Most of the blokes who've lent me money aren't religious at all.
Religion, what's the point?
- Thread starter TheRedFlag
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran are here to talk about a frustrating 2 points dropped at Crystal Palace. They then discuss the regeneration of Old Trafford. Finally, Nik is joined by special guest Michael Statham from the Football Oranje podcast - who gives us a more in depth look at our EL opposition FC Twente, and then runs through the (many) Dutch connections currently at United.
Most of the blokes who've lent me money aren't religious at all.
So you think the religious institutions who actively engage in lobbying and campaigns against homosexuals don't have a much bigger negative effect on homosexuals than random homophobic atheists who just don't like guys fecking each other in the ass? You don't Iran's theocratic stance "there are no gay people in Iran" is an example of religious bigotry of the worst kind and that they're nice blokes really? You don't think that the political figures who argue that homosexuality is a sin and that gay marriage should be illegal is an example of religions not being kind? You don't think that preachers telling their congregations that homosexuality is a sin isn't an unkind thing? You don't think that religious persecution of homosexuals amounts to a bigger negative impact than all other kinds of homophobic bigotry?
No, but only god thinks them deserving of an eternity of violent punishment.
It also teaches to discriminate and feel superior to others. I recall youth organizers constantly downplaying other religions as wrong, claiming homosexuals were abominations, denouncing scientific findings, and the list goes on.
Yes it does but I think christianity is at least evolving on a lot of that. I don't think they'll ever come round to abortion though. Which is weird when they support the death penalty in a lot of instances.
It must be hard work keeping up with who you have to hate and love.
You live in America right Grinner? Do you think that the millions of Americans on the Christian right, who argue that abortion is murder, that homosexuality is a sin, that premarital sex is immoral are genuinely nice, tolerant people?
Yes, but you probably knew them. This was a complete stranger off of the internet.
I've decided it can't be a bad thing if people find solace in it.
I don't think a lot of them really practice what they preach. When they are confronted with it in their daily lives I think they mostly do the right thing.
I do believe most religious Americans are tolerant people, Silva. However, they are clouded by a religious superiority complex. The clergy are too vocal and the politicians play the religious card too much. There are the whackos out there that take things to the extreme and harm, murder, deny others that do not condone to their perverted views, but overall the majority are just vocal/hold feelings silently until in a majority.
I label the majority of religious Americans as "once a week Christians" i.e. only practicing their faith on Sundays. They're all hypocrits in my view.
That said, I do feel America will move in the right direction as a whole once religion looses its destructive grip. It needs to get the feck out of politics now.
I label the majority of religious Americans as "once a week Christians" i.e. only practicing their faith on Sundays. They're all hypocrits in my view.
That said, I do feel America will move in the right direction as a whole once religion looses its destructive grip. It needs to get the feck out of politics now.
People find solace in whatever benefits them. Do you think people who commit genocide, are slave mongers or pillage and rape ever have a hard time going to sleep?
I'm an atheist.
Like when they voted to repeal prop 8 in California?
Exactly...a few knobs with positions of power and a public platform are the face of religion. Good people like Red Dreams far outnumber them.
I couldn't remember who it was. Guess my point isn't illustrated then. Can you lend me 50 quid?
feck off.Well the theory on that is that the black population really swayed that vote because they were coming out for Obama. Black people really hate gays for some reason and it's not all down to religion.
Most perhaps, but most atheists are also tolerant people and no atheist takes their intolerance from the teachings of others - rather takes it from whatever ignorance they have. Institutionalized intolerance and bigotry is rife in the American right, you only have to look at the republican party to see that. It's impossible for them to elect a presidential candidate who isn't against gay marriage and abortion, and that's entirely down to the religious influence on that party.
Aren't black people in America largely living in poorer socio-economic areas, where it's easier for religious leaders to have an impact on them?
You seem rather at ease with the fact the majority of people will be tormented in hell, for eternity.
You spend so much time on here discussing religion with people who'll obviously not be convinced by you insted of knocking on the door of someone easier to convince. For someone blessed with suck knowledge, seems a waste of time. One would thing God'd be the one you'd want to please, not your own ego...
It's more about peer-pressure and overt masculinity. Black males are the most intolerant group against homosexuals.
I've given money to strangers on many more occasions than I've received money from strangers. Needless to say I'm not a religious man.
So it's down to a rigorous gender binary then? Don't you think the traditions religion institutionalized over thousands of years are directly responsible for that?
I don't see the utility of religion in terms of promoting "good". I'm pretty sure good people who are religious would still be good people if they weren't religious. Or at least it's as valid a claim as the other way around.
I didn't lose my "being good" traits when I became atheist but I have gained far more liberal views in regards to fellow humans, the planet, animals, etc, things I didn't hold when I was biased by a belief my faith made me superior to others. Nor do I give credit to religion providing me those "being good" traits. I find it was more a product of having genuine good-hearted family members and friends, irregardless of their religious affiliation. I tend to associate myself with like-minded individuals.
I tend to feel that I always knew was right and wrong and acted according to my desires.
I tend to feel that I always knew was right and wrong and acted according to my desires.
I believe goodness is a human trait but that religion does tend to make you exercise it a bit more. If we could figure out how to do that without the fairy tales and silly hate then the world would be grand.
There's a lot of good folk who happen to be religious. A lot of them take religion supermarket style though, using ordinary morality and human decency to decide which questionable religious practices they can skip and/or not follow to the letter. But then these people are good in that sense, exactly to the extent that they are not religious.
When you support policies against contraception in Africa, intolerance of homosexuals, believe that the rest of us heretics will go to hell etc. I don't really care you're all pleasant and neighborly on the surface.
It's also grossly unfair on organizations that do humanitarian work without proselytizing, and without fear of divine punishment or the hope for a divine reward, to assume any good work out there is exclusively done by religious groups.
And none of that has anything whatsoever to do with the truth of religious claims.
Support Amnesty International, by all means be a humanist. You don't have to believe in prophets flying on winged horses to do any of that.
When you support policies against contraception in Africa, intolerance of homosexuals, believe that the rest of us heretics will go to hell etc. I don't really care you're all pleasant and neighborly on the surface.
It's also grossly unfair on organizations that do humanitarian work without proselytizing, and without fear of divine punishment or the hope for a divine reward, to assume any good work out there is exclusively done by religious groups.
And none of that has anything whatsoever to do with the truth of religious claims.
Support Amnesty International, by all means be a humanist. You don't have to believe in prophets flying on winged horses to do any of that.
Werewolf is an expert on Islam.
Did you swallow your last humiliation or does it still hurt ? Because I am still waiting for my answers
Of course the leaders and whatnot would simply find a new cause (like religion is) to rally behind. I don't feel religion is the actual root cause of the majority of terrible acts (ex: Hitler's religious views) no more than the absense of religion is the root cause (like atheism blamed on Stalin). It's simply the platform to push a person/group/party to act out. Something else would take religion's place.
I suspect the vast majority don't rape and pillage. That said, I'm not sure about Sultan.
I agree Marcey. Politicians will find anything to drive a wedge. That's how they get people who feel strongly to come out to vote for them.The problem is with many who are religious, they throw away the essential ingredient called tolerance. Live and let live is so easy. It is a lot easier to find areas we can agree with than disagree. Yet so many look for what divides us.
Although there have been some harsh words on this thread, really everyone is pretty sincere and I'm sure over glass of beer we would find loads to have a laugh about.
Take it easy lads.
No because I left with dignity. A person who reverts to insults to either make or point, or he simple does it out of frustration, is humiliation (not to forget that you were a straw man). But please, tell us all more about Islam, as your love for the religion grows daily.Did you swallow your last humiliation or does it still hurt ? Because I am still waiting for my answers
The word "Fitrah" has more than one meaning in Arabic.. You probably missed the more obvious meaning at times like this (with Ramadan beginning this week)..Anyway, your question sounds so random and pointless to me (not because I want to say so, but because I highly doubt that it has anything to do with proving/disproving Islam as a religion). Can you tell me where you're going with this question exactly?
His question (to an extent) is, if we're all born with innate knowledge of Allah and Islam, why is Islam so confined to specific regions? And why is it that people who have never come into contact with Islamic teachings don't spontaneously start worshiping Allah?
To be honest, there is nothing that can prove/disprove any religion, Danny.
Not unless you come back from the dead with some video footage.
Not unless you come back from the dead with some video footage.
I agree Marcey. Politicians will find anything to drive a wedge. That's how they get people who feel strongly to come out to vote for them.The problem is with many who are religious, they throw away the essential ingredient called tolerance. Live and let live is so easy. It is a lot easier to find areas we can agree with than disagree. Yet so many look for what divides us.
Although there have been some harsh words on this thread, really everyone is pretty sincere and I'm sure over glass of beer we would find loads to have a laugh about.
Take it easy lads.
That's not due to religion, that's a human nature. You get that even among football fans, is football to blame here too?
If you read the Quran, or read about the lives of prophets, you'll see that they were very tolerant to others, regardless of their belief.
Those people who are trying to use religion for their own interests don't represent religion. Politicians lie about everything, why are we assuming then that they're telling the truth when it comes to religion?
What?
Why do you care about that? You're 100% sure that there is no such thing as hell.
The Abrahamic god, specifically. I.e, not just an unmoved mover, but an unmoved mover who also promises untold eternal glory in the afterlife.