Of course he’s much worse than those players, not even half as good at general midfield play.
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Of course he’s much worse than those players, not even half as good at general midfield play.
I don't see Pellistri making it here. He's very willing and direct, but is generally lacking in various areas. Maybe a decent option off the bench for now. Like a budget Garnacho.
He doesn't work as hard as the pundits say. He loses many physical duels too. He is a below average passer. His positioning is atrocious deep in midfield.
He does come alive in the box and is very dangerous. He's a goal threat. The only reason why he plays.
He'd do well at Everton.
He does come alive in the box and is very dangerous. He's a goal threat. The only reason why he plays.
He'd do well at Everton.
Absolutely delusional this. Either that or you are deliberately trolling everyone here. Even that dinosaur Moyes who inflicted Fellani on us wasn’t prepared to pay more than £30m and there was zero interest from any other club. Demonstrates just how bad this guy is. Instead of wasting minutes on him we should be blooding Mainoo who might turn out to be a star. McTomminey will never be anything other than utterly mediocre.
Well he isn’t because no one would even pay £30m for him except Moyes.
James Garner is better.
Garner was always more talented. Gomes, even more so.
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Bring Lampard into the coaching team.
Make him a no 10 Weghorst.
Whilst true my point is based on Garners current form in the premier league where he's having a great run as one of the best young cms in the league. Games we don't know how he'd do in the premier league.
He’s worth what someone is willing to pay which will never be much more than 30m. The teams that would be interested aren’t going to be spending what we spent on Mount on anyone let alone Mctominay.
Yeah, he is doing well. He was never really given a chance here despite being one of the bigger talents in the academy and performing well on loan. Some even hailed the club for selling him, deeming it as being proactive for making a quick buck.
Just because someone want to throw out money on some average player doesn't mean they are worth that much. When you can do that on other players, we shouldn't let McTominay go for pretty much nothing if we compare to players that are almost same quality wise.
Just to compare. Stats are clearly showing that comparing him with a £100m+ player like Caciedo, McTominay is better in attacking and slightly better in defending aspect. The only aspect that Caicedo is better on is passing where he is more involved in so called teamplay but on other hand he have more minutes on the pitch. Almost same can be said about comparing him to Rice when you take into account that he played a lot less than Rice.
He is one of our more productive midfielders in PL. Have scored more than Rashford, Garnacho, Hojlund and Martial together. But hey, some of you want to give him away. Instead of fixing real problems you are after guy that does a good job.
You need to get this out of your head. He isn't anywhere near them quality wise. Also, any move that McTominay makes will be to a smaller club. The likes of Rice and Caicedo made progressive moves to bigger clubs. £30-40m certainly isn't "pretty much nothing", for such an average player.
15 goals in 155 Premier League games. Never scored more than 4 in a season. In his last two seasons, he scored one goal in each of them.
He is and stats from Premier League shows you just that. Quality shouldn't matter if you are going to bigger or smaller club. Quality is quality. And he is not worse than any of those two. I wouldn't follow what social media, fan clubs or media says.
Goalscoring leader so far this year. More than our forward line together.
I don't think what he does on the pitch in terms of "midfielder" role matters anymore, he is a goal threat and that is all that is important for Ten Hag currently.
What stats? McTominay isn't a prolific goalscorer, a high volume passer or anywhere close to Caicedo or Rice defensively. McTominay will not be going to Arsenal or Chelsea for £100m. He will be joining the likes of Fulham, Everton or West Ham for £30-40m.
He might not be prolific but that doesn't take away that right now, he is our main goalscorer in Premier League.
I say once again, look at the stats if you want to compare players. I can even help you with that. I usually don't like stats. I'm all for what you see watching players play. However, when you look at the games and see one thing, then someone tries to argue that it is not like that you just check it with stats to. Remember now that when you look at stats you take into account minutes/games they played.
He might not be going to Arsenal or Chelsea for that money but nobody, unless you don't know what you are doing, would pay £100m plus for Caicedo or Rice. Their value is pretty much what McTominay is.
I thought it would be a mistake letting Garner go.
We were surprisingly very quick to sell him. So early in ten Hag's tenure too. Makes me wonder what the thinking was. Perhaps the player wanted assurances about game time, then requested to move when that wasn't guaranteed.
Even though he is very one dimensional, I think he can be our winger version of Chicharito, coming off the bench to wreak havoc on tired legs.
That is our best use of him. I just don't think he is good enough long term.
I think Garner has said something to that effect in an interview, though I could be wrong. What annoys me is that we sold him for pennies and continued to play McTominay who is a known quantity and as likeable as he is, just isn't at the level we aspire to be.
Agreed. McTominay has played far too many games for this football club. Year after year of persistence and for what? Hopefully Mainoo will work his way into the side soon enough. An academy midfield player who actually has talent worth persevering with.
It was the first of Ten Hag's decisions that left me scratching my head. Hopefully you're right about Mainoo, he's a top talent and should get the opportunity to realise it here.
Scoring 2 goals in injury time was enough to get starting spot. Forgetting the number of times this guy has put in anonymous performances. That was a head scratcher.
We definitely should be able to get 40-50m for him, he should be sold at the end of the season and replaced with a more suitable midfielder for Ten Hag(if he's still here).
Urgh. This shit again. Who is gonna pay that sort of money for McTominay ffs? We couldn't get above 30m in the summer. Name the club(s) who you think will pay that
I'd keep him, simply because he's versatile and does the stuff that other players don't want to do.
Bruno/Mount - New Midfielder/McTominay
Deep-lying Playmaker/Mainoo
Bruno/Mount - New Midfielder/McTominay
Deep-lying Playmaker/Mainoo
Whats not to love about such "exclusive" opinions. Mate, each to their own of course but I am sure, you'll have serious difficulties finding a football fan away from United who wouldn't say that this is bonkers. Rice and Caicedo went for crazy money, granted but both are superior players to McTominay. Especially Rice.
Just look at McToms fbref... It is carried right now from his goal contributions that are very high.
His ball progression isn't even mediocre - he is 8th(!!!!!!) percentile for passes attempted, 7th (!!!!) percentile for progressive passes. Pass completion 50th, Carries 67th, takeons 56th. Touches in penalty box is 83th.
Defensively he is very much below average, 58th for tackles, 29th for interceptions. Blocks and Aerials are 82th and 84th. Clearances is 98th, probably connected with his heading.
All I am seeing is a below average CB, that is trying to act as a midfielder but is best being used as some sort of battle ram 2nd striker. But I wouldn't consider myself a fan like you. A player like him has use but certainly not for a club like United that is trying to get back on the horse. Do yourself a favor, look at his fbref profile. And compare it with Caicedo (also a bit unimpressive but clearly above average where it matters) and Rice (who is pretty well suited for his role).
McTominay Fbref
Caicedo fbref
Rice fbref
McTominay loses out everywhere, eyetest or stats.
He doesn't and that is what I shown you. You also have to take into account that he has played less minutes.
So ask yourself this.
United have a hefty amount of statistic analysis specialists, a huge amount of data is processed and the team is selected partly based on these numbers.
Yet.
McTominay still starts games, even when there are other options, despite the arm chair analysts stating that he's poor, or in the x percentile for passes potentially missed or blades of grass trespassed over.
Why is it he still starts these games?
Because he scored a couple of goals against Brentford and Casemiro is injured.
Exactly this. And to be honest, I hate every minute McTominay gets. Not because I hate him or anything. It is just useless because it will do feck all Uniteds future. He isn't going to improve. He isn't at a good level. Why is he starting? Mabe because the manager doesn't trust the younger players to keep him in the job (legitimate opinion) or because United is lacking goal threat where McTominays form is useful right now.
But again - look, where we are. Look at the results, look at the performances. Nothing we are doing, is a sign that says "I think we are onto something".
McTominay is our player, he should be used as long as he is here and he has some uses. But acting as if he somehow better than Caicedo or even Rice is completely crazy. Shit like that would go right into our RAWK thread if this would be Liverpool.
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Because Erik Ten Hag doesn’t know what a midfield is.
You have to be blind to not realize it's because he scored those 2 goals. He was going to get sold and was out of favor by Ten Hag before then.
It's because he didn't show all of his skill for the first team in that limited amount of time. Most people don't watch the academy so they don't know the technical skills these young players possess. You see the same thing happening with Hannibal right now if you click on his performances thread. It's a different thing altogether with McTominay or Rashford. The technical skill they show for the first team is exactly what they showed for the youth teams. They're quite established so it's no longer a case of them having the mentality to pull off what they showed for the youth teams.
In Garner, Hannibal, or even Greenwood's cases, these players quite clearly had more to offer in the men's games, but were quite tentative at first. In Greenwood's case, he had yet to show his final ball ability for United. That was something he showed for the youth team and rarely even attempted it for the first team. In Garner and Hannibal's cases, they had yet to show their passing skill or technical skill as they are young players who understandably were timid or haven't dealt with the pace of the PL level men's game yet.
Garner has now stepped out of that shell for Everton.
Posters who are ignorant just think the young players skills are as is. In a lot of cases, they would be right. But they're too eager to make a final say for some of our more talented, but tentative players.
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Why are their respective ages not even taken into account because that's the main reason ( after football ability) as to why McT will never close to those valuations. Whatever you consumed while typing that, stop it
I think people cannot now see beyond the weird hatred they have of McTominay now.
All valid discussion on his performances have now been rendered useless by people just blindly spewing nonsense about how a top level manager 'doesn't know what a Midfield is' or how he is only playing because of two goals, despite having other options on the bench.
It's actually a bit embarrassing that a fan base can go this way.
All valid discussion on his performances have now been rendered useless by people just blindly spewing nonsense about how a top level manager 'doesn't know what a Midfield is' or how he is only playing because of two goals, despite having other options on the bench.
It's actually a bit embarrassing that a fan base can go this way.
Definitely the case. 5 years of stinking up the place but hey, lets forget all of that because he scored 2 goals in injury time!
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