(Realistic) January Signings Thread

The players I'd like to see us sign over the next 12 months from my limited knowledge:

Leroy Sane (RW/LW)
Lucas Moura/Mahrez/Mane (RW/LW) (with Moura first choice)
Griezmann (SS)
Gundogan (CM)
Isco (No. 10)
Lukaku (CF) (Kane will be twice as expensive)

Of course, that's my uneducated layman view. I'd expect a football club with a bazillion scouts to be able to get a few less obvious gems in rather than all these super-expensive signings I've mentioned, but if we can do what I've mentioned over the next, let's say, 2/3 transfer windows, we'll have:

Strikers - Martial, Lukaku.
8's & 10's - Herrera, Isco, Mata.
Wide attackers/wide forwards - Sane, Moura/Mahrez/Mane, Greizmann, Memhpis and if needed, Martial.
CM's - Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin, Gundogan and if needed, Carrick.

That, for me, is the overhaul we need in attack. It wont happen at once, but it is what is needed.
 
Green_Red said:
Yea I read that his value is currently like 8 - 10. The crazy fee makes it realistic were in for him though.
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8-10 seems harsh. I know nothing about the fellow but from what I read here people seem to think he's good but maybe not supremely gifted.

Yep, we're the new Real Madrid in this regard. We never seem to get any bargains not named Daley "Danny" Blind.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
8-10 seems harsh. I know nothing about the fellow but from what I read here people seem to think he's good but maybe not supremely gifted.

Yep, we're the new Real Madrid in this regard. We never seem to get any bargains not named Daley "Danny" Blind.
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Lol and only in that regard
 
Forget signing players, we need to get Fellaini out asap.
Bring back Januzaj and Wilson from loan and I'll be happy with that.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
The players I'd like to see us sign over the next 12 months from my limited knowledge:

Leroy Sane (RW/LW)
Lucas Moura/Mahrez/Mane (RW/LW) (with Moura first choice)
Griezmann (SS)
Gundogan (CM)
Isco (No. 10)
Lukaku (CF) (Kane will be twice as expensive)

Of course, that's my uneducated layman view. I'd expect a football club with a bazillion scouts to be able to get a few less obvious gems in rather than all these super-expensive signings I've mentioned, but if we can do what I've mentioned over the next, let's say, 2/3 transfer windows, we'll have:

Strikers - Martial, Lukaku.
8's & 10's - Herrera, Isco, Mata.
Wide attackers/wide forwards - Sane, Moura/Mahrez/Mane, Greizmann, Memhpis and if needed, Martial.
CM's - Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin, Gundogan and if needed, Carrick.

That, for me, is the overhaul we need in attack. It wont happen at once, but it is what is needed.
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That is another 150-200 million pounds easily. So LVG needs approximately 400 pounds to build a team and then take credit for 'philosophy' and 'building a foundation'. I could do that with those sums.
 
NK86 said:
That is another 150-200 million pounds easily. So LVG needs approximately 400 pounds to build a team and then take credit for 'philosophy' and 'building a foundation'. I could do that with those sums.
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Well you need enormous funds to completely buy a new squad, which is what we're having to do. It's got nothing to do with LVG and what he "needs". You can't lose an entire team and then expect to replace it with top quality footballers with 100 million.

Also, as you'll have noticed, I know sod-all about the footballing scene around Europe, so I've gone for the most obvious and hyped names around. If a footballing club has a scouting system of any merit it should be getting a few bargains as well.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Well you need enormous funds to completely buy a new squad, which is what we're having to do. It's got nothing to do with LVG and what he "needs". You can't lose an entire team and then expect to replace it with top quality footballers with 100 million.

Also, as you'll have noticed, I know sod-all about the footballing scene around Europe, so I've gone for the most obvious and hyped names around. If a footballing club has a scouting system of any merit it should be getting a few bargains as well.
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We didn't have to rebuild the whole team at the same time. It is LVG who sold players left, right and center without even thinking of transitioning it properly.
 
NK86 said:
We didn't have to rebuild the whole team at the same time. It is LVG who sold players left, right and center without even thinking of transitioning it properly.
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We could have kept one or two for a year or so more but their time was up or almost up.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
We could have kept one or two for a year or so more but their time was up or almost up.
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I think we should never have let Chicharito go. He may not be Messi but he was not as bad as some people made him out to be. Same goes for Nani. Those two would have given us good impetus and boost when we are struggling.
 
NK86 said:
I think we should never have let Chicharito go. He may not be Messi but he was not as bad as some people made him out to be. Same goes for Nani. Those two would have given us good impetus and boost when we are struggling.
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Chichartio could have stayed, but he's a squad player in the long-term. Nani is debateable but he had gone completely shit for us.

That's two, the other ones that we've lost over the last 2.5/3 years are:

Giggs
Rio
Vidic
Evra
Park (?)
Welbeck
Cleverley
Scholes
Rafael
Anderson
RVP
Evans
Kagawa
Fletcher
Fabio

The ones that have stayed have either become average over the years, were always average or are past their peak:
Rooney
Carrick
Young
Valencia

So, in essence, we've lost an entire squad. It happens very rarely that an entire squad goes to pieces like that. So people should remember what we're actually doing when they judge our spending. In this day and age, you have to spend big to replace an almost entire squad.
 
We used to be one of best teams in the world. Now, I see the attack of Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich... they have world class players like Messi, Neymar, Suárez, Ronaldo, Bale, James, Lewandowski, Muller, Robben, etc. Even in the league teams with Sánche, Ozil, Agüero, KDB, among others.

My point is, we should go out and bring the best available. Some in January, most of them in the summer. Players like Griezmann, Lucas Moura, Gundogan, etc. I agree that Sane, Mane, Anderson, Berahino and others could improve us, but we need the best out there to be able to compete with the top teams and return where we belong.

So, realistically speaking... Who do you think are the best players available (January/summer) in these positions: CB, CM, No.10, RW and ST?
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Chichartio could have stayed, but he's a squad player in the long-term. Nani is debateable but he had gone completely shit for us.

That's two, the other ones that we've lost over the last 2.5/3 years are:

Giggs
Rio
Vidic
Evra
Park (?)
Welbeck
Cleverley
Scholes
Rafael
Anderson
RVP
Evans
Kagawa
Fletcher
Fabio

The ones that have stayed have either become average over the years, were always average or are past their peak:
Rooney
Carrick
Young
Valencia

So, in essence, we've lost an entire squad. It happens very rarely that an entire squad goes to pieces like that. So people should remember what we're actually doing when they judge our spending. In this day and age, you have to spend big to replace an almost entire squad.
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We had already brought in replacements for Rio/Vida in Smalling and Jones. LVG bought Rojo and his suitability to our standards is really debatable. So he has not really sorted out the CB for us. Blind is definitely not a long term solution.

Yes he has helped improve our midfield but what has he added in attack compared to what he has let go? As I said, the rebuild job was there but that should have been transitioned better. Letting go of squad players is one thing, not replacing them is another. We could have kept Nani and Chicharito to aid us this season before offloading them the next one. Both hardly got any chances under LVG and he shipped them out without letting them have a go here under him. What is the logic in that? Both could have helped us this year and then we could have planned their replacements this coming season. As things stand, we have completed the part of selling the 'deadwood' without even starting the process of actually replacing them.
 
NK86 said:
We had already brought in replacements for Rio/Vida in Smalling and Jones. LVG bought Rojo and his suitability to our standards is really debatable. So he has not really sorted out the CB for us. Blind is definitely not a long term solution.

Yes he has helped improve our midfield but what has he added in attack compared to what he has let go? As I said, the rebuild job was there but that should have been transitioned better. Letting go of squad players is one thing, not replacing them is another. We could have kept Nani and Chicharito to aid us this season before offloading them the next one. Both hardly got any chances under LVG and he shipped them out without letting them have a go here under him. What is the logic in that? Both could have helped us this year and then we could have planned their replacements this coming season. As things stand, we have completed the part of selling the 'deadwood' without even starting the process of actually replacing them.
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That wasn't the point I made. You said that we'll be spending so much to build a team. It's clear from our discussion spending so much is indeed required to completely build a squad from almost scratch. Should we be getting a few bargains and over-spending less? Definitely. But do we need to spend a ridiculous amount in this era to do that? Definitely. You seem to agree as well given you think we haven't actually spent enough, and need to sign players to replace the guys we let go .
 
amolbhatia50k said:
If you trust the views of all the Bundesliga team-supporting posters here, he's got nothing special about his game other than his set-piece delivery.

I would like us to really go for Leroy Sane this summer. The kid looks a really high quality talent. With him and Martial, we could have one of the brightest attacks in Europe soon. Will be hard to get him in January though.

There's not many top signings I can see us making in January. The likes of Sane and Griezmann will be hard to get. More like to get lesser players in Jan, unless you unearth a gem. And I'm not sure this is the time to be spending poorly on our attack.
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I just had a quick YT look at him and he seems slightly above average. He has a really good pass on him and can thread through some great balls and has decent speed. I don't know how his crossing is (Since the videos I saw really never showcased that). His dribbling seems pretty decent too, but nothing spectacular, but in all the videos I saw, he has space to run into,space to attack. You can't expect that in the PL. He will have to dribble past players from mostly a standing start rather than run into space and then take on players. That maybe a problem (especially the way we play).
 
Ijazz17 said:
I just had a quick YT look at him and he seems slightly above average. He has a really good pass on him and can thread through some great balls and has decent speed. I don't know how his crossing is (Since the videos I saw really never showcased that). His dribbling seems pretty decent too, but nothing spectacular, but in all the videos I saw, he has space to run into,space to attack. You can't expect that in the PL. He will have to dribble past players from mostly a standing start rather than run into space and then take on players. That maybe a problem (especially the way we play).
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Yep. Leroy Sane is the one I want us to sign from the German league. Draxler was really hyped but I'm not sure how he's doing anymore (apart from that superb performance against us).
 
amolbhatia50k said:
That wasn't the point I made. You said that we'll be spending so much to build a team. It's clear from our discussion spending so much is indeed required to completely build a squad from almost scratch. Should we be getting a few bargains and over-spending less? Definitely. But do we need to spend a ridiculous amount in this era to do that? Definitely. You seem to agree as well given you think we haven't actually spent enough, and need to sign players to replace the guys we let go .
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The point is, every team has to spend, but the duration over which it spends is also an important factor. Spending 400 mil over 5 years compared to 2 years is completely different. Therein lies my point. We do need to rebuild but it has to be transitioned better. It has to be done over a period of time taking into account costs and the effect of such large scale changes on the team and the club as a whole. LVG has failed horribly there IMO.

I still don't understand what exactly is LVG's role. Is he for the here and now or is he just a part of the overall plan to put us back on the top? Right now, neither seems to be taking shape.
 
I think people are getting hung up on YouTube videos, yes they are quite nice to look at to see a few nice highlights but they clearly don't give you anywhere near the whole picture. If you look at nanis YouTube clips some of the stuff he's done is comparable to Neymar in terms of flair but we all know what he's really like, same with Depay who looked incredible but when it comes down to the cold hard reality of pl football you never know how things will turn out.
 
NK86 said:
The point is, every team has to spend, but the duration over which it spends is also an important factor. Spending 400 mil over 5 years compared to 2 years is completely different. Therein lies my point. We do need to rebuild but it has to be transitioned better. It has to be done over a period of time taking into account costs and the effect of such large scale changes on the team and the club as a whole. LVG has failed horribly there IMO.
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You yourself stated that you'd keep only 2 players out of the 15 names I mentioned yet you think we should have taken our time to transition. Why keep highly paid "stars" despite them being rubbish/past it? Given how impatient football fans of top teams are, they had to go for me, barring the couple of arguable names we've discussed.

For me, our situation wasn't an "every team has to spend" one. It was completely unique in that we had a legendary manager replaced by an inept one leading to an almost entire squad falling apart. That isn't usual, and I think one must understand the nature of the beast before diagnosing it.

You are correct in that we may have failed, in some cases, in getting players in when we had let them go, but a fast transition was absolutely necessary in this very rare situation we found ourselves in.

How well we've coached our signings is a totally different matter, of course, and the answer so far is - not well enough.
 
We keep saying it, but this is a huge transfer window for us. Failure to add quality to the squad could mean missing out on Europe next season. Easier said than done as we know how hard it is to buy very good players in January. Given that LVG is going nowhere and the teams playing style won't change either, then we need a clinical striker and a pacy winger - tall order but those additions could be a massive difference. We won't get either in January that will improve us however, unless we spend a huge, and I mean huge amount of money.
If money was no problem then get in Lukaku. Job done.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
You yourself stated that you'd keep only 2 players out of the 15 names I mentioned yet you think we should have taken our time to transition. Why keep highly paid "stars" despite them being rubbish/past it? Given how impatient football fans of top teams are, they had to go for me, barring the couple of arguable names we've discussed.

For me, our situation wasn't an "every team has to spend" one. It was completely unique in that we had a legendary manager replaced by an inept one leading to an almost entire squad falling apart. That isn't usual, and I think one must understand the nature of the beast before diagnosing it.

You are correct in that we may have failed, in some cases, in getting players in when we had let them go, but a fast transition was absolutely necessary in this very rare situation we found ourselves in.

How well we've coached our signings is a totally different matter, of course, and the answer so far is - not well enough.
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I mentioned just two players. However let's go with the list you provided:

Giggs - Retired. Supposedly replaced with Memphis.
Rio - Retired. Replaced with Smalling. Fergie's buy.
Vidic - Moved on. Replaced with Jones. Fergie's buy.
Evra - Replaced by Shaw.
Park (?) - Was not even here when LVG arrived. How can he be mentioned. In that case, we will need to name a lot more players.
Welbeck - Should not have been let go.
Cleverley - Replaced by Ander.
Scholes - Replaced by Schneiderlin
Rafael - Replaced by Darmian
Anderson - Replaced by MS
RVP - May have been kept on. Not replaced.
Evans - Should not have been moved on without replacement. Was a good squad player.
Kagawa - Again could have been kept. No replacement.
Fletcher - Hardly featured for us the last 3-4 seasons. He was not even a squad player.
Fabio - Again moved on before LVG. Should not be counted.

So basically he has replaced Giggs, Evra, Rafael, Welbeck, Cleverley, Anderson. The likes of Welbeck, Kagawa, Nani, Chicharito were definitely good enough to be kept on for a few seasons till we could phase them out from our squad with better players.

That is what I mean by transitioning. You don't dismantle a squad in 12 months and then hope things don't go awry. We could have planned it way better. To say that Nani, Welbeck, Chicha and Kagawa were not even good enough to be squad players for us is being really unkind to them. We have a situation where we have to depend on CBJ and Varela in a key CL encounter. Not to mention Nick Powell! You think Nani/Kagawa would not have been better bets or with the kind of form we have seen, Welbeck or Chicharito would not have been good back ups for Rooney?

We hear a lot of people harp on continuity as a reason for backing LVG, continuity is also required with players who are good.
 
NK86 said:
I mentioned just two players. However let's go with the list you provided:

Giggs - Retired. Supposedly replaced with Memphis.
Rio - Retired. Replaced with Smalling. Fergie's buy.
Vidic - Moved on. Replaced with Jones. Fergie's buy.
Evra - Replaced by Shaw.
Park (?) - Was not even here when LVG arrived. How can he be mentioned. In that case, we will need to name a lot more players.
Welbeck - Should not have been let go.
Cleverley - Replaced by Ander.
Scholes - Replaced by Schneiderlin
Rafael - Replaced by Darmian
Anderson - Replaced by MS
RVP - May have been kept on. Not replaced.
Evans - Should not have been moved on without replacement. Was a good squad player.
Kagawa - Again could have been kept. No replacement.
Fletcher - Hardly featured for us the last 3-4 seasons. He was not even a squad player.
Fabio - Again moved on before LVG. Should not be counted.

So basically he has replaced Giggs, Evra, Rafael, Welbeck, Cleverley, Anderson. The likes of Welbeck, Kagawa, Nani, Chicharito were definitely good enough to be kept on for a few seasons till we could phase them out from our squad with better players.

That is what I mean by transitioning. You don't dismantle a squad in 12 months and then hope things don't go awry. We could have planned it way better. To say that Nani, Welbeck, Chicha and Kagawa were not even good enough to be squad players for us is being really unkind to them. We have a situation where we have to depend on CBJ and Varela in a key CL encounter. Not to mention Nick Powell! You think Nani/Kagawa would not have been better bets or with the kind of form we have seen, Welbeck or Chicharito would not have been good back ups for Rooney?
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You seem to be focusing on who all we have replaced rather than who all we had to replace.

What we've lost:
My point of listing those names was to highlight the scale of what we actually lost, none of which is debatable.

In addition to losing all those names, we've also leadership, winners, Manchester United men, and that isn't easy for the club either.

Regarding the ones you think we shouldn't have lost - Welbeck is never fit, ever, and w.r.t Kagawa, how many 10's do we need really? His place was gone when we signed Mata and Herrera. We do need to revamp our attack and that is, IMO, where our overhaul is incomplete.

Who we've replaced:
A better indicator, IMO, of who we have replaced is:

Martial - RVP replacement
Memphis - Giggs replacement
Schnederlin - Anderson replacement
Schweinsteiger - Cleverley replacement
Herrera and Mata - Scholes and Kagawa replacements
Darmian - Rafael replacement
Shaw - Evra replacement
Blind - Park/Evans/Buttner or Fabio replacement
Rojo - Evans/Buttner or Fabio replacement
Fellaini - Fletcher (makes up the numbers I suppose) replacment

I don't know how we could have done that without spending big. And I personally, wouldn't have liked to see this happening over a 3-4 year period. It had to happen quickly IMO. But yes, we could have either kept a couple, or bought a couple more. Our attack was left woefully short.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
I don't know how we could have done that without spending big. And I personally, wouldn't have liked to see this happening over a 3-4 year period. It had to happen quickly IMO. But yes, we could have either kept a couple, or bought a couple more. Our attack was left woefully short
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It should have happened over 3-4 years, but from 2011-2012.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Agreed. Ideally it should have begun sooner. But once new managers came it had to be done quickly.
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That's true and Van gaal did pretty well. Now he just needs to find a striker, a right winger and replace Fellaini.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Agreed. Ideally it should have begun sooner. But once new managers came it had to be done quickly.
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I agree that we should have done it sooner but to do it in one go was not the right approach. You cannot just replace the whole squad at once. If that were a feasible option without its repercussions, Abrahamovic would have done that with the Chelsea players when they undermined AVB. There is a reason massive changes are not made in one go. Sure not all players are starting quality but that is why we need squad players as well. The likes of JOS and Wes Brown would have been out of the door first if LVG had arrived earlier. The reason they were not is because SAF knew how to get the best out of average players who could play important roles in the squad in a long season. If we look at replacing every squad player, then obviously the rebuild will look bigger than required.
 
We need two strikers!! That should be priority. Fergie always had four out and out strikers and our lack of goals just proves that we're crying out for one. Rooney ain't getting the goals and Martial is just a kid. Maybe a big money move for Kane or heck even Ighalo or Mane. Just get them in!!
 
NK86 said:
I agree that we should have done it sooner but to do it in one go was not the right approach. You cannot just replace the whole squad at once. If that were a feasible option without its repercussions, Abrahamovic would have done that with the Chelsea players when they undermined AVB. There is a reason massive changes are not made in one go. Sure not all players are starting quality but that is why we need squad players as well. The likes of JOS and Wes Brown would have been out of the door first if LVG had arrived earlier. The reason they were not is because SAF knew how to get the best out of average players who could play important roles in the squad in a long season. If we look at replacing every squad player, then obviously the rebuild will look bigger than required.
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I agree with that. I can understand that LVG wasn't fond of some of our players (Welbeck, Hernandez, Nani, Evans, Kagawa), I backed him when he sold some of them but I still don't know how you can sell Hernandez, Nani and Kagawa at the end of the window without replacing them, I don't even understand why you can't keep them one more season, I don't understand the timing.
 
JPRouve said:
That's true and Van gaal did pretty well. Now he just needs to find a striker, a right winger and replace Fellaini.
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I'd argue that we need two wingers. So ST, two wingers and a number 10 to replace Rooney/Fellaini.

NK86 said:
I agree that we should have done it sooner but to do it in one go was not the right approach. You cannot just replace the whole squad at once. If that were a feasible option without its repercussions, Abrahamovic would have done that with the Chelsea players when they undermined AVB. There is a reason massive changes are not made in one go. Sure not all players are starting quality but that is why we need squad players as well. The likes of JOS and Wes Brown would have been out of the door first if LVG had arrived earlier. The reason they were not is because SAF knew how to get the best out of average players who could play important roles in the squad in a long season. If we look at replacing every squad player, then obviously the rebuild will look bigger than required.
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I partially agree with you, but only to the extent of possibly 2 players. We can fix that the coming summer, though, if we get our signings right.
 
JPRouve said:
I agree with that. I can understand that LVG wasn't fond of some of our players (Welbeck, Hernandez, Nani, Evans, Kagawa), I backed him when he sold some of them but I still don't know how you can sell Hernandez, Nani and Kagawa at the end of the window without replacing them, I don't even understand why you can't keep them one more season, I don't understand the timing.
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Exactly my point. You don't go about replacing squad players willy-nilly at one go. Makes very little sense.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
I'd argue that we need two wingers. So ST, two wingers and a number 10 to replace Rooney/Fellaini.
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We will also need a CB, if not this January then definitely in the summer. Blind is not a solution and Jones is just too injury prone. Not to mention, maybe a GK as well if DDG does finally move on.
 
NK86 said:
We will also need a CB, if not this January then definitely in the summer. Blind is not a solution and Jones is just too injury prone. Not to mention, maybe a GK as well if DDG does finally move on.
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Indeed.
 
Mane, Mahrez, Lukaku, Greizmann, Lucas, Isco ... There are enough out there that are more than good enough and that could be attainable.
 
The Guardian is reporting that City are preparing a bid for Sané. If we can't get Mané in January I definately hope that we are in for Sané as well.
 
Speak said:
Yes, it really is.
It's no better on paper than Redknapp's 11/12 Tottenham team. So expect similar results.

Stoke and Everton both have a better front three. And the midfield is one-paced, and sluggish.
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I sure hope you don't wan van Gaal fired then though because according to your assessment, he's leading the team to the place it belongs.
 
I just can't see us buying anyone in Jan....we need an overhaul and unfortunately the board will evaluate our position at the send of the season before we buy again.
 
You should go for Breel Embolo - start building for the future now. He's gettable.

I'd like to see him at Spurs, but I don't think it's achievable for us right now. If we finish in the top 4 then maybe that will change if no one else has snapped him up this January.
 
GlastonSpur said:
You should go for Breel Embolo - start building for the future now. He's gettable.

I'd like to see him at Spurs, but I don't think it's achievable for us right now. If we finish in the top 4 then maybe that will change if no one else has snapped him up this January.
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Will he want to risk moving mid season with euros around the corner?
 
Adisa said:
Will he want to risk moving mid season with euros around the corner?
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I don't know enough about the Swiss senior team to offer an opinion. Do they have a lot of other good striker options? If not, then he might not be taking much of a risk.

But the chance to play in the Prem for United would be a huge thing for him to turn down.
 
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