Religion, what's the point?

MrMarcello said:
Hmm. Religious flock do the same when clergy speak.

The ironing is delicious.
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Well that's simply not true. The whole reason why we have so many denominations and then again traditional vs progressive streams within individual denominations clearly demonstrates that there are constant in-house discourses on almost every subject regarding religion and theology.
 
There's a very good interview with former bishop of Edinburgh Richard Holloway right now on HARDtalk on BBC.

You'll probably get it on iPlayer if you've missed it. The bishop lost his faith and after turning his back on the profession amidst much controversy now considers himself as being an agnostic Christian. Well worth a watch for anyone interested in the topic at hand.
 
The religious on FB are lapping up Kirk's 'Unstoppable' movie. I read about his 'Monumental' film and that it was criticized by, well basically anyone that understands history while not being clouded with religious bias.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monumental:_In_Search_of_America's_National_Treasure

Monumental has received mixed reviews. Joni Eareckson Tada, a renowned author and radio host, wrote, "Informative... Enlightening... Amazing... these are the words that aptly describe my response to this remarkable movie." Francis Chan praised the movie's message, saying "After seeing this film, I have never been more proud of our country’s heritage and more concerned about our future."[11]
Americans United for Separation of Church and State’s Joseph L. Conn wrote "The theme of the movie seems to be that the Pilgrims came to America seeking religious liberty, and they set up a model Christian community that we ought to emulate today," and continued "Well, here’s some news, Kirk and Company. The Pilgrims and Puritans did come here seeking religious liberty, but they set up a regime that gave freedom only to themselves, denying it to others. In keeping with its religious viewpoint, Plymouth Colony prescribed the death penalty for adulterers, homosexuals and witches, whipping for denying the scriptures and a fine for harboring a Quaker." He ended his review saying "Don’t be misled by Kirk Cameron’s charming smile. It masks a chilling agenda." [12]
Gawker's Rich Juzwiak, in a review titled "Kirk Cameron: A Bigot in Pilgrim’s Clothing", said the movie "is too petrified to say anything, a relic of this era of the shameful bigot who’ll spew hatred and then get mad when it’s recognized as such. Monumental is a neutering of even Cameron’s cowardly waffling, in which he stood by his comments about homosexuality … while clarifying that he loves gay people and don’t [sic] think they should be mistreated. Last night, he didn’t even have the balls to be contradictory." [13]
Radio commentator Glenn Beck said, "This is A) a great movie to see. B) a great movie to bring your kids to, and teach them about the history of our country, and C) it is important, because we need to start supporting people that are doing things like this..." [14]
The documentary was reviewed in episode 74 of The Cognitive Dissonance Podcast (along with fellow podcaster George Hrab guesting).[15] The hosts criticized it for the elements of revisionist history, bias, and general poor quality.
 
Anyone who prescribes movies as a good way to learn the history of anything needs re-educating.
 
Surely a Glenn Beck endorsement is a killer for any movie.
 
monumental-poster-413x620.jpg


What an utter bell end.
 
MrMarcello said:
The religious on FB are lapping up Kirk's 'Unstoppable' movie. I read about his 'Monumental' film and that it was criticized by, well basically anyone that understands history while not being clouded with religious bias.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monumental:_In_Search_of_America's_National_Treasure

Monumental has received mixed reviews. Joni Eareckson Tada, a renowned author and radio host, wrote, "Informative... Enlightening... Amazing... these are the words that aptly describe my response to this remarkable movie." Francis Chan praised the movie's message, saying "After seeing this film, I have never been more proud of our country’s heritage and more concerned about our future."[11]
Americans United for Separation of Church and State’s Joseph L. Conn wrote "The theme of the movie seems to be that the Pilgrims came to America seeking religious liberty, and they set up a model Christian community that we ought to emulate today," and continued "Well, here’s some news, Kirk and Company. The Pilgrims and Puritans did come here seeking religious liberty, but they set up a regime that gave freedom only to themselves, denying it to others. In keeping with its religious viewpoint, Plymouth Colony prescribed the death penalty for adulterers, homosexuals and witches, whipping for denying the scriptures and a fine for harboring a Quaker." He ended his review saying "Don’t be misled by Kirk Cameron’s charming smile. It masks a chilling agenda." [12]
Gawker's Rich Juzwiak, in a review titled "Kirk Cameron: A Bigot in Pilgrim’s Clothing", said the movie "is too petrified to say anything, a relic of this era of the shameful bigot who’ll spew hatred and then get mad when it’s recognized as such. Monumental is a neutering of even Cameron’s cowardly waffling, in which he stood by his comments about homosexuality … while clarifying that he loves gay people and don’t [sic] think they should be mistreated. Last night, he didn’t even have the balls to be contradictory." [13]
Radio commentator Glenn Beck said, "This is A) a great movie to see. B) a great movie to bring your kids to, and teach them about the history of our country, and C) it is important, because we need to start supporting people that are doing things like this..." [14]
The documentary was reviewed in episode 74 of The Cognitive Dissonance Podcast (along with fellow podcaster George Hrab guesting).[15] The hosts criticized it for the elements of revisionist history, bias, and general poor quality.
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This dude's film seem to be over the top but the same can be said for the reactions. Americans are something else really.
 
Dr. Dwayne said:
Anyone who prescribes movies as a good way to learn the history of anything needs re-educating.
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You mean war of the worlds wasn't real and that we did not triumph over the Martians? My whole life would be a lie
 
My client project manager, is a lady of Indian origin, who is educated and I've worked with her for more than 7 years. She's very good at what she did, although her colleagues call her a bitch, hey, she gets the results. By all accounts, she is intelligent, has 2 lovely kids and has a settled life.

Apparently, she has now went back to India and is living in an Ashram. I don't know if it's temporary or permanent. But I'm seeing her posts in FB daily, and she has taken her two kids there. The posts are random and they are always about 'Free space of mind that is available in the ashram'. Today, she posted that her kids wanted to bring rain to the ashram and chanted some mantra and made the weather change. As a family, they again chanted it and made dark clouds appear. Every day, it's something similar, posts which reek like Boss, about attacking the free space.

:wenger:
 
niMic said:
That is incredibly disturbing. I can usually laugh these things off, but that one is too much. I'm actually horrified.

How anyone can look at that and go "yeah, that's a good message" is beyond me. They must be severely twisted.
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What's the problem with the message? Don't lie, forgive, be thankful, etc. I'd say that's a pretty good message. The presentation however is a bit weird. And using 'Collosians 3 something' as actual song lyrics is also weird. Having said that I have no idea about the background of whatever show that is and clearly it's all edited.
 
Mihajlovic said:
What's the problem with the message? Don't lie, forgive, be thankful, etc. I'd say that's a pretty good message. The presentation however is a bit weird. And using 'Collosians 3 something' as actual song lyrics is also weird. Having said that I have no idea about the background of whatever show that is and clearly it's all edited.
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Those children come across as brainwashed. And it doesn't just say those things, it says do those things because god, which is a terrible message. Ethics/morals/social norms should be instilled in people for the sake of the morals themselves, not in return for a reward.
 
Mihajlovic said:
What's the problem with the message? Don't lie, forgive, be thankful, etc. I'd say that's a pretty good message. The presentation however is a bit weird. And using 'Collosians 3 something' as actual song lyrics is also weird. Having said that I have no idea about the background of whatever show that is and clearly it's all edited.
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The presentation was extremely creepy, and that's ignoring the fact that there's a bunch of kids running around in circles happily singing "OBEY OBEY OBEY THIS PLEASES THE LORD".

"Clearly it's all edited"? It's a music video, of sorts. That's how they work.
 
niMic said:
The presentation was extremely creepy, and that's ignoring the fact that there's a bunch of kids running around in circles happily singing "OBEY OBEY OBEY THIS PLEASES THE LORD".

"Clearly it's all edited"? It's a music video, of sorts. That's how they work.
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Ah that is supposed to be a music video.
Yea I can see how it can come across as a bit creepy.
 
Ciderman I like the documentary you posted, havent had time to watch the whole thing but looks very interesting. Let's see what the old chap has to say.
 
niMic said:
The presentation was extremely creepy, and that's ignoring the fact that there's a bunch of kids running around in circles happily singing "OBEY OBEY OBEY THIS PLEASES THE LORD".

"Clearly it's all edited"? It's a music video, of sorts. That's how they work.
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As for the "obey..." obviously that's a direct quote from Paul's epistle to the Colossians and it will inevitable sound archaic as it's religious 1st century AD language.
 
Mihajlovic said:
Ciderman I like the documentary you posted, havent had time to watch the whole thing but looks very interesting. Let's see what the old chap has to say.
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He's a fascinating man. I bet that not many Christian priests have risen to the prominent post of Bishop of Edinburgh or equivalent before resigning, turning atheist (he describes himself as a Christian Agnostic) and living to tell the tale.

He describes his actions, thoughts, feelings and encounters, telling his tale quite eloquently.
 
niMic said:
"Only way we could know what happened in the past is if someone was there to tell us".

Now that's just sound logic right there.
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Was he on Noah's Ark? Also Noah didn't take 2 of every animal he took two of the unclean ones and 7 of the clean.......
 


David Mitchell is one of many people I've seen that misunderstand the definitions of 'agnosticism' and 'atheism'. He says that agnosticism is the most rational position is as though it's a mid point between theism and atheism, when in fact anybody who does not completely accept theistic claims is an atheist ("I'm not convinced there's something").

"I'm not ready not reject it" makes it sound like atheism is claiming no God exists, which not the case. You can choose not to believe 'X' without saying anything about 'Y'.
 
I think he does sound genuinely agnostic to be fair, I just also think he's very wrong about the rationality part.
 
Amethyst said:
David Mitchell is one of many people I've seen that misunderstand the definitions of 'agnosticism' and 'atheism'. He says that agnosticism is the most rational position is as though it's a mid point between theism and atheism, when in fact anybody who does not completely accept theistic claims is an atheist ("I'm not convinced there's something").

"I'm not ready not reject it" makes it sound like atheism is claiming no God exists, which not the case. You can choose not to believe 'X' without saying anything about 'Y'.
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What is your definition of agnosticism?
 
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