[Pscholes18]

What a shite show....Hojlund taking a shot to the face ON PURPOSE and NOTHING FROM VAR!

FECKING CHARLIE SHEEN HAD HIS HANDS UP BECAUSE HE WAS GOING TO GRAB THE COPP PLAYER LIKE THE CNUT ALWAYS DOES.

DALOT FECK OFF TO STOKE!


They actually played well even when going down to 10. Can't blame Rashford for the red..he was just trying to box out the attacker. Harsh call. Their first goal....wtf was Onana doing?

 

[Pscholes18]

Dalot - All he has to do on both the third and fourth (if you watch it back) goals, is, at any point, look around him to see where the opposition player is, and he doesn't even try to do this, on either occasion, despite having more than enough time to defensively set himself, and it being a basic common sense thing to do when defending your own penalty area. We already lost at home to Galatasaray because he literally just stood next to someone and let them (very VERY slowly) score when we were controlling the game. For 50K a week I don't think turning your head slightly in order to do your job is actually very much to ask. He is, frankly, the dumbest player I have ever watched, and I've watched Renato Sanchez try to pass to an advertising board and Balotelli fail to work out how to put a shirt on.

The officials - Anyone else remember in the first minute when McTominay passed the ball to Maguire's hand for some reason in our area, and then it hit Maguire on the hand very blatantly, and then the ref and VAR didn't have a problem with this? Who is watching football and still being able to take it seriously at this point?

McTominay - Why did he randomly decide to calmly pass the ball to Maguire's hand in the penalty area?


I actually thought we played well so I'm not going to be too critical outside of Dalot who's relentless stupidity I have tired of. There were some mistakes towards then end but the biggest influence on the scoreline was the referee

Yeah he did not do anyone a favor with that cnut of a move...why didn't he just take the ball down and then pass or hoof it out?

 

[Waynne]

I didn’t watch it, which is a fantastic result on a personal level. Expected a loss anyway.

Same.

Club needs a complete purge from top to bottom.

Bring in people that will bleed for the badge if you're 1 man down or 3 goals down.

 

[Rustyspider13]

It's even worse than that. We barely create. He dragged us with individual magic in the first game. Yet when we finally create chances for him, we still find a way to lose despite his goals. The media has been licking their lips talking about our strikers not scoring, trying to paint him as a bad signing. Yet we don't create for him. Put Haaland in this team and it'd be the same. The sad part is we have one of the most creative players in the world with us as well , and another fast direct attacked in Rashford. It's quite clear the build up behind them is responsible for this, yet the media won't see that when criticizing.

You can say that again. I have no clue why our coaches continue to not address our build up issues. In the start of the second half we kept the ball for like 5 minutes without crossing the half way line. Every time we made a slight opening in their press, McT would choose the back pass. Whereas in the first half, Eriksen was picking out players on the half turn with ease. I understand the decision to take off Eriksen for defensive solidarity, but our team can't get the ball forward without him and no way were we going to hold on with our defense. All of this just compounds the weird decision to sign Mount. A younger version of Eriksen was the easiest profile to look for, yet we fecked it up. Our recruitment process is the single biggest thing that is holding us back and I hope it's the first thing that is completely restructured as soon as the ownership issue stabilizes.

 

[tjb]

I'll only analyze the period before Rashford getting sent off.

For me, it was good:

• Our pressing has improved immensely, and the shape and dynamism of the press actually reminds me of Bayern's under Heynkes.
• Bruno as a 10 was very important as it made the transitions to attack really swift.
• we had better movement. off the ball

For me, the biggest change over the last two games has been the intensity of the passes, particularly in the backline. There is more power being put into those passes, this is helping us move the ball more quickly than we have previously. This is something we haven't been doing at all this season.

In terms of play, I don't believe the first half was flawless. I do believe that our midfield partnership's incapacity to move the ball itself was disguised by Bruno and Hojlund finding good spaces, dropping deep positions and moving the ball themselves. This is why we didn't have more attacks, despite playing well. The connections were coming from Dalot coming inside or direct passes being played from defence, not Eriksen and Mctominay connecting play like they should be doing. The 6 and 8 spots in our midfield haven't shown the strength or intensity necessary to compete with other midfields this season. It has caused a lot of grief when you combine that with the open spaces that Ten Haag's unwise tactical choices created.

All things considered, it was a significant improvement on most of the season. It also demonstrates that, rather than the 433, diamond, or 4141, the 4231 is the formation we should to be utilizing and expanding upon. I would even go so far as to suggest that Bruno should be our number ten in any formation we employ going forward because he can unleash Hojlund, Rashford, and Garnacho, particularly on the counter.


In terms of the rest of the game, I do think we were unlucky with the red card and penalty. That wasn't a red card and really was an injustice that this was given. We would have comfortably won the game without that decision. In saying that, the one man disadvantage highlighted the weakness we currently have at the back. When put under pressure, unlike last season, the defence folds. We all knew Licha and Shaw were influencial last season. These performances are simply proving how invaluable they were and the fact that regardless of whether Ten Haag remains our manager, we need to fortify the backline. As unlucky as we were, Ten Haag's game management has to come into question. We've experienced too many negative turnarounds. Fans seem to blame the players for not being mentally able to deal with rough circumstances, but I also think Ten Haag struggles to adapt to changes in games and this has been badly exposed this season. Once his plan A doesn't work, he can't adapt. At Ajax, you can get away with that. At United, in a league with top managers and physically strong teams, you can't have that weakness. 9 losses in 17 games is not good enough. Almost being out of the Champions League is not good enough. Being out of the title race this early is not good enough. The fact that the first half performance is our best performance of the season is not good enough. We shouldn't even be in this position in the first place, no matter how poor our luck has been.

 

[Winrar]

I thought we turned a corner with the late winner against Fulham?

Sick and tired of seeing capitulation from our players. Time and time again.

 

[BorisManUtd]

Didn't watch the first half so just watched the highlights of it and I'm even more gutted. We had a nice lead and think it'd probably have finished like 4-1 in the end or something like that if it wasn't for Rashford's red card. Another disappointing result.

 

[wolvored]

Where are you from and does stamp mean something else there?

Take your rose tinted glasses off and look at it again.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

The big thing is I'm just not shocked anymore about how mentally fragile these players are. 2 nil up. Yes there's actually red card. Any decent team can mentally focus, get to half and know that can readjust and prepare for the second half struggle. With our players I knew there was no shot of that happening. I was honestly curious if we would just allow 1 goal or multiple. Sure as shit we don't even let the pressure build on them at all and immediately just fecking fold up.

Oh hey here's a lucky break and we are now up again. We gonna focus up and see this one out? Nah feck that let's make sure we allow another 2 late goals and get zero points.

 

[Cloud7]

If we can’t qualify for the next round can we at least finish last in the group?

Having more time off between games is surely more beneficial to this squad than whatever positives we get from dropping into Europa league

 

[Sky1981]

10 men or 11 if you can't defend a one goal lead against FC Copenhagen for 10 minutes when your qualifications depends on it you have no business in the CL.

Absolutely pathetic to crumble down like that. Any other team would have parked the aeroplane and be done with it.

 

[Waynne]

Club is in freefall.

Fire the manager, we're fecked.
Stick with the manager, we're fecked.

I can't bring myself to watch the dross anymore. I just catch the highlights (good or bad).

Sad state.

 

[Kopral Jono]

10 men or 11 if you can't defend a one goal lead against FC Copenhagen for 10 minutes when your qualifications depends on it you have no business in the CL.

Absolutely pathetic to crumble down like that. Any other team would have parked the aeroplane and be done with it.

Yes. The fact that we were up 2-0 and conceded FOUR GOALS against fecking Copenhagen, regardless of the red card, is scandalous.

 

[Sky1981]

Yes. The fact that we were up 2-0 and conceded FOUR GOALS against fecking Copenhagen, regardless of the red card, is scandalous.

We used to joke about "Cambodian Striker" back in those days, but it seems that even Cambodian Striker is much better than our 350k cough... Rash (pun intended)

 

[JoeyJoJoJrShabadoo]

The overreaction in here is next level. We got done by the ref and we fell apart. It happens

 

[DJ_21]

We could have and should have gone 4-0 up in the first halve. Hojlund missed 2 very good chances. Everything’s going against us this season. The players are obviously still fighting and playing for ETH. So it isn’t a case of them not playing for him.

 

[tenpoless]

'Roony'
You can't make this shit up.

 

[SonOfFergie]

We were very good before that weird pause of the game. I wanted to say who kidnaped the real United, who are those imposers? Then good until the sending off and we would have won the game comfortably. After Evans injury and red card we folded. You have to hold on and not concede before the half. If you concede two goals instead in that time you are in trouble. Second half was a waste of time to watch. We capitulated as expected. Wan Bissaka with all his faults is a big improvements on full back, Dalot is a liability. After the red we should immediately replace Eriksen who was anonymous and also Garnacho, push Dalot further up or replace him with Antony and get Lindelof at the full back to be more solid at the back. Players are still fighting. We now know that this season is a write off, and most probably no europe for next season. We won't get relegated. So you have at least two transfer windows to fih things up. Clean up the deadwood, bring in young good players and play them. Get Shaw and Martinez fit and playing regularly. Bring in attacker to take the burden off Hojlund. Develop a recognizable pattern of play.

And at the end of the day. Thinking about it quality wise not one of our players would get into City's first 11. We are where we are for a reason.

 

[FrenchRed]

Didn’t bother to watch this one as I’d had a long day at work and didn’t want to be pi55ed off when I got home when we screwed something up.

Sounds like a mess of a game as I thought it would be.

 

[AndySmith1990]

Sorry but a red card doesn't excuse conceding 4 to Copenhagen. I've seen top teams still be competitive and even win when they have a, man down. I remember Chelsea beating Barcelona with 10 men.

As we know this team is mentality weak and can't handle it when things go wrong. And as usual Ten Hags game management is shite

 

[Jordi Cruyff 99]

The overreaction in here is next level. We got done by the ref and we fell apart. It happens

Such a poor excuse. It's Copenhagen ffs.

 

[Jeffthered]

Team is going nowhere. ETH is lost. Good that Rasmus scored a couple. We have no midfield balance and an unsettled team. Who is our midfield and how does the manager want them, and the team, to play???

FC Copenhagen are not a top European team. They're decent, hardworking, a good side... but I'm sorry, I would hope that Manchester United would take care of such a team.

There is no definable tempo, identity, consistency or rhythm to our game.

This muddled thinking is picked up by the players. It's poor. I'll be surprised if he is with us next season, because he is unconvincing as a manager. Last season the Premiership was weaker, many teams have improved, which was expected. ETH has been found out. I have no faith in him at all.

He's a disciplinarian. And after a while, if that is all you have, that takes you only so far.

 

[Berbasbullet]

Take your rose tinted glasses off and look at it again.

Do you think rashford meant to do it?

 

[Red_Aaron]

The absolutely ridiculous season continues. Even when things go really well they still turn to shit. There's some voodoo or black magic or something going on here. I've never seen a season like it

Never a red and both penalties are complete bollocks. We win this at a stroll without entirely unnecessary VAR intervention

Still despite the dreadful luck we still have the game won with 10 to go. Absolutely maddening from Dalot on the 3rd goal, so sloppy

We won't win in Turkey and frankly id rather finish bottom and get the extra training days for the squad

 

[DomesticTadpole]

All that talk about top 4 being success, how its important to be in it, how it attracts world class players (LOL), people drool about it just to be a joke, this is getting worse than Arsenal under Wenger.

Think it attracts players who see a big payday. Our policy has to change. I would actually take some time in the wilderness if it means we build an actual team. Start looking at who our best youngsters are and build a side to last. Bring in younger exciting players. Not ones who are in semi retirement or on the lookout for the next big move.

 

[erikcred]

Bring in people that will bleed for the badge if you're 1 man down or 3 goals down.

That's not a thing anymore. Rio, Terry, Lampard, Gerrard were the last of that type. Now players may bleed for certain managers like Pep, Klopp, Simeone, even Mourinho for a season probably, Ange maybe. But definitely not ETH.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

What gets me is this season, every dumb error by our defence seems to almost always be punished. It's like you can see it a mile away. Even if they've been flawless the whole game.

AWB's hospital pass - check
Maguire doing a weird zombie double arm reach for a player, rather than tackling the ball - Check
Varane losing his nerve and making a poor clearance - Check

Against really good clinical teams, you get punished, but these days we're getting punished whoever we play

Thing is when we went down to ten men we had to get ourselves organised straight away and that comes from the touchline. What instructions did they send out or did they just expect them to get on with it. This situation is when you see manager frantically sending messages out to their players.

 

[NinjaZombie]

I didn’t watch it, which is a fantastic result on a personal level. Expected a loss anyway.

Same.

Club needs a complete purge from top to bottom.

Bring in people that will bleed for the badge if you're 1 man down or 3 goals down.

We were very good before the red card. I think it was the first time I've seen the plan actually working. Our transition was excellent and we actually finished off chances. We also passed the ball around swiftly and sharply.

This is that rare loss where I actually can't blame any of the players. Well, except maybe for Dalot for switching off but it is what it is.

 

[mattyround]

Maaaaaaaan, it's tough at the moment.

An assortment of observations:

Onana has settled down now. I don't think it's a coincidence that his presence coincided with - in general - United's best performance with 10 men in recent memory.

Varane's face like thunder. Is he just annoyed at missing the Manc derby, or is there a deeper rift with the manager? Either way, in the words of Tony Soprano, he's gotta get over it because he's needed against Luton. I can't remember whether it was the third or fourth goal we conceded, but he treated the ball like a bomb.

Dalot. Mixed bag. He's really good when the game is happening in front of him - hence a couple of really aggressive tackles that relieved pressure in the final quarter of the game - but completely switched off at the back post.

Wan Bisakka has quietly become excellent, both defensively and on the ball.

I thought Amrabat controlled the tempo well when he came on. I never felt as though we were under major pressure in the second half and only lost the game due to silly individual moments as opposed to dealing with concerted waves from Copenhagen.

Rashford red card was unlucky, but with the rules as they are, I can understand the decision. There doesn't seem to be any room for common sense interpretations, especially in Europe. He was actually looking lively and sharp prior to that and I would play him in the same position against Luton.

Hojlund is an absolute monster. He will score in the Luton game. I liked some of his hold up and link up play yesterday. Him coming off for Mount was a pretty bad decision by Ten Hag. Also, why did we sign Mount? It surely wasn't for five minute cameos.

That looked like a United team that was together and trying to pull in the same direction which augurs well for the manager. I do think we will start getting the rub of the green.

I fancy us to beat Luton and Everton which will leave us in a pretty handy league position. What we then need to do against Newcastle and Chelsea is something we haven't done all season - over perform in a game where we aren't expected to win. If we can get 10 points from four games then that will feel like a semblance of momentum.

I won't be gutted to go out of the CL and have a two-track focus for the remainder of the season, especially as the squad doesn't seem up to the physical rigours this term. Onwards.

 

[fergiewherearethou]

We were very good before the red card. I think it was the first time I've seen the plan actually working. Our transition was excellent and we actually finished off chances. We also passed the ball around swiftly and sharply.

This is that rare loss where I actually can't blame any of the players. Well, except maybe for Dalot for switching off but it is what it is.

Agreed, it was our best half hour of football in this season until the red card.
The fact we don't know how to play with 10 men is a different story though.

 

[Savlehest]

The first 30 min was properly the worst minutes I have seen from Copenhagen, we played good because they did nearly everything wrong, not because we pressed high or did something special. We are a horrible team, coached wrong and have really bad players.
I don’t get why we buy all these expensive players, just to find out they are yet again not good enough. No plan for Mount, can’t guide Antony, can’t make the defense compact. I know you can’t blame ETH for everything. But still, this is some of the worst mistakes made in recent time from a manager.

 

[mitchmouse]

I thought we played really well at times and were in total control until the ridiculous red card. A foul, maybe but totally accidentally - watch it be a yellow for the rest of the season.

Dreadul VAR too not to spot the offside for their first goal (although I agree Onana should have stopped it - didn't think he was great at the third either and maybe even the winner was stoppable given hitting it into the ground slowed it down and brought it to a decent height).

Having defended so well, it was so United to then makes stupid mistakes. The game was there for the taking when we went back in front. Though Garnacho and Hojilund were very good and there was a spark of life back in Rashford's play. Maguire was good too until that dumb play it out from the back moment with Varane, who should certainly know better. Lots of energy and breaking up play from McT and the side looked a bit more balanced - don't think it helped losing Evans early on because he was pretty untroubled.

No idea why ETH brought on Mount... Rasmus might have been tired but his pace scared them shitless and a draw was really of no use to us so to do so at 3-3 it was just odd. Shows we need a second real striker among other things.

VAR was so awful I fully expected them not to give us our penalty! Ref was no better at spotting things.

Our first goal was probably our best move of the season and if we had players who could find Rasmus more, he will get lots of goals.. oh, and amrabat is waste of fresh air

 

[mitchmouse]

Take your rose tinted glasses off and look at it again.

no way was it a stamp, he tried to shield the ball and, yes, caught the player, but yellow at the most

 

[Solius]

Take your rose tinted glasses off and look at it again.

A stamp is something you do with force. You change the speed of your food midair to really slam it down. He’s just planting his foot.

 

[Oranges038]

Never went for the ball for me, a stamp on the foot is a red. Put it this way if it was a stamp on Rashford we would all have been screaming for a red card for the opposing player.

He's moving his leg across and planting his foot to protect the ball, it's a natural body movement to protect the ball, I teach this move to kids every week. He was unlucky that the other player stuck his leg in as that's what he was planting his foot to guard against.

It's not a red card in any scenario for any player, because it's not a deliberate stamping action.

 

[Big Andy]

And plenty of teams don’t. The odds are against you, and while you might make it out, you also might not.

If a striker gets sent off or a winger, then I don't see it as big of an issue than if a defender or goalie gets sent off. You should still be able to defend properly. You shut up shop, especially at 2-0 up. You play defensively and change your plan. We don't do that.

 

[Oranges038]

Dalot - All he has to do on both the third and fourth (if you watch it back) goals, is, at any point, look around him to see where the opposition player is, and he doesn't even try to do this, on either occasion, despite having more than enough time to defensively set himself, and it being a basic common sense thing to do when defending your own penalty area. We already lost at home to Galatasaray because he literally just stood next to someone and let them (very VERY slowly) score when we were controlling the game. For 50K a week I don't think turning your head slightly in order to do your job is actually very much to ask. He is, frankly, the dumbest player I have ever watched, and I've watched Renato Sanchez try to pass to an advertising board and Balotelli fail to work out how to put a shirt on.

The officials - Anyone else remember in the first minute when McTominay passed the ball to Maguire's hand for some reason in our area, and then it hit Maguire on the hand very blatantly, and then the ref and VAR didn't have a problem with this? Who is watching football and still being able to take it seriously at this point?

McTominay - Why did he randomly decide to calmly pass the ball to Maguire's hand in the penalty area?


I actually thought we played well so I'm not going to be too critical outside of Dalot who's relentless stupidity I have tired of. There were some mistakes towards then end but the biggest influence on the scoreline was the referee

3 of the goals were typical of the shite back post defending we've seen from AWB and Dalot time and time again over the years.

Not to mention the pathetic efforts to close down and block the crosses by Garnacho on the first, AWB on the third and Mount on the fourth.

 

[SteveCoppellFan]

The overreaction in here is next level. We got done by the ref and we fell apart. It happens

We got done by the ref - yeah it happens a lot ( lately ) but we cannot control that.

We fell apart - yeah it happens a lot ( lately ) but we can control that and we fail at it time and time again.

 

[IRN-BRUno]

If you'd said before this group started that we'd score 3 goals at Bayern, be a goal up with 20 minutes left against Galatasaray, and be leading 2-0/3-2 with 10 minutes to go in Copenhagen I'd have assumed we'd be cruising through but somehow it now looks like we're struggling to even get 3rd.

That was actually a really good performance until the red, a lot of talk about their atmosphere but they were silenced almost immediately and we had complete control. Their first goal clearly has an offside player directly in front of Onana but doesn't get checked or even mentioned by commentary.

Both penalties were very harsh but at least he was consistent in giving them albeit he took an age on the monitor for ours. 3rd is poor defending, I wasn't sure the ball had actually gone out for a corner in the build-up but missed the replay and haven't seen it mentioned here so assume it did. 4th was an even worse goal to concede. Clear 2nd yellow missed for the elbow on Hojlund as well.

I just don't know what to make of this anymore, I keep swinging from thinking a change of manager will help to wondering what anyone can do with some of the decisions against us and players who make so many basic mistakes. At the moment I'm just looking forward to the international break which is something I never thought I'd say.

 

[Denis79]

We did well before the red card but this isn't the first time we just crumble as soon as something doesn't go according to plan. The players and ETH need to compose themselves when things go against us, 2-0 up against Copenhagen should still be winnable or at the very least less dramatic than it was, even with a man down. We made it look like we lost half the team.