The Redcafe Champions League Draft

[Theon]

Rui Costa is very under rated unfortunately, I've had him once and he was ignored.

Yup that's why I reckon it's the only debateable pick - not in terms of ability just how he is percieved as a player.

With Blanc though, even though I agree with Anto he could be underrated, this is outweighed by how good he was an also the added bonus of forming one of the most proven CB partnerships of the entire era.

 

[Fergus' son]

Rui Costa is very under rated unfortunately, I've had him once and he was ignored.

I'v had him before in a draft similar to this and he was rather well received.

Offers good versatility too so fantastic pick IMO. I would've took him if he lasted til my pick in the same round.

 

[Theon]

It's really very difficult to address that in match threads, most people don't read them. I actually rate Desailly higher in midfield, higher than Essien at his peak as well, but I can see how it may look better for both him and Blanc to make a defensive duo. WC and Euro-winning pair, hard to argue against that indeed.

Yeah true, but he should do so all the same!

Yeah I agree on Desailly and Essien, when I was going to pick him it was for midfield but either of the two would work brilliantly and with Blanc it's a no brainer IMO.

 

[antohan]

Thoughts so far...?

Gk
Thuram/RB - Thuram/CB - Ayala - LB
Makelele - Bastian
RW - Moller - LW
Batistuta

I'm not sure about Batistuta as a lone man up front, he always had other forwards playing alongside him.

I thought you would go with Makelele anchoring and the two R/LW being more forward than midfield types. Moller is a great player, just not sure he is the best partner for Schweinsteiger as the two midfielders in front of Makelele. Not saying he isn't, just that I remember him in the role you just put him in, not in the one I think I would need with the rest of that personnel.

Ultimately, it will make sense or not depending on who you get on the flanks.

 

[Fergus' son]

I'm not sure about Batistuta as a lone man up front, he always had other forwards playing alongside him.

I thought you would go with Makelele anchoring and the two R/LW being more forward than midfield types. Moller is a great player, just not sure he is the best partner for Schweinsteiger as the two midfielders in front of Makelele. Not saying he isn't, just that I remember him in the role you just put him in, not in the one I think I would need with the rest of that personnel.

Ultimately, it will make sense or not depending on who you get on the flanks.

I see where you're coming from, thanks. Will have to think of my next picks carefully...

 

[antohan]

I see where you're coming from, thanks. Will have to think of my next picks carefully...

I would also see Thuram as a CB there and maybe go for someone who is more of a wingback (seeing as I would have a right forward and not someone who works the flanks and tracks back).

Mind, you could do that on both flanks or one alone but with Thuram also being a RB I think he gives you real scope for that RWB to be a complete attacking mentalist and be appropriately covered, while the LB is more of a traditional conservative type.

Difficult to go any further without throwing names around.

 

[antohan]

Guys, just to let you know. As much as I enjoy the exchanges, I will not be taking any more PMs from any of you. It's quite dodgy to end up with 4-5 people sharing their plans/list of immediate options with you and being asked to comment.

It has not affected anyone so far, but I already had one situation where someone asked me about someone that I had talked about with someone else (who got to pick first anyway). That is bound to happen a lot as most would be thinking about the same players in each round.

More than happy to discuss out in the open without naming names.

 

[Thisistheone]

Essien that destroyed Keane? Essien was meant to be our Keane replacement. He was a beast, but that argument doesn't fly with me.

Players who had their peaks elsewhere but played out their careers in the PL usually get rough treatment relative to their peak form, and you already have two, particularly if you are planning on having Desailly as a defender.

By at least I meant to leave Desailly out though, Rui Costa's appreciation on here is quite mixed.

I meant when we played Lyon and first came across Essien. That night he gave Keane a hell of a game.

Essien was also brilliant for Chelsea. People should remember fine. If not I could always bump the Essien thread on here to refresh everyone's memory

 

[BD]

Who do you think is the strongest at this stage? I love nahealai's midfield trio(though would be worried about a lack of Iniesta/Fabregas type player in the trio), but not sure how he is going to get Raul and Ruud in there together without compromising one of them. He may need to play a diamond or something similar, which I'm not a fan of at all. Theon's midfield is looking good, but again, difficult to see how he'll get the four of them in their preferred position, unless he goes for a diamond. I'm liking the look of our team so far, but feel we need a bit more flair and creativity in there.

 

[antohan]

I meant when we played Lyon and first came across Essien. That night he gave Keane a hell of a game.

Essien was also brilliant for Chelsea. People should remember fine. If not I could always bump the Essien thread on here to refresh everyone's memory

Have no recollection of that game. I would assume most people would assume (as I did) that Essien had played against us fro Chelsea while Keane was with us. Not sure they did but, either way, Keane was going downhill and most likely was in that Lyon game you refer to as well.

Essien was without a shadow of a doubt the player we most envied Chelsea having. Not Drogba, Robben, Lampard, Makelele, Terry, Carvalho, Cole... Essien. That in itself says a lot, and not just that we needed someone exactly like him.

But you do realise that if you have to refresh people's memories about something that happened 8 years ago, you have the same issue with Blanc and Rui Costa (I loved the Fiorentina Rui Costa, for example, more so than the Milan one). The age of the RC population is relevant, bugger all you can do about that.

Even Henry's popularity in these drafts has changed dramatically in the last few years. Cristiano had already done everything he did in the EPL and Henry was still considered a bigger EPL great, then the Messi-CR 1gpg generation started to kick in and suddenly Henry is no better than Benzema.

 

[NM]

Thought hard about taking Mcmanaman. Only reason I didn't was because he is a bit of a cnut( has any1 seen his punditry?) and scouse bias.

 

[Cutch]

Who do you think is the strongest at this stage? I love nahealai's midfield trio(though would be worried about a lack of Iniesta/Fabregas type player in the trio), but not sure how he is going to get Raul and Ruud in there together without compromising one of them. He may need to play a diamond or something similar, which I'm not a fan of at all. Theon's midfield is looking good, but again, difficult to see how he'll get the four of them in their preferred position, unless he goes for a diamond. I'm liking the look of our team so far, but feel we need a bit more flair and creativity in there.

I think its so hard to call at this stage. My personal favourites are Gio (who seems to plan everything to perfection in these drafts), and probably your own which looks very physically strong. Ralaks is looking pretty good too. Most of the rest of the teams are looking very good also but i'm unsure in some cases how they're going to fill in the blanks or play certain players together. Stobzilla's for example will be interesting to see how Totti, Gerrard and Veron fit in the one team, and what recruitments and system nahealai will employ to counter his lack of width.

Its delicately poised.

​

 

[Moby]

Rui Costa and Batigol was a phenomenal partnership but I doubt many watched Viola in the 90s to exactly remember that. Both lack International honours as well which doesn't help their case. Having said that I think both are quite popular and top names in their positions in this draft.

 

[NM]

Have no recollection of that game. I would assume most people would assume (as I did) that Essien had played against us fro Chelsea while Keane was with us. Not sure they did but, either way, Keane was going downhill and most likely was in that Lyon game you refer to as well.

Essien was without a shadow of a doubt the player we most envied Chelsea having. Not Drogba, Robben, Lampard, Makelele, Terry, Carvalho, Cole... Essien. That in itself says a lot, and not just that we needed someone exactly like him.

But you do realise that if you have to refresh people's memories about something that happened 8 years ago, you have the same issue with Blanc and Rui Costa (I loved the Fiorentina Rui Costa, for example, more so than the Milan one). The age of the RC population is relevant, bugger all you can do about that.

Even Henry's popularity in these drafts has changed dramatically in the last few years. Cristiano had already done everything he did in the EPL and Henry was still considered a bigger EPL great, then the Messi-CR 1gpg generation started to kick in and suddenly Henry is no better than Benzema.

Please, tell me you made that up.

 

[Thisistheone]

True. Could have picked a team full of current players and maybe get further in the draft but decided to pick a team I know and players I loved. At one point I was going for a Serie A 90's theme all the way through but couldn't in the end.

 

[Moby]

True. Could have picked a team full of current players and maybe get further in the draft but decided to pick a team I know and players I loved. At one point I was going for a Serie A 90's theme all the way through but couldn't in the end.

I think it was you or RedIceland in the Premier League Draft in the newbs who kicked my arse in the final with players like Torres and Modric while I had the likes of Shearer and Overmars but got nothing out of it.

Funny how these things work.

 

[antohan]

Please, tell me you made that up.

Slight exaggeration but in relative standing in that generation's consciousness I don't think I'm far off.

 

[Theon]

Remember to PM if you're going offline and you know your pick

 

[Fergus' son]

Rui Costa and Batigol was a phenomenal partnership but I doubt many watched Viola in the 90s to exactly remember that. Both lack International honours as well which doesn't help their case. Having said that I think both are quite popular and top names in their positions in this draft.

I don't think Batigol divides opinion in the same way that Anto was suggesting Rui Costa does, haven't come across anyone yet that doesn't believe he's one of the greatest strikers they've ever seen.

 

[Thisistheone]

I think it was you or RedIceland in the Premier League Draft in the newbs who kicked my arse in the final with players like Torres and Modric while I had the likes of Shearer and Overmars but got nothing out of it.

Funny how these things work.

Yeah that was RedIceland cos he stuffed me in the semi-finals!

Think he had Fabregas and Modric in CM?

 

[Moby]

Yeah that was RedIceland cos he stuffed me in the semi-finals!

Think he had Fabregas and Modric in CM?

Yeah. It was quite a modern looking team relatively though I think it ended in a draw in the final. But he played it quite smart with picking players who were very fresh in everyone's memory.

 

[Thisistheone]

I don't think Batigol divides opinion in the same way that Anto was suggesting Rui Costa does, haven't come across anyone yet that doesn't believe he's one of the greatest strikers they've ever seen.

Everyone loves Batistuta

 

[BD]

I think its so hard to call at this stage. My personal favourites are Gio (who seems to plan everything to perfection in these drafts), and probably your own which looks very physically strong. Ralaks is looking pretty good too. Most of the rest of the teams are looking very good also but i'm unsure in some cases how they're going to fill in the blanks or play certain players together. Stobzilla's for example will be interesting to see how Totti, Gerrard and Veron fit in the one team, and what recruitments and system nahealai will employ to counter his lack of width.

Its delicately poised.

Yeah, that's thanks to NM's influence! We talked before the draft about our preferred style and he prefers big bruisers whereas I like technically gifted players, speed and possession. I figured that going for bruisers first would be better and then filling the gaps in with a bit of flair. I'm happy with how our team is going at the moment.

 

[Moby]

I don't think Batigol divides opinion in the same way that Anto was suggesting Rui Costa does, haven't come across anyone yet that doesn't believe he's one of the greatest strikers they've ever seen.

I think he still gets underrated at times. Most complete striker I've seen and a proper match winner if there ever was one. Plus he scored all those goals against great mean Serie A defenses without playing at one of the top teams. Had he played for a team like Milan or Juve he would have been at least rated at the level of someone like Van Basten whereas now I don't think that is the case.

 

[Fergus' son]

I think he still gets underrated at times. Most complete striker I've seen and a proper match winner if there ever was one. Plus he scored all those goals against great mean Serie A defenses without playing at one of the top teams. Had he played for a team like Milan or Juve he would have been at least rated at the level of someone like Van Basten whereas now I don't think that is the case.

Fair points.

I'm sure Maradona described him as the best striker he's ever seen...?

 

[Isotope]

Not many rate Benzema, nowadays.

 

[antohan]

Who do you think is the strongest at this stage? I love nahealai's midfield trio(though would be worried about a lack of Iniesta/Fabregas type player in the trio), but not sure how he is going to get Raul and Ruud in there together without compromising one of them. He may need to play a diamond or something similar, which I'm not a fan of at all. Theon's midfield is looking good, but again, difficult to see how he'll get the four of them in their preferred position, unless he goes for a diamond. I'm liking the look of our team so far, but feel we need a bit more flair and creativity in there.

Right now: 1. Snow, 2. Gio....... 3. EDogen 4. nahealai (two great midfields there)... everyone else

I find it odd that Gio has gone with a right-footed leftback, I thought I would never see the day. All top players though who you would happily take all the way to the final, and the CL requirements well taken care of. Excellent draft from him so far and has left room for improving with standout additions in the rigth positions. I think this may be the one for Gio. Shame I'm not around to scupper him with a vastly inferior side .

I do think Snow already has the foundations to kick some arse though.

 

[Cutch]

Yeah, that's thanks to NM's influence! We talked before the draft about our preferred style and he prefers big bruisers whereas I like technically gifted players, speed and possession. I figured that going for bruisers first would be better and then filling the gaps in with a bit of flair. I'm happy with how our team is going at the moment.

Yeah its similar to how i approached a previous draft. I had powerhouses like Drogba, Ballack, Gerrard and also Pires who was big for a winger. Think i'd too many cnuts in the side but so didn't get the votes.

 

[Fergus' son]

Who do you think is the strongest at this stage? I love nahealai's midfield trio(though would be worried about a lack of Iniesta/Fabregas type player in the trio), but not sure how he is going to get Raul and Ruud in there together without compromising one of them. He may need to play a diamond or something similar, which I'm not a fan of at all. Theon's midfield is looking good, but again, difficult to see how he'll get the four of them in their preferred position, unless he goes for a diamond. I'm liking the look of our team so far, but feel we need a bit more flair and creativity in there.

Tito and Gio IMO.

 

[Cutch]

Right now: 1. Snow, 2. Gio....... 3. EDogen 4. nahealai (two great midfields there)... everyone else

I find it odd that Gio has gone with a right-footed leftback, I thought I would never see the day. All top players though who you would happily take all the way to the final, and the CL requirements well taken care of. Excellent draft from him so far and has left room for improving with standout additions in the rigth positions. I think this may be the one for Gio. Shame I'm not around to scupper him with a vastly inferior side .

I do think Snow already has the foundations to kick some arse though.

Hope you're right! The chelsea trio at the back should hopefully stand us in good stead and then it'll be a case of hoping everyone remembers the phenomenal peak that Mendieta, Ronaldinho and Kaka had in the CL, then hopefully get the right players to fill in the blanks.

 

[antohan]

Yeah its similar to how i approached a previous draft. I had powerhouses like Drogba, Ballack, Gerrard and also Pires who was big for a winger. Think i'd too many cnuts in the side but so didn't get the votes.

Cuntishness definitely is a factor, club of origin also is, you fecked up on both counts there.

There's a chap out there who always votes against the team with a scouser in it. Just the one vote you may think, but I won two games that way, one being an epic low vote comeback against Gio when he had Souness and Hansen in the 50s draft

 

[antohan]

Hope you're right! The chelsea trio at the back should hopefully stand us in good stead and then it'll be a case of hoping everyone remembers the phenomenal peak that Mendieta, Ronaldinho and Kaka had in the CL, then hopefully get the right players to fill in the blanks.

As above, so long as people don't vote with their heart, that's an awesome back four you are putting together.

 

[Cutch]

Cuntishness definitely is a factor, club of origin also is, you fecked up on both counts there.

There's a chap out there who always votes against the team with a scouser in it. Just the one vote you may think, but I won two games that way, one being an epic low vote comeback against Gio when he had Souness and Hansen in the 50s draft

For feck sake. Some people take it too far

 

[Stobzilla]

Ok then, somebody pick mine apart please, I'm in a masochistic mood today.

 

[Fergus' son]

Makelele was vital to the success of that Chelsea back line IMO!

 

[Theon]

Hope you're right! The chelsea trio at the back should hopefully stand us in good stead and then it'll be a case of hoping everyone remembers the phenomenal peak that Mendieta, Ronaldinho and Kaka had in the CL, then hopefully get the right players to fill in the blanks.

I definitely like the way you've gone for a proven backline and that Chelsea defence was one of the best the Premiership has ever seen, really good idea that you've pulled off, though Terry was the least of it and you picked him first! You need a ballwinner or DM atm though but if you can get the right partner for Mendieta you are laughing.

 

[Fergus' son]

Ok then, somebody pick mine apart please, I'm in a masochistic mood today.

You were one of my favourites til Veron was picked, now I just can't see how you will line up. Diamond?

 

[Theon]

Makelele was vital to the success of that Chelsea back line IMO!

Yeah this is obviously true actually. I retract my previous comment.

 

[Fergus' son]

Yeah this is obviously true actually. I retract my previous comment.

Still a good idea having defenders that worked together though, I think Terry was picked too early. I would've prioritised Makelele, Carvalho and Cole all before Terry if I was trying to recreate Chelsea defensive solidity.

 

[Theon]

Yeah that was tounge in cheek! I think it was a great idea and it's a great looking defence.

But I did initailly forget about Makelele and the impact he had on that side. I think Tito has the best CB partnership out of everyone, as much as I rate Nesta.