I don't understand why Woodward would brief the press over this, surely this will just cause animosity.
The beginning of the end... (the original board vetoed Mourinho's transfer wish list thread)
- Thread starter charlenefan
- Start date
The Varane thing is a stupid thing to make public, is it any wonder the club get fleeced by everyone across Europe
So what was the second signing he would have liked:
"I would like two more players. I don't think I'm going to have two," he said. "I think it's possible I'm going to have one.
Maybe he wanted two CB's?
They got conned good and properAll that noise and 'leaks' about PSG probably got Ed in a panic, who probably didn't want to start shopping for a new manager.
He should have been more clever though as Jose did the exact same thing in his last season at Chelsea.
Yup.
PSG were never interest, it was obvious we got played by him and Mendes.
Different times tho, mate.
Just look at the CB's and their level given the age. Young CB's lack experience and are really hard to break into top sides that require a lot of concentration and to be at high level all the time.
Jose's teams have always based on a solid backline, it's where it starts. He recalled Jorge Costa from loan at Porto, bought Carvalho at Chelsea, Lucio at Inter, Carvalho at Real and converted Ramos as CB. All experienced choices and players he's comfortable working with.
Having an experienced CB who you trust is vital for Jose. He doesn't trust either Smalling or Jones IMO and it's for a reason.
Yeah because buying ready made players has worked out terribly for Madrid. 4 European cups in 5 years and the most successful team in history.
At least it's something.Again mate if true then the issues detailed in these rumours are no different to what happens at the vast majority of football clubs throughout history. If you have read any of SAF's books this sort of stuff happened to him regularly under Edwards especially.
I don't think it necessarily the club undermining a manager. But more two different perspectives on one goal clashing. Mourinho thinking only about the football side when he identifies targets and Woodward etc looking at those targets from a business perspective.
If people seriously think Alderweireld is short term then please give me a list of players better than him for less/similar money?
Especially since we saw first hand how good he can be. Then again there are other CBs out there, who we could sign.
This is exactly my viewpoint. I'm not expecting a lot from this season and if the "end" is the end of Mourinho's tenure then that is what I expect it to be. But I'm glad we didn't spend £65m on Alderweireld when I don't think it would have made that much difference.
To me this is unacceptable. But i'd have more sympathy for Jose then the board as it's the board who have final say and they've wrecked our season. People forget we started last season well...it was shown that we are NOT good enough. We don't have enough game changers. City added to their options and we talked about value. Mentally we are not in a position to challenge City and we risk falling further behind because of this complete stupidity. If we had have signed Mahrez and Mane a few seasons back, we'd be a much better squad but we did nothing. We are uncertain at this point with a manager who maybe play a kid or two but we're in a bad way. Shaw and Valencia are not suddenly going to turn into players who get more then a handful of assists a season....our lack of width/pace out wide to get in behind is killing us. When teams sit back, we don't have the quality or mentality and maybe even sometimes belief/confidence to break them down.
Last edited:
Why are 28 year old players suddenly seen as "over the hill"? You can easily get 4-5 years of top quality from them.
And what if Jose wanted to play 3 CB's at the back, compared to last season? It isn't his job to identify targets or line up.
It isn't just Toby there were around 5 CB's that he briefed we turned our noses on. Hell even Boateng is better than either Jones or Smalling - not being a donkey with the ball.
Yes i had no idea who he was before his mom display against us.
Manolas perhaps? Not necessarily better though.
So what is the choice? Do we wait for Varane to become available or should we get the next best available defender ? I think the latter is more logical. To let the club fall behind it's competitors is more fiscally irresponsible in the long term than spending big money on a world class defender who's 30 yrs old.
I think footballers peak sooner nowadays tbh with all the games they play.
Thread title is perfect. Really is beginning of the end and shows how appallingly bad we are run. If you don't support Jose's vision then don't give him a new contract.
Good.
They’re sick if spunking money on the likes of Lindelof, a player not good enough and needs upgrading 12 months later.
He’s happy with Jones and Smalling else he would have sold them by now and he bought Bailly and Lindelof, there’s also Rojo so the board must be wondering why he wants another cb.
They’re sick if spunking money on the likes of Lindelof, a player not good enough and needs upgrading 12 months later.
He’s happy with Jones and Smalling else he would have sold them by now and he bought Bailly and Lindelof, there’s also Rojo so the board must be wondering why he wants another cb.
Keylor Navas is the oldest player they signed since Mourinho left (age 27). Vast majority of them were signed 21-23. Even Modric and Kroos were 24-25 respectively.
It's an awful example.
Surely going by the logic 'the club' and Ed Woodward want Mourinho to see out his contract until 2020 too then? Because you can't argue that you're keeping the long term in mind to defend your lack of investing, and judge your manager on (not) delivering short term results in the meantime.
Another problem would be that sacking Mourinho if he keeps us in top 4 this year could cost the club 20+ million, which again would not be good value for money compared to simply keeping him until his contract is up.
Another problem would be that sacking Mourinho if he keeps us in top 4 this year could cost the club 20+ million, which again would not be good value for money compared to simply keeping him until his contract is up.
Rojo who's been given a new contract by Mourinho.
This is a clear sign of tension between the club and the manager. Think we’re in for a rough season folks.
Err no it’s not as many other posters have adequately explained.
And using Real Madrid as an example is thoroughly pointless.
Too many people are trying to turn our club into fecking Dortmund.
Wanting to buy top class players, rather than overpriced short-term fixes on average players makes sense until you remember that we are playing converted mediocre wingers as our first choice full-backs. The notion that there wasnt anyone available in the world who would be an improvement is laughable - especially if you add in the claim that we would have been willing to spend £100m on a CB.
I don't buy it at all.
I don't buy it at all.
I think if things were rosey with Jose and Ed they’d have given him the signings but I reckon JM is talking himself out of a job here at the minute for whatever reason, throwing decent players under the bus left and right, including his own fecking signings, falling out with everyone instead of trying to gee people up and have them run through walls for him... the club and players owe him nothing like...
I assumed the initial strategy when he came in would be to have a player in his prime as a starter and an exciting youngster as their understudy who would get plenty of game time... it’s not that far fetched. 60 million for Maguire though!!! So glad we didn’t go there, that just screams another shite post Fergie United signing that we won’t get the best out of or even know how to use or see how he’s any better than what we’ve got?
I hate that Liverpool’s big signings all of a sudden, while expensive, look like good well planned transfers that actually instantly improve them. they have longevity/resale all through the team on about 1/2 of the wages we are spending and the players seem to have some pride in the club and get on with the manager. Argh... Klopp is actually just In the process of doing a better job than Jose and it’ll be an actual fact this season. He started off with a far worse team than Jose stepped into and spent less since...That’s just how I feel now. It’s been so depressing and frustrating following us the last few years. Yeah I used to question Fergie a decent amount too but he always somehow pulled it out of the bag and got the job done. Ignoring Midfield etc etc...
this team needs a productive right winger and some kind of leader/win at all costs player on the pitch. the club need to stop signing average shite players with shit mentalities and giving them absolutely massive wages that scare a buying club off and ultimately their form here never deserves but there’s no incentive to do anything except tow the line, keep quiet and keep collecting the biggest wages of your life while the contract runs down. What’s the point in signing players like Shaw and Martial if you don’t have an arm around the shoulder kind of manager? Do the scouts scout, surely these lads personalities are checked before we spend so much on them? I actually doubt it now... Where’s the incentive to improve or fight for your place if the manager doesn’t really fancy you? It’s way too cushy and pc and nicely nicey here... and that’s just the painfully obvious stuff your average fan could see for the last 5 years. Rooney contract when even his biggest fan could see he was on the wane, signing Sanchez for the left with martial finally starting to shine (briefly) ,looking for a CB after signing 2 in the last 2 years (not much confidence going into a new season there Jose!), being linked to an average English CB for 60 million who we could have signed for 20 million 2 years ago, fellaini release clause, all our shit managerial appointments, “we can do things in the transfer market other clubs can only dream of” Herrera lawyers, not getting Thiago, Kroos etc etc meltdown over. Apologies, I needed that!
On the other hand I’m Looking forward to some football. I think an improved pogba lukaku Sanchez and martial could be worth another 10 points to us this season. Fred looks like a good signing. Do they still want to play for Jose? Can he coach and improve them? Can he inspire them? Can I handle another season listening to/looking at Jose moaning and then refusing to rotate or give new players a proper chance and tabloid click bait about pogba being unhappy the whole time. Argh! So conflicted. I’ll never stop supporting but it’s so depressing being a united fan right now. It’s hard watching something you love turn into a total shit show and a circus. : (
Last edited:
Surprised Jose’s list didnt include John Terry.
Ronaldo and Bale were both world record signings. If Woodward wants to break the world record and get Mbappe we'd be OK with it, some chance of that ever happening. Madrid spent massive money on any area they needed strengthening and always targeted the best players regardless of age. Their just aren't very many CB's in world football better than Toby who we could sign since all his gum flapping about Varane is just that.
This definitely isn't going to help his odds of being the first manager to go this season.
Do you lot remember when Sir Alex used to say the manager must be the most important person at a football club? Those were the days...
Got no idea. Might have been the case if we were going for a formation change. With the Martial issues there's a chance Mourinho changed his mind about the attacking signing but we would have needed to have sold him first.
Issue with Alderweireld was Spurs wanting £70M for someone who'll cost £25M in a year's time and has just come off an injury that kept him out a while. Not even City would pay that if they knew he'd be coming to them the following season for the lower price.
Woody also has an ego, it must suck when Jose always puts the pressure on him in press conferences.
I feel like I’ve heard the ‘ask my CEO’ type of line a lot from Jose when pressed for transfer news or the ‘I asked for x players and only got y’
It’s sll gonna kick off that’s pretty clear, we’ll drop a few points and the whole thing will blow open.
There's nothing even suggesting this is anything about full backs though. It's obviously about a CB. Mourinho hasn't looked for full-back since he's been here - Andy Robertson went to Liverpool last summer uncontested, Mendy went to City. Mourinho loves Young and Valencia - and he intended them to be first choice.
Because the club is getting shit on for being incompetent in the transfer market and Ed is taking the brunt of that blame. This press briefing puts the club and Ed in better light and essentially names Jose as a short-termist. It’s been a success too as the majority of fans appear to be siding with the club here.
Alder is nowhere as good as Varane, is 4 years older, and probably doesn't have any advertisement value (unlike Varane who was overhyped since he was 18 or so and was mentioned as the next big thing when it comes to defenders).
Saying that, I think that Alder would have become our best CB, though his stats surprisingly are not good at all. Wouldn't surprise me at all if Ed has data analysts under him who also look from that point of view.
Woodward hired him because at the time he was probably the only manager on the market, who could dig Woodward and the club out of a hole and save them financial penalties if they did not meet their sponsors requirements of not qualifying for the Champions League.
Failure would have cost the club financially and brought into question Woodward's past decision making with regard to the recruitment
not only of managers but players. ( This is the CEO who actually paid Everton more than they were originally asking for Fellaini ).
I suspect Woodward promised Jose the earth in financial backing in the transfer market and this would appear to be correct in the first 2 years. However, the contract has been saved for the time being. Now Woodward who has no previous knowledge of football suddenly if the press reports are correct feels that the playing side of the club does not need improving and this would appear to be contrary to the thoughts of the manager and certainly the view of a large number of supports
Has Woodward, ( Clearly if he has it must be with the clear backing of the owners ) reneged on promises made to Jose. Clearly as supporters we are not likely to have an answer to this question. However, if correct then I believe it will eventually be detrimental to the club for the following reasons. 1. The present manager will leave since no manager can build a side to his playing style if the board or CEO., are choosing the players. 2. Prospective future managers will question Woodward's and the boards integrity with regard what he and the board promise, thus top managers will not come. 3. As a result of 2 we will recruit a sub standard manager and effectively the playing side will be determined by the board or the CEO.
It's hard not to be cynical about the Glazers lining their pockets after today, and all the similar stories that have come out in the last hour or so certainly appear to be a damage limitation exercise from the club, but you're contradicting yourself a bit with your post.
We should be looking to bring in the big names, like you say, but that's not Mina, Maguire or Boateng. There just aren't many top CBs available or willing to move right now.
Also, the board have backed him with ready made players like Matic and Sanchez, and I'm sure they would have paid a hefty fee for Willian if Chelsea would sell. Bale was obviously the main target, but that dream ended when Ronaldo left for Juventus.
Personally, I'd like to see us go back to looking to develop young players with potential, and bring in the occasional star when the opportunity arises to help guide them.
The problem is you need a long term manager for that, and when we have signed these players recently it hasn't worked out - Shaw, Depay, even Martial.
We need to be more clever going forward, I don't know exactly how that looks, but to be honest I very much doubt Mourinho will be a part of it.
I wonder why the fans didn t see it coming
I'm not! Because it's easy to say that. If they don't back the manager then you have a problem. This is really about ££££. But by the same token, why a new central defender and not full back or winger? This nonsense should be nipped in the bud.
While it's true the club have backed Jose prior, that support has to continue else the supporters should ask why is the club looking to create a problem? If they feel we've too many defenders, LEARN how to sell players properly. Other then Blind, usually we sell for cheap.
The club and this value talk is a joke and even if the transfer market had been longer in England, we'd still be wasting out breath on these idiots looking to improve the squad. Forget names at this point. We just need new ideas to problems that won't go away. We needed players to CHALLENGE others to improve because it seems they prance about like show ponies in training and very few show signs of being able to improve as players.
Or maybe these over paid primadonnas will learn how to give proper width so that we can play to our full potential rather then struggle with teams that sit back. Naturally that would be the best solution but let's be realistic. We have become what Sir Alex warned against. Complacent. Because the owners bought into success. They have no idea what's required when it leaves you
And maybe they are right to talk about value but then I don't think it's right that they should have been allowed to purchase the club when they didn't have the money.....Now this is an 'Ed' vs Jose thing but they obviously back Ed else he would have been ignored. City and the like have destroyed the market but you have to compete or sell the club if you cannot compete else we risk becoming arsenal but with more commerical deals and better social media interaction.
Last edited: