PL L FA Premier League

West Ham United 2:1 Manchester United

Post-match discussion

Sun, 27 October 2024

Glorio said:
Ok we should have scored in the first half, but you can't take a half off and expect to win games.

For people trying to absolve EtH of blame here, what happened in the 2nd half? How is it we're being dominated by West Ham?

Their manager made a change that swung the game in their favour and our manager had no answer.
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Nailed it
 
wolvored said:
The season is already written off. Where do you think we will finish? What gives you confidence TH can turn it around? Do you think that all of a sudden we will become like prime Barca and climb to the top of the table?
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We'll finish mid-table with maybe a good cup run. We're not even prime United under Big Ron circa 1983 let alone prime Barca.
 
wolvored said:
Hojlund shouldnt have been bought for 70+ million at the level he is at. In a perfect world he or a player like him (as in a young unexperienced striker) should have been bought for a lot less to compliment our experienced striker and learn off him to eventually take over, not expected to come in and save a mediocre side.
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Yeah that's pretty much my thoughts as well. Although I'm not too concerned about the fee to be honest. He's no Antony.
 
Didn't take the chances, the usual wastefulness. Can't really blame a shady decision at the end when we really don't have anything together. Cannot wait for Hag to go. How many defeats will it take now?
 
FlawlessVictory88 said:
The real issue is how pathetic our wide options are. Garnacho and Rashford wouldn't start at any top 6 team, I have more patience with Garna because he's young and maybe he can reach the level we need but as of right now he's no better than most wingers in the bottom half of the table.

Not even remotely close to elite wide forwards like Vini/Yamal/Saka/Son/Salah etc etd
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This is the problem. Too greedy and too similar. We should play one and Amad as at least he would look for the pass more often. Rashford and Garnacho generally only pass at the last second if they cant get through and going to lose the ball.
 
On the penalty, should the referee reject it on the grounds that it wasn't a clear and obvious error? Or is that purely a VAR decision and the only question for the ref once he's at the screen is whether it was the wrong decision.

Seems to me it's the latter and Oliver put the ref in an impossible situation. Once he made him look again the outcome was inevitable. I guess what is obvious to Michael Oliver is by definition a very subjective matter.
 
Positive: in the first half we created some chances. Negatives: everything else. Awful second half, missed chances, poor Dalot, and so on. We lost again, and yes, we could blame the referee, VAR, whoever but the real reason why we lost was the total inability to score. As usual. I watched Mark Goldbridge, he is a funny bloke but he has no idea about football. Ha sait ten Hag has to go but it won't change anything. I disagree.
 
The circumstances for the loss change week to week but it doesn’t really matter. A half decent team, like Spurs last week, don’t allow that game to be close… Manager must go but players are also highly overrated
 
At least the press still write things like West Ham stun Man United. Don't know which Man United they think this is as I'm not surprised by these results in the least.

There was a very complimentary headline that reported "Aston Villa holds Man United" or something along those lines a few weeks ago which gave me a chuckle at how incredulous it sounded. Funny yet sad, all things considered!
 
Glorio said:
Ok we should have scored in the first half, but you can't take a half off and expect to win games.

For people trying to absolve EtH of blame here, what happened in the 2nd half? How is it we're being dominated by West Ham?

Their manager made a change that swung the game in their favour and our manager had no answer.
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One half FC is one of the hallmarks of ETH’s tenure. The only exciting thing is you don’t know which half it’ll be, and more often than not it’s neither.
 
Keith Hackett is not impressed...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/footbal...-west-ham-manchester-united-penalty-decision/

"Crikey me, this is horrendous. The decision to give West Ham a penalty that they won the game from – and could cost Erik ten Hag his job – is one of the worst I have ever seen. Matthijs de Ligt did not foul Danny Ings.

I am struggling to even put this into words. It is bizarre – I am stunned. Actually, it is worse than bizarre. A park referee would not even give this as a penalty. Ten Hag has every right to be furious.

It is not a clear and obvious error for David Coote to give no penalty. What on earth has Michael Oliver even seen, as the VAR?

It goes back to what I have spoken about in the past, about referees and hierarchy. Everyone says Oliver is the No 1 referee in the country, and Coote is probably eight, nine or 10 in the list. I am not saying he is subservient, that would be the wrong choice of words, but is Coote essentially just taking Oliver’s word for it? Is he working on a preconceived idea that Oliver must be right all the time?"
 
Admittedly I did not watch the full game and I do appreciate that West Ham's xG was better (although not reflected in the highlights) but just seeing some of the chances in the first half, it's quite astonishing that we weren't leading at HT. Not that it excuses ETH, as we should keep up those same standards in the 2nd half but that's a pretty bitter pill to swallow.
 
glazed said:
It goes back to what I have spoken about in the past, about referees and hierarchy. Everyone says Oliver is the No 1 referee in the country, and Coote is probably eight, nine or 10 in the list. I am not saying he is subservient, that would be the wrong choice of words, but is Coote essentially just taking Oliver’s word for it? Is he working on a preconceived idea that Oliver must be right all the time?"
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That's likely how it was. It happens in all walks of life. What junior is going to challenge the number one man even if he knows he's wrong?
 
glazed said:
Keith Hackett is not impressed...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/footbal...-west-ham-manchester-united-penalty-decision/

"Crikey me, this is horrendous. The decision to give West Ham a penalty that they won the game from – and could cost Erik ten Hag his job – is one of the worst I have ever seen. Matthijs de Ligt did not foul Danny Ings.

I am struggling to even put this into words. It is bizarre – I am stunned. Actually, it is worse than bizarre. A park referee would not even give this as a penalty. Ten Hag has every right to be furious.

It is not a clear and obvious error for David Coote to give no penalty. What on earth has Michael Oliver even seen, as the VAR?

It goes back to what I have spoken about in the past, about referees and hierarchy. Everyone says Oliver is the No 1 referee in the country, and Coote is probably eight, nine or 10 in the list. I am not saying he is subservient, that would be the wrong choice of words, but is Coote essentially just taking Oliver’s word for it? Is he working on a preconceived idea that Oliver must be right all the time?"
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Nah, he's probably just afraid Oliver won't take him as a special guest assistant referee on his next all expenses paid trip to the desert.
 
While it's far from all being his fault I do think the club has to have a certain standard that they cannot accept less than and we've gone way beyond that.

Has to go.
 
Anyone who says we played well first half needs to re-watch it, West Ham were terrible we were just better, the difference being Garnacho's pace, that got us a lot of chances, but that is all they were chances, they were not indicative of a great or dominant performance. Today we played bad Ole-ball with near enough a 1st choice 11, so where is the process, progress, plan?

I do not understand why:

  • Dalot is playing in attack for the majority of every match, and a player who is better in attack is having to cover his position
  • A winger Rashford, Garnacho, Amad or Antony starts 1 left 1 right, and they NEVER switch or move around
Penalty was an absolute farce, but really the result was easily on the cards, we were poor, they were poor, we maybe did enough to deserve a draw, but cannot really have any complaints, we were hardly robbed
 
glazed said:
On the penalty, should the referee reject it on the grounds that it wasn't a clear and obvious error? Or is that purely a VAR decision and the only question for the ref once he's at the screen is whether it was the wrong decision.

Seems to me it's the latter and Oliver put the ref in an impossible situation. Once he made him look again the outcome was inevitable. I guess what is obvious to Michael Oliver is by definition a very subjective matter.
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Yeah. Seems ref didn't give it but Oliver stuck his oar in when it wasn't necessary.
 
Ridiculous decision obviously but it should never have come to that. We should have been out of sight by halftime and then we played the second half as if we were 3-0 up.

The second half performance was poor, we never reacted to their subs and didn't seem to want to win the game.
 
If today's game was a one off, taken in isolation that we should've been out of sight at half time but it was just one of those days in front of goal and then got absolutely shafted by VAR, then it wouldn't be so bad, but it's pretty much every week where we somehow manage to lose a game we should of won convincingly.

That's on the manager I'm afraid, the book stops with him.Time to move him on.
 
Oranges038 said:
Nah, he's probably just afraid Oliver won't take him as a special guest assistant referee on his next all expenses paid trip to the desert.
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I don’t think Taylor or Oliver should be anywhere near PL matches, or even the VAR booth ever again, and in all seriousness the fact that they can pass on their biases and introduce them to their “extra funds” contacts seems a pretty valid concern.
 
Bluelion7 said:
I don’t think Taylor or Oliver should be anywhere near PL matches, or even the VAR booth ever again, and in all seriousness the fact that they can pass on their biases and introduce them to their “extra funds” contacts seems a pretty valid concern.
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As soon as he took that gig from City's owners he should have been removed from the PL.
 
Just finished watching the replay. Some thoughts…

- We have assembled the most useless front line in the history of United. We have two wingers you don’t know how to create chances and one of them is invisible and barely breaks out of a jog half the games. We have a 9 who doesn’t get chances but also creates nothing for himself. Our best attacker is a guy the manager refuses to play. If we had even one decent finisher on the field, this game would have been 4-0 at half. That’s how bad WH were and how easy or chances were.

- Should ETH go? Yes, but it’s hard to play him when our front line is inept in front of goal.

- Dalot is an awful player. I’ve been saying this for years and nobody will convince me otherwise. He’s terrible in defense, can’t make routine passes, is a horrible decision maker, and for all this talk about him being good going forward I never see it. His miss today was a chance that any professional player should score 11/10 times. He was the worst player on the pitch today and has been half the year.

- Bruno continues his awful run. Guy is giving the ball away 20 times a game. He’s always done this but he used to create a handful of big chances as well. That has dried up and he’s turned into a clone of Alexis Sanchez (United version, not Arsenal).

- United fans need to come to terms with the fact that as of right now…Garnacho isn’t very good. Or at least, he shouldn’t be starting for any big team. He struggles with ball control, as soon as he gets the ball he puts his head down until he close enough to shoot, and his decision making is horrible. Oh and he’s not a good finisher. He’s a bulk shooter so eventually he scores a few. He’s a net negative to the offense and a big part of the reason Hojlund can’t get any chances.

- A new manager is badly needed, but it’s not going to fix things. This team is badly lacking in talent. We should have sold Marcus this past summer. We’ll be lucky to get 40 mil now. Looking around the squad, how many of these guys even get into Spurs lineup? We need to start rebuilding the front line and finding a Bruno successor now.
 
Exiled_Red said:
Just finished watching the replay. Some thoughts…

- We have assembled the most useless front line in the history of United. We have two wingers you don’t know how to create chances and one of them is invisible and barely breaks out of a jog half the games. We have a 9 who doesn’t get chances but also creates nothing for himself. Our best attacker is a guy the manager refuses to play. If we had even one decent finisher on the field, this game would have been 4-0 at half. That’s how bad WH were and how easy or chances were.

- Should ETH go? Yes, but it’s hard to play him when our front line is inept in front of goal.

- Dalot is an awful player. I’ve been saying this for years and nobody will convince me otherwise. He’s terrible in defense, can’t make routine passes, is a horrible decision maker, and for all this talk about him being good going forward I never see it. His miss today was a chance that any professional player should score 11/10 times. He was the worst player on the pitch today and has been half the year.

- Bruno continues his awful run. Guy is giving the ball away 20 times a game. He’s always done this but he used to create a handful of big chances as well. That has dried up and he’s turned into a clone of Alexis Sanchez (United version, not Arsenal).

- United fans need to come to terms with the fact that as of right now…Garnacho isn’t very good. Or at least, he shouldn’t be starting for any big team. He struggles with ball control, as soon as he gets the ball he puts his head down until he close enough to shoot, and his decision making is horrible. Oh and he’s not a good finisher. He’s a bulk shooter so eventually he scores a few. He’s a net negative to the offense and a big part of the reason Hojlund can’t get any chances.

- A new manager is badly needed, but it’s not going to fix things. This team is badly lacking in talent. We should have sold Marcus this past summer. We’ll be lucky to get 40 mil now. Looking around the squad, how many of these guys even get into Spurs lineup? We need to start rebuilding the front line and finding a Bruno successor now.
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Think you're quite a bit over the top here. Bruno's had a bad season generally so far, but he was actually excellent today. Season best both from him and Casemiro. Rashford and Højlund were the weak points today.
 
VAR screwed us over again. Micheal Oliver shouldn't be anywhere near football.
 
When you are losing 1-0, you need the big personality and character of the team and we showed resilience to get back into it. But it was unfair and unjust, the way we conceded the penalty.
 
Losing to one of the worst, most disorganised teams in the league is a whole new achievement.
 
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Man of the Match

Casemiro image Casemiro 41% of 126 votes

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4.9 Total Average Rating

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Score Predictions

78,38,39
  • Man Utd win
  • West Ham win
  • Draw

Detailed Results

  • 20% West Ham 1:2 Man Utd
  • 15% West Ham 1:1 Man Utd
  • 11% West Ham 0:2 Man Utd
  • 10% West Ham 1:3 Man Utd
  • 8% West Ham 2:0 Man Utd
  • 7% West Ham 2:1 Man Utd
  • 6% West Ham 2:2 Man Utd
  • 5% West Ham 0:1 Man Utd
  • 5% West Ham 3:1 Man Utd
  • 4% West Ham 0:0 Man Utd
  • 3% West Ham 0:3 Man Utd
  • 3% West Ham 1:0 Man Utd
  • 1% West Ham 3:0 Man Utd
  • 1% West Ham 1:4 Man Utd
  • 1% West Ham 4:2 Man Utd
  • 1% West Ham 9:0 Man Utd
  • 1% West Ham 2:3 Man Utd
Compiled from 155 predictions.
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Match Stats

  1. West Ham
  2. Man Utd
Overall Possession
42.5% 57.5%
Shots
12 18
Shots on target
3 5
Shots off target
8 7
Blocked shots
1 6
Total touches in the box
30 33
Goalkeeper saves
4 1
Fouls
6 7
Corners
6 5

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