I think it was pretty clear what the succession plan was when Van Gaal was hired, otherwise he would surely have brought along Kluivert as his number two.
The Argument for Giggs as our Next Manager
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I think it was pretty clear what the succession plan was when Van Gaal was hired, otherwise he would surely have brought along Kluivert as his number two.
It could well have been, but the question is whether it should have been. The odds of Giggs being a success are very low imo, and the fact that he is such a beloved legend, suggests that when he flounders, he will be given twice the amount of time to correct himself, which could be utterly disastrous.
I would take Giggs over Simeone any idea. Don't get me wrong, I think Simeone did a ridiculously brilliant job at Atlético but it's about getting a good fit which doesn't necessarily mean the most proven. By that I mean that Simeone, like Rafa and Mourinho are pragmatic managers who will come in and try to extract the most out of what we have by building a solid base. That is fine and even the best strategy at a club that is not expected to stand side by side with the best like Porto, Chelsea (2005-2006), Atlético Madrid or even Internazionale. But if you are going to call yourself one of the biggest clubs in the world with the resources we have, it is simply not acceptable to play like underdog like that. Giggs might turn out to be a disaster like Moyes but at least I know he won't have us approach games against the best sides like inferiors and I'd rather we fail with an approach befitting a big club than win like an underdog.
It would be a very bad move but he's jockeying for position by the looks of things. Fergie's pushing him and now Beckham. Maybe they'll sway the owners, and maybe they won't but if this were a horse race, the odds on Giggs would be quite short I would think.
Yep, that's the impression I get as well. Fergie, Becks, Gaz, Butty, Scholesy...all of them of course.
The only one that can really do that in a way similar to Ferguson is Simeone. However, he plays on the underdog trick a lot more then Ferguson did.
Here's a thing. Let's suppose the Glazers don't go with Giggs and appoint, say, Pep as Van Gaal's successor. Will they insist that Giggs remain as assistant even if Pep wants his own man? Van Gaal may have acquiesced but I wonder if the next man will be so keen.
A guy like Pep or Klopp may well take the LvG approach of retaining a native assistant, not sure about Simeone or Ancelotti. Woodward or the Glazers should certainly not get in the business of attempting to impose an assistant on the new manager.
The club wanted an ex player among the coaching staff. Doesn't mean he must be next in line for the manager.
Do not want him anywhere near the top spot. For the club and especially for him.
Is the Sunderland job still open? Maybe he could go there and show us something? 
I don't want to hate our Giggsy please don't make him our nr-uno . If this goes sour it's hard to blame the guy who tore them all apart
Of course, I'm assuming that Giggs will want to be the assistant of the next manager. I don't think he wants to be the perennial number two. He might do a Brian Kidd and sling his hook for another team if he doesn't get the manager's job. Bit of a gamble for United to appoint him despite the support from the old boys' network. To me, that's all a bit too incestuous. The good of the club comes first and if that means an ex-player gets his nose put out of joint, too bad.
Ten or fifteen years ago, I'd have been all for it but football has changed so rapidly. Back then Moyes would have been given another season, maybe two, to build his own team. But now, all things are weighed to the nth degree and the corporate United of 2015 cannot afford another error in picking a manager.
Imagine he gets the job but he's stinking the place out, we would probably give him a lot of time as a club legend. If managers like Guardiola are available employing him is a needless risk.
That's how it's working out, or seems to be.
I am all for the idea for grooming Giggs to be our next manager. If we want someone to grow with us, it has to be Giggs.
Pretty bold assumption there. Not saying they wouldnt be interested, but the notion that any manager in world football would just drop whatever job they are doing to come to United sounds pretty arrogant.
Its not so bold when you consider 2 of them are unemployed and Guardiola may be soon as well.
Really?.Sounds fickle to me.
Do you think Giggs has the "balls" to make tough decisions? tbh I don't know but I sure would not want to risk our future with him...though I may have been desperate enough to think of him before.
Why does it have to be Giggs and not, say Butt or Phil Neville? Because he was a better player, a far bigger name? We know that means nothing when it comes to management.
Because I am most impressed with how Giggs successfully adapt his game when he get into different ages, and against all odds, and how well he took care of himself over his long successful career at the top. That's the traits to become a good manager in my book. Plus he always sounds intelligent to me, someone who understand the game well and everyone look up to him.
So you think taking up Yoga means he's good enough to manage Man Utd ? Interesting.
I rather see Neville become our manager
So you think taking up Yoga is all Giggs did over his 20 years of success at the top? Interesting.
You specifically cited his ability to adapt and take care of himself during his career, which is why I raised the Yoga bit. Given his lack of experience as a manager, let alone at a top club, what has he done that makes you believe he will be successful at managing the world's biggest club ?
Said it for a while and maintain the view that we'd be bonkers to appoint this guy over and above someone like Pep, Carlo and others. Just an unecessary, massive risk.
There are less than fivw people in the world with the complete skill set needed to manage a club like United. Being a company man through and through is not enough, nor is being a shrewd tactian, nor is being a visionary, being a skilled transfer operator is not enough either. The whole package is needed and the club needs to consider these traits carefully. How can Giggs get the job ahead of people who have proven that they have these skills and have implemented them successfully?
You need to be special to manage United, why should we appoint Giggs on nothing more than hunch?
We'll be in a huge shithole if we appoint Giggs, we need to make sure Pep is our next manager, we can't afford to feck about like we did with the Moyes appointment. The PL is a dogfight for the top 4 which could soon become an even tighter top 3 if our clubs continue to under perform in Europe. This is not the time for a romantic experiment, it's already cost a fortune to recover from the Moyes madness and even then it's still a work in progress.
I really, really want us to go for a Guardiola or Ancelotti to follow Van Gaal, I just don't buy into Giggs having the credentials to manage because he was a great player and a club legend.
If, though, Giggs did take the job and was sensible enough to build around him a team of technical experts, maybe keep employing Van Gaal's staff who are unlikely to follow him into retirement. I could just about agree with that.
The thought of him giving Scholesy a call and then Fizzer and then promoting Butty to first team duties terrifies me. Do they know United inside out? Sure, but I'm not convinced that how things were done in the 90's and 00's is how we will attain success going forward. I'm also not convinced that Giggs, Neville, Butt and Scholes would be anything close to the technical teams Barca, Real, Bayern and co have in place.
If, though, Giggs did take the job and was sensible enough to build around him a team of technical experts, maybe keep employing Van Gaal's staff who are unlikely to follow him into retirement. I could just about agree with that.
The thought of him giving Scholesy a call and then Fizzer and then promoting Butty to first team duties terrifies me. Do they know United inside out? Sure, but I'm not convinced that how things were done in the 90's and 00's is how we will attain success going forward. I'm also not convinced that Giggs, Neville, Butt and Scholes would be anything close to the technical teams Barca, Real, Bayern and co have in place.
No one knows if he will be successful, I never suggest that anyway. All I say is I like what I see from his traits to groom as our future manager.
Maybe let's first start with what makes a good manager. For me its Tactical knowledge, Man Management, Motivating, Discipline, Judging player's ability and potential, match preparation/opponents analysis, formulating game plan and execution, develop righting culture/mentality to the dressing room etc. and that's how I assess Giggs capablility to become future manager of our club
Tactical knowledge - After over 20 years of playing at top, over 1000 games played, successfully adapting into different roles and style of play, I think he has reasonably better knowledge base of the game than most others.
Man Management - We don't know how well could he manage players as a manager. But there are many traits which looks very hopeful to me. First of all he managed himself well over his long career, secondly players used to look up to him, and thirdly he seems to manage his relationship well with his colleagues and coaches, gaining alot of respect from them as well.
Motivating - This maybe an unknown, but again he motivates himself very well even after winning 13 league titles and especially after so many years. And it also seems he is capable of giving a good motivational talk, as revealed by some of our players (Linegaard, Herrera)
Discipline - He was never once sent off in his 24 seasons for the club. Not a bad discipline record. But question remain to be asked how well and fair could he discipline others when he needs to.
Juding player's ability and potential - I heard somewhere Giggs is responsible for scouting Martial for a year and then recommend the club to sign him. Also he must be one of those players begging Fergie to sign the young Ronaldo after the friendly. That's not much in it though, but not a bad record for spotting talent.
Match preparation/opponents analysis - Unknown. But as assistant manager he is learning that everyday.
Formulating game plan and execution - Unknown. Same as above.
Develop right culture/mentality to the dressing room - He epitomize true values and culture of the club. No one knows the club better than him, from inside out.
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If Giggs' ascension to the hot seat was that assured you wouldn't see these guys pushing it so hard. This is basically a gambit to ensure that when the time comes any other name would have been drowned out of the reckoning - say something often enough and long enough it begins to accepted as fact. We have no managerial vacancy right now why speak of the future when the present has it's own challenges?
why are you so sure that Giggs represents a 'romantic experiment'.
we are talking about a person who has experienced life as a United player for 2 decades under arguably the greatest manager of all time.....
someone who has had experience under Moyes and seen the poor decisions he made,
had a taster himself for a few games as caretaker manager,
has gained more experience under another strong character, experiencing a different tactical approach and way of dealing with players and media,
wouldn't be daunted by the prospect of dealing with big name players and his standing in the game is comparable to United's standing.
in terms of football education, Giggs experience has been the equivalent of going to Cambridge, post grad at Oxford and a doctorate at MIT
why are you so convinced he's not capable?
Very good comment. This is exactly what I think as well. If it were such a sure thing that Giggs is taking over, all the old boys wouldn't be coming out trying to push the agenda so hard. Really getting on top of my nerves this. Thankful that the few comments I've read the fans that posted under those articles are basically saying no way let him go elsewhere and show what he can do first. Also, I'm irritated that at a time like this when everyone incl manager, coaching staff, players etc need to be together and work to get us winning again, we have the assistant manager taking his eye off the ball and pushing his personal agenda. That in my eyes completely disqualifies him from the job. Him putting his needs before what's good for the club is not what I want to see.
Personally, I believe the rumour that the board want to employ Pep and are skeptical of Giggs taking over. If Pep extends his stay at Bayern to end when LVG's contract comes to an end, that will solidify my suspicion that our board have approached him. I notice after I heard this rumour the class of 92 and Sir Alex himself have been pushing the 'Giggs should be next manager' narrative real hard.
To relegate them ? that wouldn't be a bad idea.Is the Sunderland job still open? Maybe he could go there and show us something?
Kill 2 birds with one stone.
Because none of that is a substitute for the actual job of having the whole football club's success or failure rest on your shoulders, which is the case for an actual manager. We have seen lots of actual trained coaches who have spent sizable amounts of time under a top manager learning all they could and experiencing success along the way, only to fail to translate that to success as an actual manager at the very top. Appointing Giggs is romanticism at it's finest, it's hoping that he'll do a Pep when Pep is an exception to the rule rather than the rule and also a man that inherited a squad with 3 of the best players on the world in it in a much less competitive league.
You guys have your minds made up and set against it, never mind what others have to a say about it, some a whole lot more in the know than yourselves.
This conspiracy that some have invented regarding the co92 and their sinister plan to gain control is fcuking hysterical... redcafe gon redcafe.
This conspiracy that some have invented regarding the co92 and their sinister plan to gain control is fcuking hysterical... redcafe gon redcafe.
I'm convinced we won't be appointing Giggs, whatever Fergie or LVG say. It just can't be true that we haven't learnt from Moyes. Giggs has done literally zero to justify the appointment, sentimentality aside. There's too much money at stake, at too critical a time in our history to mess around with it.
Yep, it happened before too. Not long ago, April 2013.
You've precisely laid out the case against him. None of the characteristics you cited demonstrate a qualified track record of already haven proven himself as a manager. If he's a good manager, then he should go off and prove it at a smaller club as the likes of Ole and Keano have attempted, prior to being gifted the biggest job in world football.
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