It always was.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach
- Thread starter sewey89
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss three 1-1 draws.
The first got us knocked out of the FA Cup, the next puts us in a good position in our Round of 16 Europa League game, and the latest was an actual decent performance against Arsenal at Old Trafford.
All hopes for the season now rest on the Europa League - does Amorim have the squad to win it?
It's weird to see so many people blaming the manager for our situation.
This squad is absolutely terrible, and was put together at huge expense by the previous managers and owners.
He isn't in charge of transfers, or finances. We have no money and can't bring anyone in due to the incompetence of, again, previous managers and owners.
He is now even more handicapped because the club gave moved on attacking players (albeit really poor ones) and not replaced them.
Oh, and it's not like he wasn't honest about his style before being brought in. The owners brought him in knowing he was going to play this style and with no plan about how to make that work with our current squad and transfers.
With decent investment (if that was possible) and time, I really think that Amorim would be by far our best bet moving forwards, but I suspect he won't get either.
This squad is absolutely terrible, and was put together at huge expense by the previous managers and owners.
He isn't in charge of transfers, or finances. We have no money and can't bring anyone in due to the incompetence of, again, previous managers and owners.
He is now even more handicapped because the club gave moved on attacking players (albeit really poor ones) and not replaced them.
Oh, and it's not like he wasn't honest about his style before being brought in. The owners brought him in knowing he was going to play this style and with no plan about how to make that work with our current squad and transfers.
With decent investment (if that was possible) and time, I really think that Amorim would be by far our best bet moving forwards, but I suspect he won't get either.
Ok so how long will you give him? I’ve already stated I like him BUT he can’t hide behind not having the players or time to train forever.
I wanted us to keep ETH. People who want us to sack Amorim are out of their minds as far as I’m concerned. Fix the club.
chef's kiss
The fact they didn't interview him in the summer because of his style and our squad, then decide in November he is the one with the same squad that does not suit his style. They need to keep him and build a team for the style otherwise they will look a bunch of blithering idiots.
That's the elephant in the room though, isn't it? His system requires significant investment to make it work, but the club is broke so (through no fault of his own) he's mostly going to have to make do with what he's got.
I saw earlier that we have picked up less points from the 13 games under Amorim that we did from the 11 games played before he arrived which just proves how he has made us worse with his tactic that doesnt work and constantly changing team selections (has he ever selected the same XI in consecutive games) that see some players playing in different roles from game to game.
Oliver Holt slagging him for getting rid of Rashford as a Man Utd “icon”. I’m finally happy the club are doing that. Honestly, everyone’s talked for ages about how rotten the club is. That’s why it’s a great move to get rid of Mr Man United.
He is the embodiment of the boom bust Man United post Ferguson era. One season pretty good, the next dog shit and so on and so on. Yet the whole time lacks the basic technical skills for us to be anything more than a top 4 team.
Who cares if we haven’t replaced him with some panic loan signing? We should take our time to get this rebuild right.
He is the embodiment of the boom bust Man United post Ferguson era. One season pretty good, the next dog shit and so on and so on. Yet the whole time lacks the basic technical skills for us to be anything more than a top 4 team.
Who cares if we haven’t replaced him with some panic loan signing? We should take our time to get this rebuild right.
No, you have to look long term. We’re talking about a rebuild over 3-4 years here. Our squad will look very different by then.
That's my point. 3-4 years is a long time. Until then, he's going to have to largely make do with the squad as it currently exists. What are the short- and medium-term objectives? Has INEOS even considered those, or are they just winging it completely like Woodward / Murtough / Arnold would have?
He'll be long long gone if the doesn't manage to get a tune out of the current squad
Good to see you have come to that conclusion after two transfer windows of full sporting control, one of which was largely considered successful at the time. A Rashford sale at £40mil next summer alone opens up the door for a few high-fee transfers on reasonable wages. Factor in the loss of Lindelof, Eriksen at the end of their contracts and others like Malacia, Casemiro and Sancho being sold off, and we are still in position for another 5 or 6 additions in the summer if it is deemed necessary.
You suspect they are. That we could be completely in the wilderness for a while until it all clicks, they have to realise a couple of summer signings might not do the trick. It will improve things, but not solve everything.
Why would they consider the medium objectives? There should only be one objective at this club and that’s to win the Premier League. The reality is after 12 years of mismanagement that will take a minimum of 3-4 years.
I’d much rather that then be finishing top 4 next year and on the same boom bust cycle we’ve been on by “making do with what we’ve got” I.e. another Rashford purple patch, short term striker signing etc. only for it to fall apart because Rashford isn’t consistent enough for a title winning team and Casemiro and Cavani-esque signings turn to deadwood.
We have to be making signings looking long term, rather than looking for quick fixes to achieve “medium term objectives”. They don’t exist.
A lot of fans, especially if you go to the old Trafford games, are starting to see his severe lack of PL experience as a huge weakness.
I said it and I repeat it, if he stays the whole season and continues with his 1.1 point per game, we’ll finish on 44-45 points, a record low and if he’s in the bottom 5 he’s getting sacked, if he manages to improve to 50 points and finishes 12th-14th he’ll get 3 months and a transfer window in the summer to show a marked improvement but if he’s got them playing the same way after a summer of £200-250m investment, he’s gone in November 2025.
He really needs to win Europa League to have a chance of staying past January 2026 in my humble opinion.
Every competently-run organization has short-, medium-, and long-term objectives. How are you going to accurately measure progress against your long-term objective (in this case, winning the PL) if you don't know how you're doing in the shorter term?
Well yes but I’m sure there will be steady progress. You were complaining about how we’re broke so he’s going to have to make do with what he’s got. I bet there will be several new faces next year who will be bought to fit into his system, and likely an improvement. We still have to accept that it’s not realistic to expect a title challenge.
You would think short term would be points increase, goals increase, less goals conceded. Which with right signings should be easily achievable. Then you look at European qualification while also increasing the numbers I mentioned in the short term objectives. Then you have to look at CL qualification. Then challenging for the title. They will need European football at some point for the money it generates. Unless we win a cup this year, we are not getting European football, so it is how long they can let that drag on.
I do not know how much more evidence Amorim needs, before he decides Maz and Dalot are not viable fullbacks. What's the harm in trying Amad and Garnacho as Full backs for one game, its not like we are pulling up any trees with these wingbacks. I am soo frustrated with his stubborn tactics, he has done every stupid shit there is to do (playing Bruno as CAM, then CM and now almost as a CB), except doing the obvious one and trying Amad and Garnacho as wingbacks, specially as our best performances under him were with Amad as full back (Everton and Southampton win) I would love for us to try at least this formation:
Hojlund/Zhirkee
Garnacho Mainoo
Ugarte Bruno
Dorgu Maz De Ligt Yoro Amad
This formation has 6 attacking players (as compared to 4 normally), we may lose the match, but at least it would be exciting and the crowd will enjoy the match. Currently we keep trying the same formation, fail to create anything, concede a goal and then go on to lose by high margin.
Our home form is awful and the obvious reason is, us being too defensive at home. Manutd have always had very attacking lineups at home. But when you start at home without any striker and a young 20 year old CM as a striker, what indication does it give the other team and above all your own strikers. Whatever message he was sending to the board also fell on deaf ears, as we did not sign anybody, it also showed lack of confidence in our current strikers, which will continue to remain our strikers for the next 4 months.
Hojlund/Zhirkee
Garnacho Mainoo
Ugarte Bruno
Dorgu Maz De Ligt Yoro Amad
This formation has 6 attacking players (as compared to 4 normally), we may lose the match, but at least it would be exciting and the crowd will enjoy the match. Currently we keep trying the same formation, fail to create anything, concede a goal and then go on to lose by high margin.
Our home form is awful and the obvious reason is, us being too defensive at home. Manutd have always had very attacking lineups at home. But when you start at home without any striker and a young 20 year old CM as a striker, what indication does it give the other team and above all your own strikers. Whatever message he was sending to the board also fell on deaf ears, as we did not sign anybody, it also showed lack of confidence in our current strikers, which will continue to remain our strikers for the next 4 months.
Maybe it is to fund Dorgu and to clear some of the wage bill for the summer.
Afterall, Rashford and Antony were giving us nothing. Even so, there has to be someone we could have brought in to bolster the forward line.
West Ham got Evan Ferguson.
yeah it's been truly awful.
I feel like Ineos should start really judging him from now. He's had a free hit, it's been shocking but whatever, there should now be a LWB and we have some serviceable RWBs, we have 2 CFs (one of whom scored a decent amount last season) so pick one and stick to them. No more experiments, just coach the shit out of what we have and then we can compare this horrendous period to what comes after. Hopefully there is clear progress.
Think get the WB's sorted, a striker, a creative midfielder should help. The WB situation we also need backups, because if the ones we use are working it is no good if one or either get injured and the replacement is rubbish. Not sure about the goalkeeper.
At least he has a couple of weeks now where he can work with the players. Agree that he has to chose his first eleven and stick to it barring injuries.
It is not happening. INEOS wont sack Amorim. Omar Berrada brought him in and will back him come the summer.
Yes, the football has been poor, but he is getting rid of some of the dead wood - Rashford and Antony gone (for now).
He is up against it. A poor squad that wasn't made much better by that summer window.
We cant really judge Amorim after this one window as he only got one player in a position of need. Give him at least this summer window where hopefully we bring in a serviceable striker because our current options are just about the worst in the league.
Oh I agree. I see small positives in the way we play and as long as that continues, he gets a pass. If we've not progressed by the summer, or we've reverted to the same tactics ten-hag resorted too, get rid and get someone else in before pre-season.
Think he's doing the short term objective, getting rid of high earners n not good enough players
I stated what should be done. I didn't predict the future and won't.
Ah I see what I’m dealing with now. Nevermind
If we lose to Leicester on Friday then I think INEOS will have a decision to make as that'll be us out of another competition and probably out of contention for one of next season's European spots and looking at our remaining Premier League fixtures im struggling to see where we'll get any points other than maybe Ipswich at home.
As painful as it is, I think the slow patient game to get the right players in - which I assume are from Lisbon (Gyokeres and Quenda) which he agreed to not buy in January - is a better strategy than panic buying in January.
This season is already a write off and we have a good enough team to have a good go in the Europa League.
We improved the wage bill, which is super important for PSR so that's (kinda) positive. We look like we've kept Nacho and Mainoo too which I'm happy about.
Next season:
- Liverpool are losing Salah and maybe VVD
- City's midfield continues to age and they're in a rebuild too
If we get the summer right, we could hopefully be in a much more competitive place next season
This season is already a write off and we have a good enough team to have a good go in the Europa League.
We improved the wage bill, which is super important for PSR so that's (kinda) positive. We look like we've kept Nacho and Mainoo too which I'm happy about.
Next season:
- Liverpool are losing Salah and maybe VVD
- City's midfield continues to age and they're in a rebuild too
If we get the summer right, we could hopefully be in a much more competitive place next season
These are wild takes, I can't understand where they're coming from unless its a place of fear. They've written the season off, the manager won't be blamed for anything that happens past this point as long as he keeps saying and doing the right things, and his teams are competitive*.
How can any board with any self respect get rid of this many players, not sign anyone and then put it on the manager? It's madness lads, if anything this just shows how safe he is until they've had chance to support him.
How many times has the term "season has been written off" been used on here throughout the past decade or so, you'd wonder. No other club of this stature operates like this but we're still doing it. In fact I can't think of any club that just casually writes off seasons as much as we do, and the fans just accepting it as normal.
Anyone blame the manager for the next 3 months should be banned.
The best part is, I remember people saying that giving Ten Hag time, like Arsenal gave Arteta, or United gave Fergie, meant he would ultimately be a success. Now the new manager is having the squad sold from underneath him and no replacements and people are saying he should be sacked. Does anyone know what they really want or are you all too soft to suffer for a bit?
It would clear a lot of rubbish posters to be fair
I think it's pretty clear at this point they wanted Amorim in early because they didn't want to pay off an interim for the rest of the season. There's no reason to do this to an actual manager in his first half season unless they're not judging him on anything that happens until next season.
That doesn't make any sense. An interim would've been cheaper than Amorim
You are assuming that they have functioning brains.