This idea that he's only been playing senior football for a few months is false since he played all of last season with Benfica's b team who play in the Portuguese version of the Championship so he has actually made 65 appearances in senior football and while obviously its not at the same level its only 2 appearances less than Shaw, 3 less than Martial and 12 less than Rooney when we paid big money for them
Renato Sanches
- Thread starter Sassy Colin
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Plus, worst case scenario we get one more stamp on our Mendes loyalty card.
I don't think I am to be honest. I compare some talents that are already in the end or middle of their careers, otherwise there's no point in comparing others whose career just kicks in. Macheda made a great start but ended up meh for example.
Morrison was clear headcase for anyone who followed him even from the start. Petrucci was highly regarded but injuries stalled him and didn't let him develop according to his talent, that is ok.
But if you look back in the last 10-15 years I don't think we brought in enough top talent compared to other top teams with similar pull and supposedly same quality of scouting network.
Sanches has played a lot of matches at youth level, I'm sure he was notably better than his peers, why don't we gamble on him at the time he's worth no more than 1m and then loan him or try to develop him at our academy?
And it's not like I'm talking about some obscure talent here, most of those young players that go on and become top talents are playing in their international youth teams.
Honestly I can't recall a youth talent that we brought in the academy and went on to play more than 20 games for us at top level. And I'm not talking about world class, but merely even a squad player.
Welbeck and Evans played a good hundred of games, I think.
I think he means youth players that we purchased from other clubs.
Welbeck is home grown and not picked up from another academy. Evans is probably the best shout and most capped player to fall into the last 15 years(should be around 13 or so).
My bad, you are right there isn't a single player from the foreigners.
I now have big belief in young players like him after Martial success, never thought he could be this good and will only grow, if we pay 45m for Sanches I hope he will have similar impact as Anthony and if not with immediate effect we have decent midfield options for now, still some players to step up like Schneiderlin.. injury free and given game time Herrera or Timmy wonderboy
Sign him up. I much prefer this philosophy of spending big on the best young prospects, rather than trying and failing to sign the Mullers and Bales of the world. We go on about developing youth and then when we're in a position to obtain one of the best prospects, people complain? Just because of a pound figure that is essentially arbitrary? Don't understand.
This kid looks like he has all the natural skills to be an excellent premier league midfielder.
This kid looks like he has all the natural skills to be an excellent premier league midfielder.
Never watched this guy,so cant say anything about his qualities but reading this thread...it made me to go back to Martial thread before he signed for us.At the start posts were more or less ok but when someone mentioned 75mil. euros as amount we are rdy to paid...oh boy 
. Even poll on that thread is interesting.
. Even poll on that thread is interesting.He'll make an excellent left back 
Have seen very little of him, but on the occasions I have seen him he has looked solid and decent but not outstanding at all, looks like a less mobile Carvalho.
Anyone who watches him frequently think he's worth the hype?
Anyone who watches him frequently think he's worth the hype?
So he looks like a fairly good young midfielder still getting to grips with playing at the level he is, but I havent seen anything slightly special about him.
I think it has something to do with factors like 90 mins rule (idk if it is still there), harder to convince for foreigners to let their 16 years old live in another country, costing much more too i think, having a world class team from 2006 to 2009 does not help some kids, managers not giving much of chances to the 'right' ones and some kids were just being unlucky with injured and United not being able to pursue latin players etc.
Don't think many of those faults lie with us. Not to say we don't need to improve though. I do wonder how clubs like Bayern grab talented players around from other countries and make them good when we can't or dont. We don't even get many of British ones.
And, I also wonder how good the likes of SAF's brother was at scouting players compared to other top scouts. Didn't he tell SAF that Anderson was better than Rooney. Turned out it was probably at being lack of fitness?
Speaking of it, how many other EPL (big) teams are doing well in that regard? You would think not being champion or not having a world class team would ease off pressure on everyone and more kids/new players will get more time to develop. But, I doubt it with everyone calling for everyone's head at United nowadays.
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Don't confuse people with facts here.
60million euros(which is likely to be the price after addons) after 20 matches. Sack all our scouts ffs!!
Really? He is basically the opposite from what i read
I mean he looks like a goddamn superhero at times in the following game. Quite fast and comfortable carrying the ball and dribbling, very powerful, solid passing and a ludicrous shot. For an 18 year old, there's a lot there
Personally, I'm for this sort of signing on principle. We aren't going to get Koke, Verratti or Pogba. We need the next ones. Obviously we have to get it right, but what CMs look more exciting and likely to become a star that we could actually sign this summer? The club has money to spend. What we lack are great players.
Why do we need Renato when we have Rooney to fill that position
How did he fare in the Benfica B team? He looks outstanding vs Chelsea youth team in the highlight. And so far in the senior level, he is among Benfica best and has lifted them. If he were consistent above the Benfica level then, I think this is the good sign that he really belongs to upcoming superstar class.
That's not the scouts fault though? They couldn't have foreseen Rossi getting injured all the time. they identify talents around Europe and some of the best ones we buy to develop like you suggest. But of course development isn't something we can predict. Plus we didn't get more out of players we have because we had a good squad till 2011 and after that SAF didn't seem to be interested in bringing up a lot of youth. For instance the
Many players choose to stay at their own club so that they can actually get developed. Last year for instance there was some upamecano guy who we wanted to buy but he chose to go somewhere else because he thought he would have more chance of playing more in another club than United.
Obviously we can't buy everyone. Mainly because different people end up differently. Chelsea tried buying everyone they thought were good but maybe 4 out of those turned out good. And only courtois can be said to be useful for the Chelsea team now. The likes of van ginkel, Marin, van aanholt all ended up Nowhere the level you need. When you do that, in the future most players are going to stop coming to you as they would probably think that they have a better chance of making it if they stay where they are. Which is kind of what Chelsea are going through right now.
So the alternative is we monitor players. We probably monitor 1000s of players like this. If they end up not good enough we leave them but if they do then we buy them. It's more expensive but it's the right way to go. Or rather it's the better way.
According to that Norwegian reporter who covers the Portuguese league our scouts have scouted 22 of his games. Either they are clueluess or they are paid to do nothing I guess...
I agree. This is why I also agree with many we need a DoF to oversee the whole system while let the first team coach the freedom focus solely on his job. Under SAF later years, our youngster severely lack first team exposure. I prefer LVG way of involving the youth in first team (not here to argue whether he got lucky or planned it ahead). What I meant SAF just throw the youngster in with the reserve/underplayed players in League Cup and easy FA Cup ties. This is more similar to U21/reserve team playing with stronger opponent than first team experience!!!
LVG took few youth at a time and try to integrate them with actual first team. If they show good sign then they get involved in match day and play with actual first team player. If they again show that can do it at first team level, and would get involve again with first team. This is actual first team experience. The young players were challenged the same as the first team players. They had to show they can perform actual first team football as a whole package, not only show their own talent/strong point just to impress with a goal, and assists, and tackle, work rate... In SAF later years, the youngsters may look impressive when they play to the strength. However, as long run when team study their weakness and knows to press these weakness, SAF youngsters often have big flaw in their games thus prevent them to become great player. Here I am talking about players like Cleverley, Welbeck, Gibson, Evans,...
That's being said, there is only that much space and games for the youngster to have first team experience the LVG way (my personal preference). That means, DoF will be great help in making the system go smoothly, that we have enough youth talent lined up while, they have enough chance to get game at various level, or being loaned out at the right time to get experience.
I bet they scouted Gaitan
On a serious note, I read that we rare scouted Benfica game until this Renato guy made into first team. Now our scouts keep coming to Benfica games for 20+ games. They must be very impressed or they are all Benfica fans in disguise going to games with our club money.
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Neves and tielemens should serve as a warning for renato. Both very highly rared youth prospects who have dropped off this season.
Disagree. Some players have style that is harder to utilize in the team. An Essien type is easier to Kroos type, even let's hypothetically say Kroos at his best is better, provides more.
Edit: Just realized Vidal is a better example than Essien since Vidal has been successfully utilized in both defensive, counter attacking team and high line & high pressing possession football.
From seeing this Renato guy a few times, IMO he belongs to the easier to utilize group of talent. Neves and Tielemens IMO are in harder group due to their games based more on passing and controlling game. Renato hypothetically if can not find game time in the central midfield, can be shifted to wing as wing back or defensive winger easily with his available tools. Or asked to carry man mark job aka Welbeck vs Alonso, Park. Ji Sung vs Pirlo... that required less positional discipline and match reading skill, but pure stamina abuse.
Only problem is I also am in no position to know how highly rated is this Renato guy's potential. Seeing the price belong to top talent bracket. Would like to hear from other poster who watched more of this guy.
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Surely we should be due a free player soon?
Whats that to do with their form being bad? For 40-60m euros, we need a first choice midfield player not an auxiliary wingback/winger.
Thing is so far, there seems to be no class midfielder available! You can't buy what is not available.
Let's me remind you about last summer where everyone wanted a class CB. Ramos played contract renewal time game with us. What's left is Otamendi who turned out not too impressive. There were no other class CB that moved last summer that we would regret missing, even though we know we need upgrade!
All we and others can do is looking at potential and the hot one would be highly inflated. This Renato in our scouts is that hot. And by a common fan like me can see that he is have tools that is easier to be utilized.
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I can guarantee you six months into the next season, there will be a wonderkid midfielder playing for some team and all of us will be going why didnt we buy him. Thats the kind of player our scouts should be identifying, not someone who has played six months at the top level and going for fees more than proven players.
For those that need some info
http://www.umaxit.com/index.php/col...es-of-manchester-united-target-renato-sanches
http://outsideoftheboot.com/2016/03/21/scout-report-renato-sanches-benficas-energetic-midfielder/
Fwiw, I'm still in the not signing him category. I'm not saying there isn't potential there but it's not convincing enough to justify the hype.
http://www.umaxit.com/index.php/col...es-of-manchester-united-target-renato-sanches
http://outsideoftheboot.com/2016/03/21/scout-report-renato-sanches-benficas-energetic-midfielder/
Fwiw, I'm still in the not signing him category. I'm not saying there isn't potential there but it's not convincing enough to justify the hype.
I don't know about the future man. I understand what you're implying, but then only thing we can do is praying that our scouts actually got this one right.
Watched him few times to know he is an easy to utilized type of player who is currently displaying good performance. I personally am not sold on this guy at this price tag neither, that's why I am asking for more info from other posters. Cheers
That happens all the time though. City were linked with Sane in January and it was the end of the world in that thread. Type of player we should be signing etc etc and now that thread hasn't been bumped in God knows how long. Dembele has become the new Sane until a new youngster comes along that we really should have been after.
All I will say is the people at the club are far better than us at judging talent and have watched him in a lot more detail than us. His last game was the 22nd time in a row we have been at Benfica specifically to watch him. I am not saying we don't make mistakes. But if our people feel he's worth the money, they should be given the benefit of the doubt. Especially after our last similar signing has proven to be a major success.
I have seen him have great to poor games like all players. But the most high profile games I saw him play very well in were those two Zenit legs. And imo, he looked special in those tow games. Absolutely dominated a team that had won all their group games with his passing and fantastic ability to hold on to the ball under pressure.
I have seen him have great to poor games like all players. But the most high profile games I saw him play very well in were those two Zenit legs. And imo, he looked special in those tow games. Absolutely dominated a team that had won all their group games with his passing and fantastic ability to hold on to the ball under pressure.
The only warning that serves is get his move to a big club with huge wages asap before he drops off.
Wow. He's ridiculously direct. It's rare to see such instinctive passing. This kid doesn't hesitate for a millisecond. If that's his level, I'm actually excited.
A few months ago I wrote a post about how (hypothetically) Keane and Scholes would take one touch before making a difficult pass. Herrera and Schweinstieger would take two. And Schneiderlin would take three. Renato Sanches looks like he's capable of being in the one touch category.
Like I've said here a few times. I took an interest in watching Benfica this season because we were heavily linked with some of their players especially Guedes, a RW who was supposed to be the next CR7. After the sale of Markovic to Liverpool I expected this kid to get a chance and try to justify the hype. But alas, it wasn't to different to other young Benfica players under the Jorge Mendez stable; over hyped and over priced. The Guedes one in particular seemed so sure. Anyway, I noticed Sanches for the next 12-15 odd games.
After watching, I can only resonate with what a few number of posters who are against the signing him having watched him for a fair bit. Which is, he definitely has an advantage over his peers of a similar age in that he physically developed, he is really built and energetic which I believe is the main reason he gets into a team of grown men easily. He does have a few bits here and there but the main thing I noticed is his physicality. He will hustle and bustle, run all day long, try the odd skill and shot there but his main role is to keep things moving and keep opponents on edge.
This is all good stuff. But as far the tactical nous and technical ability, even for an 18 year old wonderkid, I'm often left unimpressed. Some of his touches, postioning, passing, runs and concentration can be so shocking at times that you forget that he is a young footballer (stuff you dont see on Youtube clips). I'm not saying there is no room for improvement but It's not close the the standards I've seen some teenagers have. I know he is only 18 but he has the physical advantage to be compared with 19/20 year old CMs who would have had physical disadvantages at 18, given the same experience.
Tielemans is a good reference point, not now because he is "burning out" IMO, having played over 100 games by the age of 18 at pro level. Regardless of what people say about him, I think he is still a class wonderkid who needs to move to a more competitive league before he plateaus. At 16/17, Tielemans showed some serious ability that was way beyond his years. For a 16 year old, he was near perfect, relatively speaking. Same goes for the like of Oliver Torres, Veratti et al., who though were physically underdeveloped where showing some serious signs as CMs.
But that is me being pedantic, given that those players are more technical and are more of the playmaking mould. But they should be the standard of CMs IMO. After them are balanced ones like Neves, Bazoer, Rabiot who are more all round, then the defensive types like Weigl, Dahoud etc. I'm not including AMs or wide players here.
Sanches just sits as somewhere as the energy bunny, like a Michael Essien in his Lyon days not the downgraded version at Chelsea where he was converted to a DM. Actually writing this I'm beginning to realise that the breeds of "Essiens" are rare. Lol. Which Sanches is in the mould BUT that said he is still a long way from what Essien was at that stage of development. In modern football, players need to have more than one string on their bow and Sanches IMO still needs another season off the back of this season to further develop.
I'm not convinced that he is as hot as people say in terms of competition from other clubs. The Jorge Mendez link will make sure that his high price tag will deter any suitors. Unless we are crazy desperate I'd say we focus on developing the like of TFM and Pereira (for those that still thinks he deserves a shot), maybe Goss and McNair too. If it doesn't work out Sanches will still be on the market or another talent will surely emerge. Every club will be focusing on their young talent to make a quick sale to get a slice of the EPL cake. With the price quoted for Sanches, we can really force the hands of clubs for some proven top class CMs which we need more urgently.
I meant as a warning to us.
As far as I know he did well but I think he was playing a lot as a number 10 last year and has moved back this year. United were actually scouting quite a lot of Benfica b matches last year with the press assuming that it was for Guedes but it could have been for Sanches after he impressed in the 2014 under 17 European Championships
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The articles when we were first linked in January said we have been watching him for two years.
Had to stop watching after 70 seconds because this highlight reel of him is mainly him misplacing passes!
Yeh I thought the same thing, but it's worth watching all the way through to see his goal
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