I see this mostly in his mentality. His head has dropped a bit with this barren spell, he no longer charges around the pitch like he did in his first few games full of enthusiasm. He looks meek and a bit scared on the pitch now. This club just seems to have a habit of doing that to players.
9
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 43
- Goals
- 16
- Assists
- 2
- Yellow cards
- 2
- Status
13 games. Zero goals. Zero assists. Is he PL quality? Will he flop? That's alot of pressure on the 20 year old's shoulders.
United overpay for players. I wouldn't have splashed £72million on him. I've seen highlights of his game and I don't think he's worth that much.
United overpay for players. I wouldn't have splashed £72million on him. I've seen highlights of his game and I don't think he's worth that much.
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Watkins is a very good striker. Ok, not world class but defo striker who makes a difference. Look at his goals this season; some of those goals are scored from nothing and those chances would be labelled as half chances for Hojlund.
Unbelievable how this guy is still underrated among fans.
He's going like I expected. When we signed him, it screamed for us to bring in an experienced striker as well for hoijlund to learn from and also so that he's not starting every game
Added to the fact that your first line is what I've seen too. His runs are decreasing more and more and that's because he's not getting the ball and his enthusiasm is dropping game by game. If we were giving him service he would still make those runs. The number of passes he receives has dropped and thus he's making less of those runs, and you know it will happen that the cross will eventually come and he won't be there.
He really should have scored by now in the league. The one against Liverpool isn't defining as many have missed a chance similar v allisson. However I think that also could have kick started him in a game like that. We really need to put a few on a platter for him which I think would get him going
Its really physical tools and attitude, the combination of size, strength, speed, and seemingly a very willing runner and worker.
I think posters are right when they say that this type of striker often only really comes into his own in his mid 20s and is very rarely a difference-making player at 20. He hasn't really learned how to use his physical tools to impact the game when playing against other very good athletes who are playing in an organized shape and he doesn't have other clubs in his bag like dribbling, shooting from distance, control in tight spaces, etc. Almost all his goals in Italy were scored against mid-to-lower table opposition with defenders that couldn't hang with him athletically and almost all involved running behind the defense or charging at a disorganized defense on the break. Most of his CL scores have been of the same variety.
I think there is a lot of hope for him yet but if he comes good he'll most likely be a Callum Wilson, Ivan Toney, or Ollie Watkins type player who is an athletic menace that eventually learns how to score, maybe Didier Drogba in the ultimate best case scenario. He'll never be a Lewandowski, Kane, etc type because those guys had much more ability to strike, pass, and manipulate a football, even at 20 before they really made it big.
He will score a league goal... one day.
His problems are due to awful planning. He should have been starting on the right hand side with an experienced striker signed to play through the middle, or coming on as a sub as their replacement.
This would have meant far less pressure on him in terms of leading the line, give him more time on the ball (which would probably stop him from snatching at chances) and give him more space and to find angles to get shots off. He honestly couldn't be any worse than Anthony.
Totally ridiculous that we signed a 20 year old with less than a season in Serie A to lead the line for us. We're simply not creating the correct environment for our players to shine and we need to stop blaming them. Some of them might not be good enough, but they're rarely given the chance to prove otherwise.
Does anyone honestly think Haaland would even be in double figures playing for us this season being fed by the likes Anthony and Rashford?
This would have meant far less pressure on him in terms of leading the line, give him more time on the ball (which would probably stop him from snatching at chances) and give him more space and to find angles to get shots off. He honestly couldn't be any worse than Anthony.
Totally ridiculous that we signed a 20 year old with less than a season in Serie A to lead the line for us. We're simply not creating the correct environment for our players to shine and we need to stop blaming them. Some of them might not be good enough, but they're rarely given the chance to prove otherwise.
Does anyone honestly think Haaland would even be in double figures playing for us this season being fed by the likes Anthony and Rashford?
If Ronaldo could manage it I can't see any reason why Haaland can't. I think a lot of people are watching these guys play and wondering why they can't find young Rasmus. I'm actually convinced they're seeing him but don't want to pass to him - possibly due to a lack of trust.
I would try him out wide. At the very least, he can do some damage with his pace.
He was better at Newcastle.
If our players had shown the same desire to assist him as they did to get Ronaldo a goal during his drought last season then I think he'd have a few more goals by now. It's quite strange in that they must know it's probably harming his confidence.
I've been disappointed with some aspects of his game I have to admit. He's still really young and asking him to be our main striker was a ridiculous amount of pressure but I wish he was a bit more involved in games and the ball stuck to him a bit more. Finding him in the box is a criticism i'd make more of our other attacking players but when he gets the ball a bit deeper he could hold it a bit better. Early days though.
I've been disappointed with some aspects of his game I have to admit. He's still really young and asking him to be our main striker was a ridiculous amount of pressure but I wish he was a bit more involved in games and the ball stuck to him a bit more. Finding him in the box is a criticism i'd make more of our other attacking players but when he gets the ball a bit deeper he could hold it a bit better. Early days though.
We're talking this season though, we've been playing much worse than when he was here.
We also had Pogba, Sancho and Cavani in the team back then. I know they weren't the most popular players here, but if you don't think they offered more creativity than the likes of Rashford, Anthony and Amrabat I don't really know what to tell you.
Haaland is the only striker with fewer touches than Højlund out of all the starting forwards in the league, but he's being fed by the likes of Doku, Grealish, Forden and Silva who are all often camped around the opposition's box. Let's not pretend he'd be getting the same kind of service here and he's hardly the type to create for himself out of nothing. He's clearly superior, but my point is that there aren't many out and out strikers who would thrive in our team. It would take a prime Van Persie type who can regularly create something out of nothing to get a decent goal return for us.
This post has just reminded me how far our standards have fallen in such a short period of time. It's really not Højlund's fault he isn't ready though, he is only 20 after all.
I wonder how Murtough's and Erik's conversation looked like when they were planning this season? Erik said many times last year how our major problem is lack of striker's goals. And then they decide to buy unproven striker with average goal record.
What was idea behind that? Did Erik seriously think that Hojlund will score many goals this season?
Shambolic planning. But that is what you get when you don't have proper DoF.
What was idea behind that? Did Erik seriously think that Hojlund will score many goals this season?
Shambolic planning. But that is what you get when you don't have proper DoF.
You have to read the whole of that post together - yes, in an attacking sense, we're playing worse but why? I could be wrong but I believe it's because the main players in the attacking unit don't want to pass to Hojlund. Only Antony seems to make the effort. You don't see the same sort of reluctance to pass when Martial is playing.
It's not like we're creating a lot of chances for Martial, or in general when he's on the pitch. It's not a very cohesive unit atm, and although Hojlund is obviously a part of that I don't think there'd be much difference unless we put a striker who plays quite differently in the side.
Get Toney in and let this guy practice on the training field. Was a criminal decision to make him our number 1. He’s now doubting himself.
He'd be great for us.
I'd like to see Hojlund wide right occasionally. Not saying as a primary tactic, but now and then. It'd help him get more involved in possesion, build some confidence, take some of the immediate pressure off to score. Cutting in from the left, or just arriving at the back post, he might even be more likely to grab a goal.
That's actually a decent idea. Then we can finally also promote McTominay as the centre forward
That's not a reasonable thing to say. How do you skip over Bruno and mention Amrabat instead? Your previous post mentions Rashford and Antony specifically, so I made the comparison with the wingers Ronaldo actually played with, who of course, would have been Rashford, Sancho and Elanga. Sancho and Elanga are like-for-like substitutes with Antony, productivity-wise.
That is all moot, as Ronaldo's assists actually came from the entire team not a particular player. In fact, the one player who provided the most assists for Ronaldo in that season was Telles, with a grand total of 2. The rest, at least by April 24th, were Elanga, Matic, Bruno, Fred, McTominay, Rashford, Sancho, and Shaw with one each, with the starters from that list highlighted.
Of the highlighted starters, 4 of 6 are still established players here. The team hasn't changed all that much - the way they play has changed as they've gone from being built around Ronaldo, to being built around our inside forwards.
If Haaland was here, it would be the same as in Ronaldo's full season here. The team would be built around him because he's sure to get you goals with service. You don't sense that sort of confidence with Hojlund and that reflects in more selfish passing decisions.
No, but that illustrates a crucial distinction - there's not passing and there's not creating chances.
Martial gets way more passes fed into him but when an attacker plays a pass to a player like Martial, you're not looking necessarily to create for him, you're looking for him to hold the ball long enough for you to get into a good position to get the ball back. It makes a world of difference to the passing decisions a winger has to then make, especially if they back themselves to score more than they trust the striker. I should say this probably applies more to Rashford and Garnacho as Antony does seem to try to find Hojlund. Secondly, when you do look to create for Martial, you probably have a little more confidence that he's going to take the chance or at least not lose the ball to a poor first touch.
The point is, the players not passing to Hojlund is not accidental.
What
I’d think most people would disagree, he became a more all rounded striker at United, he had to because of how we played.
Fair points. I do think he is a special talent, yes. He is very quick, strong and has good movement off the ball in attack and good positioning in the press. He does a decent job but doesn’t score enough. As many have said in other posts on here, most of the prolific no9s didn’t score regularly until they were a bit older than Rasmus is.
I wouldn’t say he has no business playing every week. To do that he only needs to be the best option we’ve got (and he probably is). I agree we need goals but, again, none of our guys are scoring and you have to consider the likelihood that many proven strikers would be blunted in our current team.
Both the team and Rasmus may yet start scoring but it sure is frustrating at the moment. I’d be very much in favour of signing another forward to replace Martial, preferably a guy who can play from the right and down the middle but I can’t think of anyone we could get.
I really dont see the 'special talent'. He's fairly quick, but cant hold the ball up, poor first touch, cant create chances for himself. He doesnt get much service but did we spend £70m on a young player who needs great service to score....
We spent 70 million because of the Glazers. Thats why we overpaid for Antony, thats why we bought Fellaini so late and paid much more when we could have got him earlier and cheaper.
If we had been quick and got a cheap established striker first and then got Højlund, as soon as it was clear Kane was not a possibility, we could probably have got both for the same price.
The pricetag is completely irrelevant because of our setup. We have zero footballing structure and thus we always pay much more than we have to.
I would add to this that he also has mediocre positioning, especially when we're counter attacking.
Nonsense.
The lad is totally up against it playing for us at the moment so I feel for him. He's very young, raw and still learning the game.
Something I found interesting was in comparing the sort of chance creation other teams above us, who were scoring goals regularly had. I looked at the last five games for each club and generally speaking, the numbers of shots both on and off target in a game where these teams were scoring goals was way beyond the chances we've created in our last five games.
It made me appreciate that missing a lot of chances really is part of the game and even the best teams need a lot of chances to get a couple of goals more often than not. Judging by the stats I saw, even an experienced striker might not make the difference we'd expect given how few shots we're getting off lately with even less on target.
So my point is ultimately that it's too much to expect regular goals from an inexperienced striker when we're not even creating near the volume of chances better teams than us need to score goals regularly.
Something I found interesting was in comparing the sort of chance creation other teams above us, who were scoring goals regularly had. I looked at the last five games for each club and generally speaking, the numbers of shots both on and off target in a game where these teams were scoring goals was way beyond the chances we've created in our last five games.
It made me appreciate that missing a lot of chances really is part of the game and even the best teams need a lot of chances to get a couple of goals more often than not. Judging by the stats I saw, even an experienced striker might not make the difference we'd expect given how few shots we're getting off lately with even less on target.
So my point is ultimately that it's too much to expect regular goals from an inexperienced striker when we're not even creating near the volume of chances better teams than us need to score goals regularly.
What
I’d think most people would disagree, he became a more all rounded striker at United, he had to because of how we played.
I think the point being learning from experience and improve your technical ability are two different things. Andy Cole just grow with the level it wasn’t a technical ability improvement. Hence why the point I believe he was trying to make was that he scored at a higher rate at Newcastle.
You mean because of lack of DoF and managers deciding they want to work with "their" players (Fellaini, Antony) again? That is probably true, but the problem is we shouldn't have gone for those players (including Hojlund) in the first place, regardless of price.
Seems to me like we paid serious money for Hojlund and I find it difficult to believe there were no other options in that price range. I think if we bring another senior striker this winter then Hojlund is a reasonable gamble, but if we don't then it's plain stupid transfer.
I think he highlights the symptomatic issues around world football in his position. The lack of quality number 9s is shocking. Its a dying breed. And the upcoming ones don't really do it for me.
I'm all flued up at the moment so decided to watch highlights of cavani, ibrahimovic, ronaldos goals while here. The movement and finishing was incredible even though these players were playing in front of flawed midfields.
I would still give hojlund the benefit of doubt as we really don't create enough.
I'm all flued up at the moment so decided to watch highlights of cavani, ibrahimovic, ronaldos goals while here. The movement and finishing was incredible even though these players were playing in front of flawed midfields.
I would still give hojlund the benefit of doubt as we really don't create enough.
Not sure I get the Toney vote. A third of his PL goals are penalties. Obv that’s better than Rasmus because he’s somehow avoided scoring even once. Short term he’d probably be okay, especially if we get him in Jan and offload that waster Martial. Wouldn’t overspend on him though, plus I think Arsenal will get him. Rarely easy finding a bargain in Jan.
Yeah, he became complete striker with us. In Newcastle he was pure poacher.What
I’d think most people would disagree, he became a more all rounded striker at United, he had to because of how we played.
But in terms of Hojlund debate; Cole from early days had that nose for goal and space. He knew where to stand in penalty box and how to position himself. It is not coincidence how some strikers are "always in chance".
Hojlund doesn't have that (yet).
As i said to some posters earlier; look at goals which Watkins scored last two years. Lots of them are out of nothing. And Watkins is not Mbappe or Kane for whom you can say that he is world class player. Quality strikers will create chance for themselves and not use excuse about no service.
He may have scored at a higher rate at Newcastle but you need to take context into consideration - one season was championship and secondly Newcastle played all the chances into him not off him. He was essentially a version of Ian rush for Newcastle.
when he came to United he had to expand his game considerably and add stuff like hold up play, bringing others into the attack, running the channels more etc. he was a far better footballer leaving United
And it wasn’t just about learning from experience his first touch improved for example
We need to get another striker if we want to finish in the top 5 and I rate Hojlund but he isn't ready to lead the line.
I would agree with you if that’s how we played, we play deep and are expecting Hojlund to get the ball, use his frame to hold off stronger CBs than he’s used to then get into the box hoping for a cross. (Which never comes). We are playing off him not into him.
Cole was fantastic for us, but he had great fullbacks crossing (Irwin was superb at supporting the attack), Giggs, Beckham, Scholes etc to create chances which came by the bucket load for Cole and co.
in the league Hojlund looks stifled at the moment, we are doing little it seems to help him get this monkey off his back. Whilst in the CL were chances are more available we saw what potential he has. I think he’s got a very high ceiling but we need to support him more and a backup striker to give him time out or to play alongside him wouldn’t go amiss!
That’s the point you are missing. He’s first touch stayed the same. He just got to the level of his new teammates. It wasn’t like he didn’t come here and not deliver. The most goals scored in a game for us is 5 and he holds that record.
Ryan Giggs changed his whole game at the end of his career but he already had the intelligence skillset to do so. His requirements just changed. At the minute we don’t have a blood clue what Hojlund is. However not his fault the whole planning for this season was not good enough. Next season hopefully under new management (I.e. those running the club) ensure he is in the best environment to do so. Also the manager has to know what he wants from him.
Cole had Cantona to play alongside when he joined us, Hojlund has Mctominay. Its no surprise he looks stifled like you say.
But that is the point YOU are missing. Andy Cole’s first touch improved ten fold whilst at United. It had too
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