None of this is even remotely true
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
Never ceases to amaze me how few of our fans understand how well Fergie did after taking over mid-season compared to what happened before him and then how well he continued that on his second ( first full ) season.
His start was the fecking polar opposite of the Amorim horror show.
Educate yourselves for God’s sake.
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Can we get a Southgate vs Allegri poll for all the people who want Amorim sacked before the summer?
If the talk is true about him already telling those players who are not in his future plans, with how threadbare we are and how we’re playing, that seems like naive and frankly baffling management.
A 17-years old with average cameo was 10 times better than Hojlund.
Nothing wrong with our performance against a very in form Fulham side. We created enough and should have won before penalties. 5 big chances missed speaks volumes. Once again our attacking players let us down massively.
Garnacho on 50 shots without scoring now.
Nothing wrong with our performance against a very in form Fulham side. We created enough and should have won before penalties. 5 big chances missed speaks volumes. Once again our attacking players let us down massively.
Garnacho on 50 shots without scoring now.
Blaming the system for the results is way off. He’s playing give or take the best 11 available players most games. They can’t avoid basic defensive errors for 90 minutes- stupid stuff that would happen and cost you in any formation. Same with our attack they can’t put away decent chances.
He was right to impose standards and get players who were not putting in the effort out of the dressing room. The squad has under performed for nearly a decade, we need a manager that has standards. But a bit of a balance between keeping authority and also not alienating all players. Seems to be working at this.
Not his fault we didn’t bring in players to replace the loan outs, when we had a few injuries we see how bare the squad is. We really needed to find a couple of players on loan that could make some contributions- not a high bar.
Could he make us look better at the moment, probably. We could play defensive counter attacking and have tried to keep Rashford and Sancho etc half way motivated. But we would be just sticking in the same slow decline rut. And it would be just deferring the change that’s needed.
I don’t know if the formation will work but I like that it forces players to do their job and highlights where they don’t perform. At some point we need to have players play proper football rather than using the equivalent of Fred McTominay double pivot to paper over cracks. When you rip off that paper and see the cracks it’s ugly but at least we see the biggest areas we need to fill.
Biggest problem has been squad building and retention/management. I am somewhat hopeful this is improving gross under performing relative to ability is not being tolerated, better characters like Bruno and Maguire are playing better than they have recently and new signings like Dorgu looks good.
We need to see at least three players in and possibly two out and a proper pre season before we even consider another change in direction. I think we will see some reasons for optimism after a couple of good additions- solid not spectacular and a return of some injured players.
It’s painful now but that’s because of squad quality not anything Amorim is doing.
He was right to impose standards and get players who were not putting in the effort out of the dressing room. The squad has under performed for nearly a decade, we need a manager that has standards. But a bit of a balance between keeping authority and also not alienating all players. Seems to be working at this.
Not his fault we didn’t bring in players to replace the loan outs, when we had a few injuries we see how bare the squad is. We really needed to find a couple of players on loan that could make some contributions- not a high bar.
Could he make us look better at the moment, probably. We could play defensive counter attacking and have tried to keep Rashford and Sancho etc half way motivated. But we would be just sticking in the same slow decline rut. And it would be just deferring the change that’s needed.
I don’t know if the formation will work but I like that it forces players to do their job and highlights where they don’t perform. At some point we need to have players play proper football rather than using the equivalent of Fred McTominay double pivot to paper over cracks. When you rip off that paper and see the cracks it’s ugly but at least we see the biggest areas we need to fill.
Biggest problem has been squad building and retention/management. I am somewhat hopeful this is improving gross under performing relative to ability is not being tolerated, better characters like Bruno and Maguire are playing better than they have recently and new signings like Dorgu looks good.
We need to see at least three players in and possibly two out and a proper pre season before we even consider another change in direction. I think we will see some reasons for optimism after a couple of good additions- solid not spectacular and a return of some injured players.
It’s painful now but that’s because of squad quality not anything Amorim is doing.
We're still playing defensive counter attacking football as you put it. Nothing has really changed on that front. The only big difference is that we've become weaker in the attacking areas with the departures of several players and that has made our counter attacks worse.
There was a issue last season where we had a problem progressing the ball in the build up phase and also had a problem defending transitions and both of those problems still exist and the midfield is a big weaknesses which is currently compounded further by the players that have departed in attack without having replacements.
I don't think the question for me is the coach right now but rather how they're going to go about rectifying issues which can only be rectified by signing the right players.
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His honesty thing is doing way too much. There's a limit to it. You don't need to be constantly negative all the time and say you have no idea how to fix it. ETH was annoying with his nonsense but that was preferable to what Amorim comes out with. (Not really but after reading his interviews you think it for a second)
Wait until his wife asks him if that dress makes her look fat.
also… managing man united and playing for united is a totally different beast. The pressure level, scrutiny, expectation and weight of this shirt can’t be overlooked. That’s why players come here as really good players. Turn to shit, leave and revert to type.
Same with managers.
I actually like the way how Amorim sets up his structure during the build up phase and attacking transition where he formed a diamond in the past 2 games.
For example, I don’t think it’s best role for Garnacho to play in that diamond structure. Instead, he should play Ugarte as the left sided, while one of the wingback becomes inverted (Dalot or Maz) because Dalot and Maz have always been an inverted full back so being inverted was always been their best role.
Defensive transition:
Build up phase/attacking transition:
CB: de Ligt, Maguire, Yoro
Inverted right wingback: Dalot/Mazraoui
Attacking left wingback: Dorgu
Deep playmaker: Bruno
Box to Box or ball winning midfielder: Ugarte
R10 or wide forward: Amad/Garnacho
L10 or inverted forward: Zirkzee
Striker: Hojlund/Obi
Bruno
Ugarte —— Garnacho
Zirkzee
Bruno
Ugarte —— Eriksen
Zirkzee
I think he should keep this structure but make a little change in order to get the best out of his players in this system.Ugarte —— Garnacho
Zirkzee
Bruno
Ugarte —— Eriksen
Zirkzee
For example, I don’t think it’s best role for Garnacho to play in that diamond structure. Instead, he should play Ugarte as the left sided, while one of the wingback becomes inverted (Dalot or Maz) because Dalot and Maz have always been an inverted full back so being inverted was always been their best role.
Defensive transition:
Onana
Dalot/Maz - de Ligt - Maguire - Yoro - Dorgu
Bruno - Ugarte
Amad/Garna - Zirkzee
Hojlund/Obi
Dalot/Maz - de Ligt - Maguire - Yoro - Dorgu
Bruno - Ugarte
Amad/Garna - Zirkzee
Hojlund/Obi
Build up phase/attacking transition:
Onana
de Ligt - Maguire - Yoro
Bruno
Dalot/Maz —— Ugarte
Amad/Garna - Zirkzee - Dorgu
Hojlund/Obi
GK: Onanade Ligt - Maguire - Yoro
Bruno
Dalot/Maz —— Ugarte
Amad/Garna - Zirkzee - Dorgu
Hojlund/Obi
CB: de Ligt, Maguire, Yoro
Inverted right wingback: Dalot/Mazraoui
Attacking left wingback: Dorgu
Deep playmaker: Bruno
Box to Box or ball winning midfielder: Ugarte
R10 or wide forward: Amad/Garnacho
L10 or inverted forward: Zirkzee
Striker: Hojlund/Obi
Hope you don't mind me adding my tuppence here, appreciate the question wasn't addressed to me.
I think the setup of the team is being overplayed. I firmly believe it's the lack of ability/skill (choose another word) of the players on the pitch.
I do think systems need to be flexible, think Park being assigned to man mark etc. However overall I don't think a 3 or 4 at the back is what's our main issue/problem.
Putting aside in house issues such as Sancho or Marcus. Or even the current sitting on contracts with big money and not really focused (In my opinion likes of Casemiro) the players on the pitch are simply not good enough or ready (being polite).
There is so much talk of our defence but I honestly believe our defence isn't the big issue. The biggest issue is ball retention away from our defence. Our goalkeeper and back line keep the ball well. They see the ball a lot. We can be in the opposition half and play the ball back to the keeper.
For me the main issue is our front line. If Hojlund, Zirkzee and Garnacho could keep the ball longer further up the pitch we simply would be a more attractive team and the back line becomes irrelevant to a degree.
Our back line and MF in particular are usually under pressure almost instantly when the ball is played forward. Games against City, Arsenal and Liverpool have shown we can play the ball around our own half for ages. It's playing the ball to our front men which causes us problems because they simply cannot hold on to it.
Darling, you are the fattest you have ever been. I have never imagined that my wife would be that fat. I don't know what to do.... Anyway, what have you prepared for dinner?
I know we’ve been sinking with him but we have to give him a full first season to prove the quality which we saw in I’m at sporting. He’s taken a harder path by sticking to his system but I think it was the right way to go. Matters were made much worse by the team being terrible, inflexible, down on confidence and injuries to vital players.
Give him two windows (summer and winter) of full support and then let’s see how good he really is. It would be absolutely bonkers to give up so soon given the circumstances.
Give him two windows (summer and winter) of full support and then let’s see how good he really is. It would be absolutely bonkers to give up so soon given the circumstances.
No it’s not set up in the best way to win now but it’s set up in the way that will benefit us most nexts season. Playing a different style may improve us now but will hurt the implementation of the system which will get deferred. We need to drill down his ideas and ensure payoff next season.
United is unique in the enormous stature of the club which comes with it’s expected pressure combined with over of decade of mismanagement which has left to broken team. That combination is deadly and drags professionals down instead of pushing then up.
That’s why I am fully supportive of supporting Amorim for this coming season at least. We are essentially paying for a long time of accumulating mistakes.
What payoffs? Again, people keep projecting this la la land dream world where things will just flip into chocolate fountain. Amorim has shown nothing to warrant confidence. So far, he has struggled to get the team to string passes together, defend cohesively and score goals.
The formation he has implemented is simply not working and I am not convinced it will. He is a manager with no tactical flexibility. I think he will be out of door quicker than Hojlund's capacity to hold on to the ball.
It will flip with strong signings who suit the system. That’s your switch right there. Not to mention a lot of the injure spine returning.
I don’t think he’ll be sacked. The management see potential in him and it’s too early to judge it.
I said this in December...
People were on my neck about alot of things.
But again i say. 343 wont achieve meaningful success in EPL. It can't. Playing with 2 midfielders is the worst tactic/system/idea in EPL.
W
Why..
Why don't you counter?
Or you believe because we have Amorim and playing 343 if we sign 11 new players we will win the league?
We are here, same as ETH. He came and left us here. Some of us pointed it out. Without a midfield 3 we won't go anywhere. Sadly, it looks like it again.
Name last time a back 3 team won Champions League or EPL? Even harder question, last time a back 3 team was a top team for a considerable amount of time?
We are trying to reinvent the wheel which will turn out to be a expensive affair.. Let's see how it's going to end
People were on my neck about alot of things.
But again i say. 343 wont achieve meaningful success in EPL. It can't. Playing with 2 midfielders is the worst tactic/system/idea in EPL.
I don't even mind the system, I mind the stubbornness. Surely any manager worth his salt needs some level of adaptability and adjust according to the circumstances
Is it not best that we started of rubbish with this manager as we can now only get better. Under previous managers we started of good and went worse which obviously resulted in them getting sacked. Now it’s the other way around so let’s have faith.
No. It's the doughnuts that do that.
But we started poorly and got even worse?
But not bonkers to blindly back a manager who is doing worse than any previous manager in recent times?
Nobody expected miracles, but some improvement would of been expected by now surely, instead it's got worse. There is very little coherent play, very little purpose to what we do. When we defend there is gaps everywhere and when we attack we look about as threatening as a fluffy kitten.
Amorin has coached a team that can't defend, can't attack, can't keep possession, can't transition well and generally looks compleatly devoid of confidence and belief. And you want to blindly back him!? That is bonkers.
If we'd bought a top striker in the summer, there'd be zero excuses.
We'd have had rashford, Amad, garnacho, Hojlund, new striker, Bruno playing behind..... All we were really short of was one player. That's doesn't explain why we're aimless and slow all over the pitch. Not scoring goals is one thing, just just playing shit is another.
There was expectation in June. The same players now have no expectations and it's all ETHs fault for leaving poor Ruben with terrible players, apparently.
We'd have had rashford, Amad, garnacho, Hojlund, new striker, Bruno playing behind..... All we were really short of was one player. That's doesn't explain why we're aimless and slow all over the pitch. Not scoring goals is one thing, just just playing shit is another.
There was expectation in June. The same players now have no expectations and it's all ETHs fault for leaving poor Ruben with terrible players, apparently.
Problem is Bruno is the only one who can finish in this side and having him that deep just allows for attacks to inevitably peter out.
Adjust how? play 4-3-3 without wingers? look at players we have available.. one fit midfielder in Ugarte, striker who can't score to save his life, no actual No 10, one winger, one wingback + bunch of kids and has beens and a laughably bad GK. We have decent CB options and that's it. Non existent attack & midfield and people blame the coach.
We were absolutely terrible before the injuries as well, they are just a convenient (and yet true) excuse
Garnacho is now on 50 (!) shots without scoring.
Hojlund has been outshined by a kid.
Zitkzee looks okay at playmaking, rarely attacks any space.
The most annoying thing about you guys in the "Sack Amorim" brigade is that when we win you bring out stats to criticise the manager and always claim we "got away with it".
When we lose, you couldn't care less about stats. For example we had twice as many shots as Fulham and created 5 big chances, compared to 1 or 2 for them.
But you are not objective and you have made up your minds. You are desperate to be right.
Hojlund has been outshined by a kid.
Zitkzee looks okay at playmaking, rarely attacks any space.
The most annoying thing about you guys in the "Sack Amorim" brigade is that when we win you bring out stats to criticise the manager and always claim we "got away with it".
When we lose, you couldn't care less about stats. For example we had twice as many shots as Fulham and created 5 big chances, compared to 1 or 2 for them.
But you are not objective and you have made up your minds. You are desperate to be right.
I can only imagine you have been in a coma for 3 years.
We can all see the deficiencies in many of the players in the current squad and most of those will still be around next season and season after that.
Unfortunately , there isn’t going to be any mass change in personnel in one or two transfer windows, because of club finances, PSR, player contracts and high wages etc.
As for recruitment, attracting players in demand, who may be offered more appealing opportunities elsewhere, without resorting to overpaying and silly wages, is going to be a tough task.
So the manager gets to keep the poor hand he’s inherited, unless one or two new “diamonds” can come in and unlock whatever potential is already there.
I don’t know if Amorims system will work or not in the EPL, even with bringing in a couple of players suited to his style, but I suspect not.
Nor I can’t find any optimism going forward. We are just too far away from the level required to compete and Amorim’s ability to adjust and take a more pragmatic approach, is in doubt.
He may not make it to next season at this rate.
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Unfortunately , there isn’t going to be any mass change in personnel in one or two transfer windows, because of club finances, PSR, player contracts and high wages etc.
As for recruitment, attracting players in demand, who may be offered more appealing opportunities elsewhere, without resorting to overpaying and silly wages, is going to be a tough task.
So the manager gets to keep the poor hand he’s inherited, unless one or two new “diamonds” can come in and unlock whatever potential is already there.
I don’t know if Amorims system will work or not in the EPL, even with bringing in a couple of players suited to his style, but I suspect not.
Nor I can’t find any optimism going forward. We are just too far away from the level required to compete and Amorim’s ability to adjust and take a more pragmatic approach, is in doubt.
He may not make it to next season at this rate.
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He is a very young coach indeed, hopefully this experience will help him for the future appointmens. In today's football an aspiring top manager simply cannot afford to be a "one trick pony", he's got to adapt to situation, make the best out of the hand he's been dealt.
I do feel like a parrot for repeating this, but people that are actively advocating for him to be given more time and money to purchase players have nothing substantial to base that on. Usually when you bring in a new manager, there's that purple patch in which you get some good results, look a bit better on the pitch. We didn't get that with Amorim, we're orders of magnitude worse actually.
Having blind faith that he will somehow make a 180° turn once he's got the full pre-season and has bought a few of his players, in my opinion is simply wishful thinking. Nowadays there's barely a little over a month for the pre-season, and you don't usually sign the players you want before it starts.
Also just because he was successful in Portugal, doesn't mean that his style will successfully transition to EPL, which is a different beast entirely.
I do feel like a parrot for repeating this, but people that are actively advocating for him to be given more time and money to purchase players have nothing substantial to base that on. Usually when you bring in a new manager, there's that purple patch in which you get some good results, look a bit better on the pitch. We didn't get that with Amorim, we're orders of magnitude worse actually.
Having blind faith that he will somehow make a 180° turn once he's got the full pre-season and has bought a few of his players, in my opinion is simply wishful thinking. Nowadays there's barely a little over a month for the pre-season, and you don't usually sign the players you want before it starts.
Also just because he was successful in Portugal, doesn't mean that his style will successfully transition to EPL, which is a different beast entirely.
I don't know, I still hope to see Amorim with a quick technical physical team, replace Antony, Rashford, Sancho, Mount, Casemiro, Dalot, Hojlund, Eriksen with more transfers in the mould of Dorgu, get a proper striker and No 10, wingback, CM and CB, and I think we'll see much better results.
Agree but the opportunities given to the other managers to prove themselves isn’t comparable.
- Amorim has come in mid season when he said the summer would be the right choice.
- He’s implementing a system this team isn’t built for so that he drill it into them at the earliest,
- He has key injuries in Martinez, Mainoo, Amad with Rashdord and Antony sent away. His keeper is an absolute liability.
- He has to work with the worst line up of attackers I’ve ever seen at this club. Any one of the attackers Ole for example had pisses over any this lot (even under ETH).
- He has signed no one barring some teenagers and a 20 year old.
- He is managing a team that is mentally, technically and tactically broken and paying for a decade of mistakes by previous executives.
And it wouldn’t be blind support. They’ve also hired him for a reason. If they kept him after performing badly in the 2025/26 yes then you could argue that.
It's really difficult to win football games if you don't have a) Good players and b) players that don't score goals.
Based on that I feel like I can't judge him too harshly... but it obvously could be going a lot better.
We have a waifer thin squad and we need loads of new/fresh bodies whoever our manager is. Our options are either a) give Amorim these new players, or b) Give a brand new manager these players - and we've taken the chance on Amorim so he should be the one to get them for me.
Based on that I feel like I can't judge him too harshly... but it obvously could be going a lot better.
We have a waifer thin squad and we need loads of new/fresh bodies whoever our manager is. Our options are either a) give Amorim these new players, or b) Give a brand new manager these players - and we've taken the chance on Amorim so he should be the one to get them for me.
While I can appreciate he needs time and he doesn't want to move away from his formation which is fair enough. I think he needs to learn to be more flexible with it in game. You can keep your formation as a plan A but tweak it during a match and at times throw caution to the wind when you're losing at times.
He keeps making like for like changes even when we're losing. He brought Yoro off yesterday who was doing well for LIndelof, brought Ugarte off for Garnacho, moving Eriksen back ok a slightly more attacking change. Then 5 minutes later takes Eriksen off and brings on another defensive midfielder and we're back to where we started.
Surely vs Fulham at home in a Cup match when you're losing, you could sacrifice one of the 5 defenders on the pitch for an extra attacker? And/or maybe not use two of your subs to swap out centrebacks when the prospect of an extra 30 minutes is on the horizon?
He keeps making like for like changes even when we're losing. He brought Yoro off yesterday who was doing well for LIndelof, brought Ugarte off for Garnacho, moving Eriksen back ok a slightly more attacking change. Then 5 minutes later takes Eriksen off and brings on another defensive midfielder and we're back to where we started.
Surely vs Fulham at home in a Cup match when you're losing, you could sacrifice one of the 5 defenders on the pitch for an extra attacker? And/or maybe not use two of your subs to swap out centrebacks when the prospect of an extra 30 minutes is on the horizon?
Like who?
We had Garnacho, Obi-Martin and Casemiro (move Bruno forward) on the bench.
I think he's on thin ice now. A trophy would have saved him but if we crash out of the Europa he'll have to go.
We've been unfortunate that we lost Martinez, Mainoo and Amad right after the window closed (where we loaned out 3 senior players) and Shaw and Mount have remained crocked.