He lost family and he is gonna be getting back in that Man United starting XI banging in goals again. Just watch. He has the goods to play for a top club.
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He lost family and he is gonna be getting back in that Man United starting XI banging in goals again. Just watch. He has the goods to play for a top club.
This for me is currently the biggest issue because if we are going by that no one did, Jose did a number on everyone and as has been repeated time and time again Lukaku was utilised wrongly by Jose in a defensive system with no support. No one was going to shine in that system.
Now we have CB’s on the halfway line, Fullbacks getting to the byline, Rashford and Martial not having to act as Fullbacks then sprint 80 yards to try and help Lukaku who’s just had a ball lumped to him, it’s a new dawn, a new day, a new life for everyone at the club and Lukaku’s past history shows that he can cut it and is one of the best goal scorers in the premier league. People can deny that all they want but it’s true.
It's not his goal scoring which people are worried about though. Regardless of tactics, the aspects of his game which should transcend tactics, the basics of the game, he struggles with. No top team will be successful with a striker who offers very little in regards to build up due to a horrendous first touch and control. Even more so given almost every top team presses now. It's even more worrying as I believe his size is a big factor, yet he seems to be unwilling to shred some of his size.
Reading this, was just watching the highlights of the game against Reading. Fred makes a good tackle, goes on and passes a great through pass for Lukaku. He then goes on a run, forgets the ball and is dispossessed by the sole defender in 1 on 1 situation. 30 secs later we nearly concede.
Such frustrating player.
Sorry mate but if he was going to be world class he'd be well on the way by now at 25/26. Sadly he hasn't quite got the basics of bringing the ball under control which is something of a concern if you plan to be called world class. Surely you can see that? Whilst I hope your statement bears fruit i'm more of the belief we'll look back and think what a waste of money
He'd be well advised to get a pair of shorts that actually fits! Might run some more if they weren't tickling his toes
Pogba has had plenty of space to operate in behind Rashford, Lingard and Martial lately, not sure why you suddenly believe Lukaku is vital for that to happen.
People ignore the obvious issues with Lukaku (at the moment) and have convinced themselves that his lack of form under Mourinho was simply because it was Mourinho's tactics, and that everything will be perfect under Ole. Yet Lukaku still struggles to control the ball, as we could quite easily see when he fluffed what should've been a one on one with Readings goalkeeper, when he instead miscontrolled the ball and lost all momentum.
Was that when he scored by rounding the keeper with that shocking touch or the time he was shoulder to shoulder with someone and left the ball behind?
I didn’t say he was vital just saying it’s a role he can play that would allow us to play Rashford as a wide forward opening up space across that front 3 as we often see with Mata and Lingard killing that threat from the right.
Its amazing the amount of people that continue to defend Lukaku. Its smack evident the difference in football played when he is not on the pitch. I have no problem with Lukaku being at the club, just like i dont with Fellaini, but i do have a problem with him being lead striker. Hes proving his worth as a squad player, but that a pretty expensive squad player...
People still wanting him to be in the main 3 with Rashford and Martial, i give up with, just pure fanboys. We should be looking for a player with similar basic footballing ability to them.
And yes, Lukaku has a pretty good scoring record, but so did Darren Bent..
People still wanting him to be in the main 3 with Rashford and Martial, i give up with, just pure fanboys. We should be looking for a player with similar basic footballing ability to them.
And yes, Lukaku has a pretty good scoring record, but so did Darren Bent..
I know nothing more aside from I share the shame opinion of those better qualified than me. I'm not arrogant to suggest that I'm better placed to make broad statements about players 'never' being anything. The club make mistakes but we only know that for certain after the fact than before it. Fans have the benefit of amnesia to only remember when they call things right but never when they call it wrong.
This. Its glaringly obvious he is not good enough for a club with asperations to win big trophies. His all round game is shocking.
I've been saying it since last season that he just isn't that good but of course he'll go on runs here and there getting you goals. I actually want us to keep him but doubt he'd be happy as a rotation option.
That said, there might be a system where we can play primarily to his strengths. I personally don't know but I'll let Ole figure it out!
That said, there might be a system where we can play primarily to his strengths. I personally don't know but I'll let Ole figure it out!
Every striker scores everywhere. Lukaku is really quite good at it (goalscoring) but fairly poor in other areas (touch, hold up play etc). Being able to judge a player in his entirety should be a decent concept to grasp really.
Yeah, fanboi, that's something I'd associate with 12 year olds alright. I bet even his own mum can't keep a straight face while calling him Kane's equal.
That's a lot of words to say that youve ignored the actual football and cherry picked statistics to suit the footballer you prefer.
Lukaku isn't as good as Kane because he's clearly not been as good. When he is (and I'm skeptical he ever will be) maybe we can have this argument again. But my guess is that if we started a poll on any forum but the ilovelukaku.org one, Kane would win hands down. There's a petty simple reason for that. But you're going to ignore it anyway.
That's pretty much where I stand. He's a valuable goalscorer but his general play let's him down. He's the kind of striker you'll laud for the 10 games he keeps scoring but bemoan the other 5 he stinks up the build up play. Rotational CF is the perfect place for him given we don't have a great CF at the club. I wouldn't sell him and people are definitely harsh on him at this place. But then again, our management needs to ensure there's another option or starter ahead of him giving us the things he doesn't.
Naturally I'd be delighted if he scored 35 goals next season. He is a good finisher so you never know.
So he would be a downgrade then. Glad we've established that at least. It's where we started from and where we've ended up at.
Lukaku goalscoring prowess is massively overstated on this forum.
Let’s look at the league, which is the bread and butter:
West Brom 12/13: 17 goals
Everton 13/14: 15 goals
Everton 14/15: 10 goals
Everton 15/16: 18 goals
Everton 16/17: 25 goals
Man Utd 17/18: 16 goals
So over 6 seasons, his average works out to be about 17 goals, and they are pretty consistent. It’s a respectable number, no doubt, but 1 in 2 players are only top echelon in the 90s. That kind of number certainly isn’t enough in today’s game to justify the deficiencies in his game. If you want to shoot a lot, ruins a lot of attack, and does feck all defensively, you need to bang in 40+ goals a season.
Let’s look at the league, which is the bread and butter:
West Brom 12/13: 17 goals
Everton 13/14: 15 goals
Everton 14/15: 10 goals
Everton 15/16: 18 goals
Everton 16/17: 25 goals
Man Utd 17/18: 16 goals
So over 6 seasons, his average works out to be about 17 goals, and they are pretty consistent. It’s a respectable number, no doubt, but 1 in 2 players are only top echelon in the 90s. That kind of number certainly isn’t enough in today’s game to justify the deficiencies in his game. If you want to shoot a lot, ruins a lot of attack, and does feck all defensively, you need to bang in 40+ goals a season.
You don't make any sense. You must have missed our last 4 league games.
First I already told you, the way how we play under Ole right now based on the last 4 league games is that we rely on fluidity and quick link up play. It's not just Martial-Pogba-Shaw were the ones involved with this, every players involved with fluidity and quick link up passes.
Lukaku is a pure no 9. Our front three right now are given freedom to roam and not being static. Even if you ask him to stretch defenders, he won't be able to do it because that's Lukaku's weakness, his off ball movement is poor. Even Rio Ferdinand says he's too static and defenders can mark him easily.
Why do I need to watch highlights from last season if I already watched all our full matches and that's good enough to tell me how poor Lukaku's movement, ball control & first touch.
I don't want to watch his highlights just remind my self that Lukaku has only score 2 league goals against top 10 team (West Ham & Chelsea) last season! The same goes in the World Cup last year, only scored against Panama & Tunisia.
Lukaku is a pure no 9, to maximize his potential, we need to deliver the ball into the box but we don't the right players for that. We don't have Beckham, Giggs, Baines, players who can constantly deliver those type of service in the box. We are playing more fluid with more freedom.
Not sure why do we need to play differently? Not sure why do we need to change our XI? Why do you want to kill the rhythm of good football? We are doing fine without Lukaku in our XI and he's been making impact as a super sub and our plan B and we should keep it that way. Scoring an offside goal, a rebound goal & scoring in a cup game against Reading.
Those are numbers while playing for Everton and West Brom where few would expect a 20+ a season striker to actually get that many.
He actually had less shots at goal for United than in ANY of his previous seasons. West Brom and Everton got him more chances at goal than Manchester fecking United.
Any players will look good if we play his strength.
He's a pure no 9. To maximize his potential, we need to deliver the ball into the box but we don't have the right players for that. We don't have Beckham, Giggs, Baines, players who can constantly deliver those type of service in the box. We are playing more fluid with more freedom. Why do we need to sacrifice Rashford, Martial & etc and spend more money to buy the right players just to play Lukaku's strength?
Super sub & plan B is the best for him right now. Not sure why some people want us to change our style and our XI when we are doing fine without him in XI.
20+ shots reduction with a 15% conversion rate works out to 3 whopping goals. And shock horror you’ll find less space to work with against minnows at Utd rather than Everton.
He’s a good striker but not a great striker. There’s no shame in admitting that. There have been plenty of EPL players before him who had a good career at mid/bottom table clubs who were never quite good enough for a top club, like Bent, Defoe, or the Villa version of Benteke.
Pretty much. I can see. Ole improving all our strikers including him already.
Left the ball behind
Look, i see where this is going, debating this issue with someone who is trying to portrait Lukaku as a better player than Harry Kane is a bit pointless.
Lukaku can be a vital part of our attack if he improves his overall play, but that's not going to instantly improve due to us playing more attacking football. He has a touch of Mkhi about him so far this season.
Kane somehow managed 184 shots last year. It's almost like better teams should create more chances for the strikers to score goals, not less. Given the same amount of shots, he scores the same amonut of goals as Kane. How much of Lukaku only getting 86 shots last year (the least he's had as a starter in like 6 years) is Lukaku and how much is the team? I'm not talking about playing to his strengths here either, just playing to try and actually score goals which we've only just started doing.
I've never claimed he was a great striker, I'm just adding some perspective to the thread which is mostly full of people saying he's utter shite. That's all. I've also said several tiems that there are clearly still issues to either resolve to to accept and deal with by changing his position in the team.
No striker will score lots of goals if he doesn't take lots of shots. Lukaku scores on average the same amount of shots as Kane does by percentage.
Is Lukaku not shooting as much because the ball has bounced off him, or because the team have been playing anti football? Could it possibly be a bit of both, and we haven't really yet seen what Lukaku can really do in a team that attacks?
In parts of last season people were calling for him to be the next Captain(!) by the world cup people were salivating at the thought of him getting such good service at United this season.
I'm not writing the guy off until he's had a fair crack the same as everyone else.
If anything I think the more attacking, quicker style would make Lukaku's deficiencies even more apparent.
This is my whole point though and you’ve just said you don’t want to go watch what he’s actually like when used properly and you’ve used points that Rio stated under Jose and used he has only scored against Chelsea in recent times under Jose. What don’t people get that Jose used him incorrectly and wanted him to be static. His movement to create space is good in the box he also willingly runs the channels his whole game at West Brom and Everton was based on stretching teams and playing off the shoulder and he does that very well. This is why people get frustrated by things like you’ve said above because yes it was true under Jose but for anyone who watched him outside of that influence and the type of player he was the difference is night and day.
This is why I said you should go watch some of his time at Everton because static he was not, he’s not going to be at his best dropping deep like Martial does for us but running channels and being on the shoulder is what he is good at something Rashford has been doing.
You’ve shown again you haven’t really seen Lukaku out of Manchester United when you’re talking about needing a Beckham and stuff because because he isn’t a pure number 9 as you call it. We’ve seen him run channels and make assist when he’s had the opportunity there is just this false narrative around him and people whining out the cliches.
As for the football right now I just think it will be improved upon further with him in the squad and Rashford playing as a wide forward with them all still interchanging and swapping positions
I wasn’t claiming he was better than Kane, I was putting in to the discussion since what we hear normally is that he is a donkey that his passing stats were better than Kane’s. Key passes and so on and that he had missed less big chances.Left the ball behind
Look, i see where this is going, debating this issue with someone who is trying to portrait Lukaku as a better player than Harry Kane is a bit pointless.
Lukaku can be a vital part of our attack if he improves his overall play, but that's not going to instantly improve due to us playing more attacking football. He has a touch of Mkhi about him so far this season.
In general I think Harry Kane’s play in terms of hold up and picking a pass or setting attack underway is much better than Lukaku’s and that’s what really makes him stand out, but the two play in very different ways and if we can get Lukaku playing at his best then we easily have a 25+ goal striker who can challenge Kane for the golden boot.
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This is exactly my whole point. You don’t make any sense. You told people to watch highlights of him last season to see what he’s actually like when used properly. But we are now playing differently compared to last season. Why are we trying to go back like last season just to get the best out of Lukaku? We are doing fine now without him in XI, just stick him as a super sub.
What about you watch every game like me instead of watching highlights. Then, you will know that the way how we are playing right now won’t suit Lukaku.
‘’haven’t seen Lukaku’’ that’s exactly the best excuse you can come out with. I think you should start giving more proof of what you are saying about Lukaku. Because I have full of reasons that I have given you why he can’t play in our style right now. From the fact that Lukaku has poor off ball movement & poor first touch and ball control, from the fact that because of these weakness he struggled to score against top 10 teams, from the fact Rio Ferdinand even has the same opinion as me, from the fact that Carragher also said Lukaku is more like a RVN which is a pure no 9 than Drogba.
This is why you shouldn’t rely on highlights. Highlights won’t tell you everything. You need to watch the full match to realise how many times Lukaku always doesn’t give other players a good option for them to pass the ball, one good movement out of 10 doesn’t indicate that the player is not poor with it. It’s like saying that Cleverley pass the ball forward just because he had a few forward pass attempts.
I can see why there is a problem here when I’ve been speaking about Lukaku I’ve always referenced his time at Everton and especially his last season there. When I first started our conversation I said you should watch his time at Everton to get a better picture of what he is actually like. So when I said later on you need to check his last season I was meaning his last season at Everton. Not under the toxic one. That’s my fault for not being more specific there, sorry my bad.
So my point is that at Everton they played more like we do now, Lukaku played more in a manner that will suit us now as that is playing to his strengths. What we saw under Jose was a guy instructed to stay central and just occupy the 2 CB’s and try and hold the ball up when it’s kicked to him. Those things were never going to be his strengths, if anything it highlights his weaknesses which just makes me wonder what the hell was Jose thinking.
He’s vastly different from RVN, like miles different, they aren’t in any way similar whatsoever but since all this confusion seems based on you never having watched him at Everton my point is you should go try and watch some stuff from that 16/17 season so you can see what he is about and how very very different he is from your perception of a pure number 9 like Ruud.
Anyway do that and it should answer a lot of the questions you’ve put forth in that post and correct some of your assertions.
Edit: what’s the dig about highlights? Where have I made it seem like I only ever watch highlights? I watched all of our games even the ones that made me want to rip my eyes out watching Jose ball.
I just so happened to watch a lot of Everton as I was pretty sure United were going to move for Lukaku so I thought I’d keep a closer eye on what he was doing and saw all the things that make me think he’d on that form improve us with Martial and Rashford and freeing up space for Pogba and giving him more time.
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His touch and hold-up play was mostly decent last year with plenty of people saying the initial fears over it were exaggerated. He got 10 assists I think and even in his dry spell he was contributing, keeping us relatively happy. It was often stressed how much he'd already worked on his downsides and how he's improving his general play. This season it's horrific tbf so I can see the question marks if he can fit this new United side. However, there is a difference between being called a good striker with some deficiencies and a 'donkey'. The gifs don't help and you can use them against anyone basically. Remember last year and during WC when Fellaini was playing well and had a bit of leeway on here suddenly a couple of people dug out the old, meaningless gif against Bayern some 5 yrs ago as to show he's shite.
All in all Rom needs to at least come back to his best general play-wise, cut his dry spells and score more against good sides. This, coupled with high numbers (25/30 goals) would be enough. As of now he isn't your dream striker but far from useless. Praise him when he does well, too guys.
All in all Rom needs to at least come back to his best general play-wise, cut his dry spells and score more against good sides. This, coupled with high numbers (25/30 goals) would be enough. As of now he isn't your dream striker but far from useless. Praise him when he does well, too guys.
That's not a term most mature adults use, I actually even thought the mods frowned upon its usage on this forum.
They dont mind when it's appropriate. They're more alarmed when someone claims Kane isn't better than Lukaku.
I didn't actually say that, but the blind will 'see' what they want. Cheerios
When you mention this, people seem to come back with, well Martial would easilly score as many if he gets the chance or Aubameyang or anyone that has a good scoring rate at the time. They need to actually do it first before you can make that argument and there's a reason why not many have.
Didn't want to derail the Rashford thread. How's Lukaku's recent record?
Lukaku:
In the premier league since 14/15 season:
Year------Games------Goals
14/15------12-----------0
15/16------12-----------1
16/17------11-----------4
17/18------10-----------1
18/19-------5-----------0
Total-------50-----------6 goal every 8.3 games
FA Cup and League Cup
15/16------3-----------3
17/18------2-----------0
Total-------55-----------9 goal every 6.1 games
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So 14 goals in his first 17 games. How did he manage to drop from that to 6 goals in 50 games.....
I'm not sure thats accurate
@Mcking
In the premier league
13/14------10-----------5
12/13------10-----------5
FA Cup and League Cup
Total-------20-----------10 goal every 2 games
13/14------1-----------1
12/13------1-----------0
Total-------22-----------11 goal every 2 games
These are based on the traditional top 6 being United City Liverpool Arsenal Chelsea and Spurs so that may be why there is a discrepancy with the numbers in the other thread.
So his early years we're clearly better goal every 2 games, then he dropped off when he signed permanent with Everton is seems.
In the premier league
13/14------10-----------5
12/13------10-----------5
FA Cup and League Cup
Total-------20-----------10 goal every 2 games
13/14------1-----------1
12/13------1-----------0
Total-------22-----------11 goal every 2 games
These are based on the traditional top 6 being United City Liverpool Arsenal Chelsea and Spurs so that may be why there is a discrepancy with the numbers in the other thread.
So his early years we're clearly better goal every 2 games, then he dropped off when he signed permanent with Everton is seems.
Meanwhile, i couldn't be less bothered about the golden boot and someone challenging Harry Kane for it, i'd prefer it if we have a well functioning attack where goals are balanced out and we challenge for the Premier League instead.
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