die because of a cap... So my original point is simply, probably don't make this a discussion about morality. As you essentially said, perfect fairness and real world constraints don't go along.
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At what point does the NHS let sick people die, that other systems continue care? Serious question.
 
Pexbo said:
I'm beginning to wonder if he sees impeachment and a subsequent pardon as the only viable way out of this mess.
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I think you give him too much credit.

I think hes just a fecking moron who does not understand the consequences of saying any of these things, because he has grown up in a life of privilege, reaching the age of 70 without anything he says ever having consequences before.
 
That fat cow Sarah Huckabee Sanders might be the stupidest person I've seen in any semi important position.
 
Wednesday at Stoke said:
That fat cow Sarah Huckabee Sanders might be the stupidest person I've seen in any semi important position.
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She reminds me of an actress and I can't quite put my finger on who. Maybe SNL is just blurring the lines too much.
 
Nogbadthebad said:
I think you give him too much credit.

I think hes just a fecking moron who does not understand the consequences of saying any of these things, because he has grown up in a life of privilege, reaching the age of 70 without anything he says ever having consequences before.
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But it also puts the US governmental system under the harshest of tests. Because unless he gets impeached now, he's just proven a president CAN say whatever they like regardless of laws, rules or protocol.
 
@Wednesday at Stoke

For sure she's one of the most poorly dressed people of the administration. Given that Twitler ordered Spicey to buy a nicer suit after his first briefings, it's amazing that she's still showing up in dreadful outfits.
 
I'd heard the headline point, but I'd never read the whole thing until today. My god this is terrifying..

Trump to Time reporters said:
On his first use of force and empowering his generals
I’ve been doing this, in all fairness, when I first came into the office, the first night. You weren’t here.

But they say sir, we’re ready to go. I said where? They had some people in a certain country, Yemen, where they had them [surveilled] and they needed the go ahead to kill, to kill them.

But in other words they wanted the right to go. So they’re telling me this. And this happened for two or three weeks, four weeks. And they keep coming to me, at weird times too. I don’t care about that.

And they’re in parts of the world that most people have never even heard about. They were in cities that nobody every heard about or towns. And in some cases they’re ISIS or al-Qaeda. And so they say sir, we have a situation we’d like to be able to go and they tell me what.

Then after about four or five weeks I said wait a minute. By the time they get to me, and I get back to them, usually it’s over anyway, it’s gone, they’re gone. They couldn’t fire. You know under the Obama Administration they get back to them three or four weeks later and say it’s okay to go. They say okay to go, they left three weeks ago.

So I said to myself, I’m a believer in professionals, these people over there, whether it’s in Iraq or in Yemen or anywhere, Libya, they went to West Point, or wherever. Annapolis, they went to Air Force Academy.

I said to the general, I said how good. … The lieutenants, the captains, their majors, their colonels, they’re professionals. They love doing it, they know every inch of the territory, right. I say why am I telling them? So I authorized the generals to do the fighting. You know.
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http://time.com/4775040/donald-trump-time-interview-being-president/

So the US military are now authorized to perform kill missions without White House oversight. That's probably the most frightening thing that has happened so far under this imbecile. :eek:
 
langster said:


Such a control freak. I really cannot stand this shit anymore, he's just SO corrupt it's taking the piss.
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You know on the West Wing, Designated Survivor etc, programmes like that, where they show the behind the scenes action of everyone working hard trying to find a solution to some problem, brainstorming, and having flashes of inspiration that save the day?

This is like the Evil version of all that.
 
Oohh, this could be interesting..
State AGs representing nearly 150 million Americans demand independent Russia probe

Following Donald Trump's sudden firing of FBI Director James Comey in the middle of the investigation into Russian election interference, 20 state attorneys general — who together represent nearly half the country — have signed a public letter to the deputy U.S. attorney general to urge the appointment of a special counsel.
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http://shareblue.com/state-ags-repr...on-americans-demand-independent-russia-probe/
 
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