Something special is building at Old Trafford

Lynty said:
Living up to your name I see.

Why put a downer on a positive thread with the very first reply :lol:
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Excuse me? What do you want me to do? Just agree with the op and say "yeah you're so right, everything is great, woohoo!" despite the last six years showing that's more than likely not the case at all?

And anyway, am I wrong? Are we actually going to fix all we've done wrong over the last six years under the Glazer's and Ed?
 
Lynty said:
Living up to your name I see.

Why put a downer on a positive thread with the very first reply :lol:
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Because he doesn’t share the view? The idea of a ‘positive thread’ is just silly anyway. The OP sets a topic and the conversation begins.
 
Looking forward to us next year still struggling to break into top 4 and people telling us it's all part of the plan and it'll be next year with more money spent.
 
dev1l said:
Biggest problems have been some defensive lapses and a midfield decimated by injuries.
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I'd say waaaay more than some, there's been a comedy of errors on a weekly basis, from our CB's and DDG. Midfield yes, decimated by injuries with no similar quality replacements to step in. What happens if Fred gets an injury now? Dread the thought let alone the reality.
 
There are definitely positives in the squad and Ole deserves credit for a lot of it.

However for them to become meaningful we need to start acting like a big club. A DOF, a manager who can develop a style of play and backing the team with big funds. We're Manchester United we seem lost just now but we don't have to be forever
 
During the LVG years I think about 15-20 players left/retired from the first team squad. He signed 12 new ones.

The core/thrusted players of the next manager's team were DDG, Valencia, Smalling, Lindelöf, Bailly, Young, Fellaini, Pogba, Herrera, Matic, Mata, Lingard, Mhkitaryan/Sanchez, Rashford and Ibrahimovic/Lukaku.

There's one LVG signing in there.

As we now have a team where 10+ players seem very likely to still be important for the club in 5/6/7(+) years is at least a big plus.
 
Agree that the young talent has the makings of an exceptional core. Can add Mejbri to the list of talented youngsters that should make a first team breakthrough in the next year or two.

It feels to me like the squad is one Jadon Sancho and 2-3 (depending on Pogba) midfielders away from being complete. When you factor in natural attrition and filling the resulting holes, it feels like the rebuild should be complete after two more summers. If we can make the correct signings in those areas, we should have an excellent squad full of talented players, mostly 19-27 year old, come the 21/22 season.

As some others have said, that talent really needs an exceptional coach to get us to where we need to be, however. It also requires the club to make the necessary spending. If they're smart and take advantage of the homegrown talent we have coming through and spend the requisite money in the next 18 months to supplement it appropriately, we can have a young, talented squad for the next decade that just needs one or two signings per year.

Problem for me is, I'm not sure I have faith that we'll get the right manager and the club will make the necessary investment in the next two summer windows to get us to that point. After all, if they had invested appropriately towards the end of Fergie's tenure (which also happened to be a time of much lower transfer fees relative to the post-Fergie era), we wouldn't be in the situation we are now and have had to bring in 3-5 players per window that suited now departed managers.
 
Massive Spanner said:
Excuse me? What do you want me to do? Just agree with the op and say "yeah you're so right, everything is great, woohoo!" despite the last six years showing that's more than likely not the case at all?

And anyway, am I wrong? Are we actually going to fix all we've done wrong over the last six years under the Glazer's and Ed?
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It's just so boring.

"We'll never get anywhere with these owners and chairman, Maguire is average, Lindelof is shit" - it's the same regurgitated stuff everyday. Exhausting, especially when you read a well written OP then it's back to the drivel. You can hold conflicting opinions without presenting them so negatively...

Pennywise said:
There are definitely positives in the squad and Ole deserves credit for a lot of it.

However for them to become meaningful we need to start acting like a big club. A DOF, a manager who can develop a style of play and backing the team with big funds. We're Manchester United we seem lost just now but we don't have to be forever
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ATXRedDevil said:
Agree that the young talent has the makings of an exceptional core. Can add Mejbri to the list of talented youngsters that should make a first team breakthrough in the next year or two.

It feels to me like the squad is one Jadon Sancho and 2-3 (depending on Pogba) midfielders away from being complete. When you factor in natural attrition and filling the resulting holes, it feels like the rebuild should be complete after two more summers. If we can make the correct signings in those areas, we should have an excellent squad full of talented players, mostly 19-27 year old, come the 21/22 season.

As some others have said, that talent really needs an exceptional coach to get us to where we need to be, however. It also requires the club to make the necessary spending. If they're smart and take advantage of the homegrown talent we have coming through and spend the requisite money in the next 18 months to supplement it accordingly, we can have a young, talented squad for the next decade that just needs one or two signings per year.

Problem for me is, I'm not sure I have faith that we'll get the right manager and the club will make the necessary investment in the next two summer windows to get us to that point. After all, if they had invested appropriately towards the end of Fergie's tenure (which also happened to be a time of much lower transfer fees relative to the post-Fergie era), we wouldn't be in the situation we are now and have had to bring in 3-5 players per window that suited now departed managers.
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...like so
 
Lynty said:
It's just so boring.

"We'll never get anywhere with these owners and chairman, Maguire is average, Lindelof is shit" - it's the same regurgitated stuff everyday. Exhausting, especially when you read a well written OP then it's back to the drivel. You can hold conflicting opinions without presenting them so negatively...





...like so
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Don't you think it's funny that you're only picking up on the negatives when I agreed with most of what the op said, though? I think there are a lot of promising signs but we still will not get anywhere as things stand, I hope that changes and we do.

Honestly if all you want is everyone to agree with your opinion and be happy and jolly and there to be no negativity then maybe you should stop insulting those who don't or just f*ck off from the Caf to some magical jolly happy land full of rainbows and unicorns.
 
Massive Spanner said:
Honestly if all you want is everyone to agree with your opinion and be happy and jolly and there to be no negativity then maybe you should stop insulting those who don't or just f*ck off from the Caf to some magical jolly happy land full of rainbows and unicorns.
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It’s nice to read a legibly written and rational post that hasn’t been penned by a raging baby. Somewhat saddening that it’s the work of an opposition fan.

I agree with a good chunk of it, too. There is no guarantee that the club will climb back to the top of English football; however, there is certainly reason enough to feel optimistic. As you rightly point out, there are some very good young players at the club and an (apparent) understanding that the culture throughout the club needed a ‘reboot’. Again, no guarantees, but I’d sooner be in our position than that of Spurs or Arsenal, for example. Financially, we can do more and I think our squad is further down the line in terms of development.
 
Lynty said:
It's just so boring.

"We'll never get anywhere with these owners and chairman, Maguire is average, Lindelof is shit" - it's the same regurgitated stuff everyday. Exhausting, especially when you read a well written OP then it's back to the drivel. You can hold conflicting opinions without presenting them so negatively...





...like so
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Are you so precious that you cant accept any criticism of the club? The consensus among all fans is that the board and higher ups are holding us back. That has no bearing on any issue with the manager a poster may have which is what I imagine you're referring to with your strawman quotes.

Do we have to create positive only threads so the same posters can continue their circlejerk of out doing one anothers top rediness
 
el3mel said:
Looking forward to us next year still struggling to break into top 4 and people telling us it's all part of the plan and it'll be next year with more money spent.
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You're looking forward to us struggling to break into the top 4?

Yea, OK
 
b82REZ said:
Are you so precious that you cant accept any criticism of the club? The consensus among all fans is that the board and higher ups are holding us back. That has no bearing on any issue with the manager a poster may have which is what I imagine you're referring to with your strawman quotes.

Do we have to create positive only threads so the same posters can continue their circlejerk of out doing one anothers top rediness
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No, but can we have one positive thread without repeating all the usual whining?
 
Kag said:
It’s nice to read a legibly written and rational post that hasn’t been penned by a raging baby. Somewhat saddening that it’s the work of an opposition fan.
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Easier to look at things from an outsiders perspective sometimes, not being so close to the matter.
 
Amerifan said:
You're looking forward to us struggling to break into the top 4?

Yea, OK
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No, I'm looking forward to the excuses that will be said here regarding that. As for us struggling to break into top 4, I'm sure it's going to happen if I don't want it, because literally any logical and not deluded person will know we're going nowhere.
 
Massive Spanner said:
Some positives there for sure but sadly under our current ownership we still won't get anywhere.

Also really don't agree with Maguire and Lindelof part. The former is just about good enough for a top four club and the latter isn't good enough at this level.
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Massive Spanner said:
Don't you think it's funny that you're only picking up on the negatives when I agreed with most of what the op said, though? I think there are a lot of promising signs but we still will not get anywhere as things stand, I hope that changes and we do.

Honestly if all you want is everyone to agree with your opinion and be happy and jolly and there to be no negativity then maybe you should stop insulting those who don't or just f*ck off from the Caf to some magical jolly happy land full of rainbows and unicorns.
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From reading your first post, I can not tell that you agreed with most of the OP. Yes, you say there are positives, but the post is in general mainly in a negative tone. If you did indeed intend to be mostly positive, it was lost on me.

I also agree with other posters that there is way too much negativity in this place at the moment. Posts like yours, just after a well written, constructive OP, does keep setting a negative tone, which I fear will eventually drive positive posters away. Your second post does not really help either.
 
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JPRouve said:
I wouldn't say that something special is definitely building but that we have the material and a part of the foundations to build something special. The question is whether the site manager is actually good enough to give the project life.
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This is pretty much where I'm at. I'm not on this romanticism give Ole time, he needs to earn his time here. Top four finish or a Europa League win should be credible enough to give him few more seasons in charge. The football this season hasn't been productive enough.
 
passing-wind said:
This is pretty much where I'm at. I'm not on this romanticism give Ole time, he needs to earn his time here. Top four finish or a Europa League win should be credible enough to give him few more seasons in charge. The football this season hasn't been productive enough.
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It is because we are so inconsistent, it is embarrassing. The annoying thing is in games like Liverpool, CIty we start okay look like we will compete and 10 mins in we sit back and absorb pressure. But, thats all we do, nothing in the form of attack.
 
How dare you have a positive view on our current squad don't you know this is the CAF?
Joking aside I generally agree with most of what you said except the Lindelof part.
 
el3mel said:
No, I'm looking forward to the excuses that will be said here regarding that. As for us struggling to break into top 4, I'm sure it's going to happen if I don't want it, because literally any logical and not deluded person will know we're going nowhere.
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You state we won’t make top 4 next year with such surety and insult those who believe otherwise. Please, share with us who our manager will be next year and what our roster and injury situation will be so we can all know what you claim to know.
 
Amerifan said:
You state we won’t make top 4 next year with such surety and insult those who believe otherwise. Please, share with us who our manager will be next year and what our roster and injury situation will be so we can all know what you claim to know.
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Insulted ? :lol: Where's that insult ?
 
Don’t let the doom mongers and lords of pessimism ruin the thread.

There’s definitely an exciting spine forming at the club now. We still need some signings, but for the first time in years I’m confident that quality players can come in and actually perform and lift our team. For a long time, every new player that arrived crashed and burned. It was like we were cursed.
 
Amerifan said:
I would assume some would not appreciate being called deluded. Nice attempt at deflection, though. I will give you that. Still waiting on the answer.
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Of course deluded isn't an insult. :lol: What's that ? You must be very sensitive if you take it as one.

As for your question as long as Ole is present I'm not expecting anything more than a fight to finish top 4 whatever number of seasons he stays, it'll be just more of the same. Only with a managerial change I might start to expect more.
 
passing-wind said:
This is pretty much where I'm at. I'm not on this romanticism give Ole time, he needs to earn his time here. Top four finish or a Europa League win should be credible enough to give him few more seasons in charge. The football this season hasn't been productive enough.
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What has "romanticism." got to do with giving him time? A silly, cliched, lazy label because he scored a winner in the CL final 20 years ago. He has had 12 months in the job and one window. Doing OK as far as we can see. He is earning his time now. Because some FM experts think we should be transformed overnight and their shiny, trophyless Poch didn't happen, they are quick to jump in on an Internet forum, every time something doesn't conform to their ."vision". We're not going to repeat Fergie levels of success again. Ever.mit never happened before and is unlikely to happen. again. Not having a go at you, particularly, mate but it is a regular nonsense trotted out on here.
 
positives are definitely there, most importantly we need to find the balance in our first XI, signs are there, our front three has started to click, but we need an operator from right just as effective and quick as Rashford from the left and a linchpin like Firmino to operate from the center. Martial is good but he still lacks in finer nuances of a False 9 and also struggles to operate as a sole striker.

We need a settled midfield, need at least 3 recruits if Pogba and Matic leave in summer. So is the case with defense, We only have Maguire and Lindelof. Bailly, Rojo and Jones cannot be part of a title challenging squad. So we need to shore up our defense with one more CB as Rojo and Bailly are most likely to leave. So is the case with LB, Shaw should be sold and solid LB like Alex Telles or Ben Chilwell needs to be brought in.
 
The Boy said:
This isn’t about Ole or whether he’s good enough or not. Whoever your manager is in one or two years time they could have something very special on their hands.

The core of your team is young, very young and they’re growing together, The Athletic have done a piece about how Martial, Rashford and Greenwood have outscored Mane, Salah and Firminho so far this season. Put that alongside the growth in players like AWB, James, McT, Williams, that’s seven players aged 24 or younger all looking the business. Add in the possibilities like Laird, Garner and Tuanzebe and the future looks very bright.

This season maybe erratic but actually for once you truly are a team in transition. Key older players from the past few years are gone or being phased out and they are being replaced by fresh talented youngsters. That’s not something you’ve been able to say for years, since before SAF left.

If you get Fernandes this window, that could well be another key part of the puzzle. Maguire and Lindelof are 26 and 25 respectively, the next 4 years should see them at their peak as well.

Whoever your manager is in 2 years time will be incredibly lucky, a very talented core is coming of age at OT and though you might be disappointed or frustrated this season, soon you’ll be the envy of most clubs. The ground is being laid superbly at the moment.
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Some good points and i'm in the minority that believe that Maguire and Lindelof are actually a decent partnership (or not as bad as most people think). People have complained about our injury problems this season but if either of those two had been injured for a few months I honestly think we'd be further down the league. The players you listed need to go up another few levels- and they're young enough, they can do that but I do have a few reservations. The core of the team is based on pace and power but I do wonder if they have the technical qualities that another manager might demand.
 
Personally I'm still really enjoying this season. Even when we lose a couple I feel good about the team being on a general upward trajectory, and I actually consistently like watching us for the first time since before Fergie left, to be honest. Obviously there've been good spells and great players here and there since then, but this set of players and the way they play is just really clicking for me.
 
romufc said:
It is because we are so inconsistent, it is embarrassing. The annoying thing is in games like Liverpool, CIty we start okay look like we will compete and 10 mins in we sit back and absorb pressure. But, thats all we do, nothing in the form of attack.
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This is true, but against Wolves yesterday I actually thought we performed quite well given that Wolves were sitting back. Sure, we're not City or Liverpool able to carve these teams open with well-drilled, intricate moves, but we did create genuine chances and did link up well at times in and around the box, with both FBs getting forward on the overlap. Those are things we need to continue to see, but I took yesterday's performance as a major positive in that sense.
 
You'd think that after an entire year in charge we'd have a bit more than "somethings brewing at OT". We might kick on from now but I'm not too confident.

His first month or so was some cause for excitement. Not sure how anyone can make that point at the moment.
 
AR87 said:
This is true, but against Wolves yesterday I actually thought we performed quite well given that Wolves were sitting back. Sure, we're not City or Liverpool able to carve these teams open with well-drilled, intricate moves, but we did create genuine chances and did link up well at times in and around the box, with both FBs getting forward on the overlap. Those are things we need to continue to see, but I took yesterday's performance as a major positive in that sense.
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The first 30 minutes against City was easily the best we've played all season and the only time we looked like we had a plan and could execute it to perfection.
 
el3mel said:
Of course deluded isn't an insult. :lol: What's that ? You must be very sensitive if you take it as one.

As for your question as long as Ole is present I'm not expecting anything more than a fight to finish top 4 whatever number of seasons he stays, it'll be just more of the same. Only with a managerial change I might start to expect more.
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Calling people deluded is obviously an insult. What are you talking about?
 
One thing weve also done, which a lot wanted is, get rid of the 'deadwood'. That term used for players who arent good enough, or been around for too long or just sucking up wages.

As much service or moments some of them might have given us, its been clear for a few years the following werent good enough for united (whether it was ever or anymore):
Valencia, Young, Rojo, Darmian, Jones, Sanchez, Lukaku.... We got most of them off our wages whether its sales or loans.

But, it will only matter if we replace them correctly. We have some great youth coming through or in our team. A really young team of players. We now need to supplement them with good quality experience who want to play for United. I think that is going to be the difficult part looking at the last 4-5 years.
 
I agree with OP, this forum is extremely short sighted. I like the direction we're going in and we should be comfortably a top four team next season and pushing on for a title challenge in a couple of years if we get lucky (or plan well) with a couple of transfers. I think we should've prioritized getting a CM and AM last summer instead of trying to shore up the defence but you can't blame the club / Ole too much for that decision.

Bar injuries, we've got:

A solid young core who are only going to get better in the next 2-3 years in Rashford, Martial, McTominay, AwB, James, Greenwood. I'm going to leave Williams out because sample size is too small.
Some solid pros who are going to play consistently well for the next 2-3 years in De Gea, Maguire, Pogba (assuming we hold on to him), Lindelof.
Some useful squad players who can do a job in the first team in Shaw, Pereira and Fred.

Rest / Yth players: Dalot (too few games this season), Lingard, Rojo (Shit, need to be shipped out), Williams, Gomes, Chong, Garner (still semi unproven), Bailly (too injury prone, probably fine as a backup),

This covers 10 / 11 first team positions. The only position where we need some genuine first team quality is CM / AM depending on where we want Pogba to play. My guess is that Ole wants Pogba at #8 and Fred will be Pogba's backup. Signing Fernandes will plug the gaping hole at #10 and we'll have a quality first team.

The other problem is that we are desperate for some depth (in CM and ST especially with Lukaku and Herrera leaving) because injury to any of our first choice means that our backups are somewhat inadequate. Matic is doing McTominay's job fairly well, but he'll leave at the end of the season. Fred has been an able backup for Pogba but is not as good and Pereira is doing an okay job at #10 but is not as good as what our rivals have (KdB, B. Silva, D. Silva, Maddison, Alli, Eriksen, Mount).

I think we should kick on in the summer and get another RW, CF to rotate with James and Martial, another CM as a backup if Matic leaves and either convince Smalling to stay on as a rotation option or buy another backup CB. That's 4x transfers and is totally do-able and should put us comfortably in the top 4.
 
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