I'm confused, we absolutely should be getting a back up striker more in his ilk... but isn't Hojlund one of the most clinical finishers in the game when you look at the stats? Given the little amount of chances we create and his shots to goal ratio?
9
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 48
- Goals
- 10
- Assists
- 2
- Yellow cards
- 2
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Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) discuss United's fantastic win away against Athletic Club in the semi-final of the Europa League.
They also pick out the positives of United's 4-3 loss away at Brentford, and Nik reviews a day out at Old Trafford watching Manchester United Women qualify for the Champions League.
If you look at the best strikers over the last 10 years (apart from Haaland), most of them didn't peak until mid 20s and older. We have a gem in the making in Rasmus, he is only going to improve.
All the tools are there to be a great player, just needs service and to keep working hard.
That’s the one!
It was an impressive cameo but where Hojlund needs to perform is the PL. We’ve seen him have good games in Europe but our bread and butter is the PL and that’s where he gets shown up the most aside from his purple patches.
He really needs to improve in the league before I have any belief in him.
He really needs to improve in the league before I have any belief in him.
Just knowing where to be. You can tell the players don’t fully trust each others movement when it should be second nature. Bruno’s cross from the left was inches away. I like that he’s now trying to get in behind and pin his centre back closer to goal. If wed a more lively player on the left (like Mount) instead of Rashford I think we’d create a lot more in general.
so, so so much better than Rashford in pretty much every metric: goals, movement, passion, work rate
Not too sure about that.
Rashford, by virtue of playing on the wings have more ground to cover. Pretty sure Rashford outrun him every game.
To be fair, we haven't played too many top teams in Europe the last couple of seasons. He's consistently scored against any level of opponent in Europe over the past two seasons. Here's the teams we've met and how his goals is distributed: Bayern (1), Galatasaray (2), FC Copenhagen (2), Twente, Porto (1), Fenerbahce, PAOK, Bodø/Glimt (2), Plzen (2). In order for him to prove himself against better opponents it would require for us to actually start being competitive and stay longer in the competitions.
As for the league, he's scored 66% of his goals against mid/bottom teams (Brentford, Brighton, Sheffield United, West Ham, Wolves, Nottingham, Luton) and 33% against sub-top teams (Villa, Spurs, Newcastle).
If we compare that to someone like Gyokeres, he's scored 76% of his league goals against mid/bottom teams and 24% against the fellow top teams (Benfica, Porto). In a lesser league that is.
I agree that we need to start seeing goals against the best teams in the league. But I believe those goals would come, if we actually we're close to matching those teams when we're playing them. I'm not to worried about him - I'm more worried about a number of other positions.
There is something so innate about his skills in front of goal, he needs some work on his overall game, but he's young, that will come, but his natural instincts to put the ball in the back of the net can't be taught. Very excited about watching him develop, and excited to watch so many in this thread eat their words.
The ‘why’ is in the part of my past that you decided to cut out.
Oh give me a break. He came here 20 years old and scored 10 goals (0,42 per 90 minutes) in his first season for a dysfunctional team in the toughest league in the world.
Purple patches my a**. It’s not like he put on some magical boots and started scoring, he just got back from injury and built confidence. There’s no reason to believe he’ll fail to replicate that now he has a good manager who believes in him and play him to his strengths.
From your sensitive response to his criticism I can see why you fail to see that. Take the tinted glasses off and he is far away from a sure thing, he was a gamble when we signed him and is still a gamble now.
Every thread here mentions we need a new starting striker up front so clearly there are some question marks about him and most of this doubt comes from his league performances.
Let’s see how he gets on over this difficult run we have coming up and maybe I’ll change my mind but will you do the same?
At his age he just needs to show progress and improvement each year.
The great thing about CF is they are judged on their goals so it's a lot easier to track him compared to a CM. Easier for your average dumbarse fan on the internet, myself included.
Season 23/24
43 Games = 18 G/A
Season 24/25
17 Games = 8 G/A
I believe he will comfortable break lasts seasons numbers, and at this stage in his age/development that is all was can ask.
The great thing about CF is they are judged on their goals so it's a lot easier to track him compared to a CM. Easier for your average dumbarse fan on the internet, myself included.
Season 23/24
43 Games = 18 G/A
Season 24/25
17 Games = 8 G/A
I believe he will comfortable break lasts seasons numbers, and at this stage in his age/development that is all was can ask.
If only goals counted more if you take less shots to score them.
So that's what you took from that tweet?
All the per shot stats just seem so meaningless to me. It's the goals that count, not the number of shots. It is up to him to get more shots off as well as it is his team mates duty to feed him better.So that's what you took from that tweet?
Hope that last night spurs him into a purple patch here, he should be rubbing his hands at the thought of city at the weekend anyway.
Yeah, lies, damn lies and statistics,
right? I'm a fan but that gives a misleading picture of where he's at and his effectiveness on the pitch. He's no ninja assassin just waiting on a sniff before annihilating the opposition. But he's making progress and that'll do me for the moment.
right? I'm a fan but that gives a misleading picture of where he's at and his effectiveness on the pitch. He's no ninja assassin just waiting on a sniff before annihilating the opposition. But he's making progress and that'll do me for the moment.
His second goal was excellent and a strong example of an improvement on previous failings, bright, well timed movement, excellent use of his body to turn the defenders and then his usual good finish to round it off.
More of those improvements and a great many of us will be proven wrong about him, lets hope so at least.
More of those improvements and a great many of us will be proven wrong about him, lets hope so at least.
Yeah usually if a striker is significantly over performing his xG as Hojlund is, you expect that to drop down before long. It pretty much always happens. The ways for him to improve is to get in more scoring positions and get more shots off. Ronaldo didn't become a great goalscorer because he finished every chance available. He became a great goal scorer because he took more shots than any player in the world, and good shots at that to accumulate a high xG where it doesn't matter if you miss some big chances, you'll end up scoring eventually.
Hojlund is 92nd percentile in goals per 90... But 41st percentile in non penalty xG per 90. 2nd percentile in shots per 90.
Encouraging signs with Amorim. But it's important to recognize what things he actually needs to improve on.
Agree.
Looking at our team, where are we supposed to get goals?
Garnacho and Diallo are providing goals and assists at rate expected. at least for me.
Rashford, and to tell you the truth, Bruno as well, aren't giving us the goals as expected. Bruno still giving us assists at expected rate, Rashford gives us some assists but not at rate expected.
Ericksen gave us a little lift at beginning of season but has been a victim of rotation.
Mount needs to get and stay healthy.
But NOTHING from Casemeiro as far as goals/assists. What a dropoff...
He’s got the fundamentals to be world class eventually, he just needs more service, feels like he’s constantly feeding off scraps,
that Amad counter attack yesterday should have been put on a plate for him, we just have a lot of greedy players that want headlines and don’t always think about the best way to win as a team
that Amad counter attack yesterday should have been put on a plate for him, we just have a lot of greedy players that want headlines and don’t always think about the best way to win as a team
You were basically implying that he hadn’t showed anything in the PL. That, and the phrase “any belief in him”, was what I reacted to. I’m tired of claims based on falsehoods and it’s simply not true that he hasn’t shown he can score in the Prem. I’m also tired of fans criticizing players constantly, not only Hojlund though he does get it in unusually disproportionately high doses compared to his actual performances. Do you not think that 16 goals (including vs Bayern, Villa and Newcastle) is good for a young debutant in a struggling team?
That said I don’t think Pilzen was his best game for us. I also think he’s declined this season due mostly, though, to factors out of his control. But I think we have every reason to expect him to improve under Amorim - plenty of posts elaborate on why. Is it guaranteed? Of course not. And yes, I would also have liked him to have an experienced colleague with him up front.
Well it tells you one thing - that he’s been extremely clinical so far. That is quite important for a striker and very hard to learn. Even if his conversion rate drops a bit - and the law of averages tells us it probably will - it’s still very high. That means that when we sort out the issue of setting him up he will score bags of goals for us. That’s much easier to work on than his finishing.
Long may it continue!
If clinical is goals per taken shot, yes he is clinical. The best strikers in the league are quite clinical for the type of goals that Rasmus scores, but on top they take a lot of difficult shots with low likelihood of goal.. In the end it doesn’t matter how many goals per shot you score if the total count for goals is low.
Those stats are a bit misleading.
Newcastle are 12th position in the league and finished 7th last season.
Gyökeres scored 24% of his goals against the two top teams in his league. Those two top teams account for 12% of the teams in the league which means he scored relatively more against top teams than he did against the rest.
It's been said a ton but he has all the tools he's just not polished enough yet.
He needed a veteran in front of him. I think he's going to be brilliant though.
He needed a veteran in front of him. I think he's going to be brilliant though.
So after scoring against Bodo Glimpt and Victoria Plzen, basically 2 Championship level teams he's now tearing up the Europa league and is on fire.
Can only score against what he's facing, give the lad some credit.
This place sucks.
It doesn't, but conversion rate is still one of the most important metric to measure the quality of strikers, specifically the quality of their finishing
Someone that takes 100 shots to score 10 goals is significantly worse than someone who takes 15 shots to score 10 goals.
And this isn't even some obscure and convoluted data that have sprung up since xG started being used, conversion rate has been used since... the 2000s (?)
Which is precisely why, despite being our top scorer, Garnacho is regarded as a bad finisher, and is no coincidence we have massively massively under performed our xG this season.
If Garnacho stays the top scorer for us this season, we are done for.
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Who exactly did you want him to score them against?
A striker supposed to score goal and credit is due when he scores. I have my own doubt about him but scoring certainly helps to have some hope. Next is consistent performance. Not expecting him to score or assist in every match. Just have good run of games. That should help.
Totally agree if we sign Osimhen or Gyokeres he’ll be perfect as rotational and in some games we play 3412 rather than 3421 we need that 26/27 Marqee Striker who he can learn from.
What about if we compare someone who takes 100 shots to score 50 goals with someone who takes 15 shots to score 10 goals.
One has 0.5 goal per shot, while the other one has 0.66 goal per shot. So is this really most important metric to say that the quality of striker with 15 shots to score 10 goals is better than 100 shots to score 50 goals?
The answer is no. There are lot of factors why players takes less shots. One is due to lack of services. So what’s the reasons of lack services? This can be various factors such as strikers have poor movement and position hence the ball rarely being available for the striker or strikers have poor general hold up play hence it’s difficult to get the ball in dangerous position if strikers always ruin the pattern of play. Movement, positioning, and hold up play also part of important play to judge striker.
In addition, a striker with 15 shots to score 10 goals (0.66 goals per shot) doesn’t mean the same striker will be able to do 75 shots to score 50 goals (0.66 goals per shot) or something similar to 0.66 conversion rate. Because the more chances you’re given, the higher the pressure for a striker to convert the chances into goals. This also depends on the striker’s mentality whether the striker can handle the pressure on his shoulder being the main guy.
Therefore, conversion rate is not one of the most important metric to measure the quality of strikers. There are lot of factors need to be taken into consideration to judge the conversion rate stats.
It's all about service. Both of our wingback should be creating chances for him. Both of our 10s should. None of them are doing so consistently.
Dalot is providing no attacking threat. Neither really is Rashford or Malacia when he plays.
Replacing these with players capable of attacking team play would be a massive level up. There is little point in talking about a Rasmus upgrade until that is done.
A prime Cole or McClair would starve on the slim pickings they would get in this team.
Dalot is providing no attacking threat. Neither really is Rashford or Malacia when he plays.
Replacing these with players capable of attacking team play would be a massive level up. There is little point in talking about a Rasmus upgrade until that is done.
A prime Cole or McClair would starve on the slim pickings they would get in this team.
If you take Nunez and Rasmus and they both get 10 chances in a match, who is most likely to score?