POLL - Would you swap Moyes for Roberto Martinez or Mauricio Pochettino?

Would you swap Moyes for Martinez or Pochettino?

  • Yes - I'd gladly swap him for either of them

    Votes: 81 31.8%

  • I'd swap him for Martinez but not Pochettino

    Votes: 22 8.6%

  • I'd swap him for Pochettino but not Martinez

    Votes: 37 14.5%

  • No - I wouldn't swap him for either of them

    Votes: 115 45.1%
  • Total voters
    255
FineYoungCasual said:
Thing is, Phelan and Rene wouldn't have lost the players. They trained them every day and had been with them through thick and thin - they new how to win together. In fact, I personally feel that Moyes' removal of them made a number of senior players immediately dislike him.

They wouldn't have challenged for the title, no chance, but I firmly believe we'd be in a far better position than we are now!
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Remind me what Phelan and Rene are doing now?

If Moyes had kept them there would have been a risk of the players plus Phelan and Rene against Moyes. He would have got "that's not how Fergie did things around here". You must remember Moyes is much more of a hands-on manager than Fergie was. He left the training to Phelan and Rene but Moyes doesn't just leave it to the coaches. He did the right thing in getting rid of them and bringing in people he'd already worked with and who knew and accepted his methods.
 
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Nope. I want Moyes to be replaced, but with managers with a bit more winning pedigree. They are both fantastic managers, Pochettino and Martinez, but if we accept that the Moyes experiment has failed then our next appointment has to be a sure thing, someone like Mourinho, Ancelotti, van Gaal, Simeone or Klopp, managers with a history of winning. Bear in mind, I would have liked appointing Pochettino or Martinez over Moyes after Ferguson's retirement but now we haven't, I wouldn't have them replacing our current manager.
 
People claim we are a great club with tradition yadda yadda and good players are queing to join us..

Why cant we do the same with managers, and goes in for really top 5 managers in the business. You want to be seen as great, start acting like a great club


Like it or hate it, you gotta admire madrid, they dont take no for a fecking answer and they will hunt and get their man, be it player or manager.
 
I've got a feeling that Pochettino is the next big thing. In terms of balance and consistency, I think he's going to be a top manager whereas I've got a feeling that Martinez may just create nice teams. I've got nothing much to base it on, maybe the fact he was a defender distorts my ideas of him, but that's just what my instincts say.

However my view was always that Moyes was a high risk appointment and that we really needed a "steady the ship" proven top flight manager to prove to the players and the football world that United mean business. To take a punt on another unproven (though admittedly more intriguing) prospect seems wrong - unless of course, like any other top club who took the gamble, we were willing to admit that it might be a short term appointment.

The comparison with Guardiola at Barcelona is an interesting one, to me. They could take that risk on him, because they (and he) always knew that if it didn't work out he'd be gone (with no hard feelings on either side) in a few months.
 
Without a shadow of doubt I would have swapped Moyes with either of those two (and Laudrup too). However, I think that we should go for someone proven this time.
 
I'n not sure i would swap Moyes for either of them. All three have common traits (managing midtable teams only, only one trophy to show for, little budget to play with.) I think one of Pochettino or Martinez could be an up-grade but i don't understand why are people so sure about it.
 
Sunny Jim said:
I'n not sure i would swap Moyes for either of them. All three have common traits (managing midtable teams only, only one trophy to show for, little budget to play with.) I think one of Pochettino or Martinez could be an up-grade but i don't understand why are people so sure about it.
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The way I see it is that it's the difference in approach that, at least, Martinez seems to have. I haven't really seen many games with Southampton, bar the ones where I snooze in the afternoon while hung over - and I don't really analyze those games!

Martinez is a bit more gung-ho in his way of setting out his team, while Moyes has a tendency to eliminate risk. It's been said on here before that Moyes is a reactive manager and seems a bit dumbfounded when teams set out a defensive strategy against his team. The record at OT is an example, especially the Fulham game, where he just didn't seem to know how to adapt the tactics when Fulham parked the bus.

I think that Moyes is a very good manager - for a mid table team. He's proven this over a long period of time, wheras Martinez won the FA cup and got relegated in the same season. I'd say his way of management is more suited to a "better team" than Wigan or Everton - the risk is minimized by the players' individual qualities. Moyes ha sa way of diminishing his players inherent qualities in favor of an extremely safe approach.

I don't know if I'm making sense, it's not a thought that I've spent too much time clarifying for myself yet, even.. but, summarising the above:

I think you need to take some risks to win, and Moyes is not the person to do that. He won't get the best out of the creative players in the squad.
 
BennyBlanco said:
I'm a simple man, football for me isn't about trophy count, its about entertainment at the end of the day, I enjoy the way Martinez sides try to play football, I won't lie, I don't know if he'd ever be good enough for our fans who want... nay.. expect! us to win the league year in year out but for installing his football philosophy? yes please.
Some of the qualities Sir Alex labled Moyes with, vision, determination, loyalty, giving chances to youth... all of which could be equally applied to Martinez's time in english football.
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Its fashionable to like Martinez because his teams do try to play decent football - and fair play to him for that. But for me there is an awful lot of hype around him.

Wigan did well to win the FA Cup last year. They had a realtively easy run until late in the competition but winning it was a real achievement. But they still went down - having concede bucket loads of goals. Staying in the PL was probably better for the club in the long term.

I've heard the argument that "Wigan were always going to struggle" and I disagree - Steve Bruce didnt struggle and kept them in a decent position with the same resources, as he's doing with Hull. At the end of the day its nice to play good football - but at times you need to strike a balance. Style over substance isnt popular with fans for long.

Martinez is doing well at Everton - albeit with a side that Moyes largely built, and he may well prove able to find that balance. But her certaionly didnt at Wigan and there have been occiaions with Everton - the 4-0 Liverpool defesat for example shows for me that sometimes he doesnt have a plan B.
 
RedRover said:
Its fashionable to like Martinez because his teams do try to play decent football - and fair play to him for that. But for me there is an awful lot of hype around him.

Wigan did well to win the FA Cup last year. They had a realtively easy run until late in the competition but winning it was a real achievement. But they still went down - having concede bucket loads of goals. Staying in the PL was probably better for the club in the long term.

I've heard the argument that "Wigan were always going to struggle" and I disagree - Steve Bruce didnt struggle and kept them in a decent position with the same resources, as he's doing with Hull. At the end of the day its nice to play good football - but at times you need to strike a balance. Style over substance isnt popular with fans for long.

Martinez is doing well at Everton - albeit with a side that Moyes largely built, and he may well prove able to find that balance. But her certaionly didnt at Wigan and there have been occiaions with Everton - the 4-0 Liverpool defesat for example shows for me that sometimes he doesnt have a plan B.
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I remember reading that, based on the amount of money available to the different PL clubs, the chance of Wigan being relegated at some point over the course of Martinez' reign was something like 90% +. If that's true then there's no way you can argue he didn't do an excellent job at Wigan.

He has also done an excellent job so far at Everton considering it's his first season there after making the step up from a smaller club. If he finishes in roughly the same position while playing much better football he can't really be criticised on his debut season there.

Still wouldn't take him here though, he certainly still has plenty left to prove before he deserves that kind of opportunity.
 
No. I would like to see us give Moyes time till christmas.

Its funny to see Martinez who got his team relegated last year being hyped up and overrated by some on this forum, while Moyes tenure at Everton where his achievement was to turn relegation fodder to a side who regularly made a top 6 finish in the league is being made as nothing and brushed under the carpet.
 
I'd swap him for Vincent Tan to manage us
 
I have serious doubts whether these managers can heck it at Manchester United level. However they are better then Moyes. At least they know what tactics are.
 
Nah. While both of those guys are good managers, my feeling is that neither have the track record or authority to manage United, especially as we are right now.
 
I want Moyes gone but getting in either of those two will cause the same problems. I want someone in who can hit the ground running and has a known pedigree at the absolutely highest level.
 
in the summer I would never have wanted either of these guys, but at this point it seems like an attractive proposition!

Still wouldnt want Pochittino TBH, dont like it when managers need translators
 
Is this the shittiest poll ever?

A) Yes
B) Yes
 
No I would not swap him, swap Moyes for Martinez? One unproven manager for another? No thanks.
 
sullydnl said:
I remember reading that, based on the amount of money available to the different PL clubs, the chance of Wigan being relegated at some point over the course of Martinez' reign was something like 90% +. If that's true then there's no way you can argue he didn't do an excellent job at Wigan.

He has also done an excellent job so far at Everton considering it's his first season there after making the step up from a smaller club. If he finishes in roughly the same position while playing much better football he can't really be criticised on his debut season there.

Still wouldn't take him here though, he certainly still has plenty left to prove before he deserves that kind of opportunity.
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Can you put that much faith in statistics? Plenty of managers spend a lot of money and dont get it right. I'm not saying he didnt do well at Wigan but how many managers take a club down and get a chance to manage a top 7/8 club? It seems he was even offered the Liverpool job before Rodgers the season before. Tony Pulis might keep Crystal Palace up this year on the kind of budget Wigan had and he won't be lauded for that.

He's an amiable bloke, the press like him and he tries to play the "Spanish way" so people will like him. Fair enough, and winning the FA Cup was a real achievement.

The big issue for me is whether he can continue the success under pressure. Barry and Lukaku were good signings - but they're on loan and he'll ned to replace Lukaku at least who is a key player. He's inherited a good side but it'll be interesting to see what he does if and when those players retire or move on.
 
Rood said:
in the summer I would never have wanted either of these guys, but at this point it seems like an attractive proposition!

Still wouldnt want Pochittino TBH, dont like it when managers need translators
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Agree with that. Alright at the start but if he cant be arsed to learn the language sharpish you might have a problem.
 
Not for me, as much as I want Moyes out, I don't want a repeat of this season. Personally I think the job is to big for all three of them, we need a manager who isn't afraid to make the big decisions both on and off the pitch.
 
Dirty Schwein said:
I want Moyes gone but getting in either of those two will cause the same problems. I want someone in who can hit the ground running and has a known pedigree at the absolutely highest level.
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I agree that we should go for a seasoned manager, however do you seriously believe that they are at the same level of Moyes? Both manager seem to have a vision on how they want their team to play and its in line to what modern football demands. Tactically Moyes look like a dinosaur compared to these two.
 
jeff_goldblum said:
Do the people saying they'd swap him for Martinez have very short memories?

Despite having very similar transfer budget to what Moyes spent at Everton (actually if you tot up both teams' spending over that period Wigan spent more) he barely kept Wigan up every year, before failing in his final year. A good half season with an inherited squad and some good loans don't erase his previous record. His complete inability to organise or even grasp the concept of a defence was very endearing and entertaining at Wigan, but not something I'd want anywhere near the club I support.
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Mainz were relegated when Klopp was their manager. Look at him now, every club in the world wants him to be their manager.
 
I think the most interesting thing will be when Martinez doesn't have an established defence to rely on. If Coleman, for example, left, or when Distin leaves, or Jagielka is past his best, they might be in trouble. His record of defensive organisation is pretty poor. The fact he brought in Alcaraz doesn't say much for him either.
 
devilish said:
I agree that we should go for a seasoned manager, however do you seriously believe that they are at the same level of Moyes? Both manager seem to have a vision on how they want their team to play and its in line to what modern football demands. Tactically Moyes look like a dinosaur compared to these two.
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But my point is if we replace Moyes we should get the best that we can. No point improving a little bit when we should be improving a lot.
 
No. While their football is seemingly more attractive, why replace unproven quality at this level with the exact same thing? If we were to ever worry about a Liverpool-esque decline then that sort of managerial merry go round would be how it would happen.
 
Pochettino is the answer to our woes. I'd take martinez too but he's more risky because although he is a merchant of good football he's not the best manager tactically. There's a reason southampton have made it difficult and beaten many top teams since pochettino has taken over, its simply cause he knows his stuff. He's a great coach in waiting and whichever top team gets him first will be extremely happy.

He's like guardiola before the barca job, simeone before the atl madrid, conte before Juve and klopp before taking over at Dortmund. He just needs his chance and surely we can give him considering our manager is a plain dud who's quite clearly taking us nowhere.

Before southampton got savaged by key injuries you could see exactly what he was about. He's very good tactically, has a modern approach and he's a winner. Very ambitious manager who goes into every game to get the full three points. What more could we ask for?
 
RooneyLegend said:
Pochettino is the answer to our woes. I'd take martinez too but he's more risky because although he is a merchant of good football he's not the best manager tactically. There's a reason southampton have made it difficult and beaten many top teams since pochettino has taken over, its simply cause he knows his stuff. He's a great coach in waiting and whichever top team gets him first will be extremely happy.

He's like guardiola before the barca job, simeone before the atl madrid, conte before Juve and klopp before taking over at Dortmund. He just needs his chance and surely we can give him considering our manager is a plain dud who's quite clearly taking us nowhere.

Before southampton got savaged by key injuries you could see exactly what he was about. He's very good tactically, has a modern approach and he's a winner. Very ambitious manager who goes into every game to get the full three points. What more could we ask for?
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Would you take this risk? We gave Moyes a chance (despite how you feel about his "tactics", he was still a manager punching above his weight and doing pretty well). I dont think our team is in the position (especially with our squad) to be taking this sort of risk at the moment, especially with Chelsea and City imporving rapidly along with Liverpool. We need someone who will rock the three of those teams simply by his reputation.
 
I voted no. Pochettino is still unproven and with Martinez year after year we saw Wigan scraping near the bottom of the table. Only when the season was nearing its end Wigan started putting in performances.
If Moyes goes we need someone who can handle the pressure of running a big team like us and who can take us to the next level, with these 2 I can't see it
 
Dirty Schwein said:
Would you take this risk? We gave Moyes a chance (despite how you feel about his "tactics", he was still a manager punching above his weight and doing pretty well). I dont think our team is in the position (especially with our squad) to be taking this sort of risk at the moment, especially with Chelsea and City imporving rapidly along with Liverpool. We need someone who will rock the three of those teams simply by his reputation.
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So you would keep Moyes for his contract length rather try either of these two?

The question was if you could only replace Moyes with either of these two would you still want to replace him.

Obviously not many would pick any one of these three above Guardiola/Klopp etc, but IF we're gonna have a manager 'learn on the job', as Moyes is doing, would you prefer either of these. That's the question.
 
The only reason I say yes is that I get the feeling that Martinez and Pochettino have higher ceilings that David Moyes. Both are already at mid-table and higher at a young age, both have a certain style of play that teams now have to prepare for and both certainly will get a crack at higher level clubs if they maintain current levels at Everton and Southampton.

For me if we weren't going to go in for a proven winner once Sir Alex was done, we had to go for a young upcoming manager surely? Someone with a high enough ceiling and level of adaptability to grow into it. From day one I was fairly certain David Moyes fit none of these categories and I still remain stunned by the logic of his appointment.
 
I've voted No but not because I think Moyes is more capable, just because the other two aren't the managers we need to take us forward.
 
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