Film Star Wars: Episode VIII

[Jig1234]

Anyone else think the casino scene was pointless?

That entire subplot was pointless. Hated the 'codebreaker' storyline. Del Toro character was not flushed out very well. At first we were told specifically only the codebreaker could do the job, but they just get help form some guy they bumped into instead and then he ends up screwing them. My head hurts just thinking about it all.

 

[BluesJr]

While I was watching it I was enjoying it just fine, excited that it was another Star Wars film. It’s only now a day later actually thinking about it I realise how bad it really is and what a mess they’ve made of the whole thing. Bringing Star Wars into the modern age had so much potential but it’s just so ‘meh’.

 

[Slevs]

Spoiler

It would have been great if, for once, Kylo's offer would have been accepted by Rey. The way the film has set up her character to that moment it wasn't implausible. And something genuinely different.

Spoiler

This was my only gripe with the movie, why can't the sith ever win??? He killed Snoke for you, you fecking bitch. End everything, start a new galaxy ffs.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Spoiler

This was my only gripe with the movie, why can't the sith ever win??? He killed Snoke for you, you fecking bitch. End everything, start a new galaxy ffs.

Well because it's a family film and the Sith are evil?

While I was watching it I was enjoying it just fine, excited that it was another Star Wars film. It’s only now a day later actually thinking about it I realise how bad it really is and what a mess they’ve made of the whole thing. Bringing Star Wars into the modern age had so much potential but it’s just so ‘meh’.

How did you go from enjoying it to thinking it's bad? If you were enjoying it, it must have been doing some things right?

 

[sullydnl]

It’s not his story but the storyline of the first film was the quest to find him and he was the main character in the second one. If these films are supposed to be all about the new characters then it’s just another stick to beat them with because the old characters have dominated the first two films and the new characters only have one film left.

In what way did Finn or Poe drive the plot? Nothing they did had any bearing on the plot at all. Perhaps Poe at the start. Finn literally did nothing. Even Rey played very little part in the plot. In no way was Luke Skywalker a supporting character.

I doubt you'd find a single person involved in the film who would describe Luke as the main character. Opinions are opinions but that's just misreading the film.

 

[acnumber9]

I doubt you'd find a single person involved in the film who would describe Luke as the main character. Opinions are opinions but that's just misreading the film.

Apart from those who do the titles who had him first billing and those that made the advertising poster that has him as the prominent figure. But of course the story wasn’t about him.

 

[SuperiorXI]

Have you seen the Daisy Ridley clip where she is asked if she is happy with TLJ and she is like ”… ermmmm ... sure?”

She was one of the biggest disappointments in it I felt.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Apart from those who do the titles who had him first billing and those that made the advertising poster that has him as the prominent figure. But of course the story wasn’t about him.

Luke is not the main character. The fact that we learn everything through Rey, and he disappeared for a good portion of the movie shows that.

It's more of an ensemble film anyway

 

[sullydnl]

Apart from those who do the titles who had him first billing and those that made the advertising poster that has him as the prominent figure. But of course the story wasn’t about him.

Johnson never viewed “The Last Jedi” as Luke’s movie to begin with, citing “The Return of the Jedi” as the end of Luke’s hero journey. "I think the hero’s journey of Luke Skywalker concluded in ‘Return of the Jedi.’ This [trilogy] is the hero’s journey of Rey, and Finn, and Poe,”

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/12/st...-mark-hamill-luke-ending-spoilers-1201908343/

Aside from the director outright stating that Rey, Finn and Poe are the stories main protagonists in multiple interviews, the film itself also makes it clear that Luke isn't the main character. Not least during the actual interaction between Rey and Luke when Rey is quite clearly the audience's avatar in the story. Like I said, thinking Luke is the central character is a weird misreading of the film.

 

[acnumber9]

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/12/st...-mark-hamill-luke-ending-spoilers-1201908343/

Aside from the director outright stating that Rey, Finn and Poe are the stories main protagonists in multiple interviews, the film itself also makes it clear that Luke isn't the main character. Not least during the actual interaction between Rey and Luke when Rey is quite clearly the audience's avatar in the story. Like I said, thinking Luke is the central character is a weird misreading of the film.

What did Finn do in the movie? If Luke Skywalker isn’t the main character I’m bemused as to why the majority of advertising has him at the forefront and that it was Luke’s actions that allowed the rebels to escape and not Rey’s.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Luke and Leia provided loads of nostalgia value. Obviously they’re heavily used when it comes to marketing the film. The characters they play were were no more or less involved than a bunch of other key players. Although if you had to name two characters who the movie most centred around it would probably be Kylo Ren and Rey. They’re the modern version of Luke and Vader. As always, the supporting characters play a big part too.

 

[acnumber9]

Luke and Leia provided loads of nostalgia value. Obviously they’re heavily used when it comes to marketing the film. The characters they play were were no more or less involved than a bunch of other key players. Although if you had to name two characters who the movie most centred around it would probably be Kylo Ren and Rey. They’re the modern version of Luke and Vader. As always, the supporting characters play a big part too.

They’re used as a big part of the marketing because they’re a big part of the films and the audience it attracts. Anyone claiming it isn’t a continuation of the original trilogy is talking shit.

At a push I could agree that Kylo Ren and Rey were as prominent or slightly more so. Finn and Poe? Not a chance. No matter what shite the director is peddling. If Finn was one of his main protagonists he did a terrible job of making him relevant.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

They’re used as a big part of the marketing because they’re a big part of the films and the audience it attracts. Anyone claiming it isn’t a continuation of the original trilogy is talking shit.

At a push I could agree that Kylo Ren and Rey were as prominent or slightly more so. Finn and Poe? Not a chance. No matter what shite the director is peddling. If Finn was one of his main protagonists he did a terrible job of making him relevant.

Kind of wading into this late so not sure what prompted the tangent but why does any of this matter? As others have already said. It was an ensemble cast. Just like previous Star Wars movies. A bunch of main protagonists, more or less equally featured. Rey and Ren feel more central because they’re kind of the touching point between the two opposing forces but I doubt they got much more screen time than a bunch of other characters.

Luke was kind of like the new Obi Wan (or yer man who Liam Neeson played? Qui Quon something?) Old dude, helping guide his young protégés. Rey = Luke. Ren = Vader. Poe = Solo. Feck knows who Finn is. Leia?

 

[Mockney]

That’s the choice made by this film and one of the things people are criticising though. I’m sure a lot of kids will enjoy it but that doesn’t mean it isn’t a continuation of the old films when it blatantly is.

But what an utterly daft thing to complain about. Why would anyone, let alone Disney, make a brand new modern Star Wars saga - a colourful knock-about family Sci Fi adventure romp - and aim it at early middle aged men? What on earth would be the point of that!? Does anyone actually remember Star Wars? In what parallel universe was a it a deep and introspective film where the heroic young handsome gung-ho types were second stage to the storied grumpy middle aged parental figures, and triumphantly realised they were right all along? What kind of bizarre Brexit version of Star Wars were you expecting?

 

[acnumber9]

Kind of wading into this late so not sure what prompted the tangent but why does any of this matter? As others have already said. It was an ensemble cast. Just like previous Star Wars movies. A bunch of main protagonists, more or less equally featured. Rey and Ren feel more central because they’re kind of the touching point between the two opposing forces but I doubt they got much more screen time than a bunch of other characters.

Luke was kind of like the new Obi Wan (or yer man who Liam Neeson played? Qui Quon something?) Old dude, helping guide his young protégés. Rey = Luke. Ren = Vader. Poe = Solo. Feck knows who Finn is. Leia?

Because people are being told that they shouldn’t expect a continuation of the old films. When it’s clearly marketed as a continuation and the original characters still play a big role in it. I don’t see how anyone can watch it and claim that and also claim Luke Skywalker was a supporting character in the film.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

But what an utterly daft thing to complain about. Why would anyone, let alone Disney, make a brand new Star Wars saga - a colourful knock-about family Sci Fi adventure romp - and aim it at early middle aged men? What on earth would be the point of that!? Does anyone actually remember Star Wars? In what parallel universe was a it a deep and introspective film where the heroic young handsome gung-ho types took second billing to the storied middle aged parental figures, and realised they were right all along? What kind of bizarre Brexit version of Star Wars were you expecting?

A lot of kids movies are lapped up by middle aged men though. Every comic book adaption ever, for example. So I’d say it’s a certainty that this demographic would have been deliberately targetted with their marketing (possibly by over-playing Luke’s involvement?) along with the primary audience i.e. kids

The thing is, as a middle aged man who chooses to watch a kids movie you have to adjust your expectations accordingly, switch your brain off and enjoy the ride. Getting hung up on plot complexities of a movie which was primarily intended to be watched by 8 year olds seems like a complete waste of time

 

[ha_rooney]

Just watched it, to say I’m disappointed is an understatement.

The story felt pointless for the most part. The whole them being out of range of the Star Destroyers for 3/4 of the film was bullshit. Snoke came, snoke went. Yoda - why bother?! I didn’t get the Rey going into the darkness thing one minute then sitting chatting with Kylo the next - seemed so random. The casino/codebreaker stuff totally pointless. It forced the humour & failed more often than not.

Rey & Luke were the best thing of the film.

I can’t believe they’re giving this director his own trilogy. If this is anything to go by, I’m not expecting much.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Because people are being told that they shouldn’t expect a continuation of the old films. When it’s clearly marketed as a continuation and the original characters still play a big role in it. I don’t see how anyone can watch it and claim that and also claim Luke Skywalker was a supporting character in the film.

Oh. Right. Well I do think it was a continuation of the original trilogy. With a bunch of new faces taking centre stage and the original cast less prominent than they were in I-III. Bit surprised that anyone could see it any different. It’s a movie trope we see all the time. e.g. Harrison Ford in the new Bladerunner movie.

 

[acnumber9]

But what an utterly daft thing to complain about. Why would anyone, let alone Disney, make a brand new modern Star Wars saga - a colourful knock-about family Sci Fi adventure romp - and aim it at early middle aged men? What on earth would be the point of that!? Does anyone actually remember Star Wars? In what parallel universe was a it a deep and introspective film where the heroic young handsome gung-ho types were second stage to the storied grumpy middle aged parental figures, and triumphantly realised they were right all along? What kind of bizarre Brexit version of Star Wars were you expecting?

The film is marketed as a continuation of the original films with the main character from them being plastered all over the advertising for this one. What the feck do you expect people to expect? The level of the films success hinges on it. No amount of flowery, nonsensical bullshit you write makes your point any more true. Brexit Star Wars? Are you a parody of a bad columnist?

 

[Mockney]

Because people are being told that they shouldn’t expect a continuation of the old films. When it’s clearly marketed as a continuation and the original characters still play a big role in it. I don’t see how anyone can watch it and claim that and also claim Luke Skywalker was a supporting character in the film.

He plays the Obi Wan/Yoda role. Of course he’s a supporting character. How often he’s featured in the marketing is neither here nor there.

Unless of course you’re going in with the unrealistic expectation of this being a film about Luke Skywalker. A fun family film about a grandad rediscovering his mojo. In which case I can understand why you’d be disappointed...but then, you were always looking for the rabbit under the wrong hat.

 

[acnumber9]

He plays the Obi Wan/Yoda role. Of course he’s a supporting character. How often he’s featured in the marketing is neither here nor there.

Unless of course you’re going in with the unrealistic expectation of this being a film about Luke Skywalker. A fun family film about a grandad rediscovering his mojo. In which case I can understand why you’d be disappointed...but then, you were always looking for the rabbit under the wrong hat.

Which is why he was at the centre of the films final set piece. Rather than our new hero. I don’t recall that from the Yoda/Obi Wan role. His prominence in the advertising is a hell of a curve ball if we weren’t supposed to expect him to play a large role. Especially following the last films plot being about finding him.

If you were half as clever as you imagine you’d be impressive.

 

[Ubik]

A study in dramatic structure, by redcafe.net.

 

[R.N7]

Tbh I thought it was at least top 3 of the series. I can’t really remember the last time I enjoyed a Star Wars film so much.

 

[Mockney]

The film is marketed as a continuation of the original films with the main character from them being plastered all over the advertising for this one.

You keep saying this like it means anything. The director doesn’t make the posters. Nor does he cut the trailers. Jeff Goldblum is prominently featured in the new Jurassic Park ads but by all accounts he’s going to be in it for about 5 minutes. Parents are the ones who pay to take their kids to these things, it makes sense to cater to them somewhat.

But if you thought you were buying a ticket for How Luke Got His Groove Back, then more fool you. All it proves is my long held suspicion that Star Wars fans take their obsession with a retro children’s film series far too seriously.

...As for “why was he part of the final set peice” (the one where he directly paraphrased Obi Wans finals lines) Because it’s the middle film and they were clearing the decks for the 3rd. They killed Han in the first, Luke in this, and presumably intented to kill Leia in 9, because - if you paid any attention - it’s all about the older generation giving way to the next. Something fans of the old trilogy have been aggressively resistant to accepting. Hence the Brexit comparison.

Tbh I thought it was at least top 3 of the series. I can’t really remember the last time I enjoyed a Star Wars film so much.

Yeah, but Snoke didn’t have a backstory Nils. I don’t think you fully realise how important this is.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

.
Yeah, but Snoke didn’t have a backstory Nils. I don’t think you fully realise how important this is.

Forget that, they had the AUDACITY to kill of much storied and scene hogger that was Admiral Akbar OFF SCREEN!

0/10

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Which is why he was at the centre of the films final set piece. Rather than our new hero. I don’t recall that from the Yoda/Obi Wan role. His prominence in the advertising is a hell of a curve ball if we weren’t supposed to expect him to play a large role. Especially following the last films plot being about finding him.

If you were half as clever as you imagine you’d be impressive.

That literally happened in Attack of the Clones

 

[acnumber9]

You keep saying this like it means anything. The director doesn’t make the posters. Nor does he cut the trailers. Jeff Goldblum is prominently featured in the new Jurassic Park ads but by all accounts he’s going to be in it for about 5 minutes. Parents are the ones who pay to take their kids to these things, it makes sense to cater to them somewhat.

But if you thought you were buying a ticket for How Luke Got His Groove Back, then more fool you. All it proves is my long held suspicion that Star Wars fans take their obsession with a retro children’s film series far too seriously.

...As for “why was he part of the final set peice”...Because it’s the middle film and they were clearing the decks for the 3rd. They killed Han in the first, Luke in this, and presumably intented to kill Leia in 9, because - if you paid any attention - it’s all about the older generation giving way to the next. Something fans of the old trilogy have been aggressively resistant to accepting. Hence the Brexit comparison.

If you weren’t so wrapped up in your own opinion and shit throwaway lines you still think are cutting edge satire you might see why it’s relevant. If a film is marketed with him as a major character it’s not a huge leap for people to expect him to be a major character. Plus the fact he clearly was still a major character.

At no stage have I said what I wanted the film to be. I just wanted it to be good. If you don’t think that the film is a continuation then I don’t know what else to tell you other than you’re wrong. It’s staring you right in the face. You’re the one arguing this point despite the glaring evidence in front of you.

He wasn’t part of it, he was central to it. While Rey was away clearing rocks. He didn’t have to save the day to die. Han Solo didn’t save the day in the last one.

 

[acnumber9]

That literally happened in Attack of the Clones

That’s not the Yoda/Obi Wan role I assume was being referred to. Obi Wan did it in the prequels too. I was of the impression he meant their roles in the original trilogy.

 

[Cheesy]

Apart from those who do the titles who had him first billing and those that made the advertising poster that has him as the prominent figure. But of course the story wasn’t about him.

He's a (relatively) big name actor and the most recognisable of the cast, along with Carrie Fisher, due to their previous involvement in Star Wars. In the same way that Ford (I think?) got top billing for TFA even though he was clearly a prominent supporting character who was there to drive forward the new main characters.

Hell, if we keep to Hamill he managed to get second billing for TFA...but that movie quite clearly wasn't about him considering he was basically a plot device who stared dramatically at the camera in the final scene.

He's obviously important in this one...cause he's the main character from the originals, but his role in the trilogy as a whole was/is clearly much closer to Obi-Wan/Yoda.

 

[Mockney]

Whatever dude. Disney made a hugely expensive blockbuster space adventure trilogy about a 66 year old Luke Skywalker for grown ups. Cool beans.

 

[sullydnl]

What did Finn do in the movie? If Luke Skywalker isn’t the main character I’m bemused as to why the majority of advertising has him at the forefront and that it was Luke’s actions that allowed the rebels to escape and not Rey’s.

As has already been mentioned, the way the film is marketed doesn't neccesarily reflect the content of the film. Marketing often misleads.

In this case though I can't imagine why anyone would think they would follow up TFA (a film aimed at kids, centred around a younger generation of protagonists and notable for the total absence of Luke Skywalker) with a film in which the target audience's heroes get sidlined in favour of an old character from an old series of films who has only just appeared. Regardless of how the film was marketed, I'd expect an average member of the public to be cineliterate enough to realise that wasn't going to happen.

 

[acnumber9]

He's a (relatively) big name actor and the most recognisable of the cast, along with Carrie Fisher, due to their previous involvement in Star Wars. In the same way that Ford (I think?) got top billing for TFA even though he was clearly a prominent supporting character who was there to drive forward the new main characters.

Hell, if we keep to Hamill he managed to get second billing for TFA...but that movie quite clearly wasn't about him considering he was basically a plot device who stared dramatically at the camera in the final scene.

He's obviously important in this one...cause he's the main character from the originals, but his role in the trilogy as a whole was/is clearly much closer to Obi-Wan/Yoda.

Yeah, those are fair and true points about the billing. The advertising is quite different though. Look at the poster for Force Awakens and see the stark difference in prominence compared to The Last Jedi. Even the fecking title hints at heavy involvement of Luke Skywalker.

 

[acnumber9]

Whatever dude. Disney made a hugely expensive blockbuster space adventure trilogy about a 66 year old Luke Skywalker for grown ups. Cool beans.

They were definitely going to make as much money without him. Good luck with the column/blog satiring out of date satire.

 

[Cheesy]

Yeah, those are fair and true points about the billing. The advertising is quite different though. Look at the poster for Force Awakens and see the stark difference in prominence compared to The Last Jedi. Even the fecking title hints at heavy involvement of Luke Skywalker.

He features prominently on the poster but then no one's denying that he wasn't a prominent character. Just that he took on (more) of a supporting role as the mentor type figure, compared to the original trilogy where he was the central character of the whole thing. And again...posters are essentially like billing in that they're a form of advertising for the movie.

I'm pretty sure the boxset of the series I've got tucked away somewhere is from one of the re-releases and features Boba Fett as one of the main characters on the cover. Even though he's got like two or three lines.

 

[acnumber9]

He features prominently on the poster but then no one's denying that he wasn't a prominent character. Just that he took on (more) of a supporting role as the mentor type figure, compared to the original trilogy where he was the central character of the whole thing. And again...posters are essentially like billing in that they're a form of advertising for the movie.

I'm pretty sure the boxset of the series I've got tucked away somewhere is from one of the re-releases and features Boba Fett as one of the main characters on the cover. Even though he's got like two or three lines.

Less of a role than he had in the originals? Definitely. Less of a role than Finn or Poe? I don’t think so.

 

[Cheesy]

Less of a role than he had in the originals? Definitely. Less of a role than Finn or Poe? I don’t think so.

Over the course of the whole trilogy I'd say so. Finn and Poe weren't necessarily much bigger than him in this individual movie but when they did have scenes, they tended to be the focus of those particular scenes; by contrast Luke's are (mostly) there to further the development of Rey and Ren. That doesn't mean he's not necessarily important or anything, because he's quite clearly a key supporting character, but over the course of the trilogy I'd argue Finn and Poe are/will be closer to protagonists while Luke's more of a supporting figure. Mostly semantics, though.

 

[R.N7]

Yeah, but Snoke didn’t have a backstory Nils. I don’t think you fully realise how important this is.

He was a terribly designed character. I'm glad Rian Johnson had the good sense of killing him off.

 

[acnumber9]

Over the course of the whole trilogy I'd say so. Finn and Poe weren't necessarily much bigger than him in this individual movie but when they did have scenes, they tended to be the focus of those particular scenes; by contrast Luke's are (mostly) there to further the development of Rey and Ren. That doesn't mean he's not necessarily important or anything, because he's quite clearly a key supporting character, but over the course of the trilogy I'd argue Finn and Poe are/will be closer to protagonists while Luke's more of a supporting figure. Mostly semantics, though.

Well yeah but they have to now. Unless they send Finn to a day spa planet in the next one to find somebody who can fix an oil leak.

I’m all for more Poe in the next one because Oscar Isaac is a pretty good actor. I wouldn’t even say my biggest gripe with the film was Luke’s character. A lot can happen in the 30 years that passed to change somebody. My issue with this film was the ludicrous comedy that ruined any potential drama or emotional impact. For me anyway.

 

[Mockney]

He was a terribly designed character. I'm glad Rian Johnson had the good sense of killing him off.

Yeah, but he was in an earlier film Nils. One earlier film! You know that bit in the Three Colours Trilogy: White, where Karol turns the tables on his bosses and takes their money? Remember how annoyed you were that you didn’t know the intricate backstory of those bosses, or how they fit into the larger Kieslowski Universe? You remember that, yeah?... Now Imagine that, but with light hearted space laser duels and cute fluffy merchandisable creatures.

Yeah!....Serious fecking business you’ll no doubt agree.

 

[Revan]

The film is marketed as a continuation of the original films with the main character from them being plastered all over the advertising for this one. What the feck do you expect people to expect? The level of the films success hinges on it. No amount of flowery, nonsensical bullshit you write makes your point any more true. Brexit Star Wars? Are you a parody of a bad columnist?

Him getting his own trilogy (as long as they stick to their word that it is gonna be on some other time and so no Skywalkers) isn't a bad thing IMO. He explored some interesting themes, and the movie was quite original, so for a new trilogy, it would be okay. Just that for this movie, it kinda sucked considering that it was supposed to be a continuation of the original trilogy, the Skywalker story.