The Modern / Current Players Draft

VivaJanuzaj said:
Are you guys really judging Song for his Westham days?
He was immense for Arsenal defensively before moving to Barcelona when they played a midfield trio of:
Song -- Wilshere
Fabregas​
Song was the most defensive midfielder there and he was incredible. Surely Pogba & Yaya offer more defensive help than Wilshere and Cesc do.
He's not exactly the water carrier as his team mates can definitely do a defensive job but before moving to Barca he was one of the best DMs in the world. For me he was just as good as Matic is today if not better.
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For me, the issue with your midfield is that all three are capable of taking over a game with a solid defensive partner next to them. All three of them want to be on the front foot and their first instinct is towards the oppositions goal than worrying about what is behind them.

And in the sample Arsenal midfield you brought up, the most recent Arsenal teams haven't exactly been built of on their defensive solidity, that starts with the centre of the midfield.

Even this season Diame has worked back, Noble does the majority of the running in the middle of the park and there is also Kouyate.
 
VivaJanuzaj said:
Are you guys really judging Song for his Westham days?
He was immense for Arsenal defensively before moving to Barcelona when they played a midfield trio of:
Song -- Wilshere
Fabregas​
Song was the most defensive midfielder there and he was incredible. Surely Pogba & Yaya offer more defensive help than Wilshere and Cesc do.
He's not exactly the water carrier as his team mates can definitely do a defensive job but before moving to Barca he was one of the best DMs in the world. For me he was just as good as Matic is today if not better.
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For the bits in bold, simply no.
 
Whose Pogba's partner which is so good defensively? Pirlo? Vidal? Neither of them are close to being DMs, yet they are a very sound midfield unit. How come? Because they all contribute to defense. You look at it as if "they're first instinct is to move forward", and that's fair, but they all play in a much weaker defensive shape and do well. Yaya in particular, he is being asked to play a much less defensive midfield role than he is in City.

I don't see any midfield easily getting the better of that offensively, or at all for that matter. 3 strong midfielders who all have a defensive instinct with Yaya being allowed the freedom to unleash his amazing attacking powers, and Song being instructed to play a little bit more conservative.

Mind you, that Song played that B2B role for Arsenal because of their playing style, when a team dominates possession so much the midfielders are bound to seem more aggressive as they will control possession higher up the pitch and seem more offensive. Song doesn't lack any skill necessary for a DM in his arsenal. I don't agree with the rash part, he does seem rash to me at Westham I'll give you that, but at his prime he was huge.
 
VivaJanuzaj said:
Whose Pogba's partner which is so good defensively? Pirlo? Vidal? Neither of them are close to being DMs, yet they are a very sound midfield unit. How come? Because they all contribute to defense. You look at it as if "they're first instinct is to move forward", and that's fair, but they all play in a much weaker defensive shape and do well. Yaya in particular, he is being asked to play a much less defensive midfield role than he is in City.

I don't see any midfield easily getting the better of that offensively, or at all for that matter. 3 strong midfielders who all have a defensive instinct with Yaya being allowed the freedom to unleash his amazing attacking powers, and Song being instructed to play a little bit more conservative.

Mind you, that Song played that B2B role for Arsenal because of their playing style, when a team dominates possession so much the midfielders are bound to seem more aggressive as they will control possession higher up the pitch and seem more offensive. Song doesn't lack any skill necessary for a DM in his arsenal. I don't agree with the rash part, he does seem rash to me at Westham I'll give you that, but at his prime he was huge.
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I will save the main arguments for the match day thread, but pogba does normally play in a 5-3-2 or a 4-4-2(with marchiso,vidal and pirlo). Having three midfielders all of whom are strong defensively or an extra man in defense makes a great deal of difference.

You can play barca's yaya but I feel the city one is one of the best midfielders in the world and you would be better serve not curbing his natural attacking game for lesser midfielders(comparatively) in pogba and song.
 
  1. Pat_Mustard: 1. Xavi 2. Villa 3. Dani Alves 4. Barzagli 5. Verratti
  2. Raees: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Hummels 3. Chiellini 4. De Jong 5. Gundogan
  3. Physiocrat: 1. Robben 2. Fabregas 3. J. Boateng 4. Wilshere 5. Alba
  4. MJJ: 1. Kaká 2. Torres 3. Essien 4. Matic 5. Pique
  5. Stobzilla: 1. Lahm 2. Alaba 3. Vidal 4. Rooney 5. Turan
  6. The Red Viper: 1. Iniesta 2. Terry 3. Neymar 4. Van Persie 5. Hargreaves
  7. Isotope: 1. Suárez 2. Eto'o 3. Mascherano 4. Pepe 5. Koke
  8. Theon: 1. Schweinsteiger 2. Ibrahimovic 3. Sánchez 4. Sneijder 5. De Gea
  9. BorisDeLedFora: 1. Vidic 2. Kompany 3. De Rossi 4. Cavani 5. Rakitic
  10. Snow: 1. Hazard 2. Modric 3. Busquets 4. Azpilicueta 5. Adriano 6. Thiago
  11. VivaJanuzaj: 1. Thiago Silva 2. Yaya Touré 3. Ivanovic 4. Pogba 5. Gotze 6. Alex Song
  12. NoPace: 1. Kroos 2. Reus 3. Ramos 4. Di María 5. King 6. Falcao
  13. Barney: 1. Gerrard 2. Alonso 3. Martínez 4. Benatia 5. Zabaleta 6. Ricardo Rodriguez
  14. Skizzo: 1. Müller 2. Evra 3. Godín 4. David Silva 5. Miranda 6. Sterling
  15. crappycraperson: 1. Ribery 2. Agüero 3. Varane 4. Carrick 5. Vertonghen 6. Cech
  16. NM: 1. Bale 2. Cole 3. Maicon 4. Cambiasso 5. James Rodriguez 6. Courtois
 
Going to recreate a proven combination here.

Marek Hamsik.

  1. Pat_Mustard: 1. Xavi 2. Villa 3. Dani Alves 4. Barzagli 5. Verratti
  2. Raees: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Hummels 3. Chiellini 4. De Jong 5. Gundogan
  3. Physiocrat: 1. Robben 2. Fabregas 3. J. Boateng 4. Wilshere 5. Alba
  4. MJJ: 1. Kaká 2. Torres 3. Essien 4. Matic 5. Pique
  5. Stobzilla: 1. Lahm 2. Alaba 3. Vidal 4. Rooney 5. Turan
  6. The Red Viper: 1. Iniesta 2. Terry 3. Neymar 4. Van Persie 5. Hargreaves
  7. Isotope: 1. Suárez 2. Eto'o 3. Mascherano 4. Pepe 5. Koke
  8. Theon: 1. Schweinsteiger 2. Ibrahimovic 3. Sánchez 4. Sneijder 5. De Gea
  9. BorisDeLedFora: 1. Vidic 2. Kompany 3. De Rossi 4. Cavani 5. Rakitic 6. Hamsik
  10. Snow: 1. Hazard 2. Modric 3. Busquets 4. Azpilicueta 5. Adriano 6. Thiago
  11. VivaJanuzaj: 1. Thiago Silva 2. Yaya Touré 3. Ivanovic 4. Pogba 5. Gotze 6. Alex Song
  12. NoPace: 1. Kroos 2. Reus 3. Ramos 4. Di María 5. King 6. Falcao
  13. Barney: 1. Gerrard 2. Alonso 3. Martínez 4. Benatia 5. Zabaleta 6. Ricardo Rodriguez
  14. Skizzo: 1. Müller 2. Evra 3. Godín 4. David Silva 5. Miranda 6. Sterling
  15. crappycraperson: 1. Ribery 2. Agüero 3. Varane 4. Carrick 5. Vertonghen 6. Cech
  16. NM: 1. Bale 2. Cole 3. Maicon 4. Cambiasso 5. James Rodriguez 6. Courtois
@Theon
 
Hamsik is a very weird player. There are games where you watch him play and wonder how the flying feck has no big team gone for him and then there are games where you watch him play and think how the feck is he starting for Napoli. Though I like the fact that you have re-united Hamsik with Cavani. That helps as Hamsik played his best playing off Cavani.
 
The Red Viper said:
Hamsik is a very weird player. There are games where you watch him play and wonder how the flying feck has no big team gone for him and then there are games where you watch him play and think how the feck is he starting for Napoli. Though I like the fact that you have re-united Hamsik with Cavani. That helps as Hamsik played his best playing off Cavani.
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I think they're both incredibly overrated.
 
Raees said:
I think they're both incredibly overrated.
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I don't think Hamsik is, TRV's explanation sums it up really well. Cavani is massively overrated IMO, thought so when he was in Napoli too and although he played really good against Chelsea(if it wasn't for Courtois he'd have a hattrick with 3 very good headers), he's proving time and time again for PSG that he's not good enough of a goal threat on his own
 
VivaJanuzaj said:
I don't think Hamsik is, TRV's explanation sums it up really well. Cavani is massively overrated IMO, thought so when he was in Napoli too and although he played really good against Chelsea(if it wasn't for Courtois he'd have a hattrick with 3 very good headers), he's proving time and time again for PSG that he's not good enough of a goal threat on his own
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Every time I have seen him he strikes me as decent technically and in terms of his engine but there were much better players for Boris to still pick from. Cavani has great workrate but they're both just very average footballers.
 
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Raees said:
I think they're both incredibly overrated.
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:lol:

Fair enough.

I would argue that they were a key part of a fairly successful Napoli team that played in a similar style to what I am trying to recreate, and they both player their best football in that period. At Napoli Cavani scored 104 goals in 138 games, 0.75 per game, whilst in that period Hamsik reached double figures as well.
 
Such a shame The Clown narrowly misses :(

3/11/79, he would tear this one up :annoyed:
 
Sorry guys. Theon pmd me but I was already sleeping
 
Raees said:
Every time I have seen him he strikes me as decent technically and in terms of his engine but there were much better players for Boris to still pick from. Cavani has great workrate but they're both just very average footballers.
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And when have you caught him then as judging him for PSG isn't very accurate. PSG had the same dilemma as we did, they had two strikers who weren't necessarily a great fit and they reacted by playing one of them, Cavani, out of position.

He runs like he is possessed all game long though and for Napoli he actually scored figures that only a rare few would top in terms of a 3 year peak. 104 goals in 138 matches, versus someone like Aguero who has 97 goals in 150 games since coming to City. Suarez scored 82 goals in 133 matches for Liverpool etc.

The only one who stands out above the rest in terms of goalscoring in a 3 year peak is Zlatan I believe with his 1:1 goalscoring ratio(slightly less). I don't think Cavani should be judged due to how he is performing for PSG, he's a striker and he's played out wide - which works - but it isn't his ideal role at all.

He just runs so much and works so hard it becomes viable to play him there at all.
 
Annahnomoss said:
And when have you caught him then as judging him for PSG isn't very accurate. PSG had the same dilemma as we did, they had two strikers who weren't necessarily a great fit and they reacted by playing one of them, Cavani, out of position.

He runs like he is possessed all game long though and for Napoli he actually scored figures that only a rare few would top in terms of a 3 year peak. 104 goals in 138 matches, versus someone like Aguero who has 97 goals in 150 games since coming to City. Suarez scored 82 goals in 133 matches for Liverpool etc.

The only one who stands out above the rest in terms of goalscoring in a 3 year peak is Zlatan I believe with his 1:1 goalscoring ratio(slightly less). I don't think Cavani should be judged due to how he is performing for PSG, he's a striker and he's played out wide - which works - but it isn't his ideal role at all.

He just runs so much and works so hard it becomes viable to play him there at all.
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It isn't just about statistics, to the naked eye he is just not that great a striker at the highest level. He is average at best. Napoli was his level and he did well but god forbid if United ended up buying him to replace Falcao and RVP.

I appreciate the fact he is playing out of position but the times I have seen him up front, he didn't impress me all that much. He's solid but when I see the prices that are usually associated with him I can't help but laugh.
 
Annahnomoss said:
And when have you caught him then as judging him for PSG isn't very accurate. PSG had the same dilemma as we did, they had two strikers who weren't necessarily a great fit and they reacted by playing one of them, Cavani, out of position.

He runs like he is possessed all game long though and for Napoli he actually scored figures that only a rare few would top in terms of a 3 year peak. 104 goals in 138 matches, versus someone like Aguero who has 97 goals in 150 games since coming to City. Suarez scored 82 goals in 133 matches for Liverpool etc.

The only one who stands out above the rest in terms of goalscoring in a 3 year peak is Zlatan I believe with his 1:1 goalscoring ratio(slightly less). I don't think Cavani should be judged due to how he is performing for PSG, he's a striker and he's played out wide - which works - but it isn't his ideal role at all.

He just runs so much and works so hard it becomes viable to play him there at all.
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Raees said:
It isn't just about statistics, to the naked eye he is just not that great a striker at the highest level. He is average at best. Napoli was his level and he did well but god forbid if United ended up buying him to replace Falcao and RVP.

I appreciate the fact he is playing out of position but the times I have seen him up front, he didn't impress me all that much. He's solid but when I see the prices that are usually associated with him I can't help but laugh.
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Well when Zlatan was injured earlier this year, Cavani wasn't too good "in position"
 
  1. Pat_Mustard: 1. Xavi 2. Villa 3. Dani Alves 4. Barzagli 5. Verratti
  2. Raees: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Hummels 3. Chiellini 4. De Jong 5. Gundogan
  3. Physiocrat: 1. Robben 2. Fabregas 3. J. Boateng 4. Wilshere 5. Alba
  4. MJJ: 1. Kaká 2. Torres 3. Essien 4. Matic 5. Pique
  5. Stobzilla: 1. Lahm 2. Alaba 3. Vidal 4. Rooney 5. Turan
  6. The Red Viper: 1. Iniesta 2. Terry 3. Neymar 4. Van Persie 5. Hargreaves
  7. Isotope: 1. Suárez 2. Eto'o 3. Mascherano 4. Pepe 5. Koke 6. Chivu
  8. Theon: 1. Schweinsteiger 2. Ibrahimovic 3. Sánchez 4. Sneijder 5. de Gea 6. Koscielny
  9. BorisDeLedFora: 1. Vidic 2. Kompany 3. De Rossi 4. Cavani 5. Rakitic
  10. Snow: 1. Hazard 2. Modric 3. Busquets 4. Azpilicueta 5. Adriano 6. Thiago
  11. VivaJanuzaj: 1. Thiago Silva 2. Yaya Touré 3. Ivanovic 4. Pogba 5. Gotze 6. Alex Song
  12. NoPace: 1. Kroos 2. Reus 3. Ramos 4. Di María 5. King 6. Falcao
  13. Barney: 1. Gerrard 2. Alonso 3. Martínez 4. Benatia 5. Zabaleta 6. Ricardo Rodriguez
  14. Skizzo: 1. Müller 2. Evra 3. Godín 4. D. Silva 5. Miranda 6. Sterling
  15. crappycraperson: 1. Ribery 2. Agüero 3. Varane 4. Carrick 5. Vertonghen 6. Petr Cech
  16. NM: 1. Bale 2. Cole 3. Maicon 4. Cambiasso 5. James Rodriguez 6. Courtois
 
Edgar Allan Pillow said:
  1. Pat_Mustard: 1. Xavi 2. Villa 3. Dani Alves 4. Barzagli 5. Verratti
  2. Raees: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Hummels 3. Chiellini 4. De Jong 5. Gundogan
  3. Physiocrat: 1. Robben 2. Fabregas 3. J. Boateng 4. Wilshere 5. Alba
  4. MJJ: 1. Kaká 2. Torres 3. Essien 4. Matic 5. Pique
  5. Stobzilla: 1. Lahm 2. Alaba 3. Vidal 4. Rooney 5. Turan
  6. The Red Viper: 1. Iniesta 2. Terry 3. Neymar 4. Van Persie 5. Hargreaves
  7. Isotope: 1. Suárez 2. Eto'o 3. Mascherano 4. Pepe 5. Koke 6. Chivu
  8. Theon: 1. Schweinsteiger 2. Ibrahimovic 3. Sánchez 4. Sneijder 5. de Gea 6. Koscielny
  9. BorisDeLedFora: 1. Vidic 2. Kompany 3. De Rossi 4. Cavani 5. Rakitic
  10. Snow: 1. Hazard 2. Modric 3. Busquets 4. Azpilicueta 5. Adriano 6. Thiago
  11. VivaJanuzaj: 1. Thiago Silva 2. Yaya Touré 3. Ivanovic 4. Pogba 5. Gotze 6. Alex Song
  12. NoPace: 1. Kroos 2. Reus 3. Ramos 4. Di María 5. King 6. Falcao
  13. Barney: 1. Gerrard 2. Alonso 3. Martínez 4. Benatia 5. Zabaleta 6. Ricardo Rodriguez
  14. Skizzo: 1. Müller 2. Evra 3. Godín 4. D. Silva 5. Miranda 6. Sterling
  15. crappycraperson: 1. Ribery 2. Agüero 3. Varane 4. Carrick 5. Vertonghen 6. Petr Cech
  16. NM: 1. Bale 2. Cole 3. Maicon 4. Cambiasso 5. James Rodriguez 6. Courtois
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You missed Hamsik for Boris.
  1. Pat_Mustard: 1. Xavi 2. Villa 3. Dani Alves 4. Barzagli 5. Verratti
  2. Raees: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Hummels 3. Chiellini 4. De Jong 5. Gundogan
  3. Physiocrat: 1. Robben 2. Fabregas 3. J. Boateng 4. Wilshere 5. Alba
  4. MJJ: 1. Kaká 2. Torres 3. Essien 4. Matic 5. Pique
  5. Stobzilla: 1. Lahm 2. Alaba 3. Vidal 4. Rooney 5. Turan
  6. The Red Viper: 1. Iniesta 2. Terry 3. Neymar 4. Van Persie 5. Hargreaves
  7. Isotope: 1. Suárez 2. Eto'o 3. Mascherano 4. Pepe 5. Koke 6. Chivu
  8. Theon: 1. Schweinsteiger 2. Ibrahimovic 3. Sánchez 4. Sneijder 5. de Gea 6. Koscielny
  9. BorisDeLedFora: 1. Vidic 2. Kompany 3. De Rossi 4. Cavani 5. Rakitic 6.Hamsik
  10. Snow: 1. Hazard 2. Modric 3. Busquets 4. Azpilicueta 5. Adriano 6. Thiago
  11. VivaJanuzaj: 1. Thiago Silva 2. Yaya Touré 3. Ivanovic 4. Pogba 5. Gotze 6. Alex Song
  12. NoPace: 1. Kroos 2. Reus 3. Ramos 4. Di María 5. King 6. Falcao
  13. Barney: 1. Gerrard 2. Alonso 3. Martínez 4. Benatia 5. Zabaleta 6. Ricardo Rodriguez
  14. Skizzo: 1. Müller 2. Evra 3. Godín 4. D. Silva 5. Miranda 6. Sterling
  15. crappycraperson: 1. Ribery 2. Agüero 3. Varane 4. Carrick 5. Vertonghen 6. Petr Cech
  16. NM: 1. Bale 2. Cole 3. Maicon 4. Cambiasso 5. James Rodriguez 6. Courtois
 

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MARCELO
​
 
  1. Pat_Mustard: 1. Xavi 2. Villa 3. Dani Alves 4. Barzagli 5. Verratti
  2. Raees: 1. Ronaldinho 2. Hummels 3. Chiellini 4. De Jong 5. Gundogan
  3. Physiocrat: 1. Robben 2. Fabregas 3. J. Boateng 4. Wilshere 5. Alba
  4. MJJ: 1. Kaká 2. Torres 3. Essien 4. Matic 5. Pique
  5. Stobzilla: 1. Lahm 2. Alaba 3. Vidal 4. Rooney 5. Turan
  6. The Red Viper: 1. Iniesta 2. Terry 3. Neymar 4. Van Persie 5. Hargreaves 6. Marcelo
  7. Isotope: 1. Suárez 2. Eto'o 3. Mascherano 4. Pepe 5. Koke 6. Chivu
  8. Theon: 1. Schweinsteiger 2. Ibrahimovic 3. Sánchez 4. Sneijder 5. De Gea 6. Koscielny
  9. BorisDeLedFora: 1. Vidic 2. Kompany 3. De Rossi 4. Cavani 5. Rakitic 6. Hamsik
  10. Snow: 1. Hazard 2. Modric 3. Busquets 4. Azpilicueta 5. Adriano 6. Thiago
  11. VivaJanuzaj: 1. Thiago Silva 2. Yaya Touré 3. Ivanovic 4. Pogba 5. Gotze 6. Alex Song
  12. NoPace: 1. Kroos 2. Reus 3. Ramos 4. Di María 5. Ledley King 6. Falcao
  13. Barney: 1. Gerrard 2. Alonso 3. Martínez 4. Benatia 5. Zabaleta 6. Ricardo Rodriguez
  14. Skizzo: 1. Müller 2. Evra 3. Godín 4. D. Silva 5. Miranda 6. Sterling
  15. crappycraperson: 1. Ribery 2. Agüero 3. Varane 4. Carrick 5. Vertonghen 6. Cech
  16. NM: 1. Bale 2. Cole 3. Maicon 4. Cambiasso 5. James Rodriguez 6. Courtois
 
Barney said:
Nice pick. He was my backup to Rodriguez.
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Why, if it's not a secret? There aren't that many great brazilians here, and Ronaldinho, Kaka, Silva and Neymar are already taken. And Marcelo is superior to Rodriguez both defensively (both aren't great tbf, but Rodriguez is worse) and offensively.

Or is it because he is your 90's player?
 
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