We would have won by 20 if we didn't decide to play like shit in the last 4-5 matches. Premier League wasn't more competitive than Bundesliga this year, and hasn't been for some time.
Robert Lewandowski
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We would have won by 20 if we didn't decide to play like shit in the last 4-5 matches. Premier League wasn't more competitive than Bundesliga this year, and hasn't been for some time.
Nah but its nice to ensure that the clubs just below that level looking to start challenging again have their best players taken away before they can be a real threat eh?
I suspect we would've had Mr Abramovic and Sheikh Mansour stayed away.
That Cantona fella was decent.
Not sure what Moura and Hazard have to do with it, they weren't from rivals, and we were outbid by clubs with more money. Nasri? Again, so what? Sort of emphasizes my point that the reason we don't do what Bayern do is because we aren't the club in our league with the most financial power.
We bought Jones didn't we (and beat Pool and Arsenal to him). Rio and Rooney are probably the two most talented English players of the last ten years and we completely blew everyone out of the water to land them. Wilshere, again, comes at a time when we are no longer the "Bayern" of England, we simply don't have the financial power they or City/Chelsea do. Otherwise, I reckon we would lap him right up (though he wants to stay at Arsenal anyway).
Hmm, not sure how many times I need to say this, the reason we DON'T is because we CAN'T. Our title challengers have more money than we do, lots more, obviously we can't take their best players like Bayern take their rivals, who they are considerably bigger and richer than.
So, let me get this right. Signing a player from a strong team who is your direct title rival is evil. But signing a player from a team that is fighting for the top 4 (you know those extra millions that UCL brings with it) is good? Ok, then.
Arsenal by the way was our biggest threat during the SAF era. Getting their captain and by far their best player, just weeks after they made the most serious signings in years (Cazorla and Podolsi) is good? All hail the saint United and pity the evil Bayern.
Carry on.
Why do people keep on comparing chelsea and man city to dortmund? Can you talk me through how you think you'd go about buying someone like Silva or Yaya toure this summer if he was Moyes' number 1 target?
Yeah I don't think it's a sure bet at all. They might have massively increased their chances for next season, but it's far from a certainty they will go on to dominate the league uninterrupted for years and years to come.
Plus, if Dortmund really saw Munich as a major, long-lasting threat that wouldn't see them achieve any success in this remaining decade, they probably wouldn't agree to sell to them anyway.
I also can't really see this having some massive negative effect on Bundesliga either, medium or long term.
lolz. Blame the clubs who spent 100M and still failed.
The league isn't in decline, but it's in danger of going on another similar one to what there was between like 2005 and 2010, when Bayern, despite being the best german team, were going into the Europa league because of getting knocked out of the group stage and getting pushed aside easily by the other top teams. If Bayern takes every top player in the Bundesliga, they will walk the league by 30 points every season, and people won't be that interested anymore. Players won't want to go there too much either if it's so one-sided. The league as a whole suffers which would make Bayern suffer in the longer run. Every league needs to be a good competition to survive and stay at the top, and there needs to be big rivalries for titles like Dortmund and Bayern now, and what there is in every other league.
Bayern will be the top team (or up there at the least) in Europe for 2 or 3 years probably but after that there could be a sharp decrease in the quality of the league if they have no competition.
Sort of the point isn't it. You can splash insane amounts of money around but it doesn't guarantee you anything.
The good thing is they are not getting the pair for free which would truly decimate Dortmund. If Robert leaves as well, then they are in line to get a total of £50m+ and they can use that to strengthen their team a lot.
Bayern just won the double (possibly the treble soon) yet are releasing their current manager and bringing in a new one who we have no idea what will happen with. Domination is far from guaranteed.
I'm looking at this from Bayern's point of view: the real top players aren't going to stay at Dortmund forever, they're going to move to one of the giants (or newly monied teams). With someone like Gotze, if they don't buy him, Madrid or someone will, and then what? You wouldn't be the team to have arguably the best young talent in the world, and you would have to face him in the Champions League each year.
It's a no-brainer, you sign the best players you can.
It's a no-brainer, you sign the best players you can.
Uhm, yeah? Because we are anyway compensating them for the player that we are buying. Look at Berbatov, for example. We bought him for 30M. And they already had Bent and Keane at that time who had a very good scoring in that period. Why is it our fault when their players stop performing?!
Really? Do you think this Arsenal side would have contested us all the way to the title with RvP leading their line?
Who's suggested clubs shouldn't? And why has this turn into a debate on morality?
Really? Do you think this Arsenal side would have contested us all the way to the title with RvP leading their line?
And him NOT leading our line.
Anyway, getting RvP off Arsenal wasn't more so to weaken Arsenal (though I'm sure it helped sway SAF's hand), it was to stop City getting him. If they got him, it could've been a very different season. We didn't just sign RvP because of what he'd give us as a player, we signed him because we knew it's weaken Arsenal and give is a massive advantage over City. Not that different to what Bayern are "cnuts" for doing, really.
Really? Do you think this Arsenal side would have contested us all the way to the title with RvP leading their line?
City pretty much pushed us to the line right? Obviously we had a cushion and won the league before the last match, but it wasn't settled months ago was it. City finished 5 points ahead of Arsenal, just 2 wins. I'd say had Van Persie played for Arsenal, they obviously would have been a lot closer to us, and we would have dropped points without him. I think they could have been just as close as City in fairness, unless you can't see Van Persie making the 5 points difference?
I've read tons of comments that approach this based on the terrible morality of Munich, over common sense that they would like to buy the best talents in the league.
To be fair, Lailiani's hardly a well balanced individual.
The circumstances were the same? We weren't head over heels for Cantona, were we?
Just a general example, as I said.
Well, yes. We did buy Jones. So buying him from Blackburn is equivalent to Bayern buying Dortmund's two best players?
We still have the financial power in England. We are still very capable of paying top dollar for a player who deserves it. But saying that, we can't afford to spend with our eyes closed because of our debt (even though it is constantly reducing).
You should probably have a look at the recent financial reports. We have enough cash to buy players. Cue Robin van Persie.
Same as above.
Highly doubt that. There's so much quality in the german youth academies, the overall quality of the league will rise even further and the league overall makes more money than ever before. The league's finances weren't even close to the top3 leagues in europe between 2005-2010. We already surpassed Spain and Italy now, have increased tv deals for the next years and the commercial revenues of the clubs are rising like crazy. Nothing in the league is comparable to the dark times back then.
I find it bizarre that people are trying to point to this as the beginning of the end for the German league... when we've just watched an all-German CL final. The league is clearly on the up and up.
If you can't see the difference between us trying to buy the best players off our filthy rich title rivals, and Bayern trying to buy the best players off their far less financially and commercially successful title rivals, this conversation is pointless.
Uhm, yeah? Because we are anyway compensating them for the player that we are buying. Look at Berbatov, for example. We bought him for 30M. And they already had Bent and Keane at that time who had a very good scoring in that period. Why is it our fault when their players stop performing?!
Really? Do you think this Arsenal side would have contested us all the way to the title with RvP leading their line?
And bayern arent compensating dortmund for these players? You don't want money, you want players. It's why the top clubs don't tend to sell their best players. It's better to have the players.
Firstly, comparing bent and keane to berbatov is a joke.
Secondly, we didn't have them both because that summer, Liverpool had already come along and nicked keane off us.
Who the hell knows what arsenal would have done? Taking the best striker and arguably best player in the league from them is obviously going to affect their ability to do anything, especially when that player has shown himself capable of winning his team points they have no business winning.
Certainly though, the taking of Cole toure, clichy, nasri, rvp has rather affected their team.
It's very strange.
How is that comparable?
I agree with you, I don't have any issue with the likes of Bayern buying their title rival's best players. My concern is the Bundersliga becoming a monopoly, sure it's not a guarantee but plenty of people were concerned that La Liga would become a duopoly due to money distribution, and it's exactly what's happened.
I don't how you came up with that theory.
Seeing that Welbeck was played mostly as a winger this season, what if SAF over saw that and bought RvP, because Young, quite clearly, suffered the second season syndrome. Nani was done in the head, and he overcame that situation by playing Welbeck as a winger and RvP as the main striker.
I mean, even this makes sense, innit?
So do you think it's the league as a whole will remain at a high quality if Bayern continue to buy the best players from the other teams in the league? They will have no competition for the title and I could see that harming them in the long run really, not through any real fault of their own, but more because there aren't any teams like PSG, City or Chelsea in the Bundesliga to counter Bayerns transfers with big transfers of their own and keep the league competitive.
You're right about there being a lot of quality in the youth teams right now, but the promising players will look to leave after a few years because they would have no hopes of winning anything unless they move to Bayern or a different top team around the world. I hope I'm wrong because I enjoy watching the Bundesliga, especially Dortmund, but I can only see the league being even more one sided than it was this season.
Keep up spoony, its because Bayern are the most dastardly club to exist while Man utd are the paragon of footballing morality who would never dream of buying players from title rivals or clubs on the rung just below because of an altruism towards the state of the league.
Madrid Valencia final. It's not going to happen again unless they're drastic changes. An all German final doesn't signal a period of Bundersliga dominance.
La Liga has been a duopoly since the 1950s. It's not something that has recently happened. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Spanish_football_champions
As others have said, it's the fact that by doing this, Bayern look as if they are almost creating a monopoly so that they will simply dominate on their own with no competition.
You can't blame them for it. If they have the resources to buy the best players of other clubs then they have every right to do so and I would never condemn them for it, but it's simply the idea that Bayern can just pick off the best players from their main competition in the league, therefore destroying any competition they have. They've always been the dominant force in Germany in regards to finances and stature, but this is almost a new extreme and it would be a shame if a very competitive league simply became Bayern winning year in year out.
Give us Bale please. We'll call it charity.
But the money distribution in germany is totally different. Barca and Real have revenues more than 4 times as big as the third best team in Spain.
Dortmund will surpass 300million euro this season and Bayern will probably have around 400 million. That's not that big of a problem.
Who are out filthy rich title rivals that we are buying players from?
No. Was just replying to Cina as to our pulling power is not as bad as it is made to be.
No, that is the point. The english equivalent of dortmund are chelsea and city. You're not able to buy players off them.
If the germans open up their league to foreign owners, Im sure we ll see oil rich leverkusen and wolfsburg as title challengers and then they can be just like us with their competitiveness.
Really, so where are Depor, Valencia and Athletico thesedays? I swear Valencia made the final a few years back. Sure the top two have always been the powerhouses of Spanish football but it's worse now due to money distribution.
Before the period of moneybags, how many players did we nick off our direct title rivals?
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