I think the only reason they haven't already sold off the club is they view the Super League as an inevitability that'll boost the club's valuation and save its finances. INEOS's minority investment has bought them some time on that end.
Summer Transfer Budget?
- Thread starter Jericholyte2
- Start date
I expect it will be a similar budget to last year, Evans and Lindelof will leave, we’ll replace neither. Sancho will finally be off the books and Eriksen will leave as well.
Antony, Malacia, Rashford and Casemiro will all be loaned if they can’t be sold. Zirkzee will go back to Serie A and I can see Dalot going as well. Can’t rule out possibility of Garnacho going if there is a big bid.
We also have Elanga, Alvaro, Greenwood and Perreira all with sell on clauses and at least 1-2 likely to move.
There is going to be money coming in but I think it will just be spread around and won’t be lavished on such big signings or huge wages.
Antony, Malacia, Rashford and Casemiro will all be loaned if they can’t be sold. Zirkzee will go back to Serie A and I can see Dalot going as well. Can’t rule out possibility of Garnacho going if there is a big bid.
We also have Elanga, Alvaro, Greenwood and Perreira all with sell on clauses and at least 1-2 likely to move.
There is going to be money coming in but I think it will just be spread around and won’t be lavished on such big signings or huge wages.
This is the reality I’m afraid. Let’s see if the new guys in charge have the guts to do what’s right.
I've felt for years that we need to add starting 11 calibre players. You are not a serious football club if you're just continuously buying squad players or players that will never be good enough to be a success at Premier League or Champions League level long term.
Players like Van De Beek, Zirkzee, Malacia, Evans, Lindelof, Maguire, Eriksen, Mount, Pellestri, Casemiro and Antony. All of these players screamed average before we signed them. Never mind after seeing them play for us.
Not one of those players above looked like they had world class potential. Eriksen and Casemiro at a younger age could've been United players but never at the age they signed. Around the world class young talents you can add players with more potential for lower fees like an Evra or Vidic, but they're the rarity. When you land a gem on the cheap. We have to buy quality even if it means spending more on less players.
Ultimately I'd rather we sign a few solid players for 50m or 100m each which guarantee to raise the ceiling of the starting lineup.
One by one we have to add players that come into the starting lineup. If they don't perform to the required level they can become a squad player, but we cannot sign someone to be a "squad player". We have to be way more ambitious and add one quality young player at a time.
United were on top when we'd go out and sign Rio Ferdinand, Wayne Rooney, Cristiano Ronaldo,
Players like Van De Beek, Zirkzee, Malacia, Evans, Lindelof, Maguire, Eriksen, Mount, Pellestri, Casemiro and Antony. All of these players screamed average before we signed them. Never mind after seeing them play for us.
Not one of those players above looked like they had world class potential. Eriksen and Casemiro at a younger age could've been United players but never at the age they signed. Around the world class young talents you can add players with more potential for lower fees like an Evra or Vidic, but they're the rarity. When you land a gem on the cheap. We have to buy quality even if it means spending more on less players.
Ultimately I'd rather we sign a few solid players for 50m or 100m each which guarantee to raise the ceiling of the starting lineup.
One by one we have to add players that come into the starting lineup. If they don't perform to the required level they can become a squad player, but we cannot sign someone to be a "squad player". We have to be way more ambitious and add one quality young player at a time.
United were on top when we'd go out and sign Rio Ferdinand, Wayne Rooney, Cristiano Ronaldo,
It’s a bit annoying though because he’ll say something about how bad United are and who is a shite signing, or that they won’t finish top 6 etc
And I think “ha I’ll set a reminder in a year that he said that” but then he always ends up being right about it
I know the “I’m an idiot” persona is for the cameras but I would love to have a clear example of when he’s said something that’s turned out to be well off
Swiss Ramble made a detailed breakdown of our finances when the last set of financial results were released and estimated we'd have around 120m going into this year, not including any player sales.
So if Dorgu is costing 25m then we'd have enough for a striker in the summer, I'm guessing Gyokores but after that it would likely depend on player sales.
Everything could change if we won Europa league and had CL income but that's unlikely given current form.
Also it rarely get's brought up but our debt repayments/interest on debt repayments all count towards PSR and continue to hurt us very badly. We would have had approximately 200m more to spend in the last 3 windows if we weren't saddled with Glazer debt.
Criticise Ratcliffe all you want but he's already put hundreds of millions into the club within a year which is more than the Glazers have in almost 20 years of ownership.
So if Dorgu is costing 25m then we'd have enough for a striker in the summer, I'm guessing Gyokores but after that it would likely depend on player sales.
Everything could change if we won Europa league and had CL income but that's unlikely given current form.
Also it rarely get's brought up but our debt repayments/interest on debt repayments all count towards PSR and continue to hurt us very badly. We would have had approximately 200m more to spend in the last 3 windows if we weren't saddled with Glazer debt.
Criticise Ratcliffe all you want but he's already put hundreds of millions into the club within a year which is more than the Glazers have in almost 20 years of ownership.
With FFP.
Kimmich and David on frees would be wonderful, not happening of we don't win the EL.
Frimpong, Zubamendi,and Gyorkez have reasonable release clauses.
Kimmich and David on frees would be wonderful, not happening of we don't win the EL.
Frimpong, Zubamendi,and Gyorkez have reasonable release clauses.
Hard to know with the Merson maths.
Could be 100m, 2bn, half a million. You just never know.
My guesstimate is that our summer “budget” will again be completely dependent on player sales, almost like a 1:1 scenario.
We will hopefully be able to sell and release a few high earners, and go with a leaner squad, but that what we reduce in player wages will be used to improve our operating costs and help us manage our short term debt.
Short term pain for long term gain.
We will hopefully be able to sell and release a few high earners, and go with a leaner squad, but that what we reduce in player wages will be used to improve our operating costs and help us manage our short term debt.
Short term pain for long term gain.
Yeah that's got to be the only reason why they're still stinking the place out. I can't see any other reason they are still hanging around - they no longer take dividends do they? And the dividends aren't significant enough to make any real difference to their personal fortunes.
Do people think that the Super League is realistically going to happen? I'll be giving it a swerve if it goes ahead anyway.
So we are basically writing off blocks of seasons now rather than just each season as it comes? Because that's at least a 2-3 year plan.
I’m afraid we’ll sell Garnacho but if we get £80million that could fund £400 million of signings if amortised over 5 years (can’t be right ha).
Striker £100m
10 £50m
CM £50m
WB £50m
CD £50m
GK £50m
Trouser £50m
Striker £100m
10 £50m
CM £50m
WB £50m
CD £50m
GK £50m
Trouser £50m
Well not quite, we'd need the actual cash to fund those transfers - which we don't have.
Don't know. All I can remember is you get fined by your kit sponsorship if you miss out on CL in two successive seasons.
Despite all the doom and gloom that has remarkably not happened yet post SAF.
IIRC, the agreement with INEOS prevents dividends from being taken out for at least three years.
As for the Super League, the changes UEFA made to the CL/EL format and money distribution should keep the SL clubs on the sidelines for the next few years, but I think it's ultimately inevitable. Money talks, unfortunately.
According to The Times, under the terms of the new deal with Adidas which came into force this year, the club will be hit with a £10 million penalty every year it fails to qualify for the CL.
Loan from Ineos/SJR could help ease cash flow.
I highly doubt he said any such thing. I reckon he might have inferred we could make losses of up to 120m pre tax and remain PSR compliant for 2025.
INEOS won't just freely inject capital without expecting something in return - will the Glazers agree to it? Doubtful.
Yeah didn’t they recently get another small increase in equity as well? Don’t recall for what. Agreed with you in general but was just spitballing ways we can bypass cash flow challenges - which is easier than bypassing PSR
Not necessarily, or I guess that really depends on what you categorize as a "write off season".. By pain I'm rather reffering to the fact that we can't continue splurging money in the market, that we're gonna have to make do with a smaller squad, and that we need to accept that we're not going to challenge for title(s) next season, we must buy young and smart, and accept inconsistency - but obviously that there's still clear improvements and visible signs of us developing something that could be a platform for success going forward.
We're likely looking at a season without European football next season, and that loss of revenue might force our hand, but it might also mean that we could go with a smaller squad withouth sacrificing too much.
Ehhh yeah thanks for that captain obvious. He said we'd have 120m available which is what I posted.
I like the cut of your jib! Can you be my accountant?
Throwing more money at the problem sounds like a reoccurring theme every summer.
I stopped believing ‘spending big’ in the transfer window was the answer a long time ago.
I’d much rather hope Amorim can coach them into a more cohesive unit over the summer/pre-season.
Both methods are probable required together, but without CL football everyone needs to be realistic about the transfer kitty.
I stopped believing ‘spending big’ in the transfer window was the answer a long time ago.
I’d much rather hope Amorim can coach them into a more cohesive unit over the summer/pre-season.
Both methods are probable required together, but without CL football everyone needs to be realistic about the transfer kitty.
At this point it is looking like it is going to be a challenging summer. We need the benefits of qualifying for Europe, and to finish as high up the league as possible with each position being worth circa £3m. After that getting rid of Rashford and Casemiro will be imperative, guessing that will save us £40m before we talk about transfer fees. Mount and Shaw are our next highest wages that add little value, and can't see us getting either off our books. Erikson, Lindelof, Evans and Heaton I estimate would save us £25m as their contracts finish. Might have to sell Garnacho to fund a striker, and outside of that position I would expect we will only be making cheaper, lower wage transfers. Wilcox and co will have their work cut out making this work as we try to get back on our feet.
IN:
ST: Gyokeres: £60m
(Sporting willing to accept less than RC)
L10: Cunha £60m
CM: Baleba/Ederson £60m
CB: Diomande £50m
RWB: Quenda: £33m
Total: £263m
OUT:
Gernacho: £70m
Sancho: £25m
Rashford: £40m
Anthony: £25m
Casimero: £15m
Malacia: £15m
Hojlund: £30m
Total: £220m
Net Spend: £43m
ST: Gyokeres: £60m
(Sporting willing to accept less than RC)
L10: Cunha £60m
CM: Baleba/Ederson £60m
CB: Diomande £50m
RWB: Quenda: £33m
Total: £263m
OUT:
Gernacho: £70m
Sancho: £25m
Rashford: £40m
Anthony: £25m
Casimero: £15m
Malacia: £15m
Hojlund: £30m
Total: £220m
Net Spend: £43m
Depends, how much a club in 13th position spends on average?
Who on earth is spending that?
Thats our price, hopefully Chelsea for Garnacho. The others are cheap enough for a punt by some club abroad.
Hopefully Saudi come in for Casimero. Anthony if he has a good loan could go for that value.
If we genuinely finish 2-4 places above relegation, will any decent players willingly want to join us?
Imagine Spurs and a resurgent Everton and West Ham finishing above us. It could happen.
I’ve lost almost all positivity these last 2 weeks and now, with no Martinez and no proven goal scorers anywhere in the squad, I can’t see us getting many more points on the board.
Imagine Spurs and a resurgent Everton and West Ham finishing above us. It could happen.
I’ve lost almost all positivity these last 2 weeks and now, with no Martinez and no proven goal scorers anywhere in the squad, I can’t see us getting many more points on the board.
Ticket prices will go up, memberships will go up.
They’ll milk the fans for all they’re worth.
Huh? Elaborate for me how making a loss of 120m is equivalent to having a 120m to spend. If this Swissramble fella know his onions, he's probably not in the business of transfer speculation, though I suspect that's probably lost on you and quite a few more on here.
Any transfer wishlist that doesn’t include a goalkeeper is insane. Imagine going into a third season with Onana as our #1…
It's gonna happen. We have bigger issues to solve. A goalkeeper can hold you back from winning trophies but Onana won't hold us back from playing any specific system or from being a good side. He's been part of quality sides in the past.
We only have so much money, and it needs to be focused on the attack. We need a peak age CF with a proven scoring record, and we need a peak age #10 if we want this team to do anything. Something like Gyokeres and Cunha. We also need midfield depth. And we'll look to spend on Quenda too. Those 4 players alone would be close to 200m which I'd be surprised if we spent, so there's really no space for any other position.
Everyone always says this yet Chelsea managed to do it relatively well. And while it’s unrealistic, OP is right. There’s hardly any building blocks in the squad
Gyokeres, Cunha, Quenda, and a sneaky young mobile passer for the midfield and I’d be on cloud 9 honestly. That significantly transforms our team