Not a massive vote winner for me but certainly not a weak link either. If Lahm is played behind him it'll make for a strong flank.
The Redcafe Champions League Draft
- Thread starter Theon
- Start date
Not a massive vote winner for me but certainly not a weak link either. If Lahm is played behind him it'll make for a strong flank.
That's the way about it. Remember as you progress you get to pick other players so your wings can get fully sorted then. Decent wingers will do.
Right now there is no one position you need to absolutely prioritise any more so just sit back and when the turn comes back to you see who is left which is the best possible player to pick, regardless of position. Actually, it is at this point, with a very good side in the making that you would make an early call for a top keeper with no CL win.
Play him on the left of Henry and Mata playing right.
With Totti playing off Henry and Veron and Gerrard sat behind them.
I call it "The all in"
I've somewhat subscribed to this view in the past, but only really in an all-time type debate. You've done seriously well to get him this deep into the draft. Kohler is right up there in contention for best centre back in the draft so its a brilliant partnership.
Looking at the rest of your team you've compensated for Riquelme's lack of physicality with the unreal power and pace of Ronaldo and Vieri, and an extremely hard-working and technically competent central midfield. Possibly the strongest line-up so far imo.
I find it a little bit odd, don't think Wayne is needed in that team with Ronaldo and RuiCosta there. That's the beauty of having Rui though, can easily just drop him a little deeper.
Yep. Either drop Rui a bit deeper or play Rooney left like In 2008
So it's not just that you don't need Rooney. You also want him so he can be played out of position.
You have received some really good advice man. I liked the Roma theory. Get some attacking fullbacks, that would be proper all in.
Feels like watching the bestest league in the world team
I was joking about Rooney, I've got something much more sinister in store.
I look forward to it.
Theon Gattuso, De Rossi, Pirlo AND Iniesta??? Interesting to see what you do there
Aaaaaarrgh where has N gone ?
Theon likes diamonds. This is the third draft I've seen him in and he refuses to have anything but a diamond or a square. He is a big fan of mid-2000s Milan.
Second.
I think I would have won that Premier League draft if I had kept my diamond and not changed it with Giggs, Becks etc. Cantona would have been first pick for the upgrades off Shearer, second would have been Makelele to replace Batty and third would have been any of the remaining CB's (I got McGrath at this stage, so say him) to replace Carra.
But this is by far the most natural diamond I could have created, Pirlo, Gattuso and De Rossi have all played it and AM is just Iniesta's natural game.
Ahh okay interesting still I assume Pirlo is the deepest with De Rossi and Gattusso in cm and Iniesta in am. That is classy all world cup winners flair and steel, the Italians have familiarity and the Iniesta takes the midfield to another level.
The teams are taking shape now I like Snow's team I wonder how he will use Kaka and Ronaldinho and his defence is going to be the most solid just because of the familiarity of those playing a few good right back out there still also. I like Naehali's team also actually there is still not a standout team for me yet though some who need just the right two/three players and they will be superb. I'm looking forward to this. Does the best team win most of the time or just the person who sells his team the best?
Personally I wasn't a fan of your diamond in the PL draft at all. It just didn't seem like the right way to get the best out of Shearer (and Fowler if I remember correctly?) at all. I thought you looked infinitely better for bringing in Becks and Giggs. This one looks a far better fit though as you say.
Sorry gents, I popped out for a well-needed meal there. Back now and raring to go! I'll post my pick in a few minutes. I'm genuinely stuck between three players for the same position, and I'm wondering which would be the best vote-winner...
Yeah it wasn't ideal but the 4-4-2 was weak in the middle, whereas getting Makelele would have been the complete opposite. I went with Lampard and Keane in the end which wasn't enough against Pol and would have been smashed by Gio's team!
I think it was a mistake on my part to move away from the diamond and go 4-4-2 for that reason really, too light in the middle against top midfields. I think Pol had Cantona in the end and he would just be dropping off into the hole behind Lampard all game, needed Makelele there to mark him out I reckon
You didn't play in the 50s one? Sure you were around in the alltime?
Thanks for that.
I sense Theon is somewhat bitter that I talked him into that 4-4-2 insisting his diamond was rubbish and wouldn't make it.
All-time PL draft, a 4-4-2 with Giggs and Becks, how could that possibly be a bad idea?
I want to finalise my wing-backs as the midfield formation I've chosen will need width, which will be provided by two of the best full-backs in the game over the last 25 years: Bixente Lizarazu and Dennis Irwin. Irwin played predominantly as a left-back but was equally as proficient manning the right flank and was ultra dependable. Strong in the tackle, positionally brilliant and superb going forward, Irwin was a model of consistency. I think anyone who'd watch United and Irwin over his career there would concur with the claim that he rarely, if ever, put in a sub-7/10 performance. Bobby Charlton said he's the best full-back United have ever had, Alan Hansen said if he was asked to pick an all-time XI, he'd pick Irwin at left-back and he'd pick him at right-back. He really was that good.
Both full-backs on my team are practically carbon-copies of one another, and offer me a great deal defensively and in attack. Extremely happy to have them both on board.
P.S I came across this picture of Irwin when looking for an image. He played right-back in that Cup Final and was dependable as ever. Here he is out-foxing Liverpool's main man at the time, Steve McManaman. Superb footballer, was Irwin.
Both full-backs on my team are practically carbon-copies of one another, and offer me a great deal defensively and in attack. Extremely happy to have them both on board.
P.S I came across this picture of Irwin when looking for an image. He played right-back in that Cup Final and was dependable as ever. Here he is out-foxing Liverpool's main man at the time, Steve McManaman. Superb footballer, was Irwin.
The Game: 1. Zidane 2. Seedorf 3. Shevchenko 4. Frank De Boer 5. Pires 6. Cocu 7. Ze Roberto
JakeC: 1. Messi 2. Cantona 3. Buffon 4. Roberto Carlos 5. Xabi Alonso 6. Puyol 7. Mascherano
kps88: 1. Cristiano Ronaldo 2. Kohler 3. Davids 4. Vieri 5. Riquelme 6. Costacurta 7. Cambiasso
Thisistheone: 1. Ronaldo 2. Desailly 3. Rui Costa 4. Blanc 5. Essien 6. Dani Alves 7. Rooney
Ralaks: 1. Keane 2. Del Piero 3. Effenberg 4. Beckham 5. Overmars 6. Ramos 7. Trezeguet
nahealai: 1. Xavi 2. Raúl 3. van Nistelrooy 4. Ballack 5. Busquets 6. Lizarazu 7. Irwin
Stobzilla: 1. Henry 2. Stam 3. Totti 4. Gerrard 5. Veron 6. Mata
Feeky: 1. Maldini 2. Scholes 3. Bergkamp 4. Deschamps 5. Ibrahimovic 6. Y. Touré
akash02: 1. Romario 2. Cannavaro 3. Hagi 4. Guardiola 5. Lahm 6. McManaman
Gio: 1. Rivaldo 2. Nedved 3. Ferdinand 4. Zanetti 5. Fabregas 6. Zambrotta
Snow: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Kaka 3. Mendieta 4. Terry 5. Carvalho 6. A. Cole
Isotope: 1. Redondo 2. Ribery 3. Eto'o 4. Albertini 5. Campbell 6. Boban
EDogen: 1. Nesta 2. Giggs 3. Hierro 4. Van Persie 5. Enrique 6. Robben
Theon: 1. Iniesta 2. Pirlo 3. Cafu 4. Gattuso 5. De Rossi 6. Crespo
Fergus'son: 1. Batistuta 2. Thuram 3. Ayala 4. Makelele 5. Schweinsteiger 6. Möller
BD/NM: 1. Vieira 2. Figo 3. Vidic 4. Drogba 5.Lampard 6. Popescu
I'll PM Stobs there now.
Don't be daft anto
van Nistelrooy
------Raúl
Ballack ------------Xavi
Busquets
Lizarazu ------------------------------- Irwin
CB ------ CB ------ CB
GK
Something I'm thinking about at the moment.
Looks similar to what I thought you'd try nahealai. You'll need to get the CBs correct for it to work though.
Bad teams never win but it isn't necessarily the best TEAM winning. Usually the "flashy name" factor has been eliminated by the time you get to the final, both sides are really good and it all ends up being settled by a fundamental flaw in either team, or a feck up early in the game which makes it too high a mountain to climb.
In the 70s final Cling Bak had rubbish fullbacks but I also happened to have no out and out arse-tearing wingers so his won it. I still think I had the better unit, but it could be argued either way. What lost it actually was people disagreeing over me picking Davids to strengthen the midfield instead of Rivaldo. The final victory margin was less than half the gap that built up in the first half hour or so just on that basis alone.
In the 50s final I don't think I had a hope in hell from the outset. My team could have nicked that game 3 out of 10 times but with incredibly refined tactics, which if I tried to post would have had the same effect as the Davids-Rivaldo decision.
All-time final Cutch had probably the most hopeless RB in living memory. The No.2 in blue in the 2nd half.
It must be hard to stomach, wasn't it, Antohan?
Cool, I gave you a short reply as I didn't want to reopen that but your post later sort of did. I honestly don't have any doubt you had no chance with the previous team.
The 70s one was awful. It was horrendous to spend about a month drafting, playing and then over a single decision being pummelled like that. I didn't even get the chance to make my case, it just kept ticking. Some even said it was me not wanting to bench my Uruguayan players, when it had feck all to do with that.
Very frustrating. Early votes are important to sense which way things are going, but it is better to comment, suggest, hear the case out before jumping on a bandwagon like that. I was 8-2 before an hour had passed, and the 2 included my own vote. I wound up losing by the single vote.
Mental.
I'm out at Pub Quiz, someone post a pic of Gary Neville and call it my pick, if someone could let Feeky know as well then that'd be grand.
You are badly missing Iniesta there, Ballack is a completely different playr and I'm not sure how it would work.
The upside is, if you do get hold of Iniesta later...
Sorted, mate. It was between Irwin and Neville for me (well actually there was a third too, which would have been just as good, in my opinion) and I sided with Irwin for his attacking abilities. Not much between them, mind, although others may disagree.
The Game: 1. Zidane 2. Seedorf 3. Shevchenko 4. Frank De Boer 5. Pires 6. Cocu 7. Ze Roberto
JakeC: 1. Messi 2. Cantona 3. Buffon 4. Roberto Carlos 5. Xabi Alonso 6. Puyol 7. Mascherano
kps88: 1. Cristiano Ronaldo 2. Kohler 3. Davids 4. Vieri 5. Riquelme 6. Costacurta 7. Cambiasso
Thisistheone: 1. Ronaldo 2. Desailly 3. Rui Costa 4. Blanc 5. Essien 6. Dani Alves 7. Rooney
Ralaks: 1. Keane 2. Del Piero 3. Effenberg 4. Beckham 5. Overmars 6. Ramos 7. Trezeguet
nahealai: 1. Xavi 2. Raúl 3. van Nistelrooy 4. Ballack 5. Busquets 6. Lizarazu 7. Irwin
Stobzilla: 1. Henry 2. Stam 3. Totti 4. Gerrard 5. Veron 6. Mata 7. G. Neville
Feeky: 1. Maldini 2. Scholes 3. Bergkamp 4. Deschamps 5. Ibrahimovic 6. Y. Touré
akash02: 1. Romario 2. Cannavaro 3. Hagi 4. Guardiola 5. Lahm 6. McManaman
Gio: 1. Rivaldo 2. Nedved 3. Ferdinand 4. Zanetti 5. Fabregas 6. Zambrotta
Snow: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Kaka 3. Mendieta 4. Terry 5. Carvalho 6. A. Cole
Isotope: 1. Redondo 2. Ribery 3. Eto'o 4. Albertini 5. Campbell 6. Boban
EDogen: 1. Nesta 2. Giggs 3. Hierro 4. Van Persie 5. Enrique 6. Robben
Theon: 1. Iniesta 2. Pirlo 3. Cafu 4. Gattuso 5. De Rossi 6. Crespo
Fergus'son: 1. Batistuta 2. Thuram 3. Ayala 4. Makelele 5. Schweinsteiger 6. Möller
BD/NM: 1. Vieira 2. Figo 3. Vidic 4. Drogba 5.Lampard 6. Popescu
Feeky's up.
JakeC: 1. Messi 2. Cantona 3. Buffon 4. Roberto Carlos 5. Xabi Alonso 6. Puyol 7. Mascherano
kps88: 1. Cristiano Ronaldo 2. Kohler 3. Davids 4. Vieri 5. Riquelme 6. Costacurta 7. Cambiasso
Thisistheone: 1. Ronaldo 2. Desailly 3. Rui Costa 4. Blanc 5. Essien 6. Dani Alves 7. Rooney
Ralaks: 1. Keane 2. Del Piero 3. Effenberg 4. Beckham 5. Overmars 6. Ramos 7. Trezeguet
nahealai: 1. Xavi 2. Raúl 3. van Nistelrooy 4. Ballack 5. Busquets 6. Lizarazu 7. Irwin
Stobzilla: 1. Henry 2. Stam 3. Totti 4. Gerrard 5. Veron 6. Mata 7. G. Neville
Feeky: 1. Maldini 2. Scholes 3. Bergkamp 4. Deschamps 5. Ibrahimovic 6. Y. Touré
akash02: 1. Romario 2. Cannavaro 3. Hagi 4. Guardiola 5. Lahm 6. McManaman
Gio: 1. Rivaldo 2. Nedved 3. Ferdinand 4. Zanetti 5. Fabregas 6. Zambrotta
Snow: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Kaka 3. Mendieta 4. Terry 5. Carvalho 6. A. Cole
Isotope: 1. Redondo 2. Ribery 3. Eto'o 4. Albertini 5. Campbell 6. Boban
EDogen: 1. Nesta 2. Giggs 3. Hierro 4. Van Persie 5. Enrique 6. Robben
Theon: 1. Iniesta 2. Pirlo 3. Cafu 4. Gattuso 5. De Rossi 6. Crespo
Fergus'son: 1. Batistuta 2. Thuram 3. Ayala 4. Makelele 5. Schweinsteiger 6. Möller
BD/NM: 1. Vieira 2. Figo 3. Vidic 4. Drogba 5.Lampard 6. Popescu
Feeky's up.
I select David Silva.
The Game: 1. Zidane 2. Seedorf 3. Shevchenko 4. Frank De Boer 5. Pires 6. Cocu 7. Ze Roberto
JakeC: 1. Messi 2. Cantona 3. Buffon 4. Roberto Carlos 5. Xabi Alonso 6. Puyol 7. Mascherano
kps88: 1. Cristiano Ronaldo 2. Kohler 3. Davids 4. Vieri 5. Riquelme 6. Costacurta 7. Cambiasso
Thisistheone: 1. Ronaldo 2. Desailly 3. Rui Costa 4. Blanc 5. Essien 6. Dani Alves 7. Rooney
Ralaks: 1. Keane 2. Del Piero 3. Effenberg 4. Beckham 5. Overmars 6. Ramos 7. Trezeguet
nahealai: 1. Xavi 2. Raúl 3. van Nistelrooy 4. Ballack 5. Busquets 6. Lizarazu 7. Irwin
Stobzilla: 1. Henry 2. Stam 3. Totti 4. Gerrard 5. Veron 6. Mata 7. G. Neville
Feeky: 1. Maldini 2. Scholes 3. Bergkamp 4. Deschamps 5. Ibrahimovic 6. Y. Touré 7. David Silva
akash02: 1. Romario 2. Cannavaro 3. Hagi 4. Guardiola 5. Lahm 6. McManaman
Gio: 1. Rivaldo 2. Nedved 3. Ferdinand 4. Zanetti 5. Fabregas 6. Zambrotta
Snow: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Kaka 3. Mendieta 4. Terry 5. Carvalho 6. A. Cole
Isotope: 1. Redondo 2. Ribery 3. Eto'o 4. Albertini 5. Campbell 6. Boban
EDogen: 1. Nesta 2. Giggs 3. Hierro 4. Van Persie 5. Enrique 6. Robben
Theon: 1. Iniesta 2. Pirlo 3. Cafu 4. Gattuso 5. De Rossi 6. Crespo
Fergus'son: 1. Batistuta 2. Thuram 3. Ayala 4. Makelele 5. Schweinsteiger 6. Möller
BD/NM: 1. Vieira 2. Figo 3. Vidic 4. Drogba 5.Lampard 6. Popescu
Ak is up now.
JakeC: 1. Messi 2. Cantona 3. Buffon 4. Roberto Carlos 5. Xabi Alonso 6. Puyol 7. Mascherano
kps88: 1. Cristiano Ronaldo 2. Kohler 3. Davids 4. Vieri 5. Riquelme 6. Costacurta 7. Cambiasso
Thisistheone: 1. Ronaldo 2. Desailly 3. Rui Costa 4. Blanc 5. Essien 6. Dani Alves 7. Rooney
Ralaks: 1. Keane 2. Del Piero 3. Effenberg 4. Beckham 5. Overmars 6. Ramos 7. Trezeguet
nahealai: 1. Xavi 2. Raúl 3. van Nistelrooy 4. Ballack 5. Busquets 6. Lizarazu 7. Irwin
Stobzilla: 1. Henry 2. Stam 3. Totti 4. Gerrard 5. Veron 6. Mata 7. G. Neville
Feeky: 1. Maldini 2. Scholes 3. Bergkamp 4. Deschamps 5. Ibrahimovic 6. Y. Touré 7. David Silva
akash02: 1. Romario 2. Cannavaro 3. Hagi 4. Guardiola 5. Lahm 6. McManaman
Gio: 1. Rivaldo 2. Nedved 3. Ferdinand 4. Zanetti 5. Fabregas 6. Zambrotta
Snow: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Kaka 3. Mendieta 4. Terry 5. Carvalho 6. A. Cole
Isotope: 1. Redondo 2. Ribery 3. Eto'o 4. Albertini 5. Campbell 6. Boban
EDogen: 1. Nesta 2. Giggs 3. Hierro 4. Van Persie 5. Enrique 6. Robben
Theon: 1. Iniesta 2. Pirlo 3. Cafu 4. Gattuso 5. De Rossi 6. Crespo
Fergus'son: 1. Batistuta 2. Thuram 3. Ayala 4. Makelele 5. Schweinsteiger 6. Möller
BD/NM: 1. Vieira 2. Figo 3. Vidic 4. Drogba 5.Lampard 6. Popescu
Ak is up now.
Can understand Lizarazu but can't imagine Irwin bombing up and down the wing as a wing back should.
To be honest I remember feeling at the time that your team still stacked up well against anyones, but that Anto had backed you into the corner of arguing passionately against the need for width in one round then waxing lyrical about it in the next. He's a crafty customer!
Irwin was a very good crosser though and I don't recall him having any stamina issues even when he got old. I think Nahealai could feasibly argue that with the right tactical set up (ie: Busquets in the holding role) Irwin could do a fine job at wing back.
Irwin was fantastic going forward. Technically brilliant, excellent at timing runs forward and created chances effortlessly with those two gifted feet of his. Both himself and Ballack were exceptional at shooting/crossing with both feet, which is an invaluable skill to possess.
You could invert/mirror this video in your mind's eye and see Irwin doing the exact same thing from the right-hand side. I firmly believe if Irwin was playing for Brazil or Italy instead of Ireland, he'd have gone down as one of the international all-time greats.