We've spent £25m on Memphis, and it looks like we'll spend about £35mish on a CB, and £25m on Schneiderlein.
85m spent. Is Coleman a £20m upgrade on Valencia?
Options narrowed there
Coleman has been at worst solid and at best (the best) in the PL over the last 3 seasons though!!!!!!!!!
Valencia would have passed backwards.....
We've spent £25m on Memphis, and it looks like we'll spend about £35mish on a CB, and £25m on Schneiderlein.
85m spent. Is Coleman a £20m upgrade on Valencia?
Who is saying anything about whether they are for sale or not? Just because Benzema isn't for sale it doesn't mean we should go out and buy Shane Long. The fact that there were arguably 7 full backs in the Premier League last season who performed better than Coleman means that he isn't the standard that we should be aspiring to.
Ivanovich, Azpilicueta & Zabaleta aren't available but they are the quality we need to be looking for. Even Bellarin has shown enough in 28 appearances to show that he has a far greater potential (would Arsenal sell for £25m, who knows?). However what's the point in having a huge scouting network and the most amount of resources on the planet if you're going to settle for a solid but unspectacular full back in Seamus Coleman? We might as well shut down our academy and sack all our scouts if we can't find anyone better on the planet with an unlimited budget than Coleman.
A lot of people on this forum for some reason have the mentality of signing someone just because "he's better than what we currently have". That's the mentality of a club like Liverpool. We need to have the mentality of "would he get into the best 3-4 teams in the world". Coleman wouldn't even get onto Chelsea's bench, let alone into their team.
On the whole he's been merely solid. He had a purple patch where he looked like he may make the step up, but has since returned to his standard solid self. He's the same as the likes of Lallana, Vertonghen, Kyle Walker & Coloccini in the last 3-4 years. They make the Premier League team of the year after the stars align for them, after which time they revert to their standard decent but unspectacular selves.
At least we'd have the excuse that Liverpool have with Lallana if we signed him last season that we assumed he'd carry on at that level. It'd be like us signing Vertonghen for £25m on the basis that he looked fantastic 2 years ago.
A lot of people on this forum for some reason have the mentality of signing someone just because "he's better than what we currently have". That's the mentality of a club like Liverpool. We need to have the mentality of "would he get into the best 3-4 teams in the world". Coleman wouldn't even get onto Chelsea's bench, let alone into their team.
And we spent £16m on Valencia eight years ago.
And Valencia was worth £16m at the time. There was a point he was one of the best wingers in the league. Was it 09/10 where he'd just steam past players and whip it in for Rooney to score a header?
well if that's not proof then i don't know what is.And Coleman is worth 20m easily. 11 goals in 2 seasons right. Thats a good return. Carragher's "best right back in the PL" as of October 2014...several months into last season.
well if that's not proof then i don't know what is.
In addition to being named officially as best right back the 2013/14 season its kinda as much proof as you need!
Who is saying anything about whether they are for sale or not? Just because Benzema isn't for sale it doesn't mean we should go out and buy Shane Long. The fact that there were arguably 7 full backs in the Premier League last season who performed better than Coleman means that he isn't the standard that we should be aspiring to.
Ivanovich, Azpilicueta & Zabaleta aren't available but they are the quality we need to be looking for. Even Bellarin has shown enough in 28 appearances to show that he has a far greater potential (would Arsenal sell for £25m, who knows?). However what's the point in having a huge scouting network and the most amount of resources on the planet if you're going to settle for a solid but unspectacular full back in Seamus Coleman? We might as well shut down our academy and sack all our scouts if we can't find anyone better on the planet with an unlimited budget than Coleman.
A lot of people on this forum for some reason have the mentality of signing someone just because "he's better than what we currently have". That's the mentality of a club like Liverpool. We need to have the mentality of "would he get into the best 3-4 teams in the world". Coleman wouldn't even get onto Chelsea's bench, let alone into their team.
On the whole he's been merely solid. He had a purple patch where he looked like he may make the step up, but has since returned to his standard solid self. He's the same as the likes of Lallana, Vertonghen, Kyle Walker & Coloccini in the last 3-4 years. They make the Premier League team of the year after the stars align for them, after which time they revert to their standard decent but unspectacular selves.
At least we'd have the excuse that Liverpool have with Lallana if we signed him last season that we assumed he'd carry on at that level. It'd be like us signing Vertonghen for £25m on the basis that he looked fantastic 2 years ago.
With that attitude we'd never have bought Denis Irwin, who was arguably our greatest ever fullback
Well its not about being a 20m upgrade. Valencia wasnt free! Valencia would be a realiable back up. Rafael would be sold for perhaps 10m. It makes great sense. And sensible options is what alot of fans want. Fixing a weakness. People want Fabinho based on his name pretty much. He could be another Moreno/Mangala...no one has a clue. We know what we are getting with Coleman and its an upgrade on what we have.
You're a having a laugh there while telling other poster that it's not 2000 when somebody's throwing 10-12 mln quid around. Nobody will buy a crock of a defender who's hardly played last season for 10m.
With that attitude we'd never have bought Denis Irwin, who was arguably our greatest ever fullback
Complete rubbish. We've won countless trophies on the backs of players who fit our team, not some backwards mentality of one-upping random European teams.
And plenty said that about Gary Cahill when Chelsea signed him, so double rubbish.
You need to watch Coleman. Your talking garbage. Like the zillion neutrals who think Carrick is an average midfielder.
Someone find me a video of Valencia doing that backpass from the halfway line against Burnely and Van Gaal's reaction.
Fact is he can't cross, hardly ever beats a man these days, can't take throw-ins or touch the ball with his left foot, Coleman would be a massive upgrade.
In the modern era we wouldn't have bought Irwin for the equivilant of £25m (or possibly at all). But at the same time we wouldn't be buying the likes of Fellaini, Young & Valencia. We now have the finances to go for guaranteed quality, rather than hopeful punts from smaller teams that far more often than not don't turn out to be great.
Our strategy going forward should be buying either a) World Class players or b) younger players who we feel can develop into World Class players. Coleman fits neither of these criteria, so I don't understand why we would go for him. It's like saying we should sign Vertonghen because he's had a great season and is a relatively solid player; why when we could get far superior players?
Again I'll ask: what the hell are our scouts doing if Coleman at £25m is our top target? I understand Ramos, Schweinsteiger etc as they are the type of players that if they become available you have to be in for. But Coleman... Surely there's dozens of similar quality full backs overseas who either have way more potential or are way better value?
We won countless trophies under Alex Ferguson. Name me a team in the modern game that has built a team around copious amounts of solid but unspectacular players and has had sustained success? I certainly can't think of any that didn't have the genius of Sir Alex to get far more out of them than could ever be reasonably expected.
This same manager also won titles with the likes of Cleverley as our first choice central midfielder. Should we also be making moves to get him back as if we're in for Coleman we may as well be in for him too.
I also believe that Cahill is nothing spectacular. I imagine Mourinho will be looking to replace him once he's fixed more urgent matters: Terry, Azpilicueta and Ivanovich make him look far better than he is. That's if Zouma hasn't already pushed him to third choice. If we were buying Coleman to be a second choice squad player I'd be fine with it (well, except for the price).
I've watched Coleman on numerous occasions. He had a great season where everyone thought he'd stepped up. Last season he was a mediocre full back. You have to ask yourself which is the exception and which is the norm. Personally I take the season that the entire Everton squad were riding high on a wave of new manager syndrome as the anomoly.
If we were signing Everton players based solely on their 13/14 performances then Barry, McCarthy, Baines, Coleman, Jagielka & Lukaku should all be top of our Summer wishlist. Personally I wouldn't take any of them unless the price was < £15m and they were happy to be merely a squad option.
In the modern era we wouldn't have bought Irwin for the equivilant of £25m (or possibly at all). But at the same time we wouldn't be buying the likes of Fellaini, Young & Valencia. We now have the finances to go for guaranteed quality, rather than hopeful punts from smaller teams that far more often than not don't turn out to be great.
Our strategy going forward should be buying either a) World Class players or b) younger players who we feel can develop into World Class players. Coleman fits neither of these criteria, so I don't understand why we would go for him. It's like saying we should sign Vertonghen because he's had a great season and is a relatively solid player; why when we could get far superior players?
Again I'll ask: what the hell are our scouts doing if Coleman at £25m is our top target? I understand Ramos, Schweinsteiger etc as they are the type of players that if they become available you have to be in for. But Coleman... Surely there's dozens of similar quality full backs overseas who either have way more potential or are way better value?
In fairness if you can do anything brilliant for 12 months from climbing mountains to swimmings oceans it basically means its in you to be brilliant at it. Saying we couldnt get that from him is basically slating a supposedly brilliant LVG's ability to better young players..nothing else!
I am a bit baffled that so many seem to rate him so low and also don't seem to think he can step up, even though we have seen plenty of times before that players who have proven themselves at mid table teams can make the jump as the rise to playing wiuth better players. It also seems many forget we won the PL and CL in 2008 with Wes Brown as our RB.
yeah but if they knew anything about football they'd be supporting United.But ask a neutral...they wouldnt put him above Kieran Gibbs!
Not true. There are copious examples of players who've looked like world beaters for 7-8 months and then reverted to type (and Coleman wasn't a world beater even during his purple patch). Kagawa is a prime example of a player that most people thought was guaranteed to be phenomenal. Fellaini 12/13 had a season which was far greater than anything else he has achieved. Coentrao was bought for €30m from Benfica after a phenomenal season and has since been unable to make a great impact. Our very own Valencia had a great season 11/12 but has since been a terrible winger and a solid but unspectacular full back. Arshavin was fantastic for Arsenal for a season, before looking truly dreadful. I could go on...
You have to judge a player by their normal level, not their absolute best level. The reason we overpaid for Di Maria so much was that we were paying for the 8-9 months where he was arguably the best attacking midfielder in the world, not the 3-4 seasons where he was "just" a quality winger.
Coleman's normal level is that of a solid Premier League full back. He's the Ashley Young, Ron Vlaar or Steven Nzonzi of the right full back position.
Someone find me a video of Valencia doing that backpass from the halfway line against Burnely and Van Gaal's reaction.
Fact is he can't cross, hardly ever beats a man these days, can't take throw-ins or touch the ball with his left foot, Coleman would be a massive upgrade.
I'd be surprised if those players have ever been described by a sky sports pundit as the best in the league for their position or in the PL team of the year. Gary Neville was no better than Coleman IMO. Only he came through the ranks at United.
I'd be surprised if those players have ever been described by a sky sports pundit as the best in the league for their position or in the PL team of the year. Gary Neville was no better than Coleman IMO. Only he came through the ranks at United.
Hahaha, Jamie Redknapp is a Sky Sports Pundit, have you seen some of the nonsense that comes out his mouth?
Neville was one of the best full backs in the world and was the best ever Premier League right full back. Coleman isn't fit to lace his boots, let alone be talked about in the same breath. Neville was actually underrated by most because he came through along with Scholes, Giggs & Beckham. I'm not even going to speak about the "learned" opinions of some of the idiots on Sky, it's blatantly obvious to anyone without bias that Azpilicueta is several levels ahead of anyone else in that position.
It'd be like comparing Ashley Young with Ryan Giggs... Truly ridiculous.
/Edit: Reading your comments on Nani also makes your opinion on Coleman pretty laughable. A player who won our player of the season and was in the team of the year, putting in great performances whilst winning us a title gets slated, whilst a player who won Everton's Poty during a season where they won nothing gets rated. Just about sums it up.
Spot on. Coleman is 25, and whilst he's a decent premier league player, he's never played in Europe, and at 25 you wonder how much room is left for him develop. I'd imagine our scouts will be looking elsewhere, because £25m or whatever the fee is for Coleman would be ridiculous.
I assume you're against us signing Schneiderlin aswell, with him also being 25 and him not having played in CL/Europa before
It wasnt Redknapp?
No, because I think Schneiderlein is worth the money. I don't think Coleman is worth £25m at all.
I dont think Coleman is worth 45m. Where are you getting your random made up figures from?
