Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach

Who knew completely changing the system mid season and expecting square pegs to fit round holes would lead to this? This season is being viewed as “pre season” and it shows. Whether or not that pays off next year who knows. Confidence of the players looks terrible though.
 
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I fell asleep for the 2nd half, but having seen the first I have to point some blame to the manager here. Why is he rotating players in league matches?

His formation relies on wing backs, so why would you play your best wing back at CB, therefore completely nullifying your attack in the process? Yoro was a 50m defender, you have to trust him.

Why has Hojlund been dropped? He is clearly our best striker and today was a very important game to try to get some momentum.

The team at the moment picks itself. There is no need to tinker and upset our rhythm.
 
Solius said:
Would love to hear which goals people think are on Amorim.

The one where Onana let a central shot go in? The one where him and Martinez let a weak header bounce over the line? The one where Bayindir palmed a central shot straight back out? The one where he let a corner go straight in? The one where Martinez casually flicked it into the center of our box? The one where Maz dived in for zero reason? The multiple corner ones that he’s had zero training ground time to work on?

Our xG against from open play is pretty low. It was excellent against Arsenal and City. People need to learn to separate goals from managers. He’s got us entering the opposition box way more than before, we have way more control in games, they’re not as chaotic basketball game style as before, we regularly create a decent enough amoint of chances to win the game. He can’t do everything for them. We’ve conceded a comical amount of goals that he could do nothing about. Ten hag had the same at times but he is partly responsible for the chaotic nature some of these players have. It needs to be coached out of them and that takes time for some, replacements for others.
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Hear hear. Its clear he has set up a way for the team to create chances and thats what a manager should do if they want to win points. But if the players keep wasting away those chances there is nothing he can do other than to train/develop them (which takes a lot of time and there is a risk some players are never going to be good enough) or buy new ones. He hasn't gotten the time to do both.

Serious question for people who are already calling him just as bad as Ten Hag: what did you expect when the new manager arrived? that he can make us play good, winning football week in week out instantly by playing the same players that have downed tools and clearly not good enough this very season??

Step away from football for a bit and come back next season. Less stressful that way. Its so silly. Peak Sir Alex can come in the middle of this mess and I doubt even he can fix everything in a blink of an eye. There are constraints everywhere that can only be fixed by training and new players. Both of which takes time because the club decided to keep Ten Hag and sacked him right after. The stupidity began at the end of last season and we are now still paying the price.
 
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lolok said:
How else do you prefer Amorin teach the players his system? Training and matches are the way for players to learn.

I don't what you expect here. This squad isn't great thanks to poor purchases for a decade. The squad isn't in great physical shape, thanks to the previous manager. You want him to start playing guys 3 times every 8 days? What will happen? There will be more injuries and overall play will suffer from fatigue. He needs to rotate (for now.) He needs to figure out which players have got it in them, and which players who don't and can be offloaded in the summer.

Amorin is pulling a Klopp. Klopp came in October I think, so he too didn't get the benefit of a preseason. Klopp finished on 60 points, when they finished on 62 the year prior. Klopp spent the season coaching the players in his system and it paid off the following year when they finished 4th. It took until his 4th year!! to have the team humming, but fortunately City was still a bit better than them that year.

Klopp is world class manager, and it took him until his 4th year to turn them into title contenders. Took SAF 7 years to win a title. IDK what fans want. Some want to be delusional thinking that it should be an instant quick fix. It's not. Right now, it's all about the players learning the system, playing better and the manager figuring out who will stay and who will go in the offseason.

If you can't stomach the pain that the rest of the season will bring-- do something else with your life. There are going to be some good wins, and some bad losses. Its not going to be easy. Pep took over a team that won the title twice and were runners up twice in the 5 years before he arrived. He inherited a really good squad that included Aguero, DeBruyne, Silva, Kompany, Toure, Sterling, FErnandinho and more. Much more quality than what Amorin, Klopp or SAF had to work with when they took over.

The objective for the rest of the season is to try and win. But for players to learn the system, the manager to learn the players, and then have a successful offseason of buying and selling players to give Amorin a shot at 4th place next season.

I like the rotation right now if I'm a player. The manager is giving every player a chance, they either take that chance and perform well or they don't. Players can't be upset if they given the opportunity and failed. (Well grown up, mature players won't be upset.) Previous managers stuck by players for too long, and didn't give others a chance.

The club is paying the price for bad purchases-- it's going to take 2 more summer transfers of good signings while offloading poor signings at the same time. The club can't just spend 400mm to try and fix the team in 1 offseason. It's going to take time.
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100%

Which is why I'm not worried about results atm. I'm hopeful the players can learn, adapt and apply themselves to the new system.

Berrada wants us to be title contenders in 3 years. I believe we can get there.
 
lolok said:
How else do you prefer Amorin teach the players his system? Training and matches are the way for players to learn.

I don't what you expect here. This squad isn't great thanks to poor purchases for a decade. The squad isn't in great physical shape, thanks to the previous manager. You want him to start playing guys 3 times every 8 days? What will happen? There will be more injuries and overall play will suffer from fatigue. He needs to rotate (for now.) He needs to figure out which players have got it in them, and which players who don't and can be offloaded in the summer.

Amorin is pulling a Klopp. Klopp came in October I think, so he too didn't get the benefit of a preseason. Klopp finished on 60 points, when they finished on 62 the year prior. Klopp spent the season coaching the players in his system and it paid off the following year when they finished 4th. It took until his 4th year!! to have the team humming, but fortunately City was still a bit better than them that year.

Klopp is world class manager, and it took him until his 4th year to turn them into title contenders. Took SAF 7 years to win a title. IDK what fans want. Some want to be delusional thinking that it should be an instant quick fix. It's not. Right now, it's all about the players learning the system, playing better and the manager figuring out who will stay and who will go in the offseason.

If you can't stomach the pain that the rest of the season will bring-- do something else with your life. There are going to be some good wins, and some bad losses. Its not going to be easy. Pep took over a team that won the title twice and were runners up twice in the 5 years before he arrived. He inherited a really good squad that included Aguero, DeBruyne, Silva, Kompany, Toure, Sterling, FErnandinho and more. Much more quality than what Amorin, Klopp or SAF had to work with when they took over.

The objective for the rest of the season is to try and win. But for players to learn the system, the manager to learn the players, and then have a successful offseason of buying and selling players to give Amorin a shot at 4th place next season.

I like the rotation right now if I'm a player. The manager is giving every player a chance, they either take that chance and perform well or they don't. Players can't be upset if they given the opportunity and failed. (Well grown up, mature players won't be upset.) Previous managers stuck by players for too long, and didn't give others a chance.

The club is paying the price for bad purchases-- it's going to take 2 more summer transfers of good signings while offloading poor signings at the same time. The club can't just spend 400mm to try and fix the team in 1 offseason. It's going to take time.
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Too much sense. 0 out of 10.
 
Semigoodlookin said:
He is not going to be blameless, but I think now it has become clear the players are the problem. Amorim probably wishes he has stayed with Sporting, won the league again, and could have landed a top job down the road, maybe even Man City. Or, that the hierarchy at United listened to him and he had come to the club at the end of the season.

Manager after manager and it is the same story. I remember when Klopp first went to Liverpool and we mocked his galvanizing of the squad with strange stunts. The classic new manager bounce happens when you have desire and effort. That Liverpool team was low on quality but high on effort. It took time and a hard path, but you could see that the players were willing to play for Klopp from the start. United's current team simply do not have the effort/desire and are dubious on the quality too.

They are just not willing to put in the extra running. Most fans would take the team simply looking arsed to be there. There are players there who downed tools on Ole, Tan Hag, and now with Amorim. Those players, whether it is one of ten of them are obviously impacting the dressing room and development of other players. It cannot be that every player and manager becomes shit unless there is something culturally wrong. It also cannot be that managers with a clear identity cannot impart that onto the squad when every other team in the league, even the shit ones, have a defined way of playing. The only explanation is the players are just not willing to listen to instructions. The only thing I can't figure out is why.
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Let’s remind ourselves that ETH replaced 75% of the squad during his tenure.
The only players you can possibly be talking about downing tools from Ole throughout ETH and Amorim are Rashford, Dalot and Maguire. Dalot is not great but he’s professional. Maguire has gone through bad spells, been insulted by fans but is completely professional and seems to have a great attitude.
Rashford you could question but it looks like Amorim has sidelined him and his circus.

Amorim came in, he clearly told us that the squad isn’t strong enough or fit enough for his tactics and until he gets the squad the way he needs it, we should expect inconsistency. He recognizes that some just don’t suit tactics and/or playing for a club like Manchester United.

Translated, it means we (in my opinion) have got the right coach, we need to back him, support him and be patient.
 
Rashford is an issue but he's not the main issue. In fact, Rashford is still one of the best wingers in the club.

By leaving him out of the squad, you will potentially field an even worse player in his position. Like Malacia or Antony. Unthinkable to drop Rashford without proper replacement. This is on Amorim.
 
RopersReturn said:
AnuRu-“I wouldn't put it past some of these loafers deliberately throwing goals because Rashy isn't getting picked, that's how low I think of them.”

You could have a point.
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I really don’t agree with that statement. By all accounts many of the squad have been questioning Rashford
 
Captmfla said:
Rashford is an issue but he's not the main issue. In fact, Rashford is still one of the best wingers in the club.

By leaving him out of the squad, you will potentially field an even worse player in his position. Like Malacia or Antony. Unthinkable to drop Rashford without proper replacement. This is on Amorim.
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It’s not unthinkable when Rashford is barely producing 3 out of 10 rated performances. If he’s crap he should be dropped, not just kept in indefinitely
 
golden_blunder said:
Let’s remind ourselves that ETH replaced 75% of the squad during his tenure.
The only players you can possibly be talking about downing tools from Ole throughout ETH and Amorim are Rashford, Dalot and Maguire. Dalot is not great but he’s professional. Maguire has gone through bad spells, been insulted by fans but is completely professional and seems to have a great attitude.
Rashford you could question but it looks like Amorim has sidelined him and his circus.

Amorim came in, he clearly told us that the squad isn’t strong enough or fit enough for his tactics and until he gets the squad the way he needs it, we should expect inconsistency. He recognizes that some just don’t suit tactics and/or playing for a club like Manchester United.

Translated, it means we (in my opinion) have got the right coach, we need to back him, support him and be patient.
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Backing this up, Mitten has said repeatedly that he was told before the season by someone whose job it is to know that United’s team wasn’t a top 4 team. I’m actually encouraged by what Ruben is up to. This is a long term fix at this point.
 
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Just continue with his vision. No more falling back to stupid shit trying to accommodate people we know aren't good enough
 
I am quite pleased with how this new style of play is going. We are now losing because of poor finishing (and bad defending), and not because we are being outplayed. Yes we lost 3-0 again to the same opponents, but this is different. This is, like it or not, progress. I hope that Amorim tries to use some of our academy players like Amass. He can't be worse than Malacia, who seems to not have recovered from his injury.
 
Abandoning the system and reverting to something the squad is more comfortable with is just history repeating itself. All of our managers since Mourinho (Ole included) started off trying to implement their system but ended up abandoning it in a desperate attempt to stop us free falling. The only manager we've had post SAF who stuck to their guns was LVG, and he was hounded out and replaced with a hail mary appointment in Mourinho, who immediately undid anything positive LVG achieved like coaching the team to control possession.

In an alternate universe, Mourinho takes over from SAF instead of Moyes. Has the instant repect of the title winning squad and probably wins a league title after spending that "warchest" Moyes was terrified of opening. The weight of SAF is off the shoulders of any future manager as they're going to be following Mourinho, not SAF. LVG takes over from Mourinho after he has his scheduled meltdown. LVG implements a possession based style of play. Probably wins nothing. Next generation of manager (Ten Hag, Amorim or whoever) comes in and builds on that style and doesn't need years to do it as the foundations have already been laid for them.

Instead we are where we are. Amorim doesn't have the privilege of building upon a foundation because that foundation doesn't exist. It's hard to stomach, but I honestly think we'd be better off dropping out of Europe and spending that time on the training ground. You can't implement a drastic system change when you have to play a match every few days. Either you abandon the match preparation to focus on the system, or you abandoning the system to focus on winning the match.
 
Bert_ said:
Abandoning the system and reverting to something the squad is more comfortable with is just history repeating itself. All of our managers since Mourinho (Ole included) started off trying to implement their system but ended up abandoning it in a desperate attempt to stop us free falling. The only manager we've had post SAF who stuck to their guns was LVG, and he was hounded out and replaced with a hail mary appointment in Mourinho, who immediately undid anything positive LVG achieved like coaching the team to control possession.

In an alternate universe, Mourinho takes over from SAF instead of Moyes. Has the instant repect of the title winning squad and probably wins a league title after spending that "warchest" Moyes was terrified of opening. The weight of SAF is off the shoulders of any future manager as they're going to be following Mourinho, not SAF. LVG takes over from Mourinho after he has his scheduled meltdown. LVG implements a possession based style of play. Probably wins nothing. Next generation of manager (Ten Hag, Amorim or whoever) comes in and builds on that style and doesn't need years to do it as the foundations have already been laid for them.

Instead we are where we are. Amorim doesn't have the privilege of building upon a foundation because that foundation doesn't exist. It's hard to stomach, but I honestly think we'd be better off dropping out of Europe and spending that time on the training ground. You can't implement a drastic system change when you have to play a match every few days. Either you abandon the match preparation to focus on the system, or you abandoning the system to focus on winning the match.
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Thank you. There is 0 need. I repeat ZERO need to revert and abandon his principles.

I thought this fanbase would have learned from the mistakes of previous managers.
 
In 2 months I’ve seen more progress under Amorim than I did under 7 months of Moyes, 2 seasons of LVG, 2 of Jose, 3 of Ole, and 2 of ETH.

I’m genuinely looking forward to that this guy will do with a preseason (hopefully) £150m plus whatever we get from sales.
 
We should fully trust and back the manager for the first time. Let him clear the squad and buy players.
 
sixdwarf said:
Me and my son have just done an eight hour round-trip and £200 plus spent to see his and my first ever defeat live. To effing Bournemouth. What gets me is Amorim is clearly using actual Prem games as training sessions so that the players get used to his system. Hence the constant rotation. He hasn't said those exact words but that is what it is. Who cares about the fans and three points. Why should fans pay elevated ticket prices to watch this utter guff? There's zero passion and zest in the play. And the rotation means zero understanding between the players. It is totally mental and if this is what 'philosophy' serves us we are back in the days of Van Gaal again.

Amorim has got to change this. I get he hasn't got time on the training pitch because the actual games come thick and fast but this is a results business. Nine goals conceded in two games is not good enough and if we keep this going we are relegated.

The fans are being cheated by this constant rotation.
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I get you’re upset about witnessing a loss live, but that’s sport.

Amorim is trying to determine his squad on the fly, we all know that. Today was hardly a rotated squad. Only really Zirkzee and Malacia. And Zirkzee is a big money signing who should be getting chances like today.

If you’re happy with regular 5th place finishes, and shit football, then fine, but if you want to one day watch your team lift a title again, you’ll have to commit to the growing pains.
 
idek2346 said:
Thank you. There is 0 need. I repeat ZERO need to revert and abandon his principles.

I thought this fanbase would have learned from the mistakes of previous managers.
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The problem is whether INEOS has the patience.

It's was reported that they have started to change the objectives of the academy -- from player development as the primary objective to results matter now. And now the inevitable tension between the academy's staff and the INEOS brain trust.

If they don't have patience for academy players... You could potentially see what will happen next.. the ol' corporate quarterly results mindset?
 
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Subbing out Ugarte seemed to have backfired immensely. Anyways we are back in the "give the manager time" stage of yet another manager. One can always hope.
 
lolok said:
How else do you prefer Amorin teach the players his system? Training and matches are the way for players to learn.

I don't what you expect here. This squad isn't great thanks to poor purchases for a decade. The squad isn't in great physical shape, thanks to the previous manager. You want him to start playing guys 3 times every 8 days? What will happen? There will be more injuries and overall play will suffer from fatigue. He needs to rotate (for now.) He needs to figure out which players have got it in them, and which players who don't and can be offloaded in the summer.

Amorin is pulling a Klopp. Klopp came in October I think, so he too didn't get the benefit of a preseason. Klopp finished on 60 points, when they finished on 62 the year prior. Klopp spent the season coaching the players in his system and it paid off the following year when they finished 4th. It took until his 4th year!! to have the team humming, but fortunately City was still a bit better than them that year.

Klopp is world class manager, and it took him until his 4th year to turn them into title contenders. Took SAF 7 years to win a title. IDK what fans want. Some want to be delusional thinking that it should be an instant quick fix. It's not. Right now, it's all about the players learning the system, playing better and the manager figuring out who will stay and who will go in the offseason.

If you can't stomach the pain that the rest of the season will bring-- do something else with your life. There are going to be some good wins, and some bad losses. Its not going to be easy. Pep took over a team that won the title twice and were runners up twice in the 5 years before he arrived. He inherited a really good squad that included Aguero, DeBruyne, Silva, Kompany, Toure, Sterling, FErnandinho and more. Much more quality than what Amorin, Klopp or SAF had to work with when they took over.

The objective for the rest of the season is to try and win. But for players to learn the system, the manager to learn the players, and then have a successful offseason of buying and selling players to give Amorin a shot at 4th place next season.

I like the rotation right now if I'm a player. The manager is giving every player a chance, they either take that chance and perform well or they don't. Players can't be upset if they given the opportunity and failed. (Well grown up, mature players won't be upset.) Previous managers stuck by players for too long, and didn't give others a chance.

The club is paying the price for bad purchases-- it's going to take 2 more summer transfers of good signings while offloading poor signings at the same time. The club can't just spend 400mm to try and fix the team in 1 offseason. It's going to take time.
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I agree 100%.
 
golden_blunder said:
It’s not unthinkable when Rashford is barely producing 3 out of 10 rated performances. If he’s crap he should be dropped, not just kept in indefinitely
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No.

Rashford is still better than most other wingers.
 
croadyman said:
I worry he won't get the time and money to implement what he wants at this club
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He can if he shows progress. Part of that is fans recognising what progress is and being realistic about where we are.
The roller coaster, post match, heaven and hell thing wears people out and we'll want to move on to something fresh in a couple of years time.
 
Solius said:
Would love to hear which goals people think are on Amorim.

The one where Onana let a central shot go in? The one where him and Martinez let a weak header bounce over the line? The one where Bayindir palmed a central shot straight back out? The one where he let a corner go straight in? The one where Martinez casually flicked it into the center of our box? The one where Maz dived in for zero reason? The multiple corner ones that he’s had zero training ground time to work on?

Our xG against from open play is pretty low. It was excellent against Arsenal and City. People need to learn to separate goals from managers. He’s got us entering the opposition box way more than before, we have way more control in games, they’re not as chaotic basketball game style as before, we regularly create a decent enough amoint of chances to win the game. He can’t do everything for them. We’ve conceded a comical amount of goals that he could do nothing about. Ten hag had the same at times but he is partly responsible for the chaotic nature some of these players have. It needs to be coached out of them and that takes time for some, replacements for others.
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Excellent take.
Offensively, looking at our underlying metrics via understat: understat, we have dreadfully underperformed our xG throughout the season.
The xGa has reduced a heap under Amorim.
For the cumulative xGA, a whopping 6.26 out of around 28 xGA has come from corners, which tells a big tale.
As for xPoints, as much as I am a bit sceptical of this metric, it has us in tth place. That does tell a bit of a tale as well.

My overall sentiment is that this is a somewhat similar trajectory to Chelsea's underlying stats in 22/23. They had a shocking season but their underlying metrics were quite good. And from memory, this continued into 23/24 where later on, it started to click for them.

This is a player issue and absolutely not the manager's fault at all. I would say he's doing an excellent job outside of the set pieces.
 
I don't think there's anything to be gained by Amorim abandoning his principles to turn us into late 80s Wimbledon and hopefully finish in the top six, which really is missing the point of bringing him in.

However, I do think Ratcliffe is taking the utter piss by raising ticket prices midseason when the team is struggling.
 
mav_9me said:
Well I for one disagree. We didn't deserve to lose it convincingly. It was never a 0-3 game. We couldn't finish any of the chances and gifted them the 2nd and 3rd goals. We had too many chances and they had too few to say we deserved to lose 0-3 convincingly
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I saw the game very differently. We couldn't get to terms with their pressing in the first 30 minutes and were very sloppy with our passing and general control of the ball. I don't remember a sequence of more than 3 or 4 passes that we strung together. We couldn't get near their goal and hardly trobled their defense. Then it got better in the last 15 minutes of the half where we created a few chances and should have leveled.

Then the second half started like the first and we gave them two stupid goals with our mistakes. After going 3-0 up they sat back and we were able to create some chances & half-chances.

I actually thought that Bournemouth controlled the game pretty well and were very convincing in whatever they were doing. They pressed so well, passed around well and generally were able to stop us from playing our game. As Ruben rightly mentioned, we looked nervous and rattled in the game. We weren't able to execute our plays and gave the ball away too sloppily. I thought it was a pretty convincing performance from them and they were the only team that looked like winning the game.

Anyway, onward and upward. It was a very disappointing display from us. Hopefully, we'll learn from it and put in much better performances in the next two games before the end of the year. Winning at this stage in Ruben's process is not paramount, but convincing performances and winning breeds confidence in everyone. Losing is not good for the moral and brings unnecessary pressure.

Personally, I cannot see Ruben not succeeding here. His post match presser was reassuring. He doesn't make any excuses, analyses the game really well and you just feel that he is eventually going to get it right. He seems like the leader that we have missed since Sir Alex retired. Hope these players don't let him down and are able to lift themselves.
 
Chipper said:
That was today, our best showing in that sense. Was more talking about overall as xG was brought up. They are the numbers, not that it's always everyone's cup of tea.

I did edit on that we're talking small sample sizes too, probably when you were replying. Still very much in the realms of one game being able to swing the numbers significantly, either in the positive or negative.

Ipswich we had a lot of the ball at the back, struggled to advance the ball beyond that, gave it up in our own half a lot and didn't create much at all.

In the 4-0 v Everton the numbers were very low. So much so that I remember people disputing them on here afterwards and lots couldn't believe them. Was sceptical myself but they are what they are.

We did absolutely nothing against Arsenal. The type of game I'm talking about when saying 1 game can impact the numbers. 0.22 xG. Set piece vulnerability.

Forest ok by and large in terms of the numbers. Was never a 2-3 game based off them or what we witnessed really. Onana having a 'mare, yet another example of a set piece goal where we're really struggling. They're never high xG chances, only when teams get them against us for some reason.

City was good overall xG for an away team. As a mtach we were gifted a pen and didn't really look like doing too much in terms of how threatening we were up until that point I suppose if you're scrutinising our attack. The Bruno chance which was a good one but that was it. Set piece goal conceded.

Today yet another one of those set pieces to hurt us to put us behind, one of the first meaningful things to happen. Started creating chances and could or should have been 1-1 then the penalty happens. 2 becomes 3 very quickly and from then on we continued to create. Maybe an element of Bournemouth coasting a little at that point, but definitely not a 0-3 kind of game if you pick out chances in isolation etc.
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Watch the chances created here.

https://www.reddit.com/r/reddevils/s/wMGPmyGgs5

We still created so many chances with actual good play and not just pouring forwards or spamming balls into the box. I think we outplayed them rather than them coasting. They kept playing the same way with pressing etc and we played well around their press to create the chances.
 
There is one thing worrying me about Amorim is that he only sticks with one formation, which is this 3421 formation. I haven’t seen him changing to 3412 or 352 if we need goals (which is a formation that add more goal scorers than 3421). Lot of managers out there tend to change their formation structure just to add more forwards if they need goals, but not with Amorim. I think the lacks of flexibility in his system could be benefit for opposition managers especially in high level of football because they know that he will stick with 3421 formation no matter what.

On the positive side, he has clear idea what he wants. By having clear ideas, I hope this allows our recruitment to understand what kind of players we need to fit his system and hopefully it means we are signing the right players not average players that don’t fit the system, don’t fit the league, and need long time to adapt.
 
I'm all for giving manager time. But as he said it himself "he needs results to buy time". He definitely needs to show more than this. This is not good enough with or without new signings
 
lolok said:
(...)

If you can't stomach the pain that the rest of the season will bring-- do something else with your life. There are going to be some good wins, and some bad losses. Its not going to be easy. Pep took over a team that won the title twice and were runners up twice in the 5 years before he arrived. He inherited a really good squad that included Aguero, DeBruyne, Silva, Kompany, Toure, Sterling, FErnandinho and more. Much more quality than what Amorin, Klopp or SAF had to work with when they took over.

(...)
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Amorim has said this from day one.

He's seen the lads close up, and clearly know what a monumentous job he's taken. He know he has to field players that aren't up to it due to the schedule.
If he can handle that pressure (internally and externally), show tactical ability and start to build team spirit, I'll be willing to keep faith despite the results keep being like they are now. But my god, what an insane challenge that is. He basically has to build a culture from scratch.

Strap in - it's going to get rough. Good post btw.
 
Let him stick to his strategy as there is general improvement in our play. He will need to develop some form of plan b at some point and I hope this will be done once he successfully implements plan a.
 
I see comparisions here between Amorim and Klopp. There might be some similarities but the differences are markedly different.

The Liverpool team when Klopp took over mid season after Rodgers got sacked didn't have a wholly different tactic compared to what the tactical shift is between ETH and Amorim's styles of play. Plus they had players, while limited in talent, were willing to put in the hard work. We've got a bunch of entitled, overpaid divas who think it's beneath them to do the basic jobs.

I'm not saying that Amorim's got a tougher job than what Klopp had to do with Liverpool. But he's got to do something close to what Klopp did for our management to (hopefully) be backing him up. Klopp in that first half season itself got Liverpool to almost winning the Europa. They were denied a stone cold penalty in the first half for a handball from the opposing team player and then the combustion by Alberto Moreno. Amorim's got to focus on the Europa this time. All the other routes to Europe next season are most definitely closed.
 
Captmfla said:
Rashford is an issue but he's not the main issue. In fact, Rashford is still one of the best wingers in the club.

By leaving him out of the squad, you will potentially field an even worse player in his position. Like Malacia or Antony. Unthinkable to drop Rashford without proper replacement. This is on Amorim.
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Arrrreee you Henry Winter in disguise
 
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It's impossible I know, it's unfair and I know that too.

But, I really want Amorim to make this group better somehow and get them to be more consistent, even though the squad is lacking, I still want Amorim to work his magic and do something, I know there will be bad losses incoming but when the season ends and all is done, I want to then know for a fact that Amorim can be successful with better players, for that to be the case he has to get something out of this current crop somehow.
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Are some fans already starting to doubt him? Seriously? The guy has only been here for a short time, without the benefit of a full preseason, and we're already seeing a more structured style of play. We're no longer as exposed as we were during Erik's tenure, and our ball possession has noticeably improved. How hard is it for some fans to grasp that there are no miracles that can undo the damage of the past decade overnight?
 
RDCR07 said:
I think you’re confusing mistakes with formation/system. We are conceding cause of individual errors. Nothing Amorim or even Ferguson could do anything about that. Players aren’t good enough technically or mentally.
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I understand this, however the players were not making as many individual mistakes under EtH, I like the set up we have, we definitely have more control over games but concentration and lapses of judgement seems to be happening way more frequently now than at any point under EtH.

Is this just coincidence or maybe are the players concentrating too much on learning the new system or finding it hard to keep shape leading to these mistakes?
 
Champ said:
I understand this, however the players were not making as many individual mistakes under EtH, I like the set up we have, we definitely have more control over games but concentration and lapses of judgement seems to be happening way more frequently now than at any point under EtH.

Is this just coincidence or maybe are the players concentrating too much on learning the new system or finding it hard to keep shape leading to these mistakes?
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I wouldn't even say that they were not making these mistakes, it's just that our opposition were far worse at capitalizing on them which I think is pure coincidence. There were many games last season which we should have lost convincingly based on xG, and where we conceded a significant number of big chances that were wasted. We overperformed our metrics greatly last year, whereas it's been the opposite since Amorim joined so far.

It will eventually regress back to the mean and we will start conceding fewer goals.
 
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