Solskjaer's legacy and his future

[romufc]

Your stance(s) on Ole are really fecking weird; you went from fanatical, to being highly critical and now you seem hell bent on defending him again? Wtf.

I also see you described Jose's tenure as a failure in an older post. This is despite 2 cups and a higher points-total second place finish; with a poorer squad than Ole worked with. Yet you want to praise Ole for reaching the final of one of the cups Jose won (while getting beaten very fecking timidly), and finishing second with a worse points total (in a total anomaly of a season). All sounds very hypocritical and agenda driven.

Re Villarreal: yes we should have beaten Villarreal. They're really not all that and them beating a very poor Bayern proves feck all. I fancy Liverpool to easily dispose of them. For me, the Ajax team Jose beat in the EL Final was a comfortably better team.

This is the problem with fans like you, its either black or white. When in reality its not.

Ole deserved to be sacked? Yes. Ole deserved to start this season? Yes because he finished 2nd, got EL final. How hard is it for you to understand that?

In respects to Jose, I am not sitting here saying he is an awful manager btw, I think Jose will go down as one of the best managers. He was bad at United because a manager of his reputation and calibre should be winning more than he did.

I have no shame in changing my opinion based on facts unlike you where its either Black or White.

Ofcourse you will think that, you are a Ole hater so wont see anything subjectively.

 

[Robbie Boy]

This is the problem with fans like you, its either black or white. When in reality its not.

Ole deserved to be sacked? Yes. Ole deserved to start this season? Yes because he finished 2nd, got EL final. How hard is it for you to understand that?

In respects to Jose, I am not sitting here saying he is an awful manager btw, I think Jose will go down as one of the best managers. He was bad at United because a manager of his reputation and calibre should be winning more than he did.

I have no shame in changing my opinion based on facts unlike you where its either Black or White.

Ofcourse you will think that, you are a Ole hater so wont see anything subjectively.

Fans like me? I'm only referring to your post history on the subject. No need to get so triggered. I'm an 'Ole hater' I actually backed him most of his tenure but had massive doubts about him.

If this is your only retort instead of clarifying your blatant flip-flopping and hypocrisy, then that's your call dude. You were seriously Ole out towards the end, so just odd seeing you defend him so vehemently now. Maybe you're a contrarian? I dunno.

 

[padzilla]

Ole should have been moved on after the collapse in the league in the second half of the season and losing the Europa League Final with one of our worst ever performances in a final - a game he should have had the lads buzzing for.

Yes we finished second in the PL but let's be honest, it was one-horse race, it's not like we were pipped at the post - the league was over in January and we were not good enough, not close to good enough.

We were top of the league last Christmas and more than 10 points behind less than two months later - it was obvious the writing was on the wall and we should have acted before we did, he had taken the club as far as he could and given us many good memories along the way - no harm in that whatsoever.

We know what happened instead, now we are in a worse position than we were when he took over.

The fact many feel it was an achievement to finish second but not even challenge after Christmas, shows how expectations have diminished badly over the years.

 

[romufc]

Fans like me? I'm only referring to your post history on the subject. No need to get so triggered. I'm an 'Ole hater' I actually backed him most of his tenure but had massive doubts about him.

If this is your only retort instead of clarifying your blatant flip-flopping and hypocrisy, then that's your call dude. You were seriously Ole out towards the end, so just odd seeing you defend him so vehemently now. Maybe you're a contrarian? I dunno.

There is nothing wrong in wanting a manager out for his bad performances this season. I was Ole out and I still think it was the right call to sack him.

However; I don't think he is an awful manager that everyone suggests and his achievements were purely luck. A lucky manager doesn't break the away unbeaten record, does not go to City and consistently win.

What I am a hypocrite for defending Ole? As I said, maybe for you things are black and white, for me they aren't, I can differentiate the good he did to the bad.

I guess you dont change your opinion on things?

 

[90 + 5min]

Its interesting that one metric is used for one manager and a different for another.

Ole probably encouraged Fred to shoot more, sometimes you have to encourage your players if they make a mistake, because its the instruction you give them.

Its like with City playing out the back, Pep wants them to do that so, he took a few mistakes that led to goals / chances because the players were doing what they were told.

Also, now I see people saying Villareal are a good team and could win CL, but last season losing to them on penalties it was how bad Ole is not being able to beat them.

How can an awful manager get 3rd, 2nd and semi finals and finals? People talk about individual brilliance, where is that individual brilliance now?

How can a awful manager get the best out of 2 players that cant keep the football in Bruno and Rashford?

Always been and will be. People are now obsessed of being right whatever it takes. There is no ending of wierd arguments and made up things. We even had our own fans and still have that actually wanted us to lose games so Solskjaer would be sacked. I find that pretty crazy.

As you said. Suddenly Villareal are great team but when we lost, Solskjaer was worst manager ever. Suddenly our players are not good enough but when Solskjaer was manager it was him who was the problem.

There is obviously a a huge element of that for many on here, no other way several threads dedicated to Solskjaer would be raging daily 5 months after he got sacked.

That happens when their own world collide with reality and facts. Suddenly there is need to make up weird arguments why Solskjaer was worst of the worst. Just so they don't lose face. To be stubborn is not always a good thing.

 

[90 + 5min]

Ole should have been moved on after the collapse in the league in the second half of the season and losing the Europa League Final with one of our worst ever performances in a final - a game he should have had the lads buzzing for.

Yes we finished second in the PL but let's be honest, it was one-horse race, it's not like we were pipped at the post - the league was over in January and we were not good enough, not close to good enough.

We were top of the league last Christmas and more than 10 points behind less than two months later - it was obvious the writing was on the wall and we should have acted before we did, he had taken the club as far as he could and given us many good memories along the way - no harm in that whatsoever.

We know what happened instead, now we are in a worse position than we were when he took over.

The fact many feel it was an achievement to finish second but not even challenge after Christmas, shows how expectations have diminished badly over the years.

Achivement now. But let me ask you question. Did you think we could win the league last year with ManCity, Liverpool and Chelsea as main rivals. Be honest. And if you ddidn't, how come you see that as failure to actually come 2nd?

We all want to win. But reality is that we are not in 90's or 00's. Football and trophies are not only for us to collect. There are other teams around us.

 

[Robbie Boy]

There is nothing wrong in wanting a manager out for his bad performances this season. I was Ole out and I still think it was the right call to sack him.

However; I don't think he is an awful manager that everyone suggests and his achievements were purely luck. A lucky manager doesn't break the away unbeaten record, does not go to City and consistently win.

What I am a hypocrite for defending Ole? As I said, maybe for you things are black and white, for me they aren't, I can differentiate the good he did to the bad.

I guess you dont change your opinion on things?

You're kind of creating a strawnan here tbh, and then levelling baseless accusations against me.

Do I change my opinion on things? Absolutely; especially on things as trivial as fecking football. If you had been aware of my post history on Ole; I went from strongly wanting him gone, to backing him. I have been quite open about this, and the posts are all there. Was I an Ole doubter? Yes I was. I didn't particularly rate him as a manager, but he probably exceeded what I thought he was capable of.

However, despite my dizzy hysyeria after our summer window, it was always obvious that our famed 2nd place came with several caveats, and we never looked like getting back to the top under him. Was he lucky? Depends on your strict interpretation of the word, I suppose. I guess yeah, he was lucky at times; but every team get some luck here-and-there. I certainly wouldn't be getting upset over someome using the terminology.

I still think it's hugely hypocritical that you labelled Jose's tenure a failure, while seemingly looking somewhat fondly on Ole's. This is despite Jose getting a 'better' second place finish and winning 2 cups. I mean, I personally class all of our appointments post-Fergie as fecking shambolic, for one reason or another. If you said you preferred Ole's then that's cool, but you actually said Jose's was a failure. I preferred Ole's personally, but Jose's was obviously more successful. So if Jose was a failure, what does that make Ole?

In your heart of hearts do you believe Ole is a good manager? I don't. Time will tell, but for me, he's extremely mediocre. Failing at United is nothing to be ashamed of. Hopefully he goes on and does well elsewhere; because despite the apparent 'hate' I have for him, I certainly wish him the best in his future endeavours.

I believe he left behind the best squad, strictly speaking. But in reality, it's a mess in terms of fitness, morale, commitment, drive, tactical nous etc. Not to mention the fact that it's a collection of players bought by Fergie, Moyes, LvG, Jose and Ole. I tried to buy into the notion of the 'great squad builder' angle - due to reservations about his managerial ability - but it looks like it was built on a house of cards, and I was conned like plenty of others. No issues admitting I was wrong, though. I just don't see why the need for you to flip back to this pro-Ole stance; there isn't always a need for extremes.

Like, can you actually call any aspect of Ole's tenure a success? We had some nice wins etc, but come on, after 3-years and all that money spent; it's blatantly clear that it wasn't good enough. Sure, we can all pretend now that Villarreal are awesome, 2nd place came with no caveats and Ralf has actually shown Ole got us playing greater than the sum of our parts. But come on, it's utter desperation from a select cohort to try unsuccessfuly to praise Ole again; and be 'right' on the internet, which is very important.

 

[romufc]

You're kind of creating a strawnan here tbh, and then levelling baseless accusations against me.

Do I change my opinion on things? Absolutely; especially on things as trivial as fecking football. If you had been aware of my post history on Ole; I went from strongly wanting him gone, to backing him. I have been quite open about this, and the posts are all there. Was I an Ole doubter? Yes I was. I didn't particularly rate him as a manager, but he probably exceeded what I thought he was capable of.

However, despite my dizzy hysyeria after our summer window, it was always obvious that our famed 2nd place came with several caveats, and we never looked like getting back to the top under him. Was he lucky? Depends on your strict interpretation of the word, I suppose. I guess yeah, he was lucky at times; but every team get some luck here-and-there. I certainly wouldn't be getting upset over someome using the terminology.

I still think it's hugely hypocritical that you labelled Jose's tenure a failure, while seemingly looking somewhat fondly on Ole's. This is despite Jose getting a 'better' second place finish and winning 2 cups. I mean, I personally class all of our appointments post-Fergie as fecking shambolic, for one reason or another. If you said you preferred Ole's then that's cool, but you actually said Jose's was a failure. I preferred Ole's personally, but Jose's was obviously more successful. So if Jose was a failure, what does that make Ole?

In your heart of hearts do you believe Ole is a good manager? I don't. Time will tell, but for me, he's extremely mediocre. Failing at United is nothing to be ashamed of. Hopefully he goes on and does well elsewhere; because despite the apparent 'hate' I have for him, I certainly wish him the best in his future endeavours.

I believe he left behind the best squad, strictly speaking. But in reality, it's a mess in terms of fitness, morale, commitment, drive, tactical nous etc. Not to mention the fact that it's a collection of players bought by Fergie, Moyes, LvG, Jose and Ole. I tried to buy into the notion of the 'great squad builder' angle - due to reservations about his managerial ability - but it looks like it was built on a house of cards, and I was conned like plenty of others. No issues admitting I was wrong, though. I just don't see why the need for you to flip back to this pro-Ole stance; there isn't always a need for extremes.

Like, can you actually call any aspect of Ole's tenure a success? We had some nice wins etc, but come on, after 3-years and all that money spent; it's blatantly clear that it wasn't good enough. Sure, we can all pretend now that Villarreal are awesome, 2nd place came with no caveats and Ralf has actually shown Ole got us playing greater than the sum of our parts. But come on, it's utter desperation from a select cohort to try unsuccessfuly to praise Ole again; and be 'right' on the internet, which is very important.

Firstly, I have never said Ole has been a success at the club. Lets get that straight.

Again, its not always Black and White, defending him from people saying he is an awful manager = Pro Ole?

Ole deserved to be sacked after what he did this season? Yes.

I was told under a better coach and tactics our players will look better, you know what? They look worse now.

Ole had Bruno, Rashford scoring goals, made them look like very good players, Ralf has come in and making these players look very ordinary.

We all know Ole had his tactical flaws, I have not once said he is the perfect manager.

Finally, we have to put context whilst judging managers too, Jose with the reputation he has, winning everywhere he goes, not winning the league at United is a failure in my books for a manager like Jose, whilst with Ole, I knew he wasn't going to win us the league.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Firstly, I have never said Ole has been a success at the club. Lets get that straight.

Again, its not always Black and White, defending him from people saying he is an awful manager = Pro Ole?

Ole deserved to be sacked after what he did this season? Yes.

I was told under a better coach and tactics our players will look better, you know what? They look worse now.

Ole had Bruno, Rashford scoring goals, made them look like very good players, Ralf has come in and making these players look very ordinary.

We all know Ole had his tactical flaws, I have not once said he is the perfect manager.

Finally, we have to put context whilst judging managers too, Jose with the reputation he has, winning everywhere he goes, not winning the league at United is a failure in my books for a manager like Jose, whilst with Ole, I knew he wasn't going to win us the league.

Ok, so you're pretty much agreeing that his tenure was a failure. Good.

Unfortunately he will be judged as manager of Manchester United, as we don't bring mangers in on practice placements to learn their trade. Ole was well aware of this, and he simply done a poor job. Saying he had some individual players playing well isn't really a barometer of a managers tenure at a club, unfortunately. Those players were also shite for parts of Ole's tenure, and definitely the end part. So, it's just straw clutching, in my book.

Ralf clearly isn't the man, but that means feck all. Let's judge when a new manager comes in, has 3-years, and hundreds of millions to spend shall we? I think that's a much fairer barometer, don't you? Unless you want to be totally disingenuous and say Ole done awesome; based on the interim being a-bit crap, after walking into an absolute disaster, losing Greenwood and not having bought a single player himself. I mean, if that's what you want to go on to try vindicate Ole, then go ahead. But it means you obviously have comprehension issues when it comes to nuance and context. Ole's reign was a shambles, like those before him. No twisting of events or clutching, will alter that.

 

[romufc]

Ok, so you're pretty much agreeing that his tenure was a failure. Good.

Unfortunately he will be judged as manager of Manchester United, as we don't bring mangers in on practice placements to learn their trade. Ole was well aware of this, and he simply done a poor job. Saying he had some individual players playing well isn't really a barometer of a managers tenure at a club, unfortunately. Those players were also shite for parts of Ole's tenure, and definitely the end part. So, it's just straw clutching, in my book.

Ralf clearly isn't the man, but that means feck all. Let's judge when a new manager comes in, has 3-years, and hundreds of millions to spend shall we? I think that's a much fairer barometer, don't you? Unless you want to be totally disingenuous and say Ole done awesome; based on the interim being a-bit crap, after walking into an absolute disaster, losing Greenwood and not having bought a single player himself. I mean, if that's what you want to go on to try vindicate Ole, then go ahead. But it means you obviously have comprehension issues when it comes to nuance and context. Ole's reign was a shambles, like those before him. No twisting of events or clutching, will alter that.

Yes, the next manager is not going to be judged on 1 year. Ole had 2 full seasons, got sacked in the third, same as Jose, so I will judge the new manager after 2 full seasons.

I am fully behind the new manager, whoever it is, I want Manchester United to win titles, I don't care who the manager is to bring us trophies and which players he uses.

I mean Ole came into the job as the interim in almost the same conditions, walking into a disaster, dressing room was all over the place and we went on a very good run, so I am not clutching or twisting events that happened.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Yes, the next manager is not going to be judged on 1 year. Ole had 2 full seasons, got sacked in the third, same as Jose, so I will judge the new manager after 2 full seasons.

I am fully behind the new manager, whoever it is, I want Manchester United to win titles, I don't care who the manager is to bring us trophies and which players he uses.

I mean Ole came into the job as the interim in almost the same conditions, walking into a disaster, dressing room was all over the place and we went on a very good run, so I am not clutching or twisting events that happened.

But who said his caretaker spell wasn't great? It was great to begin with for sure. I personally never wanted him to get the fulltime gig, and in hindsight it was such a fecking amateur move from our Board. But hey, isn't that a regular occurrence. I truly believe had we spent our time during Ole's interim sourcing a better manager to take the reigns that summer, and they were backed to the same level as Ole, we would be in a much better place.

Ralf hasn't done a good job, so no arguments from me there. Ole had a better 'new manager bounce', but like, so have plenty of others. Again, it's breaking down certain small elements of his tenure to try vindicate him. I never even mentioned his interim period. If you have to go about vindicating his tenure in that manner, rather than looking at it holistically, then you know his tenure was poor. Ralf has been poor too, but that says nothing.

 

[stevoc]

Happens with all our ex managers (post-Fergie) so people really shouldn't be bothered by it.

Maybe but it seems to be on another level with Solskjaer though compared to when LVG and Jose were sacked, bizarrely.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Maybe but it seems to be on another level with Solskjaer though compared to when LVG and Jose were sacked, bizarrely.

It's just recency bias tbh. Jose got mental abuse, from what I remember. I couldn't stand him by the end of his time here. Never felt that way about LvG or Ole; I just felt both had to go, and probably got longer than they should have. I have noticed some are very touchy about Ole, and sometimes valid criticism is construed as hate. Pretty childish imo.

I just hope we can finally move on as a club and forget about all the failed post-Fergie appointments.

 

[Chripper]

As a player: Legend. He'll always be a legend.

As a manager: He was merely a placeholder.

 

[Varane around town]

I always thought that Solskjaer would be remembered as a limited manager but a great transitional figure. He'd give the club some soul back, get rid of the bad apples, turn us into a stable CL side and leave the club a better place.

Needless to say I feel a bit of a mug now.

I think Ole is a good guy who did is absolute best. It's just that he should've never been given the job in the first place and his indulgence of these players has gone and kicked us right in the wotsits.

 

[lex talionis]

Of course Ole wanted Pogba. If he didn't, he'd sell him/or tell Ed that he's no good for what I want to build here.

3 years of Ole defending Pogba and his agent.

Pogba : I'm thinking that it's time for another challenge
Ole : Nah mate, with good players football is easy

Perhaps, but there's no real evidence that Pogba was ever the right player for what Ole wanted to build. True, Ole was shambolic at building a squad yet there's nothing about Pogba that suggests he was ever the kind of footballer Ole would have sought out. To the extent that Ole had any kind of footballing philosophy, it was counterattacking football. Pogba just isn't built for counterattacking.

 

[stevoc]

It's just recency bias tbh. Jose got mental abuse, from what I remember. I couldn't stand him by the end of his time here. Never felt that way about LvG or Ole; I just felt both had to go, and probably got longer than they should have. I have noticed some are very touchy about Ole, and sometimes valid criticism is construed as hate. Pretty childish imo.

I just hope we can finally move on as a club and forget about all the failed post-Fergie appointments.

He did, same with LVG towards the end of their reigns but I can't remember if it kept the same intensity for months after they were sacked though.

Yeah I suppose some people are touchy about Solskjaer for obvious reasons. .

 

[Slysi17]

It's just recency bias tbh. Jose got mental abuse, from what I remember. I couldn't stand him by the end of his time here. Never felt that way about LvG or Ole; I just felt both had to go, and probably got longer than they should have. I have noticed some are very touchy about Ole, and sometimes valid criticism is construed as hate. Pretty childish imo.

I just hope we can finally move on as a club and forget about all the failed post-Fergie appointments.

It's like when I mentioned Liverpool injury crisis when they had to play a midfielder in defense. I said that was a factor in our 2nd place finish and Ole fanboys get touchy. One person even brought up the previous season and brought up our injuries.

 

[Forevergiggs1]

There is obviously a a huge element of that for many on here, no other way several threads dedicated to Solskjaer would be raging daily 5 months after he got sacked.

It's raging because there's still a lot of people defending him even after he left the club in a worse position than what he found it. It's not rocket science that if that defence was dropped then Ole would be nothing more than a footnote in our history and basically forgotten about but repeatedly re gurgatating all the good he done as our manager is going to keep that emotion going for the people who can actually see the woods inspite of the trees.

 

[LeGM]

It's like when I mentioned Liverpool injury crisis when they had to play a midfielder in defense. I said that was a factor in our 2nd place finish and Ole fanboys get touchy. One person even brought up the previous season and brought up our injuries.

Liverpool injuries aside, the second place finish still deserved more respect than people are giving it here. I mean Jose Mourinho said that finishing second with Manchester United was one of the greatest accomplishments of his managerial career.

 

[LeGM]

ou question. Did you think we could win the league last year with ManCity, Liverpool and Chelsea as main rivals. Be honest. And if you ddidn't, how come you see that as failure to actually come 2nd?

We all want to win. But reality is that we are not in 90's or 00's. Football and trophies are not only for us to collect

Amen to this. Ole did the absolute best he could with the hand he was dealt. Even should have collected a Europa League final had it not been for an unlucky penalty shootout.

A lot of this year's mishaps I feel come down to Ronaldo and the ill fit he has ended up being to the flow and dynamics of our team. Prior to Ronaldo's arrival you could really see the trajectory was moving upwards for Man United hence why so many Ole skeptics were on board and quite vocal in support after the summer and at the start of the season.

 

[Amir]

Liverpool injuries aside, the second place finish still deserved more respect than people are giving it here. I mean Jose Mourinho said that finishing second with Manchester United was one of the greatest accomplishments of his managerial career.

Yeah, he said it. And people laughed.

 

[Freak]

When he was here I thought he was doing well getting rid of certain players (Lukaku, Sanchez etc.) and getting in some good players (at that time, players like AWB, Maguire seemed like good buys). How wrong I was. He ended up leaving us in just as much of a mess. He also contributed to the growing player power.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Yeah, he said it. And people laughed.

There's simply too many agendas on here. We all agreed that Jose's second place finish was all very underwhelming. We all also generally agreed that his tenure was a failure, and the cups he won were second rate. But yet, some want to celebrate Ole for making it to the final of one of these second rate cups, and getting a worse second place finish. The mental gymnastics is hilarious.

 

[izak]

As a footballer he was good, as a manager he is the worst post fergie when you consider the amount of money he spent and the fact he didn't cover his reputation with the aid of any trophy, hell Moyes won the community shield

 

[Karlos PFC]

Perhaps, but there's no real evidence that Pogba was ever the right player for what Ole wanted to build. True, Ole was shambolic at building a squad yet there's nothing about Pogba that suggests he was ever the kind of footballer Ole would have sought out. To the extent that Ole had any kind of footballing philosophy, it was counterattacking football. Pogba just isn't built for counterattacking.

Sure I can't disagree with that.
But I'm pretty sure Ole wanted to keep Pogba here cause he knew him from the academy and thought he could kinda build the youth team he once managed.
At least that's what Ole said (wanted to keep him) in every presser or every time his cnut agent were speaking about United (Man United could destroy even Maradona if I took him there, it's time for a new challenge...).

 

[Amir]

Amen to this. Ole did the absolute best he could with the hand he was dealt. Even should have collected a Europa League final had it not been for an unlucky penalty shootout.

He did do his absolute best.

It's just that his best was never going to be good enough.

 

[Eriku]

As a footballer he was good, as a manager he is the worst post fergie when you consider the amount of money he spent and the fact he didn't cover his reputation with the aid of any trophy, hell Moyes won the community shield

That’s true, Moyes managed to beat Wigan in a glorified pre-season friendly with the squad of the reigning champions, clearly he’s better than Ole.

Good lord, do you think before you post?

 

[AndySmith1990]

Amen to this. Ole did the absolute best he could with the hand he was dealt. Even should have collected a Europa League final had it not been for an unlucky penalty shootout.

A lot of this year's mishaps I feel come down to Ronaldo and the ill fit he has ended up being to the flow and dynamics of our team. Prior to Ronaldo's arrival you could really see the trajectory was moving upwards for Man United hence why so many Ole skeptics were on board and quite vocal in support after the summer and at the start of the season.

Always amuses me whenever anyone tries to use "almost winning the EL" as a way of defending Solskjaer. We had to get knocked out of the CL group to reach the EL in the first place. Everything about Solskjaer was amateur, he had no business being manager of such a big club. I can't wait until we improve and e eryone moves on so we never have to hear about his time as manager again.

 

[Amir]

Perhaps, but there's no real evidence that Pogba was ever the right player for what Ole wanted to build. True, Ole was shambolic at building a squad yet there's nothing about Pogba that suggests he was ever the kind of footballer Ole would have sought out. To the extent that Ole had any kind of footballing philosophy, it was counterattacking football. Pogba just isn't built for counterattacking.

Whatever Solskjaer's footballing philosophy was, I never felt he had a certain "type" of player and that he only signed players who fitted that.

 

[padzilla]

Achivement now. But let me ask you question. Did you think we could win the league last year with ManCity, Liverpool and Chelsea as main rivals. Be honest. And if you ddidn't, how come you see that as failure to actually come 2nd?

We all want to win. But reality is that we are not in 90's or 00's. Football and trophies are not only for us to collect. There are other teams around us.

I never for one moment believed we would win the league, because of our manager.

Also finishing second was clearly a false finish due to Liverpool not having a decent fit centre half for practically the entire season and Chelsea having ludicrously appointed Frank Lampard as manager / a very similar appointment to our own at the time.

It is pretty clear where we stand now that Liverpool and Chelsea are light years ahead of us once again in under 12 months.

 

[devilish]

As a temp Ole was an excellent manager. He lead the ship to safety and he rallied the troops whose morale was at the pit. As a permanent manager his lack of tactical acumen was exposed, his nepotism didn't help his lack of experience and United was a walking disaster on the transfer market. Having said that should Ole take all the blame? Who hired the guy in the first place and were is the so called transfer committee that, together with Ole, thought that it was a good idea to bring the likes of Ronaldo, Maguire, AWB and an injury prone Varane in? Is Ole the only person who was out of depth at United? What are Jon Murtough's and Darren Fletcher's credentials?

In my opinion United will never heal until every ounce of incompetence is cleared.

 

[Jackal981]

Yeah, he said it. And people laughed.

And Ole defenders always paraded his 2nd place achievement like its a treble. These same people laughed when Mourinho said that. Funny thing is in retrospect the biggest achievement Ole had as a manager in his whole managerial career is achieving 2nd place for us.

Whatever Solskjaer's footballing philosophy was, I never felt he had a certain "type" of player and that he only signed players who fitted that.

He had a bullcrap philosophy about United DNA bollox and buying british players for his supposed "cultural revolution" ala mao zedong

 

[stevoc]

It's raging because there's still a lot of people defending him even after he left the club in a worse position than what he found it. It's not rocket science that if that defence was dropped then Ole would be nothing more than a footnote in our history and basically forgotten about but repeatedly re gurgatating all the good he done as our manager is going to keep that emotion going for the people who can actually see the woods inspite of the trees.

If that Is the case then surely the criticism and/or abuse comes first and the defending after no?

So people would only be reacting to new posts in these threads raging daily for months on end. Surely if people just let it go and stopped spouting shit about Solskjaer every day there would be no need for anyone to defend him. Chicken and Egg situation I suppose.

But hey if people get their kicks shitting on Solskjaer every day, fair play to them.

 

[Forevergiggs1]

If that Is the case then surely the criticism and/or abuse comes first and the defending after no?

So people would only be reacting to new posts in these threads raging daily for months on end. Surely if people just let it go and stopped spouting shit about Solskjaer every day there would be no need for anyone to defend him. Chicken and Egg situation I suppose.

But hey if people get their kicks shitting on Solskjaer every day, fair play to them.

The abuse started basically after the end of his first season with us when he couldn't buy a win which I suppose is natural given the level of our performances which then carried on into the following season. We did hit periods of form where even if the performances weren't ideal, the results where.

Some people chose to look at the results, some the performances which is what really split the forum apart. Winning ugly became part of the norm which was used to defend Ole while others couldn't see him taking us to the next level. Who was right/wrong? Both sides felt like they had a case which is why the vitriol will continue until we start to win something again which may be quite a while considering what's been happening at the club since (before) SAF retired and unfortunately Ole has to take his fair share of the blame with his signings, (lack of) style of play and all round miserable atmosphere that's still hanging round the club 5 months after he's gone which a lot of people find hard to defend. Myself included.

 

[anant]

The abuse started basically after the end of his first season with us when he couldn't buy a win which I suppose is natural given the level of our performances which then carried on into the following season. We did hit periods of form where even if the performances weren't ideal, the results where.

Some people chose to look at the results, some the performances which is what really split the forum apart. Winning ugly became part of the norm which was used to defend Ole while others couldn't see him taking us to the next level. Who was right/wrong? Both sides felt like they had a case which is why the vitriol will continue until we start to win something again which may be quite a while considering what's been happening at the club since (before) SAF retired and unfortunately Ole has to take his fair share of the blame with his signings, (lack of) style of play and all round miserable atmosphere that's still hanging round the club 5 months after he's gone which a lot of people find hard to defend. Myself included.

I think I've asked this to someone else on this thread, but how many games did we even win under Ole last season where we weren't the better team? BHA apart, I really can't recall any league game. Sure we weren't City level dominant in most of the wins, but I'd say we were at the very least 60-40 better than the opposition in nearly all of our wins.

And while there were ugly wins vs Fulham and Villa at the start of 2021 - where we were slightly better tbf - there were also games like the Arsenal 0-0 where we ideally should have won, but couldn't finish our chances.

 

[SirReginald]

I think I've asked this to someone else on this thread, but how many games did we even win under Ole last season where we weren't the better team? BHA apart, I really can't recall any league game. Sure we weren't City level dominant in most of the wins, but I'd say we were at the very least 60-40 better than the opposition in nearly all of our wins.

And while there were ugly wins vs Fulham and Villa at the start of 2021 - where we were slightly better tbf - there were also games like the Arsenal 0-0 where we ideally should have won, but couldn't finish our chances.

Let’s see, P38 W21 D11 L6

17/38 games you conceded first, Of which, 10/21 wins came after conceding first.

I don’t doubt that you clearly finished games strongly last year, come back record was insane, but you can’t say “nearly all our wins we were better”. Slight revisionism.

 

[crossy1686]

 

[Forevergiggs1]

I think I've asked this to someone else on this thread, but how many games did we even win under Ole last season where we weren't the better team? BHA apart, I really can't recall any league game. Sure we weren't City level dominant in most of the wins, but I'd say we were at the very least 60-40 better than the opposition in nearly all of our wins.

And while there were ugly wins vs Fulham and Villa at the start of 2021 - where we were slightly better tbf - there were also games like the Arsenal 0-0 where we ideally should have won, but couldn't finish our chances.

A reverse question would be is how many games did we play really well in? Without going behind or struggling to hold onto a lead or breaking teams down easily? There were many games like the 4-1 against Newcastle where the scoreline says we dominated but the performances said different where the game could of went either way late into the game. Of course it can happen to any teams in football but with us it was a regular event. You only have to look at the amount of times Oles head was on the block to realise good football wasn't bring played which should be the minimum requirement for a United manager after 3 years.

 

[90 + 5min]

I never for one moment believed we would win the league, because of our manager.

Also finishing second was clearly a false finish due to Liverpool not having a decent fit centre half for practically the entire season and Chelsea having ludicrously appointed Frank Lampard as manager / a very similar appointment to our own at the time.

It is pretty clear where we stand now that Liverpool and Chelsea are light years ahead of us once again in under 12 months.

If you didn't, then I guess he shouldn't be that bad coming 2nd.

I hear this about Liverpool (injuries) and Chelsea (manager) all the time. And I say, look at our injuries. It is not like we had a injury free season. We were actually very badly hit by injuries last year. Difference was they lost VanDijk who they depended on very much and still does. Can we say this season we would be lot better if we hadn't injuries and suspensions in our attacking group of players? Can we blame it on that when you say that Liverpool and Chelsea are lighyears ahead?