If it's an existential war why would you want to limit a victim in any way?They've not been denied anything that could only be used defensively and wouldn't risk depleting NATO stocks. Everything that has been denied so far has been either offensive capable (long range missiles, jets) or would risk leaving the donor country short (tanks, jets).
If it's an existential war why would you want to limit a victim in any way?
Most western countries condemned the use of these weapons in Lybia, Syria, Sudan and Yemen, so if we keep telling ourselves that ukraine is in a way defending western values (democracy, joining EU, etc), I would just hope for a little consistency.
If it's an existential war why would you want to limit a victim in any way?
If the requested weapons were given with the understanding they wouldn't be used in russian territory, do you think ukraine would just break that understanding once they got the weapons? It would be mad.That should be obvious, Western countries don't want to risk World War 3 by giving Ukraine equipment that can be used to strike inside Russia.
Kinda my point, the west never looked at this as an existential war, so seeing westerners now using that argument as a justification for this is a bit weird.Well, that's a question we've been asking since day one. Its all politics, logistics, funds and fear of 'provoking' Putin.
These weapons should have been there a year ago ideally, along with many other things.
If it's an existential war why would you want to limit a victim in any way?
Most western countries condemned the use of these weapons in Lybia, Syria, Sudan and Yemen, so if we keep telling ourselves that ukraine is in a way defending western values (democracy, joining EU, etc), I would just hope for a little consistency.
Kinda my point, the west never looked at this as an existential war, so seeing westerners now using that argument as a justification for this is a bit weird.
It feels like the US and UK’s relationship is getting increasingly strained.
The UK training Ukrainians on F16s, led to the US vetoing Wallace’s NATO appointment.
And now the UK has spoken out against providing cluster bombs to Ukraine, after the US sent them.
Hopefully it doesn’t negatively impact their approach to Ukraine.
Nonsense. Total failure would be not supplying anything and letting Russia slowly suffocate Ukraine.Total failure on all counts.
When's this recession going to occur?The US strategy for Ukraine looks more misconceived by the day.
It's a shame the UK and EU didn't stand up to the US mid last year.
What's the end game? The war probably goes on until Western countries vote out the parties supporting it?
So far what's been achieved?The destruction of large sections of Eastern Ukraine.
The EU, UK, US and global economy heading in to a massive recession and the political instability and further austerity that will probably follow it?
Meanwhile, it looks like even after all that Russia will still be occupying Ukrainian territory.
Total failure on all counts.
Ern, what? How you can say that when there’s a lot of Ukrainians still living in an independent Ukraine right now?Total failure on all counts.
It's been mentioned in this thread but it's not really a subject of discussion. I do know politicians have caught on to it. Seems a social media thing.Do you discuss NAFO in here? I've been seeing a lot of stuff about NAFO the last few days. Not good.
If the requested weapons were given with the understanding they wouldn't be used in russian territory, do you think ukraine would just break that understanding once they got the weapons? It would be mad.
Anyone who believes ukraine are a rational actor.Who is going to take thar risk? A country whose very existence is under threat is not going to be the most trustworthy on that one.
What's this about?Do you discuss NAFO in here? I've been seeing a lot of stuff about NAFO the last few days. Not good.
Oh, nothing exciting, I believe they've had some conference in Vilnius (could be wrong about that) and it looks very lame. I was wondering if anyone here wanted to fight me about how lame it looks but not looking too promising thus far.What's this about?
What does it stand for or is 'nafo' an actual word?Oh, nothing exciting, I believe they've had some conference in Vilnius (could be wrong about that) and it looks very lame. I was wondering if anyone here wanted to fight me about how lame it looks but not looking too promising thus far.
North Atlantic Fellas Organization.What does it stand for or is 'nafo' an actual word?
Thanks. Love learning new shit.
So there is. A few people seem to think the article might be just a tad flattering.there's some fun stuff in the talk page of that article
The UK doesn't operate F16's so our guys would need training first before they could train UkrainiansIt feels like the US and UK’s relationship is getting increasingly strained.
The UK training Ukrainians on F16s, led to the US vetoing Wallace’s NATO appointment.
And now the UK has spoken out against providing cluster bombs to Ukraine, after the US sent them.
Hopefully it doesn’t negatively impact their approach to Ukraine.
Oh, nothing exciting, I believe they've had some conference in Vilnius (could be wrong about that) and it looks very lame. I was wondering if anyone here wanted to fight me about how lame it looks but not looking too promising thus far.
It's definitely a difficult question, as even in the countries who deliver weapons it is not always clear.If the requested weapons were given with the understanding they wouldn't be used in russian territory, do you think ukraine would just break that understanding once they got the weapons? It would be mad.
It's been mentioned in this thread but it's not really a subject of discussion. I do know politicians have caught on to it. Seems a social media thing.
What's your suggestion?The US strategy for Ukraine looks more misconceived by the day.
It's a shame the UK and EU didn't stand up to the US mid last year.
What's the end game? The war probably goes on until Western countries vote out the parties supporting it?
So far what's been achieved?The destruction of large sections of Eastern Ukraine.
The EU, UK, US and global economy heading in to a massive recession and the political instability and further austerity that will probably follow it?
Meanwhile, it looks like even after all that Russia will still be occupying Ukrainian territory.
Total failure on all counts.
