Why change anything then? If we're all happy with the way things are going we might as well just carry on. Bring Rashford, Sancho, and Antony back. As them how we should set up from now on.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
All this just sounds like players who know they can't play to his system fighting for survival. If I was on a big contract, couldn't play to a new system, and I'd just seen Sancho, Rashford, Antony all bombed out, Casemiro not getting a kick, you can can bet your bottom dollar I'd be finding someone else to blame also.
Sorry I'm not sure what your point is. The problem leaked players will be turfed if not already done so. But I dont think it's most the squad thats a problem in that regard.
The previous managers, a mish mash of previous manager players, doing a job for the incumbent manager at the time.
That would assume Ineos are completely bought into the 3 CB setup indefinitely, which seems unlikely. The only real specialist roles are the WBs, and even then it's not like other teams haven't put FB and Wingers into those roles successfully in other cases. As said, I doubt the story is true but I would be surprise din senior players haven't been working with Amorim in terms of trying to better understand what he's looking for.
Would make a good game of guess who.
Each time we get a leak you flip down the players no longer here, or the ones who are here and currently happy.
The ones still standing are not that many.
Each time we get a leak you flip down the players no longer here, or the ones who are here and currently happy.
The ones still standing are not that many.
My post was a follow-up in a conversation about how he won the league with Sporting for the first time after 19 years, not this year.
Its a CNN article.
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/05/12/...on-title-win-covid-19-cmd-spt-intl/index.html
Fair enough – but that was written 4 years ago!
Which is actually good as it shows how his teams evolve and improve
It doesn't mean anything. Pep keeps signing midfielders and playing them as fullbacks, there's no reason why a WB or DM couldn't play in one of the CB roles that is forced to step up into the midfield.
The squad don't know what they want, they've failed, at this level you don't get multiple go's at being a success. You take it or you don't. Good players are good no matter what, bad players find excuses and people to blame, its the same in any workplace all over the world.
Thats a bit too simple of an insinuation. You think Lindelof, Malacia, Eriksen for example are looking for excuses? They don't strike me as this. Just surplus to requirements for different reasons. They show no resentment to the club.
Not sure which one to believe anymore
Not sure which one to believe anymore
Why not both? Absolutely plausible for me that most of the squad is on board but a few players aren't.
You’re judging him based on a CNN article from four years ago? Quoting that article verbatim without credit whilst disregarding the subsequent four years of them battering teams by three, four, five and even eight goals on numerous occasions?
Wow. I’ve see some ridiculous arguments in this place but that takes the biscuit.
Pep does a lot of stuff, a lot of it backfires but your point is weak, in my opinion at least. Of course you 'could' play a DM as a CB and I think that could work as we have seen it occasionally, especially in teams which really dominate the ball as a defensive measure but I challenge you to find a single Wing Back, an actual wing back not a full back, who became a top level CB?
A website that just says the opposite of whatever shite the tabloids write is a cracking "sports journalism" idea.
There isn't many player that I know have been used as CB and Wingback with any sort of success, even short term success. I only have Isla and Alaba(wingback for Austria) in mind and the success part is a bit of an exaggeration.
Tbf I feel like all "sports journalisms" are just horseshit and about clicks/sales whatever you want to call it. So I try to stay away from "mainstream" media at least. These "bloggers/freelancers" can be a little better, at least in my opinion, some of them.
Is like a minefield out there, don't know what you can trust anymore.
Someone said Ten Hag put his own career before United. My point was all coaches do that.
Well no not necessarily. Hypotherically if a manager is managing a struggling club fighting relegation but harbours ambitions of managing a top club.
Do they play 10 men behind the ball and try to scrape results to keep the club up or carry on with a more expansive style in the hope of landing a bigger job? The latter scenario arguably happened with Kompany at Burnley.
Yes but we won't be seeing the wholesale changes that some want again anytime soon.
Kompany had brought Burnley back up into the Prem in fine style in his first season. Surely he'd have been viewed even more highly if he'd changed tack and kept Burnley up towards the end of his second season? It's a strange argument to make that someone essentially relegates his own team by deliberately playing a style that he thinks will endear him to bigger clubs? Dogmatically sticking to your principles and ultimately being relegated is one thing, but believing there is a way that you could play that would keep the side up but choosing to play a different way to make yourself look better (even if it gets the side relegated) is a massive stretch. It melts my mind just thinking about it.
My God. What can't you understand??? I was refering to how he won the league that year for christ sake. You're so fecking rude too. Enough already.
Playing 3 CBs will of course increase the risk of being outnumbered on the rest of the pitch, unless the CBs rapidly can cover larger parts of the pitch. Which our CBs are poor at. I really don't understand why he is so obsessed with 343. It would be easier to support him if he showed some progress.
Revisionist and disingenuous nonsense. I had pointed out how much Amorim had improved Sporting domestically and in Europe when you decided to come up with a garbage CNN quote from his first season in charge.
Why on earth would you try and ignore the majority of his Sporting tenure when assessing the merits of his Sporting tenure!? Make it make sense.
He moved to Bayern. The biggest club looking for a new manager that season. It's hard to argue that he could have gotten a bigger job.
And do you think that Bayern wouldn't have been interested if he'd managed to keep Burnley up via a few backs-to-walls defensive performances?
C
CNN Garbage? Just because you don't agree. You are an aggressive rude poster always replying with some dumb sense of superiority, I would reply to you in a different way but can't be bothered to get a temp ban for the likes if you.
I don't think that would have made a big difference. Bayern looks for managers who can dominate with a (very) good squad. Kompany's work in the Championship showed them how that could look like, his work in the PL didn't add that much useful information in that regard.
Yep, that's my point. I didn't mean he could have got a bigger job than Bayern, just that he'd have probably been more highly thought of if he'd managed to keep Burnley in the Prem rather than overseen their relegation.
Pretty sure even our limp dick offense could put 3 past Boavista and Farense.
Why on earth would you try and ignore the majority of his Sporting tenure when assessing the merits of his Sporting tenure?
Does it really need repeating that we are NOT replacing most of our squad within a year? Ratcliff is axing another 200 jobs to balance the books, there is no money for new players. Out of the starting XI, 8 or 9 of them will still be our players this time next year.
These players know this too. That is why they are annoyed with these tactics that don't work.
This is factually not true.
Playing 3 CBs means your fullbacks become wingbacks, play higher up the pitch, have more freedom to roam and can create situation where YOU can outnumber the other team in several areas of the pitch at once.
He's not obsessed with 3-4-3 because that's not the system he plays. He plays a 3-4-2-1. He's obsessed with that formation because he's an expert on it, it's brought him huge success and it's a very flexible attacking system.
I find it just as unfathomable today as I did yesterday that any United supporter who has paid attention for the last decade is doubting Amorim at this moment in time and not laser focused on the squad of players proving once again that they are MILES and MILES off being good enough.
At last a normal reply without arrogance.
I'm not ignoring anything and am no expert on the Portuguese league or Sporting.
We were having a conversation about how Amorim won the league for the first time in 19 years. I din't know anything about how he achieved that, so I googled it. CNN is usually a credible news site so I quoted it.
That's all.
If you appear to argue in bad faith then don’t expect me to coddle you.
It was a general discussion about how he improved Sporting, which included winning their first league titles for twenty years (note the plural). Finding a quote from his very first year in order to suggest they were a cynical, low scoring team, whilst ignoring all the subsequent years when they won scoring shit loads of goals comes across as dishonest and/or disingenuous, or just downright clueless.
Disclaimer: I am not [yet] supportive of Amorim changing his tactics, mostly because I think this lot of players he has cannot be successful with any tactics. They SUCKED with back four under Ten Hag so I don't believe tactics is the solution for them. We need better players.
That said, I am not for harassing and dismissing people advocating that Amorim needs to keep an open mind, either. It is not a ridiculous opinion and while some of us do not [yet] share it, we have to respect people who do.
I would invite you to watch these two interesting (in my opinion videos) about how Conte and Simeone adapted and changed the tactics they had been known for, and very successful with for many years:
Just because Amorim has done back-three his entire, very short, career doesn't mean he should not be open-minded in the future. Conte and SImeone are even more successful than him and had been loyal to their tactics for longer. Didn't stop them from change. There is a time for anybody when they should be open for change.
That is my 2c
That said, I am not for harassing and dismissing people advocating that Amorim needs to keep an open mind, either. It is not a ridiculous opinion and while some of us do not [yet] share it, we have to respect people who do.
I would invite you to watch these two interesting (in my opinion videos) about how Conte and Simeone adapted and changed the tactics they had been known for, and very successful with for many years:
- Conte changed his back-three tactics at Napoli
- Simeone radically changed his defense-minded tactics to very attacking one
Just because Amorim has done back-three his entire, very short, career doesn't mean he should not be open-minded in the future. Conte and SImeone are even more successful than him and had been loyal to their tactics for longer. Didn't stop them from change. There is a time for anybody when they should be open for change.
That is my 2c
There you go. Ending your post with an insult. Back to your usual self.
If you can logically explain how ignoring four years of a manager’s tenure makes sense when assessing the success of that manager’s tenure, I’ll happily apologize and take a month off posting.
Probably best not to then mate