It's not only apparent, it's also official and it has been for almost two months. Retrospectively the first official case in China was in early December but they believe that the actual first case was in November.
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
It's not only apparent, it's also official and it has been for almost two months. Retrospectively the first official case in China was in early December but they believe that the actual first case was in November.
And what about "ze Germans"? Who cares about the evil drunk Russians anyway, am I right?
I think that's the key thing - the culture in America is all about personal freedom and the 'I'm alright Jack' way of thinking - so a lot of people there just won't buy into the thought that 'we are all in this together' and see the need for society as a whole to be restricted to protect the vulnerable. This is a culture that generally looks down on the vulnerable and the poor and offer little in the way of societal support to those people with or without a virus. You would hope that COVID might change the way they think over there but I suspect it won't as a lot of people see any move to lessen their supposed freedom as an act of war and socialism. Hense why you get psycho's in full military gear and automatic weapons threatening people - they honestly think they are in a war against their own Government. The paranoia ingrained in the culture there is incredible.
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Purely wishful thinking but could it be possible that the outbreaks that we're dealing with now, are pretty close to the true uncontained 'peaks' of this disease?
We are both right leaning countries and are free to elect total morons - doesnt mean that we are in anyway the same outside of that. I really do think America is a very different place to the UK.
What are you on about?
@11101 do you happen to know the official line on the first recorded case in Italy?
There's been interesting development with regards to antibody tests
https://www.roche.com/media/releases/med-cor-2020-05-03.htm
Roche mentioning theirs have specificity and sensitivity of nearly 100% each (14 days post-PCR)!
Which I've been conditioned with all the badness that has come out of COVID to be firmly in the "too good to be true category" but looking forward to its evaluation.
Apparently its been evaluated by Public Health England with initial results expected by the end of the week with aim to start role out mid-May onwards. FDA are looking at it to. Definitely something to watch out for.
Claims are that serological screening machines (called MosaiQ) which have European regulatory approval each can test up to 3000 per day with results in 35 minutes and with 12 machines ready that would be around 250000/week if its works, more here
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52529294
https://www.roche.com/media/releases/med-cor-2020-05-03.htm
Roche mentioning theirs have specificity and sensitivity of nearly 100% each (14 days post-PCR)!
Which I've been conditioned with all the badness that has come out of COVID to be firmly in the "too good to be true category" but looking forward to its evaluation.
Apparently its been evaluated by Public Health England with initial results expected by the end of the week with aim to start role out mid-May onwards. FDA are looking at it to. Definitely something to watch out for.
Claims are that serological screening machines (called MosaiQ) which have European regulatory approval each can test up to 3000 per day with results in 35 minutes and with 12 machines ready that would be around 250000/week if its works, more here
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52529294
That is potentially excellent news however what we really need to know is whether having antibody's means you are unable to get the virus again and if so for how long? Unfortunately we probably won't know that for many months yet.
I keep seeing news articles about full flights.
Where are these people going and why? Everything is shut.
Where are these people going and why? Everything is shut.
I would say no because things were getting out of hand until we used drastic measures to contain it. Without any proof, I would suspect that the virus evolved from November to February, that the chinese imported version is maybe not as contagious as the European settled version. I also want to make the point that the vase majority of people with symptoms that match with Covid-19 do not have it, it also matches with flu symptoms which can also lead to respiratory difficulties.
As I understand it is the US constitution which allows people to carry guns? (sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong).
My American friends tell me that Ironically the founding fathers had the idea that if individuals could be legally armed they could defend themselves and so prevent any future government of the people for the people, getting too big for their boots? The British in their wisdom ensured by their unwritten constitution (precedent) that there was no way an individual within the population can be legally armed, unless he's a landowner, or a titled member of the aristocracy.
Each believes they got it right?
Sure, en masse testing coupled with well defined clinical endpoints and working with patients to regularly re-swab for COVID or to check for re-infection via their pathology/hospital records would be the way forward.
With ease of lockdown anticipated and potentially an expected uptick in COVID community transmission should I'd imagine make for evaluating antibody tests and vaccines a tad easier due to increased R naught.
A lot of work and business is still happening. People commuting to and from Great Britain and Northern Ireland is a thing.
Yes each believes they got it right but its only the USA that has 6 year olds killing more of their own citizens than Isis.
There isn't one. Officially it's still the 38 year old runner in late February but they freely acknowledge he is not really the first case.
At the moment genetic sequencing suggests the virus first came to Italy from Shanghai via Germany some time in January, but they are now investigating a spike in pneumonia cases and deaths in a small area south of Milan in November and December. They are talking about exhuming some of the bodies to test them for Covid-19.
I’d imagine London has commuters flying in/out from most EU countries. Certainly hundreds of people from Dublin getting Monday/Friday flights to London every week.
Good f*cking grief. 'Get back to work, stupid peasants. Time is money.':
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So it took them what a couple of week to tell the WHO from first reports and a few more weeks before they started to tell the world? When should they have locked down to stop it spreading in your opinion?
I have little forgiveness for this idea that China let it spread when they locked down far quicker than most nations stopped inbound flights and leaders dismissed it as nonsense. I genuinely don't think other nations would have done any better and probably worse if anything considering how soft touch we are comparatively.
The conditions that caused first human transmission sure but everything else is a diversionary blame game.
Alsl I don't believe many of these unconfirmed December cases, unless they'd been to China the chances are remote. I had something which now I'd think was covid but it was clearly just the usual flu/influenza viruses circilating and it's human nature to connect the two.
Case in point, the idea that if we'd have had this virus circulate here say within Manchester we'd have locked the entire country down within a few weeks is clearly unicorn stuff.
By the sounds of it the public want an extended lockdown, possibly a couple more afterwards although I imagine furlough ending will shift opinion quite substantially.
Furthermore I hope testing public opinion is the last thing they base their decisions on, I wouldn't trust the average member of the public as far as I can throw them.
I'm just worried like you are. Compassion is still very important to me.
The number of people thinking virus is a hoax is growing every day here. Overheard conversation in a supermarket yesterday between two ladies convinced virus doesn't exist because 'they don't personally know anyone who have had it'. For context, there has been less than 100 confirmed cases in Krakow which has over 1 million population. People can't believe there are hundreds of people in agglomeration of over 1 million that they do not personally know. Wow.
I wonder if anyone follow that type of logic with aids, Ebola or frostbite.
Can they explain how usa china and russia agreed to work together on this?
What about iran and israel?
If someone can give me a good tinfoil hat explanation for that I'll believe its a lie
Actually I've met people who do. I know a person who doesn't think HIV/AIDS exist, they were invented by big pharma and governments to control people and make money.
We're in position here where the spread has been largely controlled with still under a thousand victims in the whole country. Because we've done good job controlling the situation people do not understand seriousness and severity of it. If we were in similar position as Italy or Spain with people dying in thousands every week, then perhaps those idiots would have noticed virus is real.
I don't know Sarni, the UK is about as bad as Italy and Spain but we've still got plenty of idiots who think they should be allowed to do what they want. There are always those who find it hard to get the link between actions and consequences, they're just blinded by what they want in the moment.
Government advertising: 'Stay at home, save lives'.
Tory MP: 'People have been a little too willing to save lives'.
Yeah quite possibly. People are saying 'governments cannot tell us what to do and what to not do' when this is exactly what has been happening for centuries and rightly so. I mean if your preference is to drive your car on pavement instead of road, you cannot do that either. If you want to drive down the left lane instead of right like we are supposed to, you also can't really do that either. If you want to kill your neighbor, you are not allowed to do that either. WHY ARE GOVERNMENTS CONTROLLING US LIKE THAT
There is a NHS colorectal surgeon who's posted on youtube regurgitated some bullshit about covid being a hoax, he's already been reported to the GMC which saved me the trouble of doing so, I did flag up the youtube video as dangerous content but its still up there so far.
A big part of it is that taking down these videos and deplatforming them feeds into conspiracy theorists more but I do believe that their views are dangerous and shouldn't be propagated
Fortunately I have challenged all my friends and family on social media and in real life with evidence of debunking to popular claims
Things like covid is a hoax, covid is manmade/lab generated, cures, 5G links have all been thoroughly debunked. I don't argue with people online too much but in real life I have found that those who share whatsapp messages or regurgitate them are amenable to being corrected on covid.
Being a doctor a lot of family members have approached me (sincerely) asking questions to things they've heard on whatsapp etc. Rather than dismissing them as gullible etc I do now take a more empathetic route to talk them through it.
I think critical thinking with regards to pseudoscience is a skill we have to somehow look into incorporating into society a lot more.
Sorry for not being more knowledgeable on this subject. I'd like to ask: are there organisations which would benefit from 5G having a bad reputation & so, perhaps, being abandoned by governments?
I ask this because I suspect that the recent anti-lockdown protests in America have their impetus from people or groups who want the lockdown ended for monetary reasons; and wondered if the 5G controversy was also rooted in similar shenanigans.
I ask this because I suspect that the recent anti-lockdown protests in America have their impetus from people or groups who want the lockdown ended for monetary reasons; and wondered if the 5G controversy was also rooted in similar shenanigans.
I've been asked to take a corticosteroid nasal spray(momesatone) for a couple of weeks for allergic rhinitis. Is that safe with covid19 around? @Arruda or anyone else, please?
I really should've asked the doctor, and it struck me only when I got home.
I really should've asked the doctor, and it struck me only when I got home.
I don't think so, Steve. I'm not aware of any alternatives to 5G. It's new technology, which sometimes frightens people and its release happened to coincide with the virus, enabling a certain type of people to monetize that fear.
I take a similar drug daily. No risks. You'll feel a whole lot better, though.
There's not getting it right then there's predicting 200 million people will die from a disease that in the end killed less than 300. The prediction from swine flu (65,000 people projected to die in the UK, only 457 do) is also way off.
Thanks, mate.
Could it be, though, that organisations specialising in 4G & other tech might prefer the current status quo to remain?
Wasn’t the early 5G rollout in the US (pre virus) associated with a lot of anti Chinese sentiment? I remember Trump being an asshole about the Uk going ahead with it, while it was stalled in the US. Don’t think there was any corporation behind the scepticism. Just the US government being protectionist and obstructive about tech which they perceive to benefit the Chinese economy.
This has confused me. The UK is now firmly up there with Italy and Spain but still so many people are out and about and not taking it seriously and claims of hoaxes and overreactions are not exactly uncommon either. In Italy and Spain you'd have to search far into the backpages to find any dissenting view of the lockdowns, if it was ever printed in the first place. I had thought when thousands started dying the UK would wake up too.
I don't think you appreciate what reasonable ranges on some estimates look like. When dealing with exponential growth, the difference between a few catching the disease and it being stopped at source, and that snowballing into something vast is a very fine margin. Surely what we are now experiencing shows that the swine flu estimate doesn't look that over the top? Swine flu could have easily manifested like this. So could have SARS.