Why is it more likely to succeed, I am not aware of any evidence to suggest that? Surely most managers go on a journey. The best managers are flexible, adapt, make the most of what they have and identify a path forward. The best managers dont stick with a formation they inherit, in fact most managers are really not obsessed with formation in the way that Amorim is.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
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For me it's style of play that matters more, as long as we're attacking (for the most part) I don't care what the formation is. It shouldn't really matter all that much.
He knows the fitness of the players is an issue. I actually wouldn't worry too much about the next two league games, the season seems to rest on that Sociedad game.
A positive comment about Amad potentially being back for the end of the season though. If we can beat Sociedad and get the likes of Mount, Mainoo and Shaw back after the international break then hopefully things will look a bit brighter.
A positive comment about Amad potentially being back for the end of the season though. If we can beat Sociedad and get the likes of Mount, Mainoo and Shaw back after the international break then hopefully things will look a bit brighter.
Seems like ten hag and Amorim over manage when they are stressed. Too much instruction, too many directions and the players over think.
Ruud came in and seemed fo play it quite simple.
Also who would have thought that trying to play a formation you don’t have the players for would be an issue?
Imagine that? Imagine ineos or Amorim not realizing that we don’t have the players for two wingbacks. Imagine that universe
Ruud came in and seemed fo play it quite simple.
Also who would have thought that trying to play a formation you don’t have the players for would be an issue?
Imagine that? Imagine ineos or Amorim not realizing that we don’t have the players for two wingbacks. Imagine that universe
I mentioned earlier Ruud had no reason to be stressed so just kept it simple. Now if he had the job full time, he would likely do exactly the same because the pressure would be on.
I always regret posting in here after giving in to the temptationThe relentless moaning and negativity some display is actually impressive and I don’t know how you manage it
Yeah it's crazy. I'm happy to jump on the negative train regarding managers and I'll give it out to those acting like top reds but feck me it's unbelievable that we have people so against Amorim at this stage. At least give him til end of the year.
No manager should be getting such grief after a few months, especially when the same people slag off the team he has available.
It seems very basic that we shouldn't judge a manager until they've had a preseason. I'd add we shouldn't judge a manager whilst they've got no striker. It's basic common sense even if people happen to dislike the formation they play.
I don't think we can afford to sack him to be honest.
I genuinely think based on how honest and self-critical he's been so far that he'd be open to actually mutually parting ways with no compensation.
I hope not though and I hope it works because he seems like a great guy and coach who is being undermined by a terrible situation.
Where is this revisionism coming from on Ruud. Hes not doing a particularly good job at Leicester and very very little changed at United in the few games he managed. I understand that there is little he could do in such limited time but the idea that he made any real difference is silly. We got a bit of luck in those few games that was lacking at the end of EtHs time and has been lacking for Amorim. Every damn game someone does something diabolically stupid to ruin the game. Red cards, penalties, absolutely gifting goals, awful goalkeeping errors.
If the Dorgu signing is any indication then the players they do bring in are going to be young and inexperienced most likely. In other words, even if your on team "proper rebuild" I don't think it's going to be Nirvana. They'll likely need a season or two to bed in.
So unless he performs some sort of miracle vs the Shanghai sharks in this mythical preseason, I'd expect another bottom half finish next hopefully people are patient and mentally prepared.
So unless he performs some sort of miracle vs the Shanghai sharks in this mythical preseason, I'd expect another bottom half finish next hopefully people are patient and mentally prepared.
It's not revisionism, he did relatively well albeit only for four games. Two teams we played over three of those weren't very good so it's impossible to know how it would have gone over a longer period.
People look fondly on it because although the football wasn't going to massively improve in such a short time, we looked the most comfortable we had done as a team for a long time with one of the best runs of results we've had in a long time to boot. It's only natural people will wander what if.
I don't believe it was luck, you don't have bad luck under two managers then get incredibly lucky under the interim in between. He might not have done much, but he certainly did something positive. To be honest, it just looked to me like the players were playing closer together and it really helped.
He actually did much but using a normal double pivot. It's a very basic tweak but it does two things, Bruno can focus on creating in the final third instead of running around and chasing ghost and it insulates your CBs which means that they are better positioned against crosses and long balls.
I didn't watch much of the game yesterday (I didn't know it was an early kick off) but from watching the highlights it looked like we played well up until they got their penalty. Is that a fair reflection of the game?
Yes. Although it was hard to know what to feel in terms of either being frustrated we didn't kill the game or relieved because the last twenty minutes we could have easily lost it.
On a cynical note, it's hard to know how much of that was down to Zubimendi being missing because Bruno and Casemiro both were pretty comfortable in the midfield. I hope he's missing next week too.
No, both teams were bad. We were a bit more threatening on the counter while they were more "comfortable" in possession but absolutely impotent.
Yes, although temper the idea of playing well to being the better team without really threatening i.e. Dalot not playing in Hojlund for what you would assume would be 1-0. Lots of half chances versus creating great openings. I really can't see them getting much at OT even with our form, they seemed extremely average.
Ha ha
Yes. It was enjoyable to watch also.
Just you wait until Amorim signs players like Tonyan, Ciamala, Zeke Zero, and Musras Land-ahoy, players who shred other leagues and will totally crush the Premier League.
I detect a hint of sarcasm there.
For me we looked better than recent games but I couldn't decide during the match if we were acutally playing well. After almost 2 years of truly awful football and performances under 2 managers I fear I can no longer recognise what a decent perfromance even looks like.
Ha ha brilliant
Thing is Klopp has admitted that he was offered the job at Utd, but it wasn’t attractive and he chose Liverpool.
Granted Woodward has since left, but overall the club is in an even worse position today after more years of mismanagement.
Klopp could see that Liverpool were a better prospect for growth back then. What top manager could come in and produce results like Klopp got with Liverpool with our current shambles of players?
For me we looked better than recent games but I couldn't decide during the match if we were acutally playing well. After almost 2 years of truly awful football and performances under 2 managers I fear I can no longer recognise what a decent perfromance even looks like.
Both teams were gash but I think that we were slighly better simply because we were playing on the counter and created chances for ourselves.
You seldom see the coaches downing tools, but he might be the one who does that before the players
I struggle to see how anyone sees the players available against Sociedad and expects the manager to do much more than try to survive at this point. Free flowing football is the last thing I expect to see, and unfortunately when we are then let down by brain dead decisions like we've seen from Onana and Dalot in recent weeks, those decisions can be the difference maker in games where you're trying to remain compact and avoid conceeding chances.
This team was torn apart week after week under ETH on the transition and Amorims put and end to that. Unfortunately we have next to no available players to offer much going the other way. Where we are in the table reflects the quality we have in the forward line.
This team was torn apart week after week under ETH on the transition and Amorims put and end to that. Unfortunately we have next to no available players to offer much going the other way. Where we are in the table reflects the quality we have in the forward line.
Land-ahoy would be at sea in this league, Zeke Zero too lightweight
At this point it’s semantics so let’s just leave it.
Quality response.
100%. My barometer was readjusted when I watched PSG the other night, that was peak football in my opinion (without the crucial end product), beautiful to watch.For me we looked better than recent games but I couldn't decide during the match if we were acutally playing well. After almost 2 years of truly awful football and performances under 2 managers I fear I can no longer recognise what a decent perfromance even looks like.
It was a bit depressing how far our 'good' performances are from anything even remotely like that.
Agreed, and we’ll be stuck in 12-16th place while he is here, win no trophies and no Europe. Too much debt and too much incompetence on all levels.
Good range though.
Yeah I'd agree, it was the first match in a while that I enjoyed for the most part. Up until the penalty anyway.
That's where people seem to not understand the financial side of things. The club can afford to sack him, the money isn't special and we have that kind of cash but that's beside the actual point there is roughly an 18.5m gap between 5 positions in the league. If money is a particularly big concern and you believe that the club won't be around 9th-10th then sacking him is the money move.
To be fair you replied to my post mate.
I wish I could actually watch other football but watching decent football from other teams would only make it harder to sit through a United match and the insipid shite we serve up week after week.
If you can't be good you could at least be entertaining, we seem to have mastered the art of being shite and boring.
Sorry if I was unclear. I think we'll end up 16th this season and 12-16th in Amorim's two remaning seasons. We might have the cash to sack him but that would mean less cash for transfers. I think he'll be given at least another 6 months but it will not change much.
I think, this is the effect of "I am positive and I look for comfirmation" kicking in. At the end of ETH, the players looked mostly bereft of will and believe and with Ruud, at least that part was gone. But apart from that, he didn't really adjust too much. He also had a rather easy fixture list, a sample size of this size isn't really a good tool to use. That being said, Amorim brought a rather deep change in the team set up which for sure added to the existing issues. But to me, this isn't a negative factor per se. I was quite sure that the season was more or less done when ETH was sacked and half a season to bed in a new formation is certainly better than trying to bed it in in pre-season only.
But wasn't at that point ETH also using something that was very close to a double pivot anyway? I mean, that donut thing with no midfield wasn't in full force anymore. Had we kept Ruud, my feeling is we may be a few places up the table but still nowhere in contention for anything. Especially with the injuries and form the players had. It is difficult to say, what he would have done with Rash and Antony, but after all, I support sending them away.
It was a very boring game where no team looked too capable of anything. Real had more of the ball and looked a little more comfortable with it but didn't produce any endproduct. United defended rather disciplined and tried to catch them off-guard but with also nothing much to show for. The match should have been a 0:0. And it had no real new insights on anything.
Because you guys are getting the semantic point wrong.
Let’s see if ChatGPT can do a better job at explaining:
The semantic difference lies in the distinction between coercion or external pressure (forcing someone’s hand) and direct compulsion (literally forcing someone).
• “Forcing someone’s hand” means applying pressure, limiting choices, or creating circumstances that leave someone with little realistic alternative but to act in a certain way. It implies external factors or strategic moves influencing their decision, even if they technically still have agency.
• Example: Amorim was forced to join United mid-season rather than in the summer because the club couldn’t risk waiting and potentially having to sign another manager instead.
• “Literally forcing someone” implies direct, overt compulsion, where the person has no choice in a physical or absolute sense. It suggests the use of physical force, threats, or extreme coercion.
• Example: Amorim was literally forced to join United—kidnapped, handcuffed, and dragged to Manchester against his will.
So in your example, Amorim was pressured or left with no viable alternative rather than being physically or absolutely compelled.
He used a more conservative midfield than last season which saw us be more solid but it wasn't really a strict double pivot, Ruud went with Ugarte and Casemiro as water carriers instead of any the Ugarte/Casemiro plus Eriksen/Mainoo. With Casemiro and Ugarte staying connected and closing the middle of the pitch.