The Americas Draft

More the order in which people have been taken.

If I still get pelters for taking the best goalkeeper ever in the 2nd round of a Nations limit criteria draft then I expect @MounchesterUtd to be banned from this entire website for taking Chilavert in the 1st.

I don't think anything can be inferred from the order of picks due to

1) Pool 2 requirement which inevitably creates an important strategic consideration. Difference in depth of quality at different positions really influences draft order. Offensive mid pool was much deeper in this draft than centre-back for instance so it would make sense if some higher rated AMs were taken after some lower rated CBs.

2) Tactical set-up of the manager. I decided to attempt to improve Tele Santana's 1982 tactics before I even drafted Zico. Thus, many players I might have rated in just a "Best of SA list" I instantly crossed off because they didn't fit my tactics and others I crossed off later because of team chemistry. I definitely passed over a lot of names that I deemed ill suited to my tactics even if I rated them as players.

3) Personal preference. From my experience, after the obvious selections, opinion among South Americans differs more on say a SA all-time Top 20 than I would guess Europeans differ on an all-time Europe Top 20 (just observation and I could be totally wrong there). For instance, I have noticed Europeans over the years tend to rate Cubillas higher than Cueto. But in Peru, Cueto is very typically rated as the best Peruvian player of all time. If you ask around Central America Magico Gonzalez is without a doubt going to be rated higher than if you ask about him in Montevideo or Mexico City.
 
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Fillol

D. Santos------Santamaría------Passarella------N. Santos

-----------------Varela----------Didi--------------
Ghiggia------------------------------------------------Joya
Cubillas------------
------------
Ronaldo
Perhaps. Lots of possible ways to go, though.
 
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Fillol

D. Santos-----Santamariá-----Passarella-----N. Santos

Varela-----Falcão

Garrincha------------------Zico------------------Zagallo

Ronaldo
Probably.

EDIT No pool 2 quota considered, of course.

Here is my pool 2 XI

Chilavert(CHI)

Eyzaguirre(CHI) Chumpitaz(PER) Santamaria(URU) V. Andrade(URU)

Varela/J. Andrade(URU) Vidal(CHI)

Cueto/Cubillas(PER) Schiaffino/Francescoli(URU) Sanchez(CHI)

Erico (PAR) / Suarez (URU)

I know Cubillas and Cueto are out of position here but I rate them a tier above any pool2 right winger so I put them there.
 
It's very common that a player who is regarded internationally as the best from his country (or club, or league, or what have you) is downplayed a bit by locals - with a more obscure (relatively speaking, of course) player taking his place on the top of the pile.

Finney > Matthews being a typical European example.

With players of that calibre there's no obvious right and wrong, though. But for outsiders - who tend to focus mainly on World Cup performances, or other easily available sources, when it comes to older generations of South American players - it's very useful to see that non-obvious players are rated alongside (and sometimes above) the supposedly bigger names most people know about.
 
Came across this bit on Antonio Sastre In Jonathan Wilson's book on Argentine football -

Angels with dirty faces said:
River scored 105 goals in thirty-two games the following season, 1938, but it was not enough. Independiente, with Erico again supreme, racked up 115 and sealed the title on the final day of the season with an 8-2 victory over Lanus. Erico may have gotten the goals, but the real star of that side was Antonio Sastre, a player hailed by Cesar Luis Menotti as the greatest he ever saw and in 1980 voted one of the five greatest Argentine players of all time, capable of playing in a range of positions. That was part of what made him so dangerous: with the opposition concerned with Erico and his fellow striker - ******, Sastre would drift deep, breaking the traditional structures of the game to pick up the ball deep and create the play.

Born in Lomas de Zamora in 1911, Sastre, like so many others, came to prominence at Progresista in Avellaneda barrio of the La Mosca. He made his debut in 1931, replacing the injured **** at inside-left, seemingly at the instigation of ****, whose place he would eventually take. Tall and powerful, Sastre may have ended up playing a an orthodox center-forward, but he moved to the left after Independiente signed the great Uruguayan striker ****, his versatility proving a key asset. In total, he played 340 games for Independiente, scoring 112 goals and winning the championship in 1938 and 1939, before moving to Sao Paulo in 1941. He helped them to three Paulista championships and had a statue erected in his honor. "If there was ever a Nobel Prize for Soccer," the club president Decio Pacheco Pedroso said, "there's no doubt the whole of Brazil would vote for Sastre."
 
Fillol

D. Santos------Santamaría------Passarella------N. Santos

-----------------Varela----------Didi--------------
Ghiggia------------------------------------------------Joya
Cubillas------------
------------
Ronaldo
Perhaps. Lots of possible ways to go, though.

Some South-Americans consider Carrizo as the greatest South-American GK.

The comments of a Peruvian below:

it's a common idea in South America the best Argentine goalkeeper was Carrizo, not Fillol, and put Mazurkiewicz as the second ever of the continent.

Carrizo is remembered commonly by being a pioneer, but also was an excellent goalkeeper of quickly reflected, transmitted a great security and was so good under the sticks as playing as sweeper. IFFHS awarded him as the best goalkeeper of all-time of the Americas in 1999.

Both of them are legendary players of River Plate, but Carrizo is also mentioned commonly as the best goalkeeper ever of the club over Fillol.

I don't think the weight of the international apparitions be so much as you mention (Carrizo (20) and Fillol (58)), especially when Carrizo had a long career and has the record of apparitions in the Argentine league (513). Also because by that reasoning **** couldn't be mentioned even.


The comments of an Argentinian

Both were excellent, but people who watched both of them in Argentina tend to agree about Carrizo being the better goalkeeper.

He didn't have lots of caps, just as many greats from his era in South America didn't, but he had some great performances with the national team as well, including wins over Pele's Brazil in which he was simply spectacular. During one of those matches, in Sao Paulo, he stopped a penalty from Gerson.
 
I pick Omar Oreste Corbatta


Big fan of this pick.Corbatta was a Racing legend and loved and remembered by Racing supporters to this day. He is one of the few old names even young Racing fans will know of.

 
@oneniltothearsenal

Yeah, not a coincidence if you can find a video 'Corbatta VS San Lorenzo 1963'. The Argentinian Garrincha certainly has a strong fan base.

 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU)

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG)
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU)

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. **OPEN**

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG)

@Jayvin @BorisDeLeFora
 


On a completely unrelated note, here's McGrath's game against Netherlands in 1988 Euros which I'd said I'd upload before but forgot. Great display from McGrath and Ireland, which was truly deserving of a clean sheet. Had it not been for a freak Kieft goal in the 82nd minute (with Netherlands barely looking threatening till that point), it would have been Ireland and not Netherlands who would have progressed from the group stage. Football eh?
 
Some South-Americans consider Carrizo as the greatest South-American GK.

Sure, why not.

I've seen Chilavert top S-A lists too, for that matter. Depends on several factors, as per usual. Fillol is probably the likeliest list topper on average, though.

The question in this particular draft is whether there's a perceived gap (from a voter/neutral perspective) between GK tiers here (I'd say there probably is such a gap) and whether it will make any difference.

Could be a small factor: The overall quality of the defences will likely be similar in most matches, so having a perceived top class GK (of which there may not be many, from a voter perspective) could possibly give you an edge.
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU)

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. **OPEN**

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG)
 
Sorry guys, I fell asleep :(

Do I make my pick at any time now or wait until this round is over?
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU)

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG)
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU)

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU) 12. A.Friedenreich (BRA)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG)

@DavidG
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU)

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL) 12. Andres Escobar (COL)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU) 12. A.Friedenreich (BRA)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG)

@MounchesterUtd
 
luis-perea-atletico-madrid1.jpg
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU)

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU) 12. L. Perea (COL)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL) 12. Andres Escobar (COL)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU) 12. A.Friedenreich (BRA)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG)

@mazhar13 @Marty1968 @RedTiger
 
Sure, why not.
I've seen Chilavert top S-A lists too, for that matter. Depends on several factors, as per usual. Fillol is probably the likeliest list topper on average, though.

Sure, we could say the top 3 GKs are certainy Fillol, Carrizo and Mazurkiewicz.

After that, we have probably Gilmar.
 
Sure, why not.

I've seen Chilavert top S-A lists too, for that matter. Depends on several factors, as per usual. Fillol is probably the likeliest list topper on average, though.

The question in this particular draft is whether there's a perceived gap (from a voter/neutral perspective) between GK tiers here (I'd say there probably is such a gap) and whether it will make any difference.

Could be a small factor: The overall quality of the defences will likely be similar in most matches, so having a perceived top class GK (of which there may not be many, from a voter perspective) could possibly give you an edge.

I was tempted to pass over a GK pick entirely last round as I don't think there's a huge gulf in quality among the 16 likely picks. I think I had 22 GKs on my list, and I would have been moderately happy with most of them. I do tentatively subscribe to the 'linear progression' viewpoint with keepers though, in that I think the quality in that position was generally poor until the late 60s or so and then seemed to skyrocket. Bar the odd standout like Yashin or Beara I've very rarely been genuinely impressed with an older GK.
 
I was tempted to pass over a GK pick entirely last round as I don't think there's a huge gulf in quality among the 16 likely picks. I think I had 22 GKs on my list, and I would have been moderately happy with most of them. I do tentatively subscribe to the 'linear progression' viewpoint with keepers though, in that I think the quality in that position was generally poor until the late 60s or so and then seemed to skyrocket. Bar the odd standout like Yashin or Beara I've very rarely been genuinely impressed with an older GK.

I think it's the other way around. For me Mazurkiewicz, Fillol, Gilmar, Carrizo are the standout keepers, Chilavert a notch below and then couple excellent ones - Cordoba one of them. Apart from them the discrepancy in quality IMO is bigger than suggested.
 
I was tempted to pass over a GK pick entirely last round as I don't think there's a huge gulf in quality among the 16 likely picks. I think I had 22 GKs on my list, and I would have been moderately happy with most of them. I do tentatively subscribe to the 'linear progression' viewpoint with keepers though, in that I think the quality in that position was generally poor until the late 60s or so and then seemed to skyrocket. Bar the odd standout like Yashin or Beara I've very rarely been genuinely impressed with an older GK.

Agreed. It's the one position which has majorly evolved and the changes over the last generation with the backpass rule and ball retention means a goalkeeper today is often unrecognisable from days of yore. Different times and different challenges of course and they often had to be thick-set and robust to handle shoulder barges which were par for the course. In turn they were typically less agile and sometimes struggled to get down to trundles in the bottom corner. It's also the position which sometimes underwhelms when looking at old footage - keeper errors seem to be a lot more prevalent. As for this pool, I thought Fillol and Mazurkiewicz carried the most gravitas but beyond them I don't think there is much in it - and it's more about avoiding the well known but somewhat error prone types.
 
I think it's the other way around. For me Mazurkiewicz, Fillol, Gilmar, Carrizo are the standout keepers, Chilavert a notch below and then couple excellent ones - Cordoba one of them. Apart from them the discrepancy in quality IMO is bigger than suggested.

From the relatively little I've watched I just don't see it. Fillol might be a standout but I've just seen nothing to suggest that the likes of Taffarel and Julio Cesar are inferior to the likes of Mazurkiewicz, Gilmar etc, never mind two tiers below.
 
Bar the odd standout like Yashin or Beara I've very rarely been genuinely impressed with an older GK.

Aye, I tend to agree with that. And I don't think it's a controversial opinion either - there's a watershed point somewhere, post Yashin, after which the GOAT keepers start to emerge one by one.

Before that you certainly have several interesting players - who contributed in various ways to the development of the art - but actually rating these old timers in an all-time context, and comparing them to modern (post Yashin or thereabouts) keepers, is much more difficult than doing the same for outfield players.

And the latter is difficult enough.
 
I'm not sure but specific trainings for GK are a relatively recent thing.
 
Aye, I tend to agree with that. And I don't think it's a controversial opinion either - there's a watershed point somewhere, post Yashin, after which the GOAT keepers start to emerge one by one.

Before that you certainly have several interesting players - who contributed in various ways to the development of the art - but actually rating these old timers in an all-time context, and comparing them to modern (post Yashin or thereabouts) keepers, is much more difficult than doing the same for outfield players.

And the latter is difficult enough.
Aye. A good example would be Grosics for Hungary - clearly by all and his own accounts a trailblazing sweeper keeper. And you do often see him rushing out to cover Hungary's high line. It's impressive compared to all of his contemporaries. But equally you get examples like England's first goal below where he is relatively rooted to his line. Again probably par for the course at the time, but modern expectations would see the angle closed out much earlier.