The Sunday Herald with Ronaldinho doing alot of talking about United...

Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

If he's that good then why not? Ronaldo is often injured. Raul isn't always on top form.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Ronaldinho cannot replace Ronaldo because they are two complete different players. Now if Ronaldinho will have to come to Madrid he will play either instead of Zidane or Raul soooo you dont need much brains to understand why hes not going to Real
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

If he's that good then why not? Ronaldo is often injured. Raul isn't always on top form.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Ronaldo-Raul partnership is probably the best strike partnership in the world.So Real would not feck around too much with that.Do we have the
striking partner (like Raul) to RVN?
 
Originally posted by VanNistlerater:
<strong>This is a decent debate and Weaste puts across a good argument, but, i believe Ronaldinho would benefit the team.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I'm fighting a losing battle, I'm all on my own. ;)

I like him as a player, he's very talented, but I'm just trying to address some of the worries and other questions/issues involved in him signing for us.
 
Originally posted by vijay_vr:
<strong>
Ronaldo-Raul partnership is probably the best strike partnership in the world.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Is it? Why?

They are two of the best forwards in the world when on form, but it doesn't mean that the majority of their goals come from an interchange of play between them. That's what a partnership is isn't it? An interchange of supporting play.

Between them they have scored 32 league goals this season. Ruud and Ole together have scored 34. Ruud and Scholes 39.
 
Originally posted by Spoony:
<strong>If the Gaffer wants him, thats good enough for me(us). Agreed?</strong><hr></blockquote>

Agreed, but we do not yet know if he does or not.
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

Agreed, but we do not yet know if he does or not.</strong><hr></blockquote>

no they request a meeting to talk about the weather
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

Agreed, but we do not yet know if he does or not.</strong><hr></blockquote>

He does. OK, I'll bet you that we sign him. K?
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

Is it? Why?

They are two of the best forwards in the world when on form, but it doesn't mean that the majority of their goals come from an interchange of play between them. That's what a partnership is isn't it? An interchange of supporting play.

Between them they have scored 32 league goals this season. Ruud and Ole together have scored 34. Ruud and Scholes 39.</strong><hr></blockquote>


So you mean to say that Ronaldo-Raul is not as good as Ruud and Scholes?
 
if we had a real link man then we would have been probably better than them. Personally i prefer RVN over Ronaldo
 
Originally posted by vijay_vr:
<strong>


So you mean to say that Ronaldo-Raul is not as good as Ruud and Scholes?</strong><hr></blockquote>

In terms of goals they are not, no.

But I was trying to point out to you that neither might necessarily be an effective partnership.

It would be interesting to know if anyone kept stats on partnerships, and not just one assisting the other either for goals, it's more complex than that, movement comes into it, drawing defenders off as well, etc. Does anyone know if such a system for rathing forward partnerships exists and if so does anyone collect statistcal data?
 
Originally posted by ShAoLiN_ChRoNiC:
<strong>what the heck are you guys even arguing about?

No one questioned ronaldinhos ability.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Whether he is the best signing option for us, and if so, why, and then how we would use him and how often, and whether SAF can control him, and if not why not, and then would the whole thing be a distaster or not. That type of thing. ;)
 
SAF did say he wants to strengthen United's defence. We have just been linked with Lucio. If we do get him, it would ruin the chance of Ronaldinho becoming the first Brazilian to play for United.
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

How can you say that he is? You are just making statements, you are not providing an argument. He's better than Scholes, he's the best for us. These are not arguments, they are unargued blunt statements.

Think about it! Give me an example of why you think that he is b etter than Aimar for example, or choose somebody else for that matter.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Am not comparing Ronaldinho with Zidane or Aimar.
But he is better than Scholes.I've already given the explanation.When Scholes recieves the ball in the middle he will spin around and will either try to pass or shoot.He is not the creative type capable of pinging the balls across the pitch.He lacks the flair and is capable of only playing to a particular system.But Ronaldinho has the ability to hold and carry the ball as well as to create chances.It makes alot difference in unsettling the opposition. Withdrawn striker is the player who is drifted out of the game for long periods... still he should produce something out of nothing.As Scholes is more busy he gets lost.Only few players Zidane Rivaldo Aimar..have the talent and Scholes is not in their league.
 
simple formula

Scholes is a better midfielder

Ronaldinho is a better link man


ending of story
 
so why are you comparing ruud + scholes to raul and ronnie?

its pretty clear if you ask me. behind an experienced defender, a goalkeeper and an alternative to Ruud (3 priorty positions IMO), he would probably be the priority.

i.e. an attacking player who gives the team another dimension, more options, backup and unpredictability. combined with pace, intelligence and raw skill.

never a bad thing if you ask me. he is definitely a player we could use for those reasons. its not even an argument if you ask me, we can use this kind of player.

and since we can use this kind of player, Ronaldinho suits better than most in the world right now.
 
Originally posted by vijay_vr:
<strong>
Weaste is questioning...</strong><hr></blockquote>

I am, in an attempt to get people's reasons for their views about signing him rather than simple fleeting statements about how good he is and who he is better than. Unfortunately, that is normally all you get on these forums. There is often very little reasoned argument.
 
i see where the problems are: who is better than who.

that is for the manager to decide, but a strong team should look to strengthen further.

the team lacks certain things i mentioned in my last post, Ronaldhinho can add some of those things. What more reason do you need? Its a squad game folks. different games require different players.
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

I am, in an attempt to get people's reasons for their views about signing him rather than simple fleeting statements about how good he is and who he is better than. Unfortunately, that is normally all you get on these forums. There is often very little reasoned argument.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I've given you the explanation.Are they simple fleeting statements?But can you give any possible explanation why Scholes is better than Ronaldinho
(apart from goals)?
 
Originally posted by ShAoLiN_ChRoNiC:
<strong>never a bad thing if you ask me. he is definitely a player we could use for those reasons. its not even an argument if you ask me, we can use this kind of player.

and since we can use this kind of player, Ronaldinho suits better than most in the world right now.</strong><hr></blockquote>

But this is my point, why do you think he suits better than most? Better than who?

And on your first point, you are only looking at the player, you also need to look at the team. How do you know that he would fit in? If he would, where, why him, who would be dropped, would he be used all of the time.

People never give their reasons.
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

I am, in an attempt to get people's reasons for their views about signing him rather than simple fleeting statements about how good he is and who he is better than. Unfortunately, that is normally all you get on these forums. There is often very little reasoned argument.</strong><hr></blockquote>

just browsing the thread most people have answered your questions
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

But this is my point, why do you think he suits better than most? Better than who?

And on your first point, you are only looking at the player, you also need to look at the team. How do you know that he would fit in? If he would, where, why him, who would be dropped, would he be used all of the time.

People never give their reasons.</strong><hr></blockquote>
We have given you enough reasons.But You are asking the same questions again and again?
 
Our team lacks someone who can run at defences with the ball, deliver killing balls in tight spaces, create magic out of nothing.

Now there are only a handful of players who can do all this and you have to admit, it is something our team lacks i.e. a potential weakness.

Ronaldinho is one of the few players in the world right now who can do these things. coupled with him being young and versatile...he is practically ideal.

i am not looking at the first 11, i am looking at the squad and at the options at our disposal. who he replaces, where he pays etc is down to fergie. but he will fight for his place just like anyone else, he will play if he wins.

bottom line: he has something we could use therefore he could strengthen our squad. no argument.
 
Originally posted by nickm:
<strong>No doubts, he's on the way. Do I worry about whether he can fit in? No! If he's talented, we - and he - will adapt to each other.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I do not mean everybody, but that is an example of three fleeting statements that have no meaning at all.

Take the first one. From reading a newspaper article psoted on an internet forum he has "No doubts, he's on his way". Yet he doesn't even know if SAF has him as his primary target, it's all speculation.

So, I'm trying to get some people to think a little bit more about why they have the views that they have, rather than just having them because it's an opinion. Opinions are based on reason and thought, not just plucked out of thin air.

It makes this forum a more interesting place when debate is engaged in. A little bit of questioning is a good thing.
 
Originally posted by Spoony:
<strong>Weaste, SAF WANTS HIM. So that should be GOOD ENOUGH for you.</strong><hr></blockquote>

You DONT KNOW that!
 
To be honest, he might not even leave PSG! Their coach did say that he is going to everything he can to stop him from leaving.
 
Originally posted by vijay_vr:
<strong>
We have given you enough reasons.But You are asking the same questions again and again?</strong><hr></blockquote>

No I'm not. I'm counter arguing.

A) He's good.
B) He's a natural linkman.
C) He's better at it than Scholes.
D) He's the best option for us.

Are not reasons!

You said Ronaldo and Raul are the best forward partnership in the world, but you cannot back it up can you? If you can, please do. It's this type of fleeting statement I'm trying to get you to address, and maybe think again about what you are saying. <img src="graemlins/smirk.gif" border="0" alt="[Smirk]" />
 
in a way weaste i agree with you, everyone elses argument doesnt really add up. i think they are off track and getting it wrong.

i only agree with my argument in this thread. its quite obvious to me actually....are you just playing devils advocate?
 
Originally posted by Spoony:
<strong>


Wanna bet?</strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />
 
Originally posted by ShAoLiN_ChRoNiC:
<strong>in a way weaste i agree with you, everyone elses argument doesnt really add up. i think they are off track and getting it wrong.

i only agree with my argument in this thread. its quite obvious to me actually....are you just playing devils advocate?</strong><hr></blockquote>

you have just repeated what about 5 other posters have already said in this thread
 
Originally posted by vijay_vr:
<strong>
But you havent answered my question.Why Scholes is better than Ronnie?</strong><hr></blockquote>

That's the point, I never said Scholes was better. All I pointed out was that Scholes has scored more goals in a far harder league than Ronaldihno has this season.

You on the other hand STATED in a fleeting way that Ronadinho is better that Scholes.

Do you see the difference?
 
Originally posted by WeasteDevil:
<strong>

No I'm not. I'm counter arguing.

A) He's good.
B) He's a natural linkman.
C) He's better at it than Scholes.
D) He's the best option for us.

Are not reasons!

</strong><hr></blockquote>
Read contents of 2nd and 3rd pages again..every possible explanation is given.
 
Originally posted by vijay_vr:
<strong>
Read contents of 2nd and 3rd pages again..every possible explanation is given.</strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laugh Out Loud]" />

Only after I dragged them out of you. :rolleyes:

And some of the reasons provide more questions than answers.
 
Originally posted by RUDDY:
<strong>

you have just repeated what about 5 other posters have already said in this thread</strong><hr></blockquote>

no i didnt. everyone is saying he is a great player and is a better link man than scholes and so we should get him in that hole no matter what.

i am saying our squad lacks certain qualities and he addresses that. i am also saying Scholes is a great link man and we dont NEED Ronaldinho in the hole. Ronnie will add to the squad and give variety in the starting 11. I wouldnt put him as our number one link man.

quite different if you ask me....
 
Originally posted by ShAoLiN_ChRoNiC:
<strong>

no i didnt. everyone is saying he is a great player and is a better link man than scholes and so we should get him in that hole no matter what.

i am saying our squad lacks certain qualities and he addresses that. i am also saying Scholes is a great link man and we dont NEED Ronaldinho in the hole. Ronnie will add to the squad and give variety in the starting 11. I wouldnt put him as our number one link man.

quite different if you ask me....</strong><hr></blockquote>

no most people have already said most of what you posted on page 2

its weaste making the scholes comparison