Ralf Rangnick | ex-interim manager | does anyone rate him?

[DSG]

Im more than happy to discuss my comment, not this "whatabout" that is just a circular discussion.

Im not even criticizing Ragnick. Im trying to discuss what the interim manager should be doing over the next 14 games to get us to top4, and if a brand new system we are allegedly not able to play is the right way to do it.

There’s already a group of Caf members who believe Ralf shits gold and is above any criticism. Conveniently, they also are claiming to be fine with not making top 4.

I agree with you—we are trying to make the top 4, and anyone who thinks otherwise is not thinking logically. Man Utd is a publicly listed company with a board of directors. The CEO and the board are tasked with maximizing revenue and profit. CL qualification is worth roughly 70-80m or 20% of our annual revenue.

Although we are still in the race for fourth, I think Ralf should be judged on results, and so far, the results have been underwhelming. I truly hope he can turn it around and get Cristiano firing again, but I’m not optimistic. Too many problems defensively and not enough productivity in front of goal. There is a lot chatter about how we are better defensively since Ralf joined… Well, yes, but look at the competition. The way we looked vs So’ton, if we play that way vs City, we’ll absolutely be ripped apart.

 

[ronaldinhoisagoat]

If we don't make top-4 this season after coming 3rd and 2nd in the last 2 seasons, then RR has failed as a manager. And if RR has failed as a manager then I'm not sure what leverage he will have as a "consultant" against a manager like Poch or ETH, who will simply ask him that if his ideas are so great then why did he perform so poorly in the League. His job will be useless, his inputs will be discounted. How many of you would listen to a boss who has failed his way upwards?
Alternatively we get a guy like Rose or Hasenhuttl who are going to be grateful for an opportunity to be here, but they may get intimidated by players or not be able to implement RR's vision. Then its another rebuild.

We should've signed Conte - enough of this rebuild bulls---t. Can you imagine Barca/Madrid/Bayern/Juve/City talking about a multi-year rebuild? Our ambitions are so low that we have willed ourselves into believing that missing out on top-4 is a good thing because it will allow for another f-ing REBUILD! We are Rebuild United FC!

 

[bond19821982]

I also am surprised Mejbri hasn't been given time. I thought he had a reputation of giving youngsters game time?

Do you know that he is just back from 2 international tournaments and started training with senior team just now ?

For a start, have you even seen him play ? Jeez, the place is way over the top at times. We don't even know if the player is ready and the armchair experts are at it.

 

[Hansi Fick]

Im more than happy to discuss my comment, not this "whatabout" that is just a circular discussion.

Im not even criticizing Ragnick. Im trying to discuss what the interim manager should be doing over the next 14 games to get us to top4, and if a brand new system we are allegedly not able to play is the right way to do it.

You're right in pointing out that it's absurd to talk about an interim manager in a way to fault the players for not being able to play the system.
However, I'm pretty sure that's not what's going on.
I'm 100% certain that Rangnick is under no illusions what the point of an interim manager is and that he is focused on getting results with this team as it is, the best way he knows how to.

 

[tenpoless]

Funny to see a few of Ole staunch defenders quickly criticizing Rangnick when they were hell bent on defending Ole until the end where both the performances and results were much worse than now. Hypocrite much?
For me top 4 is a must. Then we should get a new manager and move Rangnick up.

 

[Greck]

Funny to see a few of Ole staunch defenders quickly criticizing Rangnick when they were hell bent on defending Ole until the end where both the performances and results were much worse than now. Hypocrite much?
For me top 4 is a must. Then we should get a new manager and move Rangnick up.

Anyone still holding vigils for these previous managers who ruined us need to be on their way. Ole basically turned us into Tottenham.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

You're right in pointing out that it's absurd to talk about an interim manager in a way to fault the players for not being able to play the system.
However, I'm pretty sure that's not what's going on.
I'm 100% certain that Rangnick is under no illusions what the point of an interim manager is and that he is focused on getting results with this team as it is, the best way he knows how to.

The alternative to Ralf method is that we need to go back to counter attacking football because of lack of fitness of our players and inexperience to press which will set us back to modernize the style of play next season.

I rather we do it now and enjoy much better football next season. This season is gone. Just hope we can get Top 4 and go far in CL.

 

[sunama]

The alternative to Ralf method is that we need to go back to counter attacking football because of lack of fitness of our players and inexperience to press which will set us back to modernize the style of play next season.

I rather we do it now and enjoy much better football next season. This season is gone. Just hope we can get Top 4 and go far in CL.

I agree with what you are saying, but I do believe that next season is write-off. The new manager will need one season to bed in, before doing something special season after next.
Unfortunately, we are consistently the club will come good next season.....but that never happens.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

I agree with what you are saying, but I do believe that next season is write-off. The new manager will need one season to bed in, before doing something special season after next.
Unfortunately, we are consistently the club will come good next season.....but that never happens.

The problem was we can't stick to a style of play after SAF retired. Now with DOF, TD, consultant and whatnot, hopefully we can stick to this modern attacking football however painful it will be for short term.

There is no alternative solution if we want long term success. Unless we want to go back to negative counter attacking football.

 

[Morpheus 7]

You obviously can't blame Ralf for our overall position, it's not been good though so far. The players have shown themselves up too, mentality so bad since he came in. That said, he's here to manage and get results. Get the best out of what he has, we can chat about time to implement a system ect, fact is the football has been poor so far. Being outplayed by Wolves, Southampton and getting embarrassed by Boro at Old Trafford ain't good enough. We have seen a half against Palace, too little so far in my opinion.

Reputation and talk is cheap, need to see more on the pitch. Maybe it takes 6 months, it's been turbulent for him and the players being rats, lack of backing in the window hasn't helped. I don't see a press, plan or control though. I see some players still getting away with poor performances like Maguire, no consequences. The last two games have been identical, played okay in the first 30 minutes, dropped off for rest of game. Didn't deserve to win either against poor opposition. Time will tell but Ralph has started poorly in my opinion.

 

[sglowrider]

Funny to see a few of Ole staunch defenders quickly criticizing Rangnick when they were hell bent on defending Ole until the end where both the performances and results were much worse than now. Hypocrite much?
For me top 4 is a must. Then we should get a new manager and move Rangnick up.

Nah. After Ralf leaves, the Caf will be slagging off Ralf and bigging up the new manager whoever he is and claim the same thing that was accused of the previous manager. Then when that new manager leaves the Caf will be slagging off the previous new manager and bigging up the new, new manager.

How often have praised any previous manager with the exception of Fergie unless a lot of time has passed? Like Big Ron, Tommy Doc. I bet in a decade or so, Jose, Ole will be long upon highly. Time tends to reduce or eliminate the crap and highlight the positives --- and thus nostalgia or the yearning for it is a powerful force ala MAGA or BREXIT.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

It's hard to walk into a train wreck of a season with confidence so low and the squad imbalanced. But it's hard to say that Rangnick has done well because aside from stopping the flood (which is a leak now) he's done very little in his time so far.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

The problem was we can't stick to a style of play after SAF retired. Now with DOF, TD, consultant and whatnot, hopefully we can stick to this modern attacking football however painful it will be for short term.

There is no alternative solution if we want long term success. Unless we want to go back to negative counter attacking football.

Many question marks though. Will we get rid of Ronaldo? Will we hire the right man or someone who is just about decent? Will the key signings we have to make especially given the issues this season has created, be good enough? Hopefully we get the 2nd right. That can resolve many other issues. And stop being ruled by sentiment.

 

[mav_9me]

Do you know that he is just back from 2 international tournaments and started training with senior team just now ?

For a start, have you even seen him play ? Jeez, the place is way over the top at times. We don't even know if the player is ready and the armchair experts are at it.

Yes I know and yes I have seen him play. And I have wanted to see him in the first team for a while now. Obviously the coaches know better. But in this struggling team, I was looking for some hope.

 

[Greck]

Nah. After Ralf leaves, the Caf will be slagging off Ralf and bigging up the new manager whoever he is and claim the same thing that was accused of the previous manager. Then when that new manager leaves the Caf will be slagging off the previous new manager and bigging up the new, new manager.

How often have praised any previous manager with the exception of Fergie unless a lot of time has passed? Like Big Ron, Tommy Doc. I bet in a decade or so, Jose, Ole will be long upon highly. Time tends to reduce or eliminate the crap and highlight the positives --- and thus nostalgia or the yearning for it is a powerful force ala MAGA or BREXIT.

Only permanent managers who fail are slagged. The slagging Ole gets isn't some irrational unfair phenomenon. If Ralf is made permanent, spends hundreds of millions and underdelivers silverware and success then yes he should be slagged like Ole and Jose.

 

[Mr PG]

Football fans really lack insight. Wolves were losing every game early in the season and their board stuck with Bruno Lage/ Same as Southampton they had a nightmare last season. Anyone who understands football can see what Ralf is trying to implement. Fitness was up until the international break and he's had to build it up back again combined with integrating new players like Pogba and missing Key players like Fred and Telles has disrupted alot of his plans but you can see a team emerging from the fog. We will all moon about Soton and Ralf should have made subs sooner and he's saddled with an ageing 37 yr old Striker upfront who throes a tantrum when substituted.

 

[Foxbatt]

The problem was we can't stick to a style of play after SAF retired. Now with DOF, TD, consultant and whatnot, hopefully we can stick to this modern attacking football however painful it will be for short term.

There is no alternative solution if we want long term success. Unless we want to go back to negative counter attacking football.

The problem is that neither the DOF nor the TD has had much knowledge or experience. Just appointing people willynilly because they had some connections to SAF and the club. The sooner these people get culled the better it's for Manchester United.

 

[D. Mungai]

David Ornstein has a new development, that we shall hire deputy director of football.

100% sure that's Ralf position from June.

Part of it...


There was fresh disappointment for Manchester United on Saturday as they were held at home by Southampton to deepen frustrations at Old Trafford, amid a turbulent chapter in the club’s history.

Across the nine years since Sir Alex Ferguson left as manager, following a 20th and still their most recent league title, United have experienced an enormous amount of change on and off the pitch.

Among the key decisions made in the past 12 months was promoting John Murtough from head of football development to football director and Darren Fletcher from an academy coach to technical director.

This is seen as a fundamental area as United try to modernise their football set-up and ultimately recapture former glories, with Murtough in particular taking on a growing range of responsibilities.

Numerous departments and people report into Murtough, including Fletcher, and it has become clear to United that the workload is too much for one person and he would benefit from support.

They have therefore opted, The Athletic can reveal, to appoint a deputy football director who will work under Murtough and help strengthen an increasingly prominent side of United’s operations.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Do you know that he is just back from 2 international tournaments and started training with senior team just now ?

For a start, have you even seen him play ? Jeez, the place is way over the top at times. We don't even know if the player is ready and the armchair experts are at it.

Mejbri didn't get much game time in the AFCON did he? Not sure he's ready for the PL if so. If you look at his rivals in that squad they play for clubs like Bronby, Ferencvaros and St Etienne.

 

[romufc]

Missing the point completely, Van Gaal's idea of controlling a game meant 3 chances in 90 minutes and probably a similar number for the opposition despite the possession disparity. And as expected, 3 chances isn't enough as you'll rarely convert 2 or 3 out of 3. This football got us nowhere, falling to get top 4.

Lazy analysis of Ole's football too, no tactics but Pep couldn't get the better of him most of the time. Sure, Ole couldn't get us to the next level, but on the whole it was a better level than the rubbish under Ralf. No new manager bounce says it all and judging Ole on the performances at the end isn't a fair reflection.

Ultimately our main problems are with the squad, and planting any manager with them will only have limited success. Bad apples have well and truly spoiled the whole squad, that will need sorting first before we can get decent results from any manager, I just hope the football is nothing like what it was under Van Gaal.

Van Gaal and Rangnick's idea of controlling the game is different. We created 3/4 chances in the 30/40 minutes of control.

No, its not really lazy, the tactics we deployed against Pep whenever Ole beat him is a tactic used by Burnley, Palace and the like against big teams, defend deep and hit on the counter. With this tactic, there is a heavy reliance on keeping it level and not letting the opponent score first. Everytime City scored first, the game was over. That is not tactics, its survival only.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

David Ornstein has a new development, that we shall hire deputy director of football.

100% sure that's Ralf position from June.

Part of it...


There was fresh disappointment for Manchester United on Saturday as they were held at home by Southampton to deepen frustrations at Old Trafford, amid a turbulent chapter in the club’s history.

Across the nine years since Sir Alex Ferguson left as manager, following a 20th and still their most recent league title, United have experienced an enormous amount of change on and off the pitch.

Among the key decisions made in the past 12 months was promoting John Murtough from head of football development to football director and Darren Fletcher from an academy coach to technical director.

This is seen as a fundamental area as United try to modernise their football set-up and ultimately recapture former glories, with Murtough in particular taking on a growing range of responsibilities.

Numerous departments and people report into Murtough, including Fletcher, and it has become clear to United that the workload is too much for one person and he would benefit from support.

They have therefore opted, The Athletic can reveal, to appoint a deputy football director who will work under Murtough and help strengthen an increasingly prominent side of United’s operations.

WHy would Ralf be a deputy to Murtough? His position is as a consultant, as reported before. Knowing the board, this will likely be Evra, Carrick or Rio.

 

[Real Name]

So let me get this right, guys in media were full of praise for Ragnick but now results arent going his way they're all about him being a coach for 2 years in 10 or whatever, that includes Scholes who, legendary player as he war, is a very bad pundit, downright awful even.
You even have guys like Shearer writing articles now.

 

[DRJosh]

Rob Dawson with a click-baity piece, but Ralf is quite right in that he didn't get a full pre season.

https://www.espn.com.au/football/ma...e-if-manchester-united-miss-top-four-rangnick

Ralf Rangnick says former manager Ole Gunnar Solskjaer will have to shoulder some of the blame if Manchester United miss out on a place in the top four this season.

United are stuttering in the race of Champions League football after successive draws with Burnley and Southampton.

Rangnick admits he is "concerned" about their prospects of finishing in the top four but insists Solskjaer, sacked in November after a run of five defeats in seven league fixtures, is also responsible.

 

[pawanraj]

Ralf is only here for 6 months. That has a bearing on how invested players are in following his instructions. Not to mention a bunch of players are just playing out the last bit of their contracts.

Ralf doesn't seem particularly interested in pursuing a career in football management either - he is a "consultant", and has a 2 year consulting gig when the 6 months are over. I don't think Rangnick will want a permanent role after this season ends anyway.

And because of this, when he joined, I had mentally resigned myself to finish 6th this season, with the hope that in his two consulting years, Ralf Rangnick can work with the permanent manager(s) to put us on a path to having an identity on the field of play. I don't think anything has changed for me to revise that opinion.

 

[Laurencio]

Seeing how critical people are of RR, while being one of those that sees clear progress and thinking it’s just a matter of time before it clicks and we start finishing chances, makes me realise what those supporting Ole for his last year were feeling when we were criticising him.

I really do feel bad for him, since it’s obvious to me that he’s implementing something and the players are letting him down. The January window was a great opportunity for the club to really show that they trusted him long term and that his vision would align with the next manager’s vision. Instead, we just got rid of a bunch of players without adding anyone and we’ll likely miss out on top four this season. That’ll make it a much more gruelling task to rebuild in the summer and will lead to us again having to overpay in terms of wages and have an untenable wage structure with mid-tier players being on top-tier wages.

Most of the time it's post game rants

David Ornstein has a new development, that we shall hire deputy director of football.

100% sure that's Ralf position from June.

Part of it...


There was fresh disappointment for Manchester United on Saturday as they were held at home by Southampton to deepen frustrations at Old Trafford, amid a turbulent chapter in the club’s history.

Across the nine years since Sir Alex Ferguson left as manager, following a 20th and still their most recent league title, United have experienced an enormous amount of change on and off the pitch.

Among the key decisions made in the past 12 months was promoting John Murtough from head of football development to football director and Darren Fletcher from an academy coach to technical director.

This is seen as a fundamental area as United try to modernise their football set-up and ultimately recapture former glories, with Murtough in particular taking on a growing range of responsibilities.

Numerous departments and people report into Murtough, including Fletcher, and it has become clear to United that the workload is too much for one person and he would benefit from support.

They have therefore opted, The Athletic can reveal, to appoint a deputy football director who will work under Murtough and help strengthen an increasingly prominent side of United’s operations.

I just want to point out that 12 months ago one man was in charge of all that, the marketing department and being the CEO. Now we need 4 people - The DoF, his mentor/consultant (Rangnick), a deputy and a technical director.

No wonder things haven't worked.

 

[Zehner]

According to understat, you were 12th in the xG/xPTS table under Solskjaer and now are third over the Rangnick period. Personally I think that's a very, very good development, especially considering the off the pitch distractions (Greenwood, Lingard, Martial, Ronaldo). If I was a United fan, I'd be convincednthe team is heading into the right direction. The results will come eventually.

 

[Adnan]

David Ornstein has a new development, that we shall hire deputy director of football.

100% sure that's Ralf position from June.

Part of it...


There was fresh disappointment for Manchester United on Saturday as they were held at home by Southampton to deepen frustrations at Old Trafford, amid a turbulent chapter in the club’s history.

Across the nine years since Sir Alex Ferguson left as manager, following a 20th and still their most recent league title, United have experienced an enormous amount of change on and off the pitch.

Among the key decisions made in the past 12 months was promoting John Murtough from head of football development to football director and Darren Fletcher from an academy coach to technical director.

This is seen as a fundamental area as United try to modernise their football set-up and ultimately recapture former glories, with Murtough in particular taking on a growing range of responsibilities.

Numerous departments and people report into Murtough, including Fletcher, and it has become clear to United that the workload is too much for one person and he would benefit from support.

They have therefore opted, The Athletic can reveal, to appoint a deputy football director who will work under Murtough and help strengthen an increasingly prominent side of United’s operations.

This makes sense, there's 20-25 departments at United, which is too much for one person. Zorc at BvB has Sebastian Kehl to assist him. Marco Neppe assists Salihamidzic at Bayern, and Overmars had Gerry Hamstra assisting him at Ajax, before he resigned.

 

[VidaRed]

Do listen! 15:38 onwards

 

[D. Mungai]

WHy would Ralf be a deputy to Murtough? His position is as a consultant, as reported before. Knowing the board, this will likely be Evra, Carrick or Rio.

Seems the board decisions are moving in the right direction albeit in slow motion.

With the work ahead, even the top management and board need to share blame with someone else, no other better person than Ralf.

Look at it this way, if board/top management continue doing what they have done without changing anything and still we go down then even the fans can turn on them. But with new faces "it can portray that we tried but still we can't hack it"

 

[Real Name]

According to understat, you were 12th in the xG/xPTS table under Solskjaer and now are third over the Rangnick period. Personally I think that's a very, very good development, especially considering the off the pitch distractions (Greenwood, Lingard, Martial, Ronaldo). If I was a United fan, I'd be convincednthe team is heading into the right direction. The results will come eventually.

I'm not much into xg part, does that mean we overperformed xg under Ole and now we're on par with it?

 

[stefan92]

I'm not much into xg part, does that mean we overperformed xg under Ole and now we're on par with it?

Roughly yes. I'm sure you are aware that many people thought individual quality bailed you out quite often under Ole, that is exactly what appears statistically as overperforming xG.

While at the moment the players don't seem to be able to hit a barn door, so they are in the last few games even underperforming.

 

[crossy1686]

WHy would Ralf be a deputy to Murtough? His position is as a consultant, as reported before. Knowing the board, this will likely be Evra, Carrick or Rio.

Because Murtough oversees all the footballing side of the business and Arnold only wants to be involved in the financial. Doesn't make sense to have Ralf sitting in board meetings about budgets and club structure when he should be focusing on building a squad and getting the right players in for the manager

 

[crossy1686]

Do listen!

United talk from the 15th minute onwards.

 

[Hansi Fick]

United talk from the 15th minute onwards.

Think the term is "verbal diarrhoea". He's got nothing coherent to say, just a gush of random ranting, not that I blame him.

 

[VidaRed]

United talk from the 15th minute onwards.

You must have opened it on youtube. If you play it here it starts from there only.

 

[Real Name]

Roughly yes. I'm sure you are aware that many people thought individual quality bailed you out quite often under Ole, that is exactly what appears statistically as overperforming xG.

While at the moment the players don't seem to be able to hit a barn door, so they are in the last few games even underperforming.

Got it, thanks. So that means things are going in a good direction, we just need to start scoring?

 

[L1nk]

Something for Ralf to move into after?

 

[Zehner]

I'm not much into xg part, does that mean we overperformed xg under Ole and now we're on par with it?

The model calculates your chances of winning, losing or drawing a match based on your expected goals and your expected goals against - basically considering the quantity and quality of chances you created and conceded. Then it awards you expected points based on this.

Solskjaer outperformed his xPTS as he was 8th in the table but 11th in xPTS. Rangnick is third in the table and third in xPTS .

A more detailed comparison:

Coach	rank	xPTS rank	matches	points	xPTS	xG	xG against
Solskjaer	8th	11th	12	17	15.56	18.69	21.08
Rangnick	3rd	3rd	9	16	17.39	16.43	9.56

These stats suggest you're creating noticeably more chances and concede drastically viewer chances under Rangnick. They also indicate that you aren't as clinical under Rangnick (should've scored 16.43, really scored 13) and underperformed your xPTS.

Got it, thanks. So that means things are going in a good direction, we just need to start scoring?

It probably isn't that easy. Might be the case that the more intensive play under Rangnick means that your players are less concentrated when finishing. Still, I'd say you're on the right track and finally seem to constanty outperform your opponents in terms of chance quality x chance quantity. As a comparison: This model had you fourth for last season as well with 65 xPTS, comfortably behind City (83), Chelsea (77) and Liverpool (69).

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

Pretty short sighted from the players to be acting up knowing Ralf will be in a consultancy role for the next couple of years. If he's not given the job, I have no doubt he'll be making it very clear to the next manager who the rotten apples are.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

Because Murtough oversees all the footballing side of the business and Arnold only wants to be involved in the financial. Doesn't make sense to have Ralf sitting in board meetings about budgets and club structure when he should be focusing on building a squad and getting the right players in for the manager

Rangnick was running full football clubs from the ground up, this would be like hiring Richard Hamilton to be your back up driver behind Kevin Magnussen.