Yes indeedEveryone is born an atheist
Religion, what's the point?
- Thread starter TheRedFlag
- Start date
i basically have come to the conclusion that Religion is to make people feel better, the idea that you live and die and thats it is just too scary to comprehend, so you have to beleive in something more
Love me some Monty Python <3
Another religion
Another ideology
Another belief
Another philosophy
Another ...
There will always exist an extremist segment in the human psyche, an internal belief that my way is the only way, my way is the just way, and whatever philosophy I choose to believe in will allow me to do as I please to exert my belief onto others, even murder.
Islam never had its reformation like Catholicism and Protestant, but it's likely too late anyhow. I'm slowly losing the defense of "the vast majority of Muslims are good people" because it's seemingly the only religion that is clouded with fanaticism that condones terrorism, and a sizeable segment of the religious either don't speak out against (for differing reasons) or full on support (vocally or in silence). Yes, there's the brutal LRA and even savage monks, but it's small potatoes compared to the number of radical Islamic groups.
Is radical Islam shrinking or growing in numbers is the question for me.
of course, it won't be as easy as "getting rid of islam and world peace comes soon after," but it doesn't change that islam is a toxic ideology that needs to be uprooted/reformed. though as you mentioned a reformation isn't as easy as it sounds because islam is so strict and many of even the "moderate muslims" still embrace ideologies that are grossly incompatible with the developed world.
and it's even worse when any criticism of islam are immediately met with crude accusations of "racism" and "islamophobia", which is also further pushed on by the media.
on another note what other ideologies, beliefs, and philosophies do you think has the potential to be the "next Islam"?
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The source of radicalism comes from the Mosaic law.
According to the bible, the reason for the introduction of the Mosaic law (which Islam also loosely subscribes to), was to bring people to the conclusion that holy perfection cannot be achieved in the flesh.
No matter what you do physically, you will always fail compared to the holiness of God. Christians believe that Jesus took the curse of failure upon himself on behalf of the world. And those who believe, no longer stand condemned by the law of Moses. However, Muslims and Jews believe that they are somehow special according to their physical identity, but in order to try and physically live up to the high expectations of living a holy life according to what is expected of them, they become religiously critical of themselves, but more critical of those who frankly don't give a damn.
According to the bible, the reason for the introduction of the Mosaic law (which Islam also loosely subscribes to), was to bring people to the conclusion that holy perfection cannot be achieved in the flesh.
No matter what you do physically, you will always fail compared to the holiness of God. Christians believe that Jesus took the curse of failure upon himself on behalf of the world. And those who believe, no longer stand condemned by the law of Moses. However, Muslims and Jews believe that they are somehow special according to their physical identity, but in order to try and physically live up to the high expectations of living a holy life according to what is expected of them, they become religiously critical of themselves, but more critical of those who frankly don't give a damn.
They are to kill any nasty aliens that come here wanting to take over. Didn't you see the movie?
I always wondered why he created the aliens.
if you don't mind, I'm moving this discussion to the religion thread because this discussion is starting to move away from the nice tragedy.
unfortunately statistics tell a different story. many of these "moderate muslims" still hold beliefs that are incompatible with modern world. including treating women as second class citizens and support of grossly harsh punishments for homosexuality, adultery, apostasy, and blasphemy. (which are all backed up by the qu'ran, hadith, or both)
as for the 3rd generation muslims who grew up in the west, embrace its values, and against the radicalized parts of the islam... yes, I'm aware that people like that exist. now, it would help if majority of those people really made their voices heard and kickstart movements to reform islam (admittedly much easier said than done) instead of blindly labeling those who criticize islam as "islamopobes". because others aren't going to, or rather can't reform the religion for muslims who want their religion to be compatible with the rest of the civilized world.
unfortunately statistics tell a different story. many of these "moderate muslims" still hold beliefs that are incompatible with modern world. including treating women as second class citizens and support of grossly harsh punishments for homosexuality, adultery, apostasy, and blasphemy. (which are all backed up by the qu'ran, hadith, or both)
as for the 3rd generation muslims who grew up in the west, embrace its values, and against the radicalized parts of the islam... yes, I'm aware that people like that exist. now, it would help if majority of those people really made their voices heard and kickstart movements to reform islam (admittedly much easier said than done) instead of blindly labeling those who criticize islam as "islamopobes". because others aren't going to, or rather can't reform the religion for muslims who want their religion to be compatible with the rest of the civilized world.
I lost the defense of Christianity not condoning violence and 'terroristic' actions, mainly due to the rhetoric and actions of fear, division and violence spouted by US Christians and reading of attacks in Africa.
Killing/attacking/harassing people who don't believe the same interpretations as your religion, is the same for any religion, be it Christian, Islam, Jewish, Hindu, Buddhist , or any.
Islam, in a Christian country, has been spouted as 'in your face', only because it is just a different religion to what people are used to.
Christianity, is in my face on every major road, on people's bumpers, and round their necks, but isn't condemned.
Islam extremism is generally worse than Christian extremism because the concept of paradise after death is believed. If a person is Unafraid of death, infact welcoming it, if they believe it furthers their religion, it's hard to counteract.
if you don't mind, I'm moving this discussion to the religion thread because this discussion is starting to move away from the nice tragedy.
unfortunately statistics tell a different story. many of these "moderate muslims" still hold beliefs that are incompatible with modern world. including treating women as second class citizens and support of grossly harsh punishments for homosexuality, adultery, apostasy, and blasphemy. (which are all backed up by the qu'ran, hadith, or both)
as for the 3rd generation muslims who grew up in the west, embrace its values, and against the radicalized parts of the islam... yes, I'm aware that people like that exist. now, it would help if majority of those people really made their voices heard and kickstart movements to reform islam (admittedly much easier said than done) instead of blindly labeling those who criticize islam as "islamopobes". because others aren't going to, or rather can't reform the religion for muslims who want their religion to be compatible with the rest of the civilized world.
Just wait til Sam Harris gets ahold of that gif.
Everyone is born an atheist
What about Jesus?
This is something many muslims themselves wont agree upon. Now I know why I never enter such threads. A bunch of people speaking out of their arse about religions/ideology they know nothing about.
I don't follow crappy skewed statistics. Most I have talked to do not believe in this. Therefore, it is very relevent.
It's completely irrelevant especially with regard to the point he was making. I assume you already knew this but pretended to ignore it. Hilarious how you also ignore statistics (calling them crappy without actually knowing what kind of statistics he was referring to). Now those would be far more relevant than the bunch of people you may (or may not) have talked to.
Your post made no sense to me apart from "believe what he says. What he says is relevent and what you say is not".
Why should I trust an online poster and not my own experiences with muslims across the globe?
His point, I believe, is that you seem to be arguing that anecdotal evidence is superior to statistical evidence.
Well, then you have to get into proving he was actually born.
So if everyoone I know tells me something else from their own mouth, but "online polls" say otherwise do I tell these people "HAH intolerant cnuts! look at what this paper says!" disregarding what they themselves say?
If that is his point it is a very weak one.
Statistical analysis can get data from many more people than "who you know".
Have you considered that "who you know" might just be in the minority?
The statistics are polls. They really aren't reliable. They have a ton of factors.
It just reminds me of the Muslim/Islam hate spread around nowadays. People spend too much time reading the intolerance and studying how bad Islam and muslims are but what people need to do is ask themsleves how their own interactions have been with muslims. That's the key to stop the bigotry.
Since you brought it up, anonymous, faceless, nameless polling will render more truthful answers than you going around asking friends questions for obvious psychological reasons.
There is a reason why teachers have kids perform nameless surveys at the end of the year instead of having them sign them.
I am not "asking questions for psychological reason". I have experienced and known many muslims from a very young age. On the other hand, it seems like you or the poster that made the point are following "study cases".
I'm saying that the answers will be more truthful for obvious psychological reasons
Firstly, he was talking about Islam, what the actual texts say, in context of reformation of the religion. So, whether muslims believe it or not is entirely irrelevant to the discussion of the actual text.
Second, Yes, I'd rather trust polls and statistics than trust an online poster and his experiences.
No, it has NOTHING to with Muslim hate. Stop bringing ridiculous strawman bs into this. No one has said all muslims are intolerant.
Firstly, he was talking about Islam, what the actual texts say, in context of reformation of the religion. So, whether muslims believe it or not is entirely irrelevant to the discussion of the actual text.
Second, Yes, I'd rather trust polls and statistics than trust an online poster and his experiences.
No, it has NOTHING to with Muslim hate. Stop bringing ridiculous strawman bs into this. No one has said all muslims are intolerant.
First of all, my response was also in terms of reformation of the religion. He made the point of apostasy = death as if it was a fundamental belief of Islam which holds reformation back. It is not a fundamental belief and so he was simply wrong by mentioning it in the first place. I was trying to give examples of how it is nowhere close to being a fundamental belief.
Also, I hope you would trust YOUR OWN experiences than a poll but that is your choice.
Lastly I think it does have to do Muslims hate. I never said anyone implied all Muslims are intolerant. Yes, I have made an assumption of this being a byproduct of Muslim hate so I may be wrong but the reasoning behind my assumption is how no one (evidently) takes the time to dig deeper/understand the religion or it's people and the complexities involved with it. A poster here just pointed out how the religion cannot be reformed because of something that is not even widely agreed upon.
Along with the lack of willingness to understand, there is a general vibe of people disliking Islam (there is a thread that implies the world would be better without it) and the terrorists attack do no good either.
So again, I made an assumption about this being a result of the intolerance and hate and I may be wrong but as you can see my argument was not "strawman" as I have my reasons to come to that belief/assumption.
Well there is no god which means Jesus was just another rogue nut running around claiming end of times therefore, yes.
The vast majority of the Middle East doesn't constitute the majority of the world's Muslims.
I don't think that's what he is saying. He appears to be saying the majority in the world that believes that becomes a vast majority of the population if you focus on just the Middle East.
Yeah I can see that now
Well my Christian brothers & sister they have only gone and made Big Momma T(Mother Teresa) a bloody saint, haven't they.
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2016/sep/04/mother-teresa-declared-saint-by-pope-francis
Here's my tribute
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2016/sep/04/mother-teresa-declared-saint-by-pope-francis
Here's my tribute
It's only a matter of time before Liverpool make a bid for her.
Her relationships with Charles Keating and Duvalier were shady as hell IMO.
Whether or not they care to admit it, followers of the Roman Catholic Church are polytheists who are addicted to worshipping multiple beings. God was never enough for them, and neither was God's masochist son or even his 14 year old 'virgin' mother so they had to create an infallible representative on Earth so that they could worship somebody in the flesh. But even that wasn't enough, so they then started to worship weeping statues and apparitions....travelling hundreds of miles to seek miracles from them. But EVEN that isn't enough, and that's where saints come into it. And of course the thousands of saints who already exist in their deluded minds are not enough (or they are too boring and irrelevant) so they desperately seek to add new ones to the collection. The RC faithful are constantly on the look out for recently deceased individuals who are curing the sick from the dead so that they can begin the process of beatification and eventually have another number on speed dial. They should be thoroughly embarrassed.
Is there something worse about polytheism than monotheism in your opinion?
Yes but...they have Klopp.
UK courts should be able to issue Islamic divorces, sharia expert says
https://www.theguardian.com/law/201...-to-issue-islamic-divorces-sharia-expert-says
https://www.theguardian.com/law/201...-to-issue-islamic-divorces-sharia-expert-says
Quite a misleading headline given the reasons suggested in the article.
I find it amazing how someone - who dedicated her life to helping the poor - is retrospectively being cast as some sort of a villain. Especially when the criticism is led by a cnut like Hitchens who has dedicated his life to winding up folks on the internet and probably never stepped foot into a calcutta slum. Yes, she held terrible,dangerous views but she also helped a lot of people who desperately needed it.