Another thing that just crossed my mind. What would these players make of someone like Ten Haag if we hired him? He’s a promising coach with loads of potential, but he’s not coached in the big leagues (no disrespect to Ajax). He’s definitely no Sir AF or Pep in terms of pedigree. Would the players respond to him, or would we see the same moaning and complaining starting after a few weeks?
The general attitude of our players
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I am beginning to hate our players. It takes a lot for me to do that but this bunch is really coming close
There had been no cup victories, nor league winning for these players, I concede. But that does not mean they have suddenly turned worthless. That is my point.
Embarrassing isn't it. I'd work whatever time if it meant earning the sort of money they get.
I think it’s plain to see that we can no longer only blame the manager. The players have displayed a poor attitude for a number of years. For me the very fact that they have to be told to run more is a disgrace. One thing that they should be doing at a bare minimum is give there all, we can argue about if they good enough but the lack of effort which is apparent it unforgivable.
Hopefully we can kick out the black sheeps and install a better mentality next season. Embarrassing
Those useless feckers
Seriously the first player that complains should have their contract terminated. Why have they not been working until 5pm before now? All these years of failure they have been finishing early?No doubt they want to be home before dark to watch tiktok videos.
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A nice cleansing fire in the summer hopefully.
They see what a foundation of hard work can do for teams like City and Liverpool and they think "Nah, not arsed." and they get away with it because Old Trafford coddles them.
This is it.
They see what a foundation of hard work can do for teams like City and Liverpool and they think "Nah, not arsed." and they get away with it because Old Trafford coddles them.
I’m getting there myself, which takes a lot. Ole did a lot wrong and should have been tossed out a long time before he did, but since then we’ve seen a new manager come in and there’s been nothing. There’s barely been any more effort shown. There isn’t any drive or desire to try to salvage what has been a period of severe underperformance.
The bare minimum you ask for at a time like this is effort and we aren’t getting it on the field. Going by the manager’s words after the matches, and the way he looked during the match, this isn’t what he wants either.
I think one of the challenges we've got is teaching players to just make runs to drag their man out of position. It's okay to not get the ball passed to you whenever you make a run, if it helps someone else get in a better position.
Selfless play. We mess up an awful lot of attacking positions because we fail to pass to a teammate in a better position. Ronaldo has always been this way so I think we all kind of expect it (and tbf he has earned the right to be greedy).
But Rashford and Greenwood etc all need to cherish assists. We simply don’t have enough players who sacrifice for the team. We always had them over the years in and around the squad.
Fantastic post!
Should introduce performance related pay. For every good value add decision and outcome on the fields you get a bump. For anything thats thoughtless and negative to the team and the play, you get nothing or docked.
They don’t seem motivated by winning, climbing the table or anything we would think. So, take their guaranteed cash away. See if that makes them wake up.
They don’t seem motivated by winning, climbing the table or anything we would think. So, take their guaranteed cash away. See if that makes them wake up.
Read on The Athletic that Rashford, Ronaldo and Matic headed straight for the tunnel and didn't acknowledge our 3,000 traveling fans.
Ole builds a squad overflowing with "United DNA".
Also a squad that gets upset when you try and make them train in the dark.
Squad needs properly gutted. And the only cultural reset we need is on our wage structure.
Hopefully we're at least guaranteed to get rid of Pogba and Lingard in the near future. Then we get started turfing out the other no marks on hyperinflated wages like Martial and Henderson.
Also a squad that gets upset when you try and make them train in the dark.
Squad needs properly gutted. And the only cultural reset we need is on our wage structure.
Hopefully we're at least guaranteed to get rid of Pogba and Lingard in the near future. Then we get started turfing out the other no marks on hyperinflated wages like Martial and Henderson.
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If you think of some of the goals we've conceded in recent years. The regular careless maguire touch, the cowardly pogba handball v west ham, the de gea stubbed toe v arsenal. There are plenty more examples if i put my mind to it i think we could get a truly embarrassing list that speaks to players who simply don't have that edge of the best
They train in the dark. If they can learn to pass to each other without any spotlights imagine in real games
You know what's more infuriating about all this?
That for 30 minutes vs. Palace we had the best press I've seen from a United team in about a decade! In a fecking decade! And since? Possibly the worst I've seen from them. How is it possible to go from such a brilliant instance of it to not at all?
It's not as if Ralf is telling them to not do it.
Ralf: More of what you did against Palace, please!
The squad:
That for 30 minutes vs. Palace we had the best press I've seen from a United team in about a decade! In a fecking decade! And since? Possibly the worst I've seen from them. How is it possible to go from such a brilliant instance of it to not at all?
It's not as if Ralf is telling them to not do it.
Ralf: More of what you did against Palace, please!
The squad:
Looks like we are only kind of pregnant…
Also that’s where Klopp and Edwards have wiped the floor with us and everyone else. They found competitors first and foremost that don’t seem to need the reassurance of league leading wages to feel “valued”
I hope Ralf pulls the carpet from underneath these guys. We need warriors sprinkled with a little bit of quality and not the other way around
Also that’s where Klopp and Edwards have wiped the floor with us and everyone else. They found competitors first and foremost that don’t seem to need the reassurance of league leading wages to feel “valued”
I hope Ralf pulls the carpet from underneath these guys. We need warriors sprinkled with a little bit of quality and not the other way around
Also, all this reminds me of the time when those cnuts refused to check Louis van Gaal's emails with the video analysis in them for each player. That pissed me right off because look now; everyone is doing video analysis review. LvG was instituting that back in 2014/15! Because of some pampered players, the club couldn't modernise under LvG as it could have, and we wouldn't be so far behind the curve now.
Just having a laugh now.
Rangnick doesn't look soft, he pretty much has his hands tied as he's just the interim manager, so it's an uphill battle to get the players to put in a shift. If they don't want to, there's nothing much he can do this season, especially with no real leadership in the dressing room. It will take more than a couple of weeks to undo what's been allowed in years and even if he fails to do so, I'm confident that he'll do his job upstairs.
First and foremost is to find (or buy) a leader who can reign in the dressing room, secondly to get rid asap of the players who want to leave as they're understandably much likely to create a rift. Same for players who are surplus to requirements and should've never been extended in the first time. It also seems to be that a number of players are also dissatisfied with their game time, so they need to know in no uncertain terms where they stand. Ole's allegedly false promises to these players have certainly played a big role in the latest dressing room atmosphere.
Whilst I personally think that RR was a great appointment, I think that you missed out on Conté, because even if he'd fallen out with the board later, he'd have drilled that lot into shape and wouldn't have taken shite from anyone in the dressing room. You'll absolutely need a (permanent) manager with a very strong personality, some trophies in his cabinet, and the full backing of of the board, to clear the dressing room out and undo the rent seeking behaviour that has festered since SAF left. The players need to be reminded what it means to play for one of the biggest clubs in the world, but it can only come when the board considers anything else as title challenge and a couple of trophies in season as a failure. Not top 4 and CL participation BS.
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The dressing room clique theory is interesting, I actually think there is one large central clique of mainly Spanish/Portuguese/Brazilian players who make up the majority of the dressing room and the remaining players are all individuals on the fringe.
The first group clearly exists as you can see it from all the social media interactions, meals out etc.
Because this is such a large, seemingly inclusive group it doesn't seem that damaging a scenario but the issue is it contains a lot of players who weren’t getting a chance under Ole (Telles, Bailly, Dalot, Mata) this likely created a strong sense of disharmony and unhappiness in the core group.
On the fringes you then have the individuals like Ronaldo, Pogba, Martial, most of the English players, who just treat playing for United as a well paying job rather than feeling part of a community - this also likely feeds into a weird fractured feel in the dressing room.
Just a theory of course, but it's clear things aren't right behind the scenes.
The first group clearly exists as you can see it from all the social media interactions, meals out etc.
Because this is such a large, seemingly inclusive group it doesn't seem that damaging a scenario but the issue is it contains a lot of players who weren’t getting a chance under Ole (Telles, Bailly, Dalot, Mata) this likely created a strong sense of disharmony and unhappiness in the core group.
On the fringes you then have the individuals like Ronaldo, Pogba, Martial, most of the English players, who just treat playing for United as a well paying job rather than feeling part of a community - this also likely feeds into a weird fractured feel in the dressing room.
Just a theory of course, but it's clear things aren't right behind the scenes.
All I can say is I thank God we didn't play Brighton and Brentford when we did. Both teams are exactly the type of team we'd normally struggle against in the best of times and in the current circumstances would've badly exposed us.
I don't think there are any big cliques, there are lots of little ones. Bruno/Fred/Telles/Dalot. Mata/De Gea. Rashford/Lingard.
Our key players don't seem to like each other. Ronaldo, Bruno, Maguire and De Gea. Or at least, they're not keen on each other and they all hate Maguire. And Ronaldo/Bruno seem to have a real contempt growing for Rashford/Greenwood.
I disagree that there's any real dislike considering Bruno annoyingly tried to find Rashford every time he made a run, no matter how difficult and unlikely it was to come off. I say this having been of the opinion prior to the last game that Bruno and all portuguese players have a mental block when it come to Ronaldo. He's their idol and they seem to try and find him regardless of other options - it limits Portugal and seems to be limiting us too. While the long balls annoyed me, it was refreshing to see Bruno actively looking to feed Rashford with Ronaldo on the pitch.
For his part, you could say Ronaldo is more accommodating of Bruno than the rest of the players, period, he death stares anyone else. And of course no one questions Ronaldo himself.
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Something I always found weird - really random too. When Martial used to play, even when he stunk up the place, no one ever seemed to give him an earful.
Yeah a right bunch of mollycoddled divas which won't do their image any favours
Ronaldo does this 30x a game. Our players are just too shit to see it.
This thread is a good example of what's wrong and quite how fecked we actually are. Fred, Rashford etc simply get the weight wrong on passes over and over and over and over again.
Rashford himself makes runs like that every single game, its why he gets on the ball so often to lose it. Cavani got picked out for a couple of chances in 45 minutes too, it's a low bar if that is Ronaldo's highlight reel from the game.
They've had free reign for so long playing that improvised style, it's understandably made some of them less capable of actually applying themselves to a set of instructions. Throw in a run a patchy form and you get a rather frustrated footballer.
The attitude of the players is the same as the attitude of the board.They don't give a feck about what is happening on the pitch.
This is exactly what my point was, and why we need 2 cms who can complete those passes. It's where alot of frustrations coming from and Brunos as bad as Fred and Rashford and Mctominay half the time with his passing.
Well it was dark so they probably wanted to get home.
Don't be sarcastic! It was really really dark!
Now I get why we are so poor when we are playing the evening.
Now explain me why we are so poor when playing afternoon…is it always raining or windy or a bit cold ?
Rangnick should program another shift at 10pm as well.
This. We have lost that army-like sense of unit discipline for way too long while other clubs built theirs over time, and it's time to go back to that by all means necessary. I would even sacrifice goats to get Roy Keane in so he can knock sense (litterally) into players' brains.
If the lazy blokes among the players think that Rangnick is locked in with them, they are grossly wrong. They are the ones locked in with him, a man who will make sure their lives will be miserable when their sense of comfort will be lost forever.
This is why I sympathise with Ronnie behaving like such a twat at the end of games.
He's played with Scholes and Rooney, then Modric and Kroos, and then Pjanic and Dybala (quite a step down there). And now he has Fred and Rashford. It'd boil your piss to want to win a game of football and have those clowns trying to weight passes into you after 15 years of the best midfielders supplying you.
I was talking with some mates about this and we raised this idea, parallel to the ‘not being held to account’ argument is that they have never been ‘punished’ for failure.
The likes of Salah and KdB have failed at big clubs and then had to go back and rebuild their reputations. The likes of Kane etc went out on loan to lower league clubs to taste ‘real’ football.
The likes of McT, Rashford and Greenwood should have been sent out on loan to play 40-50 games a season in The Championship and faced the physical nature of that league, before being given the reigns at Man Utd’s first team. But they weren’t, they’ve been ‘raised’ on a fast-track pathway for any decent academy prospect (remembering a Rashford wasn’t the No.1 prospect from the academy at the time he made his debut) and then been left in 1st team roles that they’re not ready either physically or mentally for. Then on top of that, when they’ve done ‘OK’, with sporadic good performances, they get new contracts at a bump of 50-100k a week extra!
These players haven’t had to break a sweat to end up in the United 1st team and now we’re seeing the dirty side of that.
The likes of Salah and KdB have failed at big clubs and then had to go back and rebuild their reputations. The likes of Kane etc went out on loan to lower league clubs to taste ‘real’ football.
The likes of McT, Rashford and Greenwood should have been sent out on loan to play 40-50 games a season in The Championship and faced the physical nature of that league, before being given the reigns at Man Utd’s first team. But they weren’t, they’ve been ‘raised’ on a fast-track pathway for any decent academy prospect (remembering a Rashford wasn’t the No.1 prospect from the academy at the time he made his debut) and then been left in 1st team roles that they’re not ready either physically or mentally for. Then on top of that, when they’ve done ‘OK’, with sporadic good performances, they get new contracts at a bump of 50-100k a week extra!
These players haven’t had to break a sweat to end up in the United 1st team and now we’re seeing the dirty side of that.
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