I think it's because of the way we've fallen since SAF retired and that spurs fans can compare and boast at their achievements.
Which is strange because I know a couple of spurs fans personally, and they are more like @africanspur or @balaks
The Spurs thread | 2016-2017 season | Serious thread - wummers/derailers will be threadbanned
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I think it's because of the way we've fallen since SAF retired and that spurs fans can compare and boast at their achievements.
Which is strange because I know a couple of spurs fans personally, and they are more like @africanspur or @balaks
Yeah it's funny that some posters here don't like the arrogance of some of the Spurs fans on this board.
The opposite can be found when Spurs fans hang around other Spurs fans because I find some to be such annoyingly pessimistic downers.
It's not funny, it's just normal.
We have a huge share of pessimistic United fans on the caf as well
True. It just bothers me that some seem to never want to enjoy a good thing while they have it.It's not funny, it's just normal.
We have a huge share of pessimistic United fans on the caf as well
Could it go tits up for us? Absolutely, but even that's not a guarantee. But I for one will not worry about that and ruin the good thing we have right now.
I guarantee that somewhere in the world there is a Spurs fan who is still furious we sacked Tim Sherwood. You get crazies in every place.
I'll happily admit it's not been easy to adjust to the fact that Spurs are currently in a better place than United. The club we've laughed at for years for being serial bottlers ffs, it's fecking painful. Now look at most of our pathetic bunch of players.
How well do spurs pay their players in comparison to the other big sides? If they really want to step up and stay there then they need higher profile signings which come with minimum £200,000 a week wage demands.
Dembele just oozes class.
Do we though? We are doing very well right now without having to do that. I think we could do that in the future but not before the stadium is finished.
I'm talking about a sustained period of winning the league/doing well in Europe. The rich clubs of the league will still attract bigger players thus making spurs job even harder in terms of consistency. As excellent as the coaching staff are, it's hard to compete against $ at the end of the day. Normality is already restored in Spain after Athleticos relatively small period of success, and I feel if spurs don't win the league soon, they'll still be seen as a club not capable of sustained success and deemed not the best choice for players to join, particularly on lower wages.
We will never be a club with the resources of the likes of Utd, Chelsea, City, etc. it's just not possible for us. We are in a position of great overachievement and that has been down to excellent recruitment and a top class manager - we can improve and grow as a club but it will be a gradual process over many years - much in the way we have improved in the past 3 years. We could win the league with this team - we couldnt win the champions league - could we become the type of club that could win a champions league? Maybe in about 5-10 years yeah but we are in a totally different position to the other clubs around us which makes what we do achieve put into perspective.
Agree with what you say, but if you look at some of the teams that win the Champions league it's not impossible
A cup competition can always be unpredictable, and the chances of winning a cup including Real Madrid and Barcelona is a lot more realistic than winning a league that includes those teams imo. Won't happen though.I guarantee that somewhere in the world there is a United fan who is still furious we sacked LVG/appointed Jose. You get crazies in every place.
Their biggest problem will be keeping their existing players, they won't be competing with United, City & Chelsea for players not for the foreseeable future. The majority of that Spurs team would earn a lot more money playing elsewhere, there's a lot of teams around Europe who will be sniffing around those players although I think its more likely they'd lose players to domestic rivals as European clubs will be put off by the transfers fees Levy quotes. If Spurs can keep everyone and add some quality this summer I'd expect them to go very close on winning the league, the problem is if the Wembley moves goes ahead, I think it will cost them too many points.
That's not an option for us, not with a new stadium to pay for and not with the wage hike demands across the squad that would come with suddenly paying a top whack of £200k.
So we'll continue along the path that's served us well in recent years: youth development (the academy and the signing of young prospects from elsewhere), squad continuity (largely keeping the same group together, with relatively little squad churn) and reliance on the coaching and team-bonding skills of Pochettino and his assistants.
I said last summer that the young average of the squad would likely mean a general improvement, and although many said it wouldn't be enough for top 4 (as I recall, around 75% of the vote on here just before the season began), so far the sceptics have been proved wrong.
What we've been doing we can continue to do. The biggest risk is that Pochettino decides to leave, although from what he's said it seems he's keen on building a dynasty at Spurs.
I think the risk is more like with Arsenal, that your players could start asking why they aren't getting top level wages for putting in top level performances.
I'm under know illusions about big clubs and big money but we're seeing more and more that big wages don't mean success. Look at Liverpool. Quotes from probably are most senior player, Lloris, has stated "his future is with Poch. That's a refreshing thought there are no "u never knows" or "anything can happen in football". That coupled with the fact that just this season we have tied all of our "stars" down to new contracts would show that the rest of the squad feel the same.
Kane, Alli et all will be well aware bigger clubs want them. Next season is massive, if we can get through the Wembley season that will help the team and then move into our new home hopefully players will content. The fact we are in London IMO also helps. Saying all that I'm not stupid I'm sure we will be tested but one thing I do know as fact is Levy won't sell a player who doesn't want to go and if one or 2 do force a move Levy will fleece every last penny out of the move.
That's a little to simplistic, Arsenal for the last good number of season have been treading water. No real sign of the title or CL. Poch's project is only 2-3 seasons in and constantly improving. Of course if we don't start winning something players will start asking questions but we have a good number of seasons before the atmosphere at Spurs is as toxic as it is at Arsenal.
Not sure, but your team needs better players. If the whole team on its best day was filled to the brim with players of the Kane, Alli, Aldewereld standard then you guys would be fighting for the CL with the coach you guys have.
Poch is clearly a talented manager and Spurs are profiting from that. He has made them a well-drilled side that looks stable and consistent. Their European campaigns were very underwhelming though.
That's what was said pre-season last summer, when our top 4 chances were written off. But even aside from Kane, Alli and Alderweireld, there are not many players who are better than Lloris, Walker, Rose and Eriksen in their respective positions/roles (this already amounts to 7 players in our best XI). And those who are (or might be) are quite simply way out of our current price range.
Then there is Wanyama, Dier, Vertonghen and Song, all of them lot more than just decent, along with talented youngsters like Winks now emerging and probably Marcus Edwards being also added to the first team squad next season. Plus Lamela to return, I hope, following his hip operation.
It's true we've under-performed in Europe, but it looks like we'll get another crack at it. With another spell of Pochettino's coaching under their belts, and the experience gained thus far, we can hope to do ourselves justice this next time around ... provided we can adjust better to having to play at Wembley.
Yeah, but could we do a Dortmund model with a higher wage structure and therefore a better chance of keeping players? I would think we could.
Attract the best young talents with the knowledge that Poch will play and improve you and therefore improve the team. It can be done - we can go for the Naby Keitas rather than the Paul Pogbas and get some sustained success.
Is there a team in this league who doesn't?
If you were then to grade that on a scale considering all the teams in the league where would Spurs fall on that scale?
Food for thought.
They could, but they keep signing new long term deals.
Levy's new strategy of consistent raises appears to be working well. The players stay happy knowing if they perform they'll incrementally constantly improve their wages and Levy stays happy knowing he gets to maintain contractual control.
What great success have we seen at Liverpool?
I really like what Spurs are doing, especially with the English lads, but you have to put some cold perspective on things - the club needs some silverwear or it runs the risk of being another present day Arsenal.
I think a domestic trophy this season would do them the world of good going into the summer and with the talent in the squad is to be expected.
The issue will appear if they continue to not win anything, despite hovering around the top 4 for a while. Players will move on no two ways about it.
As great as it would be to win a trophy, continual improvement, and showing more consistency than many of the other top 6 clubs is also worth something. It's not like we are competing with the most expensive players around who chase 200k a week anyway, and for most players around we will be able to continue to attract good players, and I think we're going into this summer in a better position than in a very long time to attract good players (and also keep our current ones). Arsenals issues aren't that they didn't win anything imo, but rather a mentality that has crept into the club, and a certain soft mentality that we seem to be moving away from (I hope).
Winning is nice though, by all means!
While those players might look like all that in the premiership scale, in the bigger scheme of things they aren't hence why you'll struggle in Europe. The standards at the top end of the European game are too high and teams are too well coached for them to flourish there. Any weakness will be exposed, as they have been.
Wanyama, Eriksen, Lamela, Son will not be playing staring roles in the CL. Whats more is as a team, Spurs is inherently an attacking team so you wont exactly go in there and do a Atl Madrid, Juventus or Leicester. You're going to need better talent in order to shake up the status quo cause i have no doubt poch is good enough to have a huge impact in the competition.
Personally i though spurs will win the league this season with some smart additions but that didn't suffice. Poch might be great, but he's no miracle worker and another year under his tutelage isn't taking this side up another few levels.
There's a reason teams in this league struggle in the CL, and that;s cause they aren't all that. Heck, last season we saw Leicester walk the league. The standards aren't all that high despite all this best league in the world talk. Being concerned about what everyone else is doing isn't going to take spurs forward. Food for thought.
Fair point, English teams got a lot to prove in Europe next season, Spurs included.
I think you might be talking utter bollocks mate.
You're questioning us defensively even though we're the best in the league. A little odd that.
Where did i question you guys defensively?
The proof is in the pudding. You guys have done nothing of note in the CL. The thing is the prem is some kind of cocoon and everyone in it acts like there isn't anything outside of it. Every top English club should be looking at themselves from a European perspective imo.
"inherently an attacking team you won't exactly do a Juventus, At. Madrid or Leicester".
That's definitely questioning us defensively.
Either way we're obviously going into every summer looking to improve the squad and therefore improve our play in Europe.
Sort of a silly argument as a whole.
Not to mention the sudden argument from a United fan that performance in European competition is suddenly the be all and end all hasn't exactly gone over my head.
No, that's me saying you guys are an attacking team, not a pragmatic one like Juventus, Atletico and leceister(Juve less so than the others). You guys try to take the lead in games by imposing your style with the ball, not by soaking up pressure and hitting on the break which is what those teams can do well. Just because a team is a attacking one doesnt mean they concede goals or have a leaky defence. Bayern don't go around conceding goals all willy nilly yet would you call them a pragmatic side?
True, not exactly sure why you did turn it into an arguement. Spurs tried the same thing last summer and only wanyama improved the squad. This will be an opportunity missed if you guys repeat the same mistakes in the market cause your team isnt good enough not to make signifcant improvements.
Perhaps its because of the difference in stature of the clubs we support that you think what im saying is strange but the truth is every big club(which i'm guessing is what spurs aspire to be) aims to great on a continetal scale. Being the best in the prem is great, but being elite in europe is true greatness. We had that for a very long time, competing with other giants of world football. Thats why, as a club we're such a massive entity.
Even for a club like Spurs that tries to grow organically its not out of the realms of reality. Atl Madrid grow exponentially every year due to their exploits in Europe. If spurs were to do the same, especially cause of the fact that its a premiership club, sooner rather than later you guys might be able to call yourselves the biggest club in north London.
I guess, but I'm not really worried about "big club" labels or making marquee signings. In fact that's exactly what I hope we avoid. I'm hoping we sign a few more young players this summer and keep on keeping on.
Last year for example myself and other Spurs supporters pointed out that regardless of summer signings we would improve based simply on the age of the players and Pochettino's ability to improve them. We were laughed at and derided and last year's results were chalked up to the rest of the league underperforming rather than Spurs doing anything well. This year comes around and what have we seen? A somewhat lacklustre summer - Wanyama is immense, I still believe in Janssen, and Nkoudou and Sissoko may be headed for an early visit to the trash heap. Yet we continued our performance from last year and improved. Winks has come in and done well and hopefully he recovers well from his injury and possibly cements a first team place. I also wouldn't be surprised to see more from academy products like Marcus Edwards, Cameron Carter-Vickers, and Kyle Walker-Peters. These players are the most important to me imo. They build the mentality of the squad, they are the drivers for the badge and not the name on the shirt, they build a level of accountability in the locker room.
In my personal opinion I think you're looking at Spurs through a Manchester United lens. You're thinking about how you'd improve this squad if it was the United squad, but that's not how we're going to do things. The entire club is going through a process of slow and steady progression. We're building the infrastructure, building the squad, and building the mentality. It can't all be achieved in one summer through signings and in my opinion I think we're doing it the right way for what we have and where we come from.
What I want to see is us to develop a model where we can build towards continued growth and sustained success and through it I hope to see us lift some trophies - similar to the Dortmund model perhaps. Whether we're considered a "big club" or whatever is totally immaterial and it's something that holds absolutely no importance to me - it's something football fans seem to enjoy bickering about even though it has no real value.
You hope your club avoids being a big club? then what's the point?
In order to have sustained success then you're going to have to be a big club. There is no middle of the road club out there that has any sort of sustained success, not at this level anyways.
Yeah but these improvments arent all that great. With the other clubs in the prem so desperate for success moving slowly wont be the answer. Another thing is without success, keeping key players responsible for this successful period will be harder and harder if the club doesnt move quickly. Heck, even the manager would end up frustrated given just how ambitious he sounds.
Young players can also be marquee signings. By signing Rooney in the early 00's we sealed one of the positions in our attack for over a decade. Look what Hazard has already managed to achieve at Chelsea, and he's going to keep going.
I'm not saying go into the market, throw huge money on expensive, yet not so good players like we and city do. just use all the transfer windows correctly and elivate the level of the squad. Juve seem able to do it. They are better than us and city at a fraction of the cost. Even Bayern aren't in the market wasting all their financial resources on middle of the road, high priced players.
I'm saying the club should go into the market and make the right signings to lift the level of the squad a notch or two. whether the said players are big signings or young signings is irrelevant. just as long as they are the right ones. Dele Alli is a huge player in the league and he was cheap. We spent a fortune on Martial and he isn't as good atm. Do what the squad needs to move up. Look, janssen plus Sissoko is massive money, so would it be all that odd to suggest that if you guys perhaps needed the final piece of the jigsaw you can afford it?
If Spurs have improved by signing one quality player, imagine how much the club would've improved if the rest of the signings weren't duds.
Probably unpopular here but I actually like Spurs and I'm pleased they're doing well. They're a club with history, a really good manager and they've assembled a really good well-balanced and exciting side the 'right way'. There's nothing to not like about them for me - we arent a London club so we have no bitter rivalry with them.
I'd much rather see them doing well than anyone else in that top 4/5.
I'd much rather see them doing well than anyone else in that top 4/5.
I think you'll find the vast majority of United fans will agree despite the constant wumming from the sudden influx of Spurs fans that have decided to grace the forum - glory hunters eh?
On topic though Spurs need to deliver success. One, to keep their players happy and two, to really utilise the squad they have at the moment.
Continuing to win nothing other than top 4 shouldn't be seen as good enough as it's not. You can talk about doing things the 'right way' and not wanting to be a big club but let's be honest it's bollocks. Fans pay to see success and the club's honours list grow. Fact. Teams like United, City and Chelsea won't stand still. There's simply too much money in the game now for that to happen. Spurs need to take the opportunity presented to them as if they don't they'll only regret it later down the line.
To believe that top players will stay on incremental money for a team that may be doing well but is really failing to turn that into winners medals is naive and short sighted.
For what it's worth I can see Spurs winning the FA Cup. They then need a good summer in the market as the last few have been mixed with gems and expensive dross.
That's what I mean Liverpool pay massive wages but that investment doesn't bring them success.
I don't buy that. For example, how many teams in Europe have a better back 5 five than Spurs? Lloris, Walker, Alderweireld, Vertonghen and Rose are collectively top notch.
That's the reason you did so well in CL and in Europa?
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