If Madrid's transfer ban would be as effective as Barca's transfer ban they must be shaking in their boots.
Sergio Ramos | Signs new 5 year contract
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If Madrid's transfer ban would be as effective as Barca's transfer ban they must be shaking in their boots.
How so??
If we valued Morgan Schneiderlin at 25m and Real knew of the offer and were willing to pay 30m, I'm pretty sure Southampton would go with Real's offer...
Modric - http://www1.skysports.com/football/...ic-honoured-to-be-wanted-by-sir-alex-ferguson
Ozil - http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/oct/22/ferguson-wayne-rooney-sign-mesut-ozil-book
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...r-United-signed-Mesut-Ozil-Arsenals-nose.html - I know its the daily fail but none the less, the story seem very precise in its information.
Kroos - http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...er-frustration-over-Paul-Pogba-and-Toni-Kroos
Take what you will from those links but all any of us can go on is stories in the media and most of them contain quotes from parties involved.
Hey stop trying to derail the positivity train....
22 yellow cards last season, twenty-bloody-two! For a team who doesn't even have to defend for the most part. Not for me.
The other side of this is that physicality in La Liga is severely punished compared to the Premier League so Ramos will be right at home
Is that even real? I don't think they would get banned but if it happened, that would be funny to watch.
Fergie was only interested in Modrić and admired him, nothing more and Moyes didnt know what to do in TW, as it was said, was linked with about 100 players and was interested in Ozil and Kroos but did nothing about it and Rooney wanted Fergie to sign Ozil which again means absolutely nothing.
That's it from me in this conversation.
He is rash sometimes and is likely to pick up cards, as is evident with his red card career count, but I would half the domestic yellows out of those 22 while playing in England. Even he ends up picking 8-9 in leagues here, it is not that awful. Matic picked 10 in league last season. Overall, net, Ramos will be upgrade to our defense. I too don't agree with belief of some that he is best CB around currently etc but there aren't many real top class CBs currently and more so who can be available and hence I won't mind if we sign Ramos. To me, still, De Gea staying and we signing Otamendi > Signing Ramos and selling De Gea.
That last option is by far the best outcome. The performance of Otamendi, ironically against Madrid earlier this year was one of the best centre back performances I've seen for quite a while. Got a few years on Ramos too. That is another thing that concerns me, his age. £30 million plus for a 29 year old centre back is quite the fee, especially for one that isn't really all that great. Signing RVP for less than that was a good piece of business as he was a key reason for us winning the league. You can see now that his legs have gone and I don't believe Ramos to be one of the centre backs that end up playing to a high level in his 30's or being instrumental in us winning the league.
Ozil had an offer made to him by United, that is as concrete as it gets. I'm really not sure how you can state he nor United done nothing about it. Did you read the link?
As for Kroos, again it seems you haven't bothered reading the link.
Now if you want to be pedantic about the term "groundwork" go ahead but it is common knowledge Moyes attended Bayern matches to scout / discuss a transfer. Again, I'm not really sure how much more evidence you need.
Perhaps your right, we should leave it as clearly an agreement / middle ground can't be found.
We were certainly "in for" Modric, as 'Arry says. But doing business with Levy - for United - ain't easy. Modric was too expensive for one thing. Perhaps he fancied a move abroad as well - though he was more than willing to join Chelsea the previous season, so who knows.
Anyway, I'm not sure what you're actually getting at with this: Real are "in for" most high profile players, and they're a more attractive destination than almost any other club (one may question how wise certain players are to go there, but that's another debate), so them "beating" us to any number of players isn't surprising. For those players you mention you could say they, Real, "beat" several other clubs too.
As it stands now a certain kind of player will go with Real or Barca over United - that's just the way it is. It doesn't reflect poorly on us as such. The only thing we could've done to make sure we got the players you mention is to spunk an indecent amount of money on them - and I for one don't think that's a sustainable (or desirable) policy in the long run. We just have to get back to actually winning trophies - and then we'll find it easier to compete with the glitz of Madrid again.
Well actually no, that article says there was an offer signed by Ozil and made to United and United had no interest. (If it is even true, it is the Mail after all)
And besides that was when he was leaving Real to join Arsenal, weren't you talking about Real stealing players we were trying to sign?
Bidding for the same players aside and ending up losing out to Madrid for those transfer targets, I think the real reason why some/many United fans are pissed off at Madrid, is because we are almost never in a situation where we are forced to sell an asset that we don't want to sell.
What key player other than Ronaldo in the last 10, maybe 20, years have we lost that we really wanted to keep? Most of the time we either sell/get rid of players that are surplus to requirements (Berbatov,...), that are just not good enough (Buttner, Bebe,...), that have been good enough but getting on with age (Ferdinand, Evra, Vidic,...), or that had fallen out with SAF (Stam, Becks, Keane,...). We are never raided for our key players that we want to keep, and the only time that it did happen was when Madrid came in for Ronaldo. Rooney to City or Chelsea were strong rumours at one point and would have been another example, but that but didn't happen. Now we might have a second case of a key player we wish to keep, that might leave and again it would be to Real Madrid. That's 2 out of 2 really, which feeds the perception of Real 'stealing' our best players, because they seem to be the only ones who can lure them away for some reason. It makes us United fans feel smaller as a club than we are, because we look at United as a final destination, the end of the road. And most of the time, that has been true in the last 20 years, because we are fortunate to be that big a club.
We do lose players like Pique or Pogba from time to time, but those were not key players when they left so that doesn't have the same impact than losing key first team players has.
Anyway, therefor standing firm on the De Gea transfer and landing Madrid's next captain would change that perception a little.
What key player other than Ronaldo in the last 10, maybe 20, years have we lost that we really wanted to keep? Most of the time we either sell/get rid of players that are surplus to requirements (Berbatov,...), that are just not good enough (Buttner, Bebe,...), that have been good enough but getting on with age (Ferdinand, Evra, Vidic,...), or that had fallen out with SAF (Stam, Becks, Keane,...). We are never raided for our key players that we want to keep, and the only time that it did happen was when Madrid came in for Ronaldo. Rooney to City or Chelsea were strong rumours at one point and would have been another example, but that but didn't happen. Now we might have a second case of a key player we wish to keep, that might leave and again it would be to Real Madrid. That's 2 out of 2 really, which feeds the perception of Real 'stealing' our best players, because they seem to be the only ones who can lure them away for some reason. It makes us United fans feel smaller as a club than we are, because we look at United as a final destination, the end of the road. And most of the time, that has been true in the last 20 years, because we are fortunate to be that big a club.
We do lose players like Pique or Pogba from time to time, but those were not key players when they left so that doesn't have the same impact than losing key first team players has.
Anyway, therefor standing firm on the De Gea transfer and landing Madrid's next captain would change that perception a little.
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55% of Real Madrid fans now want to sell him. Good news.
http://futbol.as.com/futbol/2015/07/02/primera/1435858121_550214.html
http://futbol.as.com/futbol/2015/07/02/primera/1435858121_550214.html
Yeah i think that could be the reason some despise Madrid it seems. But not just because he was a player we wanted to keep but also because he is one of the best players to ever play the game, and the player we were building the team around for the next 5-6 years. Had he stayed it's possible/likely we would have won 5-7 titles in a row and maybe another CL, and i'm sure that pisses people off myself included.
Other than Ronaldo the only other player who left us under SAF who we wanted to keep was maybe Kanchelskis. I was also going to say Tevez but it's likely Ferguson was glad to see the back of the little prick.
You are correct it was very rare. But Paul Ince is a name you can add to the very small list
Weren't Ferguson and Ince having issues and that is why Ferguson sold him?
Fergie did want rid of Ince and Ince was not as great as hyped up.
Well, we certainly bid for Bale, Moyes confirmed so. We are heavily linked with Kroos, the player even acknowledged our interest and he appeared to be onboard coming until we missed out on the CL. We were certainly interested in Ozil and Modric, Fergie even went to see Ozil play.
I remember it as Ferguson wanted to sell Ince to make room for Scholes and Butt, that season before he left apparently they weren't really getting on either. Ferguson had accused Ince of bottling it against Barcelona and blamed him for the goal against Everton in the cup final. So a parting of ways seemed inevitable.
I know of the story where Ince claims SAF phoned him up and said he had made a mistake and wanted him to stay but even if that were true he did want to sell him in the first place.
Add Benzema there too
Ince even outperformed Roy Keane in 94/95 . He was a key player
There probably is some truth that he and Fergie clashed but no way did Fergie want to lose him at that moment
This waiting game bored me to sleep. No point trying to figure out what will happen if there's no new information around.
Instead, I thought I'd talk about Sergio Ramos the player. It beggars belief that there'd be people here who think that Sergio Ramos isn't quite a good "defender ".
He loves his histrionics. He's can play the he dirty. But He is also committed. Passionate, powerful and a real leader in defence.
Every single coach who has ever worked with him says the same thing - He's a wonderful player who gives you every option in defence. He's a monster in the air and loves getting stuck into tackles. He's also quite brave ala Vidic. Anyone who's watched him long enough will say that.
He isn't a pure defender and that's what makes him so brilliant. He's a guy who'll be able to move the game from back to front effortlessly. In the modern game you keep one of those players in your team. Barca has Pique. PSG have Luiz. City have Kompany... Et al.
Now just how much of a ball player Ramos is compared to his defending is what needs to be talked about. I agree that he's more fantastic a ball player than he is a defender, but he's still exceptional in defence.
There is no way in hell that a man plays 120+ caps for his nation, 445 games for his club, Has played and won in CL and World Cup finals and in the end be known as a sub-par defender.
Let's also get one thing clear. He's no David fecking Luiz who's always a minute away from forgetting how to defend entirely. Ramos is a lot better than that. He deserves to be up there with the top defenders in the last decade. He's not a conventional CB for sure. But he's been an ever present force in world football for a good ten years.
We should all be over the fecking moon of this happens. Not many like him around.
Instead, I thought I'd talk about Sergio Ramos the player. It beggars belief that there'd be people here who think that Sergio Ramos isn't quite a good "defender ".
He loves his histrionics. He's can play the he dirty. But He is also committed. Passionate, powerful and a real leader in defence.
Every single coach who has ever worked with him says the same thing - He's a wonderful player who gives you every option in defence. He's a monster in the air and loves getting stuck into tackles. He's also quite brave ala Vidic. Anyone who's watched him long enough will say that.
He isn't a pure defender and that's what makes him so brilliant. He's a guy who'll be able to move the game from back to front effortlessly. In the modern game you keep one of those players in your team. Barca has Pique. PSG have Luiz. City have Kompany... Et al.
Now just how much of a ball player Ramos is compared to his defending is what needs to be talked about. I agree that he's more fantastic a ball player than he is a defender, but he's still exceptional in defence.
There is no way in hell that a man plays 120+ caps for his nation, 445 games for his club, Has played and won in CL and World Cup finals and in the end be known as a sub-par defender.
Let's also get one thing clear. He's no David fecking Luiz who's always a minute away from forgetting how to defend entirely. Ramos is a lot better than that. He deserves to be up there with the top defenders in the last decade. He's not a conventional CB for sure. But he's been an ever present force in world football for a good ten years.
We should all be over the fecking moon of this happens. Not many like him around.
Agreed,good post
Without trying to get caught up in all the tabloid talk, if either deal were to happen, then I think both players move for the same fee.
World class keeper with one year to run.
World class defender who wants.
In all honesty, I'd be happy with this outcome. I just don't want us paying a large fee on top of DDG going.
World class keeper with one year to run.
World class defender who wants.
In all honesty, I'd be happy with this outcome. I just don't want us paying a large fee on top of DDG going.
He is now 29 years old. We can probably say the same things about Rooney but we all know he is not the same player anymore.
They're not even comparable in terms of fitness.. not even close. Ramos has never had a major injury, is incredibly athletic and plays in a position where experience is needed rather than dynamism, so he should still be able to give us peak performances.
Whereas Rooney is quite clearly past his best and not dynamic at all in a position where we are crying out for some dynamism.
It's exactly his reliance on his athleticism and physicality that means he would become less effective in the next few years. I know there's more to be said about reading the game as a cb and having the positional awareness, but the premier league is demanding. I'm tempted to compare him to Rio, but Rio had many injuries but the similarity for me is that Rio lost his pace in his latter years and he lost his effectiveness, and Ramos would/could go down the same path.
If that was the case why would he have accepted the bid from Inter?
On the flip side, someone like Maldini was blessed with great natural athleticism, avoided major injuries and it allowed him to age brilliantly.. same for Giggs in his thirties. One would hope Ramos is of that ilk.
Then how come Pepe had only 6? Believe me it's not that the league is not that physical its just his gamestyle. He has picked over 180 yellows in his career...
My very first line is about his rashness. Pepe has less cards doesn't take away the fact that in La liga. a player is likely to get yellow for some fouls which they would get away with in PL. Thereafter, I also mentioned Matic to point out that just because player in defensive positions is picking yellows, doesn't make him bad. I myself am not a big fan of Ramos but getting him won't be a bad choice. Still as I said if we retain DDG and get Otamendi than swapping DDG-Ramos, I will be more happy.
If he helps us reclaim our status as one of the undisputed top dogs in Europe then it would have been worth it, wouldn't you say? Plus we have Phil Jones and Rojo around so maybe by then one of them will have reached the heights we require.
That is truly one of the greatest gifs I have ever seen! Bravo!
Is this Ramos thing real OR do you guys think he is merely angling for a better deal at Real Madrid?
I mean, why would he want to willingly leave Madrid, if Madrid improve his contract?
I cant think of even 1 reason.
I mean, why would he want to willingly leave Madrid, if Madrid improve his contract?
I cant think of even 1 reason.
I was thinking if Ramos was indeed angling for a new contract, it would have probably been done by now
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