Film Star Wars: Episode VIII

Oo0AahCantona said:
A perfect example of the multitude of decisions that butchered this movie would be vice admiral holdo's? character.

If you swapped her out completely with admiral ahkbar in her role, it becomes a much better plot point. Because it gives a send off to a much loved fan favourate, who got killed off bloody screen for feck sake.

Akhbar sacrifising himself for the fleet would have been a damn sight more epic and meaningful than introducing a new character nobody has any attachment to, or gives a shit about. They managed to kill 0 birds with 2 stones.
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I quite liked Holdo.

I'm not saying it was spectacularly executed but the change does make sense given that Star Wars is now a franchise designed to big up women. They want to put women in prominent authority positions; demonstrate to a new generation of boys that they should accept a woman's authority and to a new generation of girls that they are capable of it (and don't have to take no shit either). By booting Ackbar out into space and promoting Holdo they manage to put that message front and centre and in that light Po's story arc makes a lot more sense. I guess the decision was taken that it's more socially important for the audience to see the film's set piece act of heroic sacrifice come from a woman than a squid. I agree it was a bit forced and I guess it's a bit sad for fans that Ackbar gets jettisoned the way he does but it makes perfect sense given the ham-fisted but laudable objectives of the producers of the movie.
 
Ekkie Thump said:
I quite liked Holdo.

I'm not saying it was spectacularly executed but it does make sense given that Star Wars is now a franchise designed to big up women. They want to put women in prominent authority positions; demonstrate to a new generation of boys that they should accept a woman's authority and to a new generation of girls that they are capable of it (and don't have to take no shit either). By booting Ackbar out into space and promoting Holdo they manage to put that message front and centre and in that light Po's story arc makes a lot more sense. I guess the decision was taken that it's more socially important for the audience to see the film's set piece act of heroic sacrifice come from a woman than a squid. I agree it was a bit forced and I guess it's a bit sad for fans that Ackbar gets jettisoned the way he does but it makes perfect sense given the ham-fisted but laudable objectives of the producers of the movie.
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Mate it's all white dudes directing the movies.
 
Wibble said:
Why is everyone assuming that Rey's parents are "nobodies" just because Ren said so?
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Its actually Rey who says it first.

Ren says "Don't you want to know the truth about your parents? You've known it all along. Say it!"
Rey says "They were nobody"
Ren says: "They were junk traders, who sold you off for drinking money. You have no part in this story. You came from nothing; you're nothing. But not to me."
(Don't ask, I have a weirdly accurate memory for dialogue).

The point wasn't that this was some big reveal or that Kylo was trying to trick her; the point was actually Rey facing a truth she had really known all along, but was in denial about. The mirror vision in the cave reflected that; she was seeking an alternative answer from a mystical force to the one she's always known but not wanted to confront; that her parents were just ordinary people that abandoned her.

Its even all through the Force Awakens. Maz literally says "I see your eyes, you already know the truth". Rey keeps saying throughout the movie that she's waiting for her family to come back, refusing to accept that there actually is no one out there looking for her. The story has always been about Rey's denial of her own abandonment, not about some mystery lineage. I loved the reveal, I thought it was perfect.
 
Why is everyone saying that Luke is now gone? Surely he'll be in the next one as a force ghost a la Yoda. I think he'll have a major part to play. When he went, Rey said she felt peace and purpose. Yoda also showed that you can interact with the physical environment from beyond the grave. Seems to me like he just merged with the force to become more ubiquitous.

Also, are we convinced Snoke is dead? There are several ways he could still be alive.
 
Ackbar's voice actor died last year I'm pretty sure. Probably shelved any major plans they had for him.
 
Cheesy said:
Ackbar's voice actor died last year I'm pretty sure. Probably shelved any major plans they had for him.
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This is true.

I also kind of think this whole thing with Ackbar is a case in point as to why films are so littered with fan service these days. Holdo's end was the culmination of a movie-long arc with Poe, who begins the film playing the hero and getting a lot of his own people killed. Ackbar would be purely because he's a cult hero. Should've got a better end, but not in that scene.
 
Rey goes to the island to look for help but when did she get magical powers?I only remember a scene with her "training" with the sword and later suddenly she can move rocks. Did It happen in the previous movie?maybe I didn't watch It too carefully.
The same with Leia being in the outer space.I thought that she was human,not able to guide her body back to the starship.
Not the biggest fan but I liked it.,more than the VII.I like the characters of the pilot and Ren.
The scenes in the island were a bit boring and spent too many minutes in the ship.
I would add more secondary stories (as the Planet with the casino) and although probably its inherent to the saga I am a bit tired of Jedis,the force,Luke and fights with laser swords.
 
crappycraperson said:
There is no chance Disney just allowed Rian to do whatever with the main characters of the movie or even gave him a complete free reign with the plot. I mean supposedly killing off Luke could not have happened without their approval and personally I don't think even Rey's parentage reveal was done without studio's approval.
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Of course they would have to approve whatever he came up with, but it's more that he was allowed to come up with whatever he wanted in the first place. He's already spoken about how it was his decision to kill off the characters and answer Rey's parentage. I assumed such major plot points would have already been mapped out for the trilogy as a whole before he even came on board.
 
carvajal said:
Rey goes to the island to look for help but when did she get magical powers?I only remember a scene with her "training" with the sword and later suddenly she can move rocks. Did It happen in the previous movie?maybe I didn't watch It too carefully.
The same with Leia being in the outer space.I thought that she was human,not able to guide her body back to the starship.
Not the biggest fan but I liked it.,more than the VII.I like the characters of the pilot and Ren.
The scenes in the island were a bit boring and spent too many minutes in the ship.
I would add more secondary stories (as the Planet with the casino) and although probably its inherent to the saga I am a bit tired of Jedis,the force,Luke and fights with laser swords.
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Leia was said to be as naturally gifted with the force as Luke during the first star wars movies, we have barely seen her use the force for other stuff than "feel" stuff. Think it was fine. Not a great/needed addition, but fine.
As for the bolded, you should just skip star wars on the big screen for the foreseeable future.
 
carvajal said:
Rey goes to the island to look for help but when did she get magical powers?I only remember a scene with her "training" with the sword and later suddenly she can move rocks. Did It happen in the previous movie?maybe I didn't watch It too carefully.
The same with Leia being in the outer space.I thought that she was human,not able to guide her body back to the starship.
Not the biggest fan but I liked it.,more than the VII.I like the characters of the pilot and Ren.
The scenes in the island were a bit boring and spent too many minutes in the ship.
I would add more secondary stories (as the Planet with the casino) and although probably its inherent to the saga I am a bit tired of Jedis,the force,Luke and fights with laser swords.
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:lol:
 
Mr Smith said:
Its actually Rey who says it first.

Ren says "Don't you want to know the truth about your parents? You've known it all along. Say it!"
Rey says "They were nobody"
Ren says: "They were junk traders, who sold you off for drinking money. You have no part in this story. You came from nothing; you're nothing. But not to me."
(Don't ask, I have a weirdly accurate memory for dialogue).

The point wasn't that this was some big reveal or that Kylo was trying to trick her; the point was actually Rey facing a truth she had really known all along, but was in denial about. The mirror vision in the cave reflected that; she was seeking an alternative answer from a mystical force to the one she's always known but not wanted to confront; that her parents were just ordinary people that abandoned her.

Its even all through the Force Awakens. Maz literally says "I see your eyes, you already know the truth". Rey keeps saying throughout the movie that she's waiting for her family to come back, refusing to accept that there actually is no one out there looking for her. The story has always been about Rey's denial of her own abandonment, not about some mystery lineage. I loved the reveal, I thought it was perfect.
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Still doesn't make it true. If Rey couldn't guess the answer that Ren wanted and would buy into her fears that her parents were sumbags then she would be very dumb. Nothing so far means anything either way.
 
Ubik said:
Only two minutes in, but the lightsaber was the one Ben had at the academy, right? That's why he goes "that lightsaber belongs to me!" in TFA.


It makes more sense thematically, and Ren has little reason to say that as a lie (I'd have thought "we're cousins!" would be a better lie to convince her over).
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Could be true. Could be bullshit. Maybe en wanted her to feel that she had nothing to live up to and perhaps he was hinting at offering to be her family as they had both (in his mind) been abandoned by their families.
 
Wibble said:
Still doesn't make it true. If Rey couldn't guess the answer that Ren wanted and would buy into her fears that her parents were sumbags then she would be very dumb. Nothing so far means anything either way.
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Johnson has said he took it to be true and it wasn't Ren trying to trick her. Of course, JJ could still decide to go another way if he really wanted to.
 
Johnson isn't involved in the next film so it could still go either way. Not that I care. Just making the point that it ain't necessarily true.
 
People also forget that Return of The Jedi wasn't that liked at the time but started to be recognised as the best film once the 3rd film gave us a more satisfying end to the trilogy. Same could be true of this film as people seem to be annoyed that it left so many questions unanswered.
 
Wibble said:
People also forget that Return of The Jedi wasn't that liked at the time but started to be recognised as the best film once the 3rd film gave us a more satisfying end to the trilogy. Same could be true of this film as people seem to be annoyed that it left so many questions unanswered.
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Do you mean Empire?
 
Ødegaard said:
Leia was said to be as naturally gifted with the force as Luke during the first star wars movies, we have barely seen her use the force for other stuff than "feel" stuff. Think it was fine. Not a great/needed addition, but fine.
As for the bolded, you should just skip star wars on the big screen for the foreseeable future.
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Thanks,I didn't remember that part of Leia.
At least the fact that she had to recover for the rest of the movie makes it a little less fanciful
about the other, there are things that I would change but I like the movies. I just thought that this trilogy (if the 7,8 and 9 can be considered as a trilogy) would focus things differently, with new dangers, entities, divinities, however it seems that it is the colophon to the previous ones.
I thought that the references to previous films would not have so much weight in the plot.
Everything seems very melancholic.
After writing here I read(in As) that from 10th, the story will change, but on the other hand the actress who is Rey has sowed doubts about her presence after 2019
 
Like all Star Wars movies it doesn't really stand up to intense scrutiny but I enjoyed it. I think they have taken big steps to move away from the Skywalker saga and open up the world.

On the plus side they got rid of Snoke (terrible CGI baddie who we thankfully didn't have to see fighting) and Ren's Vader impression.
On the negative side, how come ships only have "cruise" or "light speed" as their available speeds.
 
GBBQ said:
Like all Star Wars movies it doesn't really stand up to intense scrutiny but I enjoyed it. I think they have taken big steps to move away from the Skywalker saga and open up the world.

On the plus side they got rid of Snoke (terrible CGI baddie who we thankfully didn't have to see fighting) and Ren's Vader impression.
On the negative side, how come ships only have "cruise" or "light speed" as their available speeds.
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Why would you need any other speed? Those massive ships only really need to jump between systems. What I don't get is why the first order didn't jump a star destroyer or two ahead of the rebel cruiser....
 
antsmithmk said:
Why would you need any other speed? Those massive ships only really need to jump between systems. What I don't get is why the first order didn't jump a star destroyer or two ahead of the rebel cruiser....
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They are battle ships and were chasing down a fleet so I think that in itself is sufficient reason! The speed limitations and the fuel consumption were two things I didn't like about that scenario.
 
It's fascinating that this is possibly the best reviewed Star Wars film to date but the one that has proved the most divisive to fans.
 
antsmithmk said:
Why would you need any other speed? Those massive ships only really need to jump between systems. What I don't get is why the first order didn't jump a star destroyer or two ahead of the rebel cruiser....
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Ludicrous Speed?
 
Was it explained how they were able to track the rebel ship through hyperspace? Surely a tracking device would have had to have been placed on the rebel ship?
 
Dan said:
Rian Johnson talking about Snoke.

http://ew.com/movies/2017/12/17/star-wars-last-jedi-spoilers-snoke-killed-theories/2/
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He is spot on to be honest. And like he said Palpatine was a nobody in the old trilogy too. They can still explain his background in future books or a specific origins movie. And while I liked the one theory who he is which was mentioned in the article, it was always clear for me that it would be way too complicated to explain that within the movie to everyone except for hardcore Star Wars fans. And I totally agree that Rey and Kylo would be just like "who is that guy", it would be a reveal just for the fans and the sake of it, without any meaning to the characters. I mean not even Luke had any connection to him, the only characters who might have been interested in that would be Palpatine and maybe Anakin and they are both dead.
 
Big Andy said:
I thought I was watching Spaceballs 2 at the start of it, with the "Hello, I'm holding for Hux" bit...
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Snoke using the force from God knows where to face plant Hux through hologram was pretty impressive. If he's so powerful he can do that you'd think he'd put it to more evil use.
 
Guys, I just realised they could have had Admiral Akbar suicide light speed the first order ship shouting "IT'S A TRAAAAAAAP!".
 
acnumber9 said:
Snoke using the force from God knows where to face plant Hux through hologram was pretty impressive. If he's so powerful he can do that you'd think he'd put it to more evil use.
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I could be wrong but couldn't Darth Vadar do that too?
 
Mr Smith said:
This is the key though; the people who like this new trilogy (myself included) like it because they like the new characters. If you don't like Rey, Finn, Poe, or Kylo Ren, this trilogy will never work for you. If you do like these characters, the new trilogy is a real delight. I for example fundamentally disagree with you about Kylo, I think he's a very compelling character. But I understand why he doesn't work for everyone, and that's fine. This stuff is subjective, and we shouldn't be invalidating each other's opinions to the extent that we have over the last few days (not saying you are at all, just using your comment to point this out).

I know people for instance that never liked the original Star Wars trilogy because they found Luke and Leia to be whiney and bratty respectively.

Its worth noting that as they haven't given Snoke any sort of backstory, you can completely believe he is Plagueis if you want to. I always liked the theory, so now in my headcanon (which is perfectly legitimate for each individual IMO), Plagueis is Snoke. Adds an extra layer to the trilogy plus a nice bit of dramatic irony; just as Plagueis died was mortally wounded because he underestimated his apprentice Palpatine, he was defeated again because he underestimated Kylo.
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Agreed here - and this is where I struggled with TLJ. While I really enjoyed The Force Awakens and all its new characters, I found Finn, Poe, Rose and some of the others just quite annoying in this one. The Luke/Rey/Ren stuff was great, and I even got a little teary when Luke kissed Leia on the forehead, but I found the storylines away from there just a bit silly, with the characters not giving me enough to invest in. Finn and Poe seem to be completely one-note characters, what are we supposed to find interesting about them? Particularly annoying as I liked Boyega so much in TFA.

Adam Driver and Mark Hamill were my standouts, and I’m gutted that after alll of that we won’t get Luke in the third - will we?

Not quite clear on my thoughts overall. I definitely enjoyed it, but it wasn’t as good as I wanted it to be. Better than Rogue, worse than Force Awakens in my book.
 
VP89 said:
I could be wrong but couldn't Darth Vadar do that too?
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Definitely a scene in ESB where he's speaking to a general on a big screen and the general starts choking the chicken.
ThierryHenry said:
Adam Driver and Mark Hamill were my standouts, and I’m gutted that after alll of that we won’t get Luke in the third - will we?
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I'd guess he'll be back as a force ghost like Yoda was for Luke.
 
GBBQ said:
Definitely a scene in ESB where he's speaking to a general on a big screen and the general starts choking the chicken.

I'd guess he'll be back as a force ghost like Yoda was for Luke.
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Sure Luke will be back and trolling Kylo Ren from the great beyond.

Have to say, on first viewing I was very concerned about what I had seen, though after a second, I'm thoroughly on board. Couple have lived without the last scene and the bit at the end of the horse escape when Finn and Rose give some 'right on' line about doing the right thing. A few jokes fall flat too, but I generally really liked it. Adam Driver was outstanding and the space sexting was really good.
 
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