Disappointing from Haye, should have thrown a lot more punches and kept vladmir on the ropes. He had the pace to cause him trouble but just kept taking that left jab.
The RedCafe Boxing Thread
- Thread starter CLK_FPC
- Start date
booo..
mine is newer 
About right.
Being able to take out two big cnuts who can't fight hardly qualifies you as an 'all-time great'.
Wlad broke his toe in Haye's arse but you don't hear hear him complaining about it.
Lewis is top ten all time, at worst. Would you like to debate it?
I think we're unlikely to see much improvement given that the potential American heavyweight stars continue to go down the American Football and Basketball career path instead.
This fight was a huge disappointment to me, but not because of Klitschko, Haye did all the trash talking before the fight and when he got in the ring, he did'nt try hard enough or take enough risks to win it.
Klitschko is incapable of producing anything different to what we saw tonight, Haye is a much more talented boxer, and had he the guts to get in close and trade, he would probably have fared much better. Haye is the more powerful puncher and has better variety, so the only reason i can see why he preferred to back off rather than fight on the inside is because it is safer to do so.
When you fight someone taller whose main advantage is reach, surely the best tactic was to get his guard up, duck under the jab to get inside before firing off 4 and 5 punch combos to both head and body, before getting back out again. Rough the guy up, make him fight in a style he's not comfortable fighting!
I don't buy the old 'well he's not a natural heavyweight' bollocks. Holyfield was also a cruiserweight, but he had the belief and heart of a champion who was fully prepared to go to war every fight to win. For me it's about desire, you have to want it more than the other guy and be prepared to find that little bit more than he can. Haye has the talent and the power but he quite simply does not have the heart, nor the pride or determination to put every last bit of effort into winning. He can't possibly want it enough, otherwise he would have risked more when the situation became increasingly desperate. He must have known he was behind, so why not throw caution to the wind and have a real all or nothing go?
For Haye defeat should not have been an option in such a career defining fight, instead from the first 10 mins defeat seemed almost an inevitability. His tactics seemed to place much more faith in luck, than in his own desperation to win, and that says it all really.
Klitschko is incapable of producing anything different to what we saw tonight, Haye is a much more talented boxer, and had he the guts to get in close and trade, he would probably have fared much better. Haye is the more powerful puncher and has better variety, so the only reason i can see why he preferred to back off rather than fight on the inside is because it is safer to do so.
When you fight someone taller whose main advantage is reach, surely the best tactic was to get his guard up, duck under the jab to get inside before firing off 4 and 5 punch combos to both head and body, before getting back out again. Rough the guy up, make him fight in a style he's not comfortable fighting!
I don't buy the old 'well he's not a natural heavyweight' bollocks. Holyfield was also a cruiserweight, but he had the belief and heart of a champion who was fully prepared to go to war every fight to win. For me it's about desire, you have to want it more than the other guy and be prepared to find that little bit more than he can. Haye has the talent and the power but he quite simply does not have the heart, nor the pride or determination to put every last bit of effort into winning. He can't possibly want it enough, otherwise he would have risked more when the situation became increasingly desperate. He must have known he was behind, so why not throw caution to the wind and have a real all or nothing go?
For Haye defeat should not have been an option in such a career defining fight, instead from the first 10 mins defeat seemed almost an inevitability. His tactics seemed to place much more faith in luck, than in his own desperation to win, and that says it all really.
His broken toe
His broken toe
I'm gonna back David Haye at this point, i've got a broken toe at the minute - exact same toe. Broke it stubbing it in the yard.
Anyway mine isn't quite as swollen as that but it's very painful and i can appreciate it hampering him.
David Haye: "No way I could pull out after so many fans paid their hard earned money. I believed I could still win. Klit fought me great, credit to him."
Awful fight. Haye's just another average Joe, despite all his shit-talking. The fact he managed to find himself with a world title belt shows just what an abysmal state the heavyweight division is currently in. Klitschko was far from his best, yet he made Haye look like an amateur.
Huh, Lewis beat everybody there was to beat, Tyson, Bruno, Klitschko, Holyfield, Ruddock, Golota he beat them all. his problem was no-one really wanted to fight him, Riddick Bowe famously threw his belt in a dustbin after eventually being given an ultimatum by the WBC, after months and months of stalling negotiations to fight Lewis.
All the time Bowe was ducking Lewis, he was enjoying huge purses from the fights with Holyfield, so why would he risk fighting Lewis, who incidentally had hammered Bowe at the Olympics a few years earlier.
Lewis was a great fighter, but he suffered similarly to Calzaghe, where belt holders were prepared to give up belts, or use delaying tactics, basically finding any excuse to postpone negotiations for any potential encounter. It is very difficult to prove yourself in these conditions but fortunately for both Lewis and Calzaghe, they at least managed to get the fights they needed to cement their respective legacie,s albeit at the end of their careers. Even though boxing politics robbed them both of the opportunity of dominating their respective divisions while still in their primes.
Wlad is bloody amazing.. That kind of a performance even after lowering onto Haye's level before that fight just shows what kind of a champion he is when the bell rings.. I'm sure Emanuel Steward had a big part of calming him and getting the best out of him but Wlad I think won this game in the training camp.
Who next for Wlad.. I don't think there is a serious competition this year for him, but after that who knows.. And I'm not believe Haye is going to stop after this.. Haye vs. Vitali next please!
Who next for Wlad.. I don't think there is a serious competition this year for him, but after that who knows.. And I'm not believe Haye is going to stop after this.. Haye vs. Vitali next please!
That's pretty unfair. Haye's very talented but he just wasn't big enough to have anything more than a puncher's chance against Kiltschko.
Broken toe! what a shit excuse, atleast come up with something better.
Tyson broke his back...!
Tyson broke his back...!
Did you feel he left everything he had out there? Or do you feel maybe he could have varied his tactics, maybe fought a bit more on the inside and taken a few more risks?
Maybe you feel he did as much as he could and in the end we simply discovered he is not really as good as he thinks he is. I personally thought he didn't show enough desire to win the fight, he didn't pressurise Vlad enough and he allowed him to dictate the fight in the only way he can.
So sorry, but not impressed by Haye, bit of a fraud really after all his boasting.
Maybe you feel he did as much as he could and in the end we simply discovered he is not really as good as he thinks he is. I personally thought he didn't show enough desire to win the fight, he didn't pressurise Vlad enough and he allowed him to dictate the fight in the only way he can.
So sorry, but not impressed by Haye, bit of a fraud really after all his boasting.
He's 6 ft 3 - he has more than enough height to be able to put up a fight in the heavyweight division without having to use the opponent's height as an excuse. If a boxer is shorter than his opponent and the opponent is able to use that to his advantage, he needs to have something extra. Tyson had it in abundance, Haye doesn't. 10-15 years ago, he would have been a nobody in the heavyweight division. He has been riding his luck for a couple of years now.
Bollocks! Do you think Tyson would have stood a chance? Or Holyfield? They are both significantly smaller than Haye. Haye just isn't willing to have a scrap, he wants to land big bombs, without having any desperate desire to fight. You have to fight with conviction and determination to win against Champions, nobody is simply going to give their titles away. Did Haye fight with enough pride and determination to even keep his own title, never mind taking Klitschko's?
Klitschko is a limited fighter and for me if Haye was the fighter he claims to be, he would have found a way to trouble Klitschko more often. His tactics were negative and naive, his workrate was insufficient, his punching accuracy was poor and he never once showed the desire or the effort to convince anyone he could win this fight.
Haye is a non-entity after this performance, he didn't win a round really. He has wasted enough of the Klitschko's time, why would they possibly give another payday to Haye after the way he has spoken about them.
He will fare no better against Vitali, his jab is even longer than Vlad's!
Haye has had his chance at Heavyweight and he has proved himself lacking in pretty much all areas, if you want to be the best you need more than power, and unfortunately tonight when push came to shove, and it was time to deliver on his promises, Haye proved only that he doesn't want it enough.
Yep i agree with that, i actually felt it was Haye who didn't really want the fights, he seemed to be stalling for time, maybe hoping that the Klitschko's would be past it by the time he faced them.
Whatever it didn't work and we have yet another over hyped Brit who promised much, yet at crunch time delivered very little.
The size difference comment is so stupid. Haye made his Heavyweight name off beating the "biggest" heavyweight champion there's ever been. He sucked so many people in off it...
..Yet Wlad is too big, feckin' hell!
..Yet Wlad is too big, feckin' hell!
Just out of interest does your broken toe hamper you more when you walk forwards, or less when you walk backwards!
I just think Haye isn't as good as heavyweight boxing needs right now.
As been pointed out, he's a decent enough boxer, but dressed up to be a potential great. Fact is he lacks both the heart and desire. He was swinging the odd wild punch and flopping all over the place and in the ring with a true heavyweight, funnily enough either of those who led the fighters out (Lewis/Foreman) , he'd be found out even more. The heavyweight division is a joke right now, tonight's debacle (especially the ring entrances/delay) just proved that.
As been pointed out, he's a decent enough boxer, but dressed up to be a potential great. Fact is he lacks both the heart and desire. He was swinging the odd wild punch and flopping all over the place and in the ring with a true heavyweight, funnily enough either of those who led the fighters out (Lewis/Foreman) , he'd be found out even more. The heavyweight division is a joke right now, tonight's debacle (especially the ring entrances/delay) just proved that.
People saying Haye is more talented than Wlad are idiots. Tonight showed that Klitschko is 10x the boxer Haye could ever dream of being. I actually wanted Haye to win to set up a fight with Vitali, but I knew it would never happen.
Haye was poor, but he couldn't do anything anyway. Wlad dominated the whole fight. Haye looks like an idiot for his pre-fight antics now. Fair play to Haye for fighting with a broken toe, which is definitely painful, but he had no chance regardless.
Haye was poor, but he couldn't do anything anyway. Wlad dominated the whole fight. Haye looks like an idiot for his pre-fight antics now. Fair play to Haye for fighting with a broken toe, which is definitely painful, but he had no chance regardless.
It's not an excuse. It's a fact that Klitschko's considerable height, weight and reach advantages made it an extremely difficult task for Haye.
What about Tyson? A prime Tyson was one of the most devastating fighters that the sport has ever seen. But apparently anyone who isn't at that level is ''just another average joe''?
This is Nadal-Murray, Barcelona-United syndrome repeating itself.
Haye isn't half the fighter he thinks he is.
FFS. It's boxing. It's nothing like as mainstream as Football so they need the ridiculous hype and antics to generate interest. I bet half of the people in this thread wouldn't have bought the fight without that type of promotion.
No it isn't, there is a difference between giving everything and coming up short, as opposed to not really trying and hoping to get lucky. Haye could have won this fight had he been more prepared to go to war with Vlad.
He should have tried to get on the inside and backed Vlad against the ropes, before letting off as many powerful combo's as he could. Instead he stood off, letting Vlad dictate and fight his favourite fight, and Haye was still unwilling to change tact even when it was blatantly obvious he was going to lose.
It's wrong to say because Haye is not Tyson he cannot be expected to win against this type of opponent. Holyfield was not Tyson in terms of power punching but he had the heart and pride of a champion. Hayes could easily have fought on the inside just as both tyson and holyfield would have, why? Because that is how you fight against taller men who depend on their jabs, it's not rocket science and i was personally very disappointed Haye did not at least attempt to draw Vlad into a war on the inside against the ropes, where Haye would not have to launch himself into his punches and Vlad's jab would have been nullified.
This fight says more to me about Haye than it does about Klitschko, he was always going to fight this way, and it was blatantly obvious that should he be allowed to do so he would probably win barring a sucker punch from Haye. for me Haye had to be prepared to go to war with Klitschko, it was his best chance to land the shots to take him out, he was never going to outbox him from distance.
Yes i agree with that, no such thing as bad publicity. Tbf it still happens in football whether it needs it or not, just for a bit of an extra hype in the big matches.
Trouble with Haye though is he bigged himself up, excessively disrespected his opponent for a long time and then when it's time to deliver, he barely wins a round, barely lands a punch of note, and gives up his own title without even having going for broke in the last 2 or 3 rounds.
Got to back it up if you gonna talk the talk or you end up looking like a fraud.
Haye was shit. So many wild swings and seemed to just run out of ideas. Was very easy in the end for Klitschko.
How the feck did George Foreman think it was an even fight.
How the feck did George Foreman think it was an even fight.
When the music went off we all thought Haye was coming out while Lewis was waiting outside then he came out after randomly. Foreman went to get Wladmir and he wasn't ready as well making him come back again. Highly embarrassing for whoever was in charge. Haye thought he was Apollo Creed with the 'Aint No stopping us Now' entrance.
Klitzzzzchko, I wanted Haye to back up all the shit he spouted and really go at him.
Sadly didn't happen and Dr.Robotic, plodded his way through another poor fight (not his fault). But was yet again never tested, people just seem to take a pay check against him. They go backwards, letting Wlad do what he likes.
I don't doubt Wlad's boxing skills, I think he is technically sound. I just want someone to go after him, last four fight now he may as well have boxed a Mr.Punchman.
Sadly didn't happen and Dr.Robotic, plodded his way through another poor fight (not his fault). But was yet again never tested, people just seem to take a pay check against him. They go backwards, letting Wlad do what he likes.
I don't doubt Wlad's boxing skills, I think he is technically sound. I just want someone to go after him, last four fight now he may as well have boxed a Mr.Punchman.
This. Haye may have lost but his talking got him a lot of money out of this fight.
Haye is supposed to have made >£30m from the klit fight. Pretty amazing considing for such a short career.
feck, i thought this was a thread full of top end boxers. Who of the cafe are up next against Klitchko? clearly Haye's a bitch, he only went 12 rounds....
get a grip, Haye went to win and fell short, against the best out there. So fair fecks to him for having the bottle and not getting taken out. Yes he talked the talk and couldnt walk the walk but he took some of Wlads best shots and kept pushing and got beaten...
Lets lay into him, as our man, as the person we're supposed to support.... I've got nothing but respect for both fighters, both athletes. I wanted more from the fight but wanting and seeing, or wanting and dooing are so far apart. Respect to boxers because frankly for every dickhead calling a fighter a coward or a showpony there isn't anything but a fraction of them willing or wanting to step into the ring.
get a grip, Haye went to win and fell short, against the best out there. So fair fecks to him for having the bottle and not getting taken out. Yes he talked the talk and couldnt walk the walk but he took some of Wlads best shots and kept pushing and got beaten...
Lets lay into him, as our man, as the person we're supposed to support.... I've got nothing but respect for both fighters, both athletes. I wanted more from the fight but wanting and seeing, or wanting and dooing are so far apart. Respect to boxers because frankly for every dickhead calling a fighter a coward or a showpony there isn't anything but a fraction of them willing or wanting to step into the ring.
Not British, and don't give a toss about Haye...but that reach advantage Wlad has and his change of gameplan since the knockdowns around 04/05 have meant his jab is a very very powerful tool.
It's easy saying Haye should have boxed him inside, but he has to be able to be able to there does he not? Haye got tagged again and again, anytime he got within range.
Wlad simply worked his gameplan better, and in the end won comfortably, no shame in that for David Haye.
The problem is that Haye knew about the reach advantage and the jab, he should have come up with a plan to deal with it. He didn't!