Paul Pogba / turned down United offer of 300k as “nothing”

I think Raiola and more importantly, COVID has screwed him.

Under normal circumstances, I think Real would have regenerated in 2020 after their 2019 attempt backfired and a 27 year old Pogba would have fit the bill for them alongside Valverde and Casemiro/his replacement (on the basis that Modric and Kroos would be phased out). But fast forward a pandemic during which time Real have undergone an expensive stadium renovation and no fans for the whole season as well as Pogba's chief cheerleader Zidane leaving the club, he doesn't really have an obvious out. Barca are obviously a non-starter as a) they're financially fecked, and b) they don't have a need for a Pogba while Pedri and to a lesser extent De Jong are there. Juve on a free maybe?

Likewise, Raiola promised him a move to Real but he should have realised this wasn't a stepping stone club he was moving Pogba to, it was one of THE destination clubs even if we were in a pretty dodgy state. Only a year before he got Pogba the move, he should have seen how Woody drove Perez to distraction over De Gea. Did he really think he could ride roughshod over us in the way he would do Ajax and Dortmund? He seriously overestimated his abilities.

From everything I'm seeing, I think Pogba will either sign the contract, or leave on a free. It's a shame he'll do so when the club is so close to actually becoming and realising the project that he initially signed up for in 2016, but if that's what he wants to do, then so be it. I'll wish him all the best and move on. We have similarly stellar talent in Mejbri, so I look forward to seeing him grow into this team in any case.
 
#07 said:
To some extent managing Pogba is like managing Gerrard.

On the face of it Pogba and Gerrard are like chalk and cheese, Pogba is all silk and smoothness, Gerrard blood and thunder. However, they are both centre midfielders who are not really centre midfielders.

I remember Benitez playing Gerrard on the wing and then putting Xabi Alonso and Mascherano behind him, because he did not trust Gerrard positionally in a midfield two. England managers did the same thing. It was, on the face of it, a weird one. Gerrard's long passing, his goal threat arriving late from midfield, his commitment and work rate should have made him a brilliant box-to-box midfielder . However, Gerrard's positional sense and his tendency to go chasing the game would often leave huge gaps in midfield...

...reminding you of Pogba yet?

Pogba is a brilliant player. He is strong, he works hard (don't believe me check his ball recovery and duel stats), he passes the ball beautifully, he can hit a shot from distance as good as anyone. Yet his sense for playing in the centre of midfield lacks something, just like Gerrard. If anything the issue is that both want to do too much. They want to join the attack, they want to drive the team forward, they want to chase down (how many times has Pogba shown himself to be a defensive liability running down a blind alley and giving away a penalty).

Ultimately you have to either compensate for that in Pogba, like Benitez did for Gerrard with Xabi and Mascherano, you have to be so dominant that it really doesn't matter what flaws exist in Pogba's game, or you have to decide to move him on.

Taking all the emotion out of it: 'He's not good enough!' 'He's Jogba' 'His agent is a $h!t' Man Utd's issue with Pogba has been, and will always be, systemic. We bought Pogba without a clear idea of what we wanted to use him for besides marketing. We have subsequently tried to shoehorn him into a range of tactical set ups and bought a number of other players that just don't work with him.

Its not an excuse. Its just a clear eyed, unemotional look at where things are.
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Top post in an entertaining thread. I love how the vibe in here flips from respectful to abusive in seconds; from pure daft to thoughtful and informative. File the above under the latter.
 
Widow said:
I wasn't taking aim at you.


No, I like the guy but if you think these stats prove Pogba isn't inconsistent you're sadly mistaken.
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But the stats clearly show he is consistent. Nobody says De Bruyne is inconsistent…why?

Because Man City as a team is consistent.

The point I’m making is because Pogba cost £89m when we as a team don’t perform consistently enough to win trophies, Pogba is scapegoated.
 
RedDevilUnited369 said:
Pogba being inconsistent is lazy analysis…

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Thanks for the reminder on how crucial Pogba was to this team until 2018-19. Unfortunately for him, after arrival of Bruno who has done everything Pogba could and more, his role has gradually diminished in the team. To the point that an argument can be made that replacing Pogba with a bit more limited but well-rounded player can actually improve the team.
 
#07 said:
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Would be fine with 40-50 million. Varane went for a defender and with Pogba being a flair player his fee should naturally be a bit higher. Expecting 60 odd million is not realistic with one year left. If we have someone in mind who has quality and will fit our team, go for it. Of course if Pogba is happy to stay with his wages not increasing, that would be a great outcome. but with all the noises Raiola has been make for a long time, it doesn't exactly reflect commitment.
 
Tincanalley said:
Top post in an entertaining thread. I love how the vibe in here flips from respectful to abusive in seconds; from pure daft to thoughtful and informative. File the above under the latter.
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Thanks.

For my own part, as much as I think Pogba is a really good player, I can see the logic in selling him if we can't find a system that works for the whole that also works for him.

The overall quality of the squad would be lower without him but the system as a whole might be more cohesive.

For Ole the big question for this season coming is: Do I risk the 40+ goal contributions of Bruno Fernandes by playing him further away from goal, in a 433, to try and get more out of Pogba. I wouldn't personally take that risk. Its not obvious that allowing Pogba to attack more, while letting Bruno attack less, will compensate for what we will lose from not playing Bruno as a #10.
 
pratyush_utd said:
So what? If you haven't noticed our revenue has increased almost 6-8 times more than what we had when Rio and Keane were negotiating contract. Naturally our players who are the biggest asset of our football club, will earn a larger share of that revenue.

Don't want to get into the discussion of what he is worth in terms of salary as this is something our club financial team will decide and if they think he is worth 400k then so be it.
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Ok then do you think he is worth twice what Bruno is? Or Bruno and Rashford combined, or Maguire and Greenwood. He offers more as a brand probably but nowhere near that sort of money. He and his fat rat of an agent are just in it for themselves and have played the game very well(playing us for mugs again), in that we are now offering him way more money than he’s worth so we don’t lose a £89 player for nothing.

Our revenues may have changed massively from when Rio and Roy where looking negotiating but I don’t remember Roy looking for twice the Scholes was getting or Rio twice what Vidic was getting.
It’s prob a bad comparison anyways because although both negotiated hard to get top dollar they were Utd through and though that lead by example both on and off the pitch.
 
What happens to his agent's fee if he goes on a free? No more Mr ten per cent ?
 
laughtersassassin said:


For all those moaning that he wasn't back....

Back a few days before he is even due back.
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Him and Bruno were knocked out of the Euros one day apart weren't they? Why was he given extra time anyway? I believe that is a valid criticism of the club to allow that as Bruno has been back a few days now at training.

And going off last season's exploits it's Bruno who needed the extended break not a player who turns up when he feels like it. It's Bruno who carried us to almost winning something. It certainly wasn't Pogba.
 
Nou_Camp99 said:
Him and Bruno were knocked out of the Euros one day apart weren't they? Why was he given extra time anyway? I believe that is a valid criticism of the club to allow that as Bruno has been back a few days now at training.

And going off last season's exploits it's Bruno who needed the extended break not a player who turns up when he feels like it. It's Bruno who carried us to almost winning something. It certainly wasn't Pogba.
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Bruno hardly played at the Euros. I'm sure United's sport science team knows a lot more about rest and recover than we do so let's just leave those decisions to them.

We don't have to criticise everything.
 
Nou_Camp99 said:
Him and Bruno were knocked out of the Euros one day apart weren't they? Why was he given extra time anyway? I believe that is a valid criticism of the club to allow that as Bruno has been back a few days now at training.

And going off last season's exploits it's Bruno who needed the extended break not a player who turns up when he feels like it. It's Bruno who carried us to almost winning something. It certainly wasn't Pogba.
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Star players get certain privileges. He gets a longer holiday every year.

Joking aside it’s probably due to his marketing clause in his contract. I assume he has certain marketing obligations after the season which someone like a Bruno doesn’t have The same clout to.
 
Nou_Camp99 said:
Him and Bruno were knocked out of the Euros one day apart weren't they? Why was he given extra time anyway? I believe that is a valid criticism of the club to allow that as Bruno has been back a few days now at training.

And going off last season's exploits it's Bruno who needed the extended break not a player who turns up when he feels like it. It's Bruno who carried us to almost winning something. It certainly wasn't Pogba.
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Again you don’t know what is in his contract…if Raiola negotiated an extra week off every summer..he’s doing a good job for his client.

He clearly isn’t breaking any club rules.
 
Bebestation said:
I dont mean to be rude but like if this guys goes doesn't sign another contract and plans to go on a free a second time at United- surely we cant let him feel comfortable as a human being anymore.

He is being extremely selfish. We are a a team followed by the biggest number of fans - we should be able to make a player feel intimidated.

A 90 million pound player who we bought but also helped grow in the first place is planning to leave us on a free. That is not right. Sign a contract and leave.
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What the actual feck? In what way is intimidating our own player supposed to help? Im sure being made to feel afraid will have him playing superbly and signing a new contract in no time. Or maybe it will help him decide to sign a contract so we can sell him, Im sure he will be full of goodwill to the club and wanting to cut his options to help us out after that. :rolleyes:
 
Nou_Camp99 said:
Him and Bruno were knocked out of the Euros one day apart weren't they? Why was he given extra time anyway? I believe that is a valid criticism of the club to allow that as Bruno has been back a few days now at training.

And going off last season's exploits it's Bruno who needed the extended break not a player who turns up when he feels like it. It's Bruno who carried us to almost winning something. It certainly wasn't Pogba.
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You've mentioned this already.

We don't know, the club obviously have no issue with it at all. But for some reason you seem to be foaming at the mouth about it.

He's allowed a holiday. If you want to introduce a performance based holiday scheme at United then good luck to you, but that's not how it works I'm afraid and has absolutely zero relevance, so stop trying to muddy someones name by spouting absolute nonsense.

Mainoldo said:
Star players get certain privileges. He gets a longer holiday every year.

Joking aside it’s probably due to his marketing clause in his contract. I assume he has certain marketing obligations after the season which someone like a Bruno doesn’t have The same clout to.
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That's a complete guess and is not going to help :lol:...

As for Pogba in a United shirt, I understand some peoples frustration with him, and generally it's to do with his off the ball attributes, however, isn't it undoubtedly clear, he's a phenomenal footballer on the ball. As in, he does things fairly regularly that only a handful of people on the planet can do...

If, and it's obviously a big if, we can get the best out of Pogba, then we have someone already here who could be a Ballon D'or winner. I'd love him to stay here even if it's just for one more year.
 
#07 said:
To some extent managing Pogba is like managing Gerrard.

On the face of it Pogba and Gerrard are like chalk and cheese, Pogba is all silk and smoothness, Gerrard blood and thunder. However, they are both centre midfielders who are not really centre midfielders.

I remember Benitez playing Gerrard on the wing and then putting Xabi Alonso and Mascherano behind him, because he did not trust Gerrard positionally in a midfield two. England managers did the same thing. It was, on the face of it, a weird one. Gerrard's long passing, his goal threat arriving late from midfield, his commitment and work rate should have made him a brilliant box-to-box midfielder . However, Gerrard's positional sense and his tendency to go chasing the game would often leave huge gaps in midfield...

...reminding you of Pogba yet?

Pogba is a brilliant player. He is strong, he works hard (don't believe me check his ball recovery and duel stats), he passes the ball beautifully, he can hit a shot from distance as good as anyone. Yet his sense for playing in the centre of midfield lacks something, just like Gerrard. If anything the issue is that both want to do too much. They want to join the attack, they want to drive the team forward, they want to chase down (how many times has Pogba shown himself to be a defensive liability running down a blind alley and giving away a penalty).

Ultimately you have to either compensate for that in Pogba, like Benitez did for Gerrard with Xabi and Mascherano, you have to be so dominant that it really doesn't matter what flaws exist in Pogba's game, or you have to decide to move him on.

Taking all the emotion out of it: 'He's not good enough!' 'He's Jogba' 'His agent is a $h!t' Man Utd's issue with Pogba has been, and will always be, systemic. We bought Pogba without a clear idea of what we wanted to use him for besides marketing. We have subsequently tried to shoehorn him into a range of tactical set ups and bought a number of other players that just don't work with him.

Its not an excuse. Its just a clear eyed, unemotional look at where things are.
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This is bang on, great post.
 
Compton22 said:
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Luckhurst has been right all summer, so this is most likely true. Ultimately he’s going to sign a new contract imo, Raiola negotiates and plays dirty, and the club don’t seem to have an issue dealing with him. It would also be a strange time for him to leave considering the direction we’re taking to becoming title challengers again.
 
Giggsy13 said:
Luckhurst has been right all summer, so this is most likely true. Ultimately he’s going to sign a new contract imo, Raiola negotiates and plays dirty, and the club don’t seem to have an issue dealing with him. It would also be a strange time for him to leave considering the direction we’re taking to becoming title challengers again.
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Just hope that if he does it wont be DDG/Sanchez kind of wages. But as I said before he does bring in alot of commercial revenue
 
Pay him what he and Raiola want on the condition Haaland comes next year

No Haaland no party ;)
 
Pogba is in a position where he can put to bed any suggestions questioning his commitment to the club by a) signing a new contract and/or b) releasing a statement confirming his desire to play for our club. Not at any point has he done either of those things.






What's stopping Pogba from following Kessie's example? Has any of his defenders stopped to consider for a moment that, maybe, just maybe, he is not committed to the club and is happy to take us for a ride?
 
Nou_Camp99 said:
Him and Bruno were knocked out of the Euros one day apart weren't they? Why was he given extra time anyway? I believe that is a valid criticism of the club to allow that as Bruno has been back a few days now at training.

And going off last season's exploits it's Bruno who needed the extended break not a player who turns up when he feels like it. It's Bruno who carried us to almost winning something. It certainly wasn't Pogba.
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Wait didn’t I read this same shit yesterday? Didn’t get the desired attention? Keep trying, the third time will be a charm.
 
Bebestation said:
I dont mean to be rude but like if this guys goes doesn't sign another contract and plans to go on a free a second time at United- surely we cant let him feel comfortable as a human being anymore.

He is being extremely selfish. We are a a team followed by the biggest number of fans - we should be able to make a player feel intimidated.

A 90 million pound player who we bought but also helped grow in the first place is planning to leave us on a free. That is not right. Sign a contract and leave.
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I'm not massively pro-Pogba but some of the sentiments here are just wrong.
 
theklr said:
Just hope that if he does it wont be DDG/Sanchez kind of wages. But as I said before he does bring in alot of commercial revenue
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Thing is as well, regardless of what some fools will claim in here, he brings a lot more to the table than DDG (the current version) and shouldn’t be in the same sentence as that clown Sanchez.

We’ve made mistakes with contracts and we need to be more careful with them, I agree on that. Just pointing out that in football terms he’s revered as world class, he’s going to need parity with DDG to get this renewal done imo.
 
theklr said:
Just hope that if he does it wont be DDG/Sanchez kind of wages. But as I said before he does bring in alot of commercial revenue
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I think he and his agent are eyeing the Sanchez wages, in light of him allegedly turn down £350K per week. That deal was damaging in so many ways for us as it completely blew away any wage structure we had. It set a new and uncomfortable benchmark.

The fact PSG haven’t made a formal approach suggests that they’re concerned Pogba is pulling a “Ramos” of his own to get a better contract here. Same can be said I suppose of the laughable scouser links.
 
Random Task said:
Pogba is in a position where he can put to bed any suggestions questioning his commitment to the club by a) signing a new contract and/or b) releasing a statement confirming his desire to play for our club. Not at any point has he done either of those things.






What's stopping Pogba from following Kessie's example? Has any of his defenders stopped to consider for a moment that, maybe, just maybe, he is not committed to the club and is happy to take us for a ride?
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Has any of his detractors stopped to consider for a moment that maybe, just maybe he doesn’t feel loved by said “fans” who expect him to commit to them but can’t commit to him?
 
BlackBen said:
Has any of his detractors stopped to consider for a moment that maybe, just maybe he doesn’t feel loved by said “fans” who expect him to commit to them but can’t commit to him?
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Have you ever stopped to consider that he is a professional, and as such his relationship is with the club and not with the fans?

Few Real Madrid players seem to have a problem with their shitty, entitled fans so long as they are paid top dollar and are winning things. Pogba is no different.
 
BlackBen said:
Has any of his detractors stopped to consider for a moment that maybe, just maybe he doesn’t feel loved by said “fans” who expect him to commit to them but can’t commit to him?
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I genuinely can't tell if you're being serious or not :nervous:

In the case of the former: Pogba is a professional footballer who is paid vast sums of money to perform for United. The only opinion that matters to him is that of his manager, coaches, club associates and peers within the game. Sorry to break it to you, but the opinions of fans (you and I for example) are irrelevent. As it should be for any pro sportsman or women.
 
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