Last season was an aberration. So many good teams punching miles below their weight. In the closing months we were, maybe, marginally better than teams having an epic collapse (Spurs) finding their feet under a new manager (Liverpool) or treading water until their next manager started (City/Chelsea) but make no mistake, we were absolutely shit and finished the season in atrocious form. Even though we managed to barely scrape across the line in an FA Cup Final against the mighty Crystal fecking Palace.
Really - why did so many of you think Mourinho was better than LVG?
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Last season was an aberration. So many good teams punching miles below their weight. In the closing months we were, maybe, marginally better than teams having an epic collapse (Spurs) finding their feet under a new manager (Liverpool) or treading water until their next manager started (City/Chelsea) but make no mistake, we were absolutely shit and finished the season in atrocious form. Even though we managed to barely scrape across the line in an FA Cup Final against the mighty Crystal fecking Palace.
Anyone who watched United regulary under van Gaal and who still argues that we were good under him or that we played anywhere near close to this level, let alone required level, should be banned. Incredible how people still can mention that fraud in relation with something good about United, please let us all just erase him from our memories, because he was a complete waste of time and money.
I seriously can't understand how a sane person can talk about van Gaal like he was something positive here? I don't understand how threads like these aren't locked in few minutes either.
I seriously can't understand how a sane person can talk about van Gaal like he was something positive here? I don't understand how threads like these aren't locked in few minutes either.
We've scored 4 goals three times this season. Did we look remotely close to doing that under LVG? I know we did it against City, but I can't remember many more times it happened.
We've also scored 3 away v Swansea and Bournemouth.
With better finishing we'd have put 3+ past Burnley and Stoke as well.
There are clear improvements in our team already and it's been 3 months.
We've also scored 3 away v Swansea and Bournemouth.
With better finishing we'd have put 3+ past Burnley and Stoke as well.
There are clear improvements in our team already and it's been 3 months.
Facepalm.
This a hundred percent. We are playing miles better than under Van Gaal.
Wut? Citing Van Gaal's 'extensive experience in pressure cooker clubs' as if Mourinho didn't manage the biggest club in Spain (and the world), Internazionale in their only period of success over the last 2 decades, Chelsea - where he was under massive amounts of strain after Roman's spending, and one of the co-biggest clubs in Portugal. Then mentioning Van Gaal's 'amazing knowledge of football' as if Mourinho is some uppity scrub who chanced upon the job. Commitment to total football? Really? The commitment that led to some of the worst brand of football and chance creation rates a club of United's stature has ever seen?
The improvement in overall play is evident:
Credit: @Wooly Red
The midfield is rock solid, we're creating way more chances than last season, the football is pleasing on the eye in relative terms. Everything's not perfect, and no one is pretending it is. We need to finish more chances, become more tactically disciplined. The attack and defense could use some retooling over time. Signs of progress are there (maybe not in terms of points, but certainly dominant performances), but a chosen few are too blinded by bitter disregard for the man. Give him time to iron out the flaws instead of belittling him and moaning about someone who didn't even evidence a lot of tangible progress on a year-to-year basis.
The whole post is a mess - an exercise in vanity and petty one-upmanship with the 'we told you moronic plebs' narrative, and bold declarations of 'United will not get back to the glory days'. Loads of supporters never wanted him (a lot of it can be chalked down to non-footballing reasons and his personality), and there's a 'pull no punches' onslaught after only 14 league games (whereas Van Gaal came under the microscope after more than a year at the job). This includes hypocrites like @Twigginater who demand patience for everything and everyone save for Mourinho, and can't wait to lay into him for X Y Z reasons; and as a support base - United fans are really turning into a laughing stock with the constant whinging, pining for Klopp/Conte, and sly digs at their manager. How about you atleast put on a pretense of supporting him after 3+ months into the season?
The improvement in overall play is evident:
Code:
Team Shots pg Shots OT pg Goals Games Shots/goal Shots OT/goal
Chelsea 16 6 29 13 7.17 2.69
Liverpool 19.4 7.3 32 13 7.88 2.97
Manchester City 17.5 5.9 29 13 7.84 2.64
Arsenal 14.5 4.6 28 13 6.73 2.14
Tottenham 17 5.7 19 13 11.63 3.90
Manchester United 16.9 5.8 18 13 12.21 4.19The midfield is rock solid, we're creating way more chances than last season, the football is pleasing on the eye in relative terms. Everything's not perfect, and no one is pretending it is. We need to finish more chances, become more tactically disciplined. The attack and defense could use some retooling over time. Signs of progress are there (maybe not in terms of points, but certainly dominant performances), but a chosen few are too blinded by bitter disregard for the man. Give him time to iron out the flaws instead of belittling him and moaning about someone who didn't even evidence a lot of tangible progress on a year-to-year basis.
That's a fair argument mate and I accept that. But I don't think you can solely blame the opposition. In your first 13 games this season, you've amassed just over 1.5PPG. In the last 13 under LVG, it was just under 1.95PPG.
I know that I'd much rather have played this Mourinho United side last week than an LVG side with Rashford and Martial getting at us through the middle. Although their confidence appears to be dwindling under Mourinho.
Which is entirely logical. 'Improvement' is what we're looking for here and that is what we have seen (for the most part). Obviously Mourinho cannot survive indefinitely by simply surpassing the appalling standards set by Van Gaal last season; he'll need to do better, and quickly.
Blame Moyes and LVG, not Jose(yet).
Here are a few reasons. Fellaini, Depay, Blind, Bastian, Schneiderlin, Rojo, Darmian, Rooney on a contract so thick no club will touch him. Young is still in the squad. Remember him coming on as striker? Striker! Jones is still here. Yes he's played 4 in a row but only because Smalling broke his big toe.
Meanwhile Nani, RVP, Rafael, and Hernandez were all shipped out. A winger, two strikers, and a RB.
The only glimmer of hope that has come out of Moyes and LVG has been Mata and Martial. Jury still out on Shaw.
Here are a few reasons. Fellaini, Depay, Blind, Bastian, Schneiderlin, Rojo, Darmian, Rooney on a contract so thick no club will touch him. Young is still in the squad. Remember him coming on as striker? Striker! Jones is still here. Yes he's played 4 in a row but only because Smalling broke his big toe.
Meanwhile Nani, RVP, Rafael, and Hernandez were all shipped out. A winger, two strikers, and a RB.
The only glimmer of hope that has come out of Moyes and LVG has been Mata and Martial. Jury still out on Shaw.
I think your argument goes both ways, when conjuring things in their head. What was said last year about LVG was ridiculous to the extreme. Obviously not comments about bore fest, but most of the other comments were just plain wrong.
It is pointless comparing this squad and it's performances under Jose with LVG. I doubt very much whether LVG would have bought any of the players Jose bought. So we will never know who he would have bought and how they would have played.
Reality is we have performed fairly average the whole of this season. A few good periods in a number of games, but in the 20 odd games under Jose, we can probably count on one hand the games where we have played significantly better than the opposition for the whole game. We would also struggle to count many entertaining games.
Rightly or wrongly, there is some significant blind faith in Jose on here because of his history of success. When I watch the games at the moment it is more in hope, than expectation, that we turn up or turn it on.
I still believe we are significantly underperforming. Not written off the season, but the way things are going a trophy less and non-CL league position season will be more disappointing imo than Moyes season because of the youth and quality in the side.
You're just restating the same argument. That you think we finished strongly last season. I know we didn't. Happy to agree to disagree.
The first reply here could have ended this thread really. Surprised there's 5 pages of replies. The football under LVG was awful, absolutely awful.
That's horseshit tbf.
Really you can't see the different? did you forget how O.T was falling asleep under LVG? at least Mourinho playing an exciting attacking football, attackers just not good enough to finish the chances we are creating, that's not a tactical problem IMO.
I think results wise appointing Mourinho anywhere can never be a bad decision. The problem with him is that aside from his results he's kind of a cnut and makes everyone hate your club with a passion. So when his team doesn't perform you're stuck with an antagonistic douche that will blame the lack of succes on anything, but himself.
LVG would not have done in a better job in any way, shape or form though. Van Gaal was done, don't be absurd.
Edit: Invictus already won this thread with that post. Mourinho is much better than LVG. It's just that he's a bit of a cnut.
LVG would not have done in a better job in any way, shape or form though. Van Gaal was done, don't be absurd.
Edit: Invictus already won this thread with that post. Mourinho is much better than LVG. It's just that he's a bit of a cnut.
Most of those players you mention do not get game time, so pretty pointless bringing them into the equation.
Moyes should only be blamed for his season. He wasn't good enough, but he really isn't responsible for anything that is happening now.
LVG probably has the same track record as Fergie in buying some duds. However, he may have not have brought the playing style we wanted to see, but he was only beaten to fourth by goal difference and still brought a trophy.
You would have thought one of the best managers in the world spending a very significant amount of money would have raised the game. Jose should be held accountable for where we are this point in time.
Just as we have slated managers is the past for duff formations, poor team selections and subs we should recognize when Jose does it.
I suspect folk made their minds up in the summer. Rest is pretty pointless.
Maybe you can enlighten us with your list of games that have been really exciting and we have been significantly better than the opposition.
What's with oppo fans talking up LvG here? We were playing dreadful football under him. We hardly created anything.
Can people really not see the difference? We're miles better under Mourinho, we're creating countless chances a game, under LvG we hardly created any most of the time, and it was an absolute borefest. The problem here is not with the manager, but with the players not finishing their chances, and i don't think there is much the manager can do about that, they just need to find a bit of momentum.
I think this is fair and entirely true. "Its Jose and hes not a United manager" was being said, but weve played the most entertaining stuff since Fergie days. If our players could finish, the results would match the performances and it would be more an indication of the level we are at (add 8 or 9 points extra to our current total for a real fair reflection).
And yes, I know you can say that for other teams, but tbh, the improvement is huge. Going to OT or watching United under LVG became a chore and strangely enough, International breaks werent the worst thing. Now its opposite.
This. It's only 3 moths under Mourinho and things looking better, Mourinho must take his time. If there's a one coach we should give enough time then it's Jose.
really-why did so many of you think that there would be an instant change of our fortunes when we have been a complete mess for 3 years?
Why are we judging Jose against LVG when he has had less than a quarter of the time LVG had?
If people can't see the difference and an improvement in our performances over the utter shite we were us during under LVG...I give up.
What makes people think it was going to be a quick fix? Unbelievable. LVG was an abomination at United. End of story, he was rightly fecked off for a better manager. I'll judge Mourinho after he has a season, and even then he should be given the time to get the team he wants together.
I'm actually enjoying watching us again, because the last 3 years has been disgraceful.
Why are we judging Jose against LVG when he has had less than a quarter of the time LVG had?
If people can't see the difference and an improvement in our performances over the utter shite we were us during under LVG...I give up.
What makes people think it was going to be a quick fix? Unbelievable. LVG was an abomination at United. End of story, he was rightly fecked off for a better manager. I'll judge Mourinho after he has a season, and even then he should be given the time to get the team he wants together.
I'm actually enjoying watching us again, because the last 3 years has been disgraceful.
We have to be patient, Mourinho has had one transfer window so far, you can't buy too many players in one window otherwise it could become disjointed. The four signings made so far have had their ups and downs but they were the correct ones.
I wish some of you were willing to give Jose half the time you were willing to give Moyes and LVG. Its been barely 3 months and the amount of bullshit reactionary threads have been shocking. Jose will come good for us, just have some bloody patience.
Yup. Which explains at least some of the drivel being posted.
Was wondering when we'd have one of these threads, the LvG fanatics didnt go away overnight they just stayed quiet and bitter. From the off there's been plenty on here waiting to talk down Mou.
LvG was shit and you're all nut cases.
LvG was shit and you're all nut cases.
I'm pretty pleased with the football I've seen under Jose. Results have been disappointing but nobody could call us lucky if we'd won our last 4 home games instead of drawing them. Almost every LVG win seemed to be thanks to us scoring our one shot on target with DDG getting man of the match, I'm so delighted at seeing the back of that dross.
It doesnt even matter if you believe he will or won't really the point is he's a top class manager and deserves at least a season before the proffesional moaners jump on him to say they always knew he wasnt good enough.
The revisionism is hilarious 
Mourinho is ten times the manager LVG is, and Moyes can ever be, and should've been appointed as soon as Sir Alex retired.
The proof is in the pudding. The performances this season do not reflect our current position at all.
I think some people need to watch some replays of our games against the likes of Midgetland, MK Dons and Cambridge.
Mourinho is ten times the manager LVG is, and Moyes can ever be, and should've been appointed as soon as Sir Alex retired.
The proof is in the pudding. The performances this season do not reflect our current position at all.
I think some people need to watch some replays of our games against the likes of Midgetland, MK Dons and Cambridge.
Mourinho is better than LVG. Of course we can't be happy with the results so far but we play much better football now than we ever did with LVG. I don't think we had a really bad match performance wise this season, even against Chelsea when we lost 4-0, we didn't deserve it. I still believe that we are 2 signings away from really starting to get the results. We desperately need a winger in the team and a striker who could score goals.
Some people of the caf really amaze me... United has shown a lot more under Mourinho in 4 months than Moyes/LVG.
You can see this squad is about to click.
You can see this squad is about to click.
Yes, those are the issues. Another is confidence.
"The boring" quip is a minimalist marketing gimmick propagated by the media that most have taken aboard to summarize Van Gaal's reign.
Mourinho wasn't hired for a process, to take the club into a new playing style and restructure the way the club handles youth from both the academy and outside. Not one of Mourinho's fans claimed last season that Mourinho would need time, he was hired because he would spend big on big name players and challenge for the title immediately.
He has failed, he has disappointed. That doesn't mean he needs to be sacked or that he can't turn things around, but so far he's not living up to the expectation of even the sceptics, and certainly not to the expectation of his fans.
Not my problem. Enjoy the "winning".
It is not foolish because we are the top 3 richest clubs in the world if I'm not mistaken. The size and resources of our club is up there with Barca and Madrid. We should be expecting a title challenge every season.
This is basically the Caf:
LvG had two years, let's see where Mourinho will be after the same amount.
The whole thread reeks of bring back Rafa absurdity.
The whole thread reeks of bring back Rafa absurdity.
By this logic Moyes wasn't at fault either then. In fact, by this logic 95% of managers that get sacked aren't at fault.
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