We've spent some bad money though eh?
The Mourinho Thread: Should he stay or go? | Sacked
- Thread starter Livewire1974
- Start date
- Status
We've spent some bad money though eh?
I agree that our current struggling and being in 11th spot is 100% on Mourinho. The squad is good enough to finish 2nd or 3rd as we have seen last season.
The problem is are we good enough to win the league ? Sooner or later this will be the ultimate target.
The upcoming manager will play better football and will finish in top 4, that's I'm sure about as we saw last season when Mourinho wasn't on his meltdown like now. The question is if the next manager will be able to take us to the next step and win us the league with the current squad, that's what I can't see all honestly.
We need a managerial change but my expectations for the next manager will be 2nd to 4th finish and good football week in week out, but I won't be expecting a league title any soon tbh.
Jose could certainly have handled it better, but we as fans don't know what he's up against with the United board. A set of cretins who made Fergie talk about a lack of value in the market. Jose is no Fergie so he doesn't have this almost mythocal ability to make greats out of just about anyone. Jose, right or wrong sees this as a way of forcing the boards hand.
I also agree that he's treading a fine line. He is absolutely making a point about the holes on the squad, it's blatant. But I think that point needs to be made.
I dont think Poch works with pressure, which will be a huge asset as him. Jose is under immense pressure not just because it's United, but because he's Mourinho.
Our player recruitment has been shambolic for 6 years (as, you would have to say, has our recruitment of managers). The club is rotten to the core. Just one big expensive mess.
Most of his whining I don't understand He's the one who bought two new center backs, so why crib about them now. He's the one who bought pogba, knowing all about his flamboyance, so why crib now.
Like Cantona said he's the wrong man for this woman and time is up, it's simply not a good fit anymore.
Like Cantona said he's the wrong man for this woman and time is up, it's simply not a good fit anymore.
I don't get this stance. Bailly was bought in season 1 to improve the squad, he did just that. Now in season 3 after taking 2nd in the league, it's time to improve/upgrade.
Not sure why Mourinho is the only manager that should stick with the same players for 6-7 years when his job to improve the team year on year.
Pep and Klopp have both bought players that has already been upgraded or replaced.
No it does. The fact we still need to replace players proves it. People need to get over the fact there is no over night remedy to our problems. Sacking the manager didnt work the first or second time. Dont now why you think the thrid time is going to be an different.
We have wasted a lot of money but that's misjudgement on the managers part. Still we have enough quality to be able to fight for at least the top 4 and with a bit of confidence challenge for the PL even or at least take it to the end. I wouldn't expect us to win the PL with current squad but I do expect us to play a better style of football and to dominate against 90% of the teams we face.
That we can't even do this is what bothers me. How much money do we need to get even the bare minimum?
More than anything, spending big after finishing second is essential, there is no doubt we were a much more attractive destination for players in June than we will be next June.
I think that bothers everyone. As I say, I personally think if Moyes was managing this squad now and you brought a fresh hungry Mourinho in, we'd be better in no time.
Mourinho's failure this season is his petulance at what transpired in the Summer, he's allowed it to effect everything.
And yes, the likes of Poch, Guardiola or Klopp would certainly be getting much more out of this squad, no doubt.
Last edited:
No he doesnt, he throws some people under the bus. And pogba hasnt played badly enough to warrant that treatment. Listen to what it is he says, hes pissed off people dont play his way. Lukaku hasnt been thrown under a bus because hes training as he should be and playing the way jose wants him to. You can argue hes using him wrong, and I think youd have an argument there, but everyone else hes had a go at publicly has been about them not giving everything for the team or not playing for him. Look at all the people in here alone that know better about how to set the team up. Then look and see if you can find a consensus. You wont, because no one knows how to set up an unbalanced team like ours.
Hes also happy to heap praise on people that do play well. But lets not talk about that.
With regards to winning the PL I don't believe we are far away. We've seen the squad get 2nd place last season and we added Fred + Dalot on top of that. we still need 3 or 4 players in some key areas to fight with Man City. Our squad depth especially in attack is not great.
10th or 11th is not a true reflection of our squads quality.
But it's the managers job to instill the belief that we can beat every opponent and we can win every game. Who thought Liverpool could get CL final with a fairly average midfield and GK on paper? It's the manager that instilled the confidence yes? Look how City players always talk about quadruple everytime they win 6/7 games in a row. A quadruple will probably never happen but if you don't believe and have the confidence you can't win anything. To win the PL not only do we need players but we need a manager that will instill the confidence and belief we are going out to win every single game, home or away. Instead our manager is telling the players they're crap and without Fellaini we can't change games. How's that supposed to help?
I didnt bring it up, he brought it up. And your right I did say net spend, which was a mistake. I was half asleep when writing it.
Last edited:
He would have been sacked in his first season at Madrid. No way would they accept finishing 6th. His first stint at Chelsea wasn't as bad as the situation at United when they booted him either.
Didnt say he was happy, I said woodward had it lined up before jose got here.
We got second but we got it 19 points away from the top. City have raised the standard of winning the league and the question is do you see us being able to get +95 points in one League with the current squad. That's the question that's needed to be asked because we all agree on the rest.
Is the squad good enough to finish 2nd or 3rd ? Definitely yes as we saw last season.
Can we play better football week in week out ? Sure, the squad looked good when it pushed forward.
Are our current struggling in the league is due to Mourinho ? Yes, he's on a meltdown and that has affected the squad.
Should we be higher in the league and beat Brighton and WHU ? Definitely yes.
Do we need a managerial change ? At this point sure we need.
All this I agree with.
Will this squad be able to put a long winning run and get plus +95 points, meet the standards City put last season ?
Well that's what I can't see it happening any time soon with our current players, sorry. We will need to mold our expectations for the upcoming manager from now imo.
We will play good football and will finish in top 4 regularly (hopefully) but the problem when we start thinking about winning the league is if we'll be good enough to do it with the amount of points needed to do it these days.
Nonsense, no way Pogba agrees to rejoin United without Mourinho & Zlatan in place.
Stay or go? GO!
Madrid wouldn't have been in United position when Jose joined though, and he wouldn't have finished 6th. And the situation at Chelsea was much worse.
You’re clearly on a wind up now. You’re either related to Jose, a Liverpool fan or Jose Mourinho himself.
Mourinho made his name at two clubs that didn't spend money and had low budgets. Porto and Inter Milan. He had the ability to get players running through brick walls and everyone gave 100% to overcome superior opponents and win trophies. What happened to this Mourinho? Mourinho the coach. Mourinho the motivator. There's nothing special anymore.
Over time he's lost this ability to get teams punching above their weight and has seems to have taken the stance that you can't win anything if you don't spend more than the rest. There are only two jobs where you have this luxury. Man City and PSG. What about all the other hundreds of managers in the world? Mourinho has the spending power to compete with any other team yet he's the only one moaning. If you're not a manager of these two clubs you must know there's no unlimited spending. We spend what is within our means.
If you look at the signings he's made:
1) Bailly = out of favour
2) Zlatan = gone
3) Mkhi = gone
4) Pogba = still question marks
5) Lindelof = still question marks
6) Matic = almost finished
7) lukaku = big question marks
8) Sanchez= big question marks
9) Dalot = needs more time
10) Fred = question marks
None of these signings have been 100% success. Even Zlatan wasn't here long enough. If there are any holes in the squad after all this spending it's because he's spent the money badly or didn't get the most of the squad.
What does it say about him that it looks like we need another 200-300 million after already spending over 350 million in the last two season?
Real have a much higher standard than we do, if it's not working, they bin the manager without a seconds thought and move on. I never wanted us to be a club that was quick to give up on managers, and we still aren't, because we've given Jose years to make it work here.
You’re clearly on a wind up now. You’re either related to Jose, a Liverpool fan or Jose Mourinho himself.
Well considering we literally have an example to compare with at Chelsea, and Madrid are currently struggling in a 2 team league it's not overly difficult to conclude he wouldn't be sacked at this point.
Then there's the fact United do not sack managers on a whim. There clearly a set of targets and minimum expectations in place.
You and others being unable to handle this is your problem, not mine.
And this "anyone who's not frothing at the mouth to get Jose out is a Scouse wum" rhetoric is just sad. Considering some of those involved in this anti Jose circle jerk are desperate for United to lose, it's a bit rich to claim those supporting the club are Liverpool fans.
@Judas, if that's the case why is the current Madrid manager still in a job. Madrid do act fast, but not even they are this rash.
Fistly Pep would of sold De Gea as would of Klopp, In defence both would of change the full backs and centre backs, as would of Poch.
In midfield, all three would of kept Matic, Linguard, Mata,Herrera, would of been bombed out. Rashford would not be playing right wing, (so who would be playing there) Lukaku, would definitely not be leading the line (maybe Poch would be ok with Lukaku), and above all else the high intensity that Pep and Klopp require many of the players would struggle with, and all three would struggle with Pogba in the midfield, Pogba is no De Bruyne or Eriksen.
Mourinho's petulance is a result of wanting addtions, to allow the team to really push on, why did the club not try to offload players, to offset any outlays in purchases. The club could of tried to sell, Jones, Rojo, Herrera, even Mata, and get in a right winger and centre back, why did the club purchase Fred, if they had no intention of selling Herrera and then give Fellani a new contract.
City wont finish 19 points ahead of everyone again. Even this season I don't think they'll be that far ahead. Let's wait for this season to end. If they're 19 points ahead again than it'll be hard for anyone but I think it was a freak season and the gap will be smaller this season. Maybe 9/10 points at the maximum. This is the gap the other teams will have to close next season. if we strengthen our squad in 3 or 4 areas in the summer we can compete with them. With current squad no but if we spend well in the summer of course yes.
Us not finishing in top 4 or even midtable doesn't affect this because we've agreed that the squad had the quality to finish 2nd last season and our current position is not a true reflection.
I don’t think that anyone who is ‘pro Jose’ is a Liverpool fan. I just think that you’re one and that you’re on a wind up in here.
Out of his depth at this level completely. In fact, I think he’s been worse than Moyes imo as he would only stunk the place for 7 months.
How was Chelsea much worse? He left on 20th September 2007. At that point, they had lost ONE game.
Question marks on Pogba? @abdo99, he's our best player by a mile.
Zlatan was great at exactly what he was supposed to be, a stop gap that allowed the club to spend big in other areas. These are two excellent signings.
Now there are certainly plenty of question marks with the rest, Matic helped us secure second though and we should have pushed on as a club from there as we were more attractive in June than we have been seen Fergie left. Whoever was manager in the Summer, imo it was an absolute disaster to not use that springboard of a "monster club back on the right track" to massively improve the squad.
Zlatan was great at exactly what he was supposed to be, a stop gap that allowed the club to spend big in other areas. These are two excellent signings.
Now there are certainly plenty of question marks with the rest, Matic helped us secure second though and we should have pushed on as a club from there as we were more attractive in June than we have been seen Fergie left. Whoever was manager in the Summer, imo it was an absolute disaster to not use that springboard of a "monster club back on the right track" to massively improve the squad.
Agree to disagree.
He's our best player of course but he's wasted in this team. There aren't question marks on him as a player but when we spend money on such a quality player I'd expect us to be a much improved team. We aren't. We still play the same boring disjointed football with Pogba than without. The question marks in this case are on the manager not Paul. At one point he's the best player in the game and the next point the team is drifting through the game and we're not affecting it in any way.
100 points was a freak and so is the 19 gap I agree, but to win the league you need to at least get 93-95 points. Chelsea also won the league in Conte season with a nearby number of points. The question is if we'll be able to get +90 points in a league campaign.
I don’t see how it can leave us in any worse position? We’re not getting relegated (which is a possibility under Jose) no matter the caretaker.
We stand no chance of getting top 4 with him either let alone challenge for anything significant.
So you just want to float about in the limbo were everyone is depressed (inc. the manager) until the of the end of the season?
Your example is totally off because we’re actually his employer and we’ll have a chance to sound out any alternatives while still having someone in charge (i.e. Carrick).
You couldn’t be more wrong in thinking that Carrick will be under any kind of pressure from the fans or media given the current situation, this season is a write off already and everyone acknowledges it.
Nothing to lose and everything to gain at this point.
Bear in mind I don’t disagree that we lack any kind of coherent planning but it doesn’t mean we should keep someone at the job who’s totally out of his depth. That’s just very flawed logic.
We need to find consistency against the smaller teams to do this. 81 points last year but stupid points dropped against Newcastle, West Brom, Huddersfield, Brighton etc. If we find the consistency in these games maybe.
Been clear for a while now, doesn’t even hide it well imo.
Maybe Zlatan required Jose considering we weren't in the CL, but Pogba could have been convinced by any top manager like Mourinho, Conte, Pep, Klopp etc. if we hired one of them and made a strong pitch.
Of course, Jose had pulling power considering he had won a league title just 2 years ago, but now he has fallen out with the only signing of his (Pogba) who appears to be a success and could be so long term.
Jose's first summer he said he has given Woody his list of 4 players, when we had signed 3 and where working on Pogba he did an interview to say he had gotten 3 and the club was trying to get the 4th. Stop peddling this nonsense
How the feck do you know all this? How about the lottery numbers?
I don't disagree with you, and made similar comments about many of them when they were signed. Most on here disagreed though, saying Mourinho had made some excellent signings, certainly comparing other top teams transfers, & only has the atmosphere towards these players changed in recent months.
I didn't feel so, so I assume any footballer who actually watch games would have figured out it's not true.
Whilst you can very likely attribute a fair amount of the 'Jose In' votes to oppo forum regulars (for obvious reasons), it would be harsh to suggest the votes are made by oppos in disguise.
Some fans simply believe he can and will turn it around. Fair do's.
Who did you have in mind?
- Status