Yeah, he needs to be a miracle worker to get more than 1 point a game in 14.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
I am no coach, but from my eyes, his performance against a Sorry Spurs Side was totally ridiculous. He seems to have no feel for the game in front of him and is above all concerned with the preservation of his ideals.
Why on earth would you have 3 centre halves against nobody, while having 2 centre midfielders (and even that is being generous) against everybody? Spurs were walking through our team time and time again, and all he saw fit to offer a resistance was Casemiro and then Bruno somewhere 30 yards away. Meanwhile Spurs had Tel playing nominally as a centre forward and 3 centre halves occupying nothing but space. Take one centre half off and add a third midfielder and start directing traffic the right way.
Why on earth would you have 3 centre halves against nobody, while having 2 centre midfielders (and even that is being generous) against everybody? Spurs were walking through our team time and time again, and all he saw fit to offer a resistance was Casemiro and then Bruno somewhere 30 yards away. Meanwhile Spurs had Tel playing nominally as a centre forward and 3 centre halves occupying nothing but space. Take one centre half off and add a third midfielder and start directing traffic the right way.
Making things up again. I think we're done here.
Exactly it's bottom of the barrel stuff. Irrespective of the perceived squad quality Amorim has been a disaster thus far.
There is no way Ruben makes United a competitive team. I'm more than happy to be proven wrong but I cannot visualise any significant level of improvement especially when it's almost a guarantee that United will continue to lose games this season. My fear for Amorim was running out of rope in his first season and that's exactly what's happened.
So Liverpool weren't 9 points of the title last season?
So Liverpool didnt get a new manager
Liverpool didnt get any major signings?
Yep, I made those things up in my head...
I am very much still backing him but I am not going to pretend like he's doing a good job so far. He's made mistakes and he's taken some silly risks and he's failed to really show the 'idea' he has for this team like he promised. Its still very early days, mind.
It's a bottom half team that Ten Hag built, getting bottom half results. Good luck to Amorim or anyone until we have better players.
Ten Hag fluking 8th with it doesn't change it's quality.
Ten Hag fluking 8th with it doesn't change it's quality.
I’m wondering if we’re going to win any game in the league
A bottom half team that he built that finished 8th last season with an injury crisis and a weaker squad. Gold.
As soon as we got hit with a few injuries, the excuses have flooded in... "how do you expect him to improve with injuries"... forgetting that pre injuries, we have been rubbish for 2 months.
There has been no improvement, no new manager bounce nothing with this manager. He can talk the talk but cannot walk it.
Look at teams that changed managers this season, there has been a change in their results and performances.
Only at United, a new manager cannot be asked to improve the players, fans keep making excuses for managers.
With this current squad - yes.
You can't possibly watch these morons misplacing simple passes, sky rocketing crosses and missing chances every week and think "oh, it's because of the manager"!
Our best players are wildly inconsistent and the rest are just shit.
They finished 8th last season with every possible statistic showing they should be 15th.
In the summer nothing improved.
Yes, Amorim could be doing a bit better. But it's so obvious where the majority of our problems are that I'm struggling to accept how much you attack him.
With respect, that's just not true. We have plenty of talented players who have pedigree of prolonged good form. Being terrible going forward and terrible at defending with this group of players is absolutely not good enough. Most of them are seasoned internationals and a few of the young starlets have gotten worse under his tenure. Mainoo looks worse, Garnacho looks worse, Yorro has on occasion looked a bit lost in a back 3 (not least because he's playing musical chairs with his CBs). Hojlund looks worse than he did last year too.
Maz who is so clearly not a wingback was persisted there on too many occasions, Dalot who is not a left wingback was persisted there on too many occasions. And theres other examples too if we dig deeper.
Why is a second manager seemingly failing to get the best out of so many of these players with "pedigree"? We were as awful with big chance wastage and similar traits under the previous manager.
Which youngsters have got worse under him? I'd say Garnacho has struggled to adapt to the new system, has improved a lot recently though, but his failings are the same as they've ever been.
Garnacho, Mainoo, Hojlund all look worse than they were last year.
Looking at one stat doesn't really excuse Amorim. We are bad in almost every department under him, and the quality of our players do not reflect what we see on the pitch - that's on the manager.
Hojlund has looked awful all season, bit obviously bollocks to claim he's gone downhill under Amorim isn't it? Mainoo has struggled all season too, then you throw in a change of formation it's not that surprising, his place in this side needs defining. There's a lot of players who look a bit lost right now.
A trend that was well underway when Amorim was still the manager of Sporting.
As for the quality of players not reflecting what we see on the pitch, why not? Because we've no evidence on which to expect much more from any of them.
Nonsense...
There is enough in the squad there to finish at least top half... not be drawn into a relegation fight.. Whilst you talk about stats being 15th last season, we should be 18th then this because we have had some very lucky results under Amorim too.
The reason a manager gets sacked is because he is underperforming, then a new manager comes in and improves the current players, at least get a new manager bounce.
Instead we have regressed under Amorim, which is the opposite effect to a new manager.
He also showing no signs that he can improve this team, why would anyone trust giving him money when he cannot improve any player?
Plenty, you say? Name them.
Whilst agreeing that Mainoo was looking tired and Hojlund was continuing his barren run under Ten Hag this season, you can't really explain for them to be Space Jam'ed this much. Both of these players have looked completely out of sorts under Amorim, you can see they are uncomfortable. Garnacho has also lost his confidence completely, it's there for all to see.
De Ligt, Maz, Yoro last season in France was very good. Mainoo, Bruno and I'd argue Garnacho would have been tipped to kick on this season after growing more into his own.
Garnacho is bound to look worse, he's an out and out winger in a formation without wingers, still there are signs of improvement.
Mainoo and Hojlund started this season worse, it didn't happen under Amorim, Mainoo was probably massively overplayed for his age last season, he's started to look better before the injury though.
Mainoo nosedived under Amorim moreso than before he joined. Mainoo certainly looked tired but that's about it. Under Amorim he looks awkward and unfamiliar with the role all together.
All three of them have been exactly as bad under Amorim as they were in the first half of the season. There's no evidence of any decline. Also worth considering that Mainoo's best performance of the season has probably been under Amorim (when he played as a 10 and everyone thought that we had finally discovered his best position) and Garnacho's super sub cameos under Amorim have looked way better than anything he produced in the first half of the season (albeit without producing much in terms of goals/assists)
Apart from that one game as a 10 Mainoo is one of very few players whose role has been exactly the same under Amorim as it was under ETH. He hasn't had to adapt to a new role.
Might have to do with the fact he's unfamiliar with the role?
Yeah that's just not true.
And who's job might it be to help with that?
So Bruno is the one and only player in our squad with "pedigree of prolonged good form" in the Premier League. Mainoo at a push but he was in very poor form before Amorim took over. Don't you think that seriously undermines your point?
It is but for some reason you want to absolve the previous manager of any wrong doing and want to make out this bloke has come in and as you say "Space Jam'd" everyone which is frankly bollocks, especially for the players we've discussed here.
So we're now blaming the coach for not having a preseason? It's gradual and Mainoo has looked better the more he played.
The player's, special accommodations are reserved for very few select individuals. The manager's job is to provide guidance through training.
Oh Premier League? Then sure. But I'm not sure what your point is - we should assume he doesnt have quality players at his disposal who are capable of good form? Because that would be pretty false.
Not at all. Amorim himself had issues trusting Mainoo, hooking both him and Ugarte in multiple games for Collyer and Garnacho. You can tell he didn't really know how to use him properly (and in the games that he made these moves our performances did not really improve). Gaslighting with a "but Mainoo played his best performance in a 10" doesn't really change that and wasn't worth any time debating.
We were incredibly lucky to finish 8th last season though. Performance wise we deserved no better than 12th - 13th.
Amorim has still been as much of a disaster as ten Hag (who was an unbelievable disaster himself), if not worse. The way we've performed over the last two months, his job would be on the line if he were the manager of Leicester or Ipswich. I know people have convinced themselves that we have the worst squad in Premier League but it's not really the case, we should be doing much, much better than we are. We are basically the worst team in the league right now, outplayed by pretty much every team we face. If we had to re-start our season tomorrow with every team in the league back to zero points, and playing the remaining 13 games, I'd be almost sure we'd get relegated. We got outclassed by Leicester and Southampton at home, and just barely fluked a win against both, there's no way our squad is this bad.
We played suicidal football and had an injury crisis. It's really not a stretch to say that we could have finished 8th with better comfort if we had a more balanced 433 and not a defensive crisis of injuries for most the season.
That's neither here nor there as I am less interested in looking as far back as last season. My point is just that Amorim has most certainly got a lot of quality players in his squad, albeit concentrated in certain areas and thin in others. But he should be capable of getting more out of the group and it doesn't need a miracle to do so.
We don't assume that, we know it. Because we've all watched the first half of this season. It's all well and good having a few decent performers in defence and midfield but if you've nobody who can reliably stick the ball in the net you're going to drop a hell of a lot of points. So watching that happen should be a surprise to absolutely nobody.
I think you need to google the term "gaslighting".
That someone (me) said "Favs to win the league" before the season is indeed made up in your head.
Yeah I'm sure the Everton fans thought their players are rubbish before Dyche was sacked too.
Also re. gaslighting I did think I had it in the wrong context
And we all know Ten Haag is an infinitely better manager than Sean fecking Dyche.
This is it.
Okay, so you dont think they were favourites? You said you knew Liverpool would win the league though.. or was it the usual with you? Hindsight and after 8/10 games you decided that?