Paul Pogba / turned down United offer of 300k as “nothing”

Him and his agent are acting like they're bigger than the club. And they're doing it cause they can.
This circus needs to be solved. If he gets even bigger wages it opens up a can of worms. I mean it's obvious his hart isnt in it and hasnt been for a while. Just let him go. Of course there's a question of who'll buy him and for what money. Clustefuk of a situation. But giving him a pay rise is a bigger risk then letting him go imo.
 
Agreed. He's going to leave on a free transfer to madrid next summer as thats where he really wants to go. Madrid will sign Mbappe by next summer and it wouldnt suprise me if Mbappe asked for Pogba to be signed as a condition of his transfer. They have a good relationship on the pitch for France.

Speaking of Mbappe at least he had the decency to be honest with PSG and tell them he wasn't going to sign a new deal and that the club should sell him this summer so they get some money for him. Pogba wouldn't do that.

Every summer its the same circus with Pogba. Like others have posted on here, he should be given an ultimatum. Sign by date x or your getting sold. Refuse to go and you can rot in the reserves. But Ole and Utd are too weak to do that.
That's exactly how it should be. In general we don't sell players easily choosing to protect their value or whatever that means
 
Hardly ransom to be fair, didn't Rooney do something similar until the squad was strengthened?

Is that what he's doing? We can't say for sure one way or another because we don't know all the facts. The only thing we know is that his agent has been actively searching for a new club and that Pogba himself has refused to sign a new contract.

I'd like to believe he's "pulling a Rooney" because he wants to challenge for the biggest trophies. He could just be angling for an improved contract. Or he could simply want out of the club. Who knows?

Either way, the fanbase will get right behind him if he proves he's committed to the club by signing a new contract. Otherwise, he's in for a rough year.
 
This should appear in a tutorial "how to post a valid and unbiased opinion on a forum".

I agree with all the points, the media circus made our fans turn on him which is fecking sad.
It's a bit disrespectful for you to insinuate that our fans only turn on him because of some media circus. A lot of us are capable of making our own opinion about a player's input and attitude without needing the media to narrate a story.
 
All good points, and your perception is your own and therefore legitimate. I don't see an agenda from you, in other words; you seem thoughtful and measured. I also agree that most opinions are just that: opinions. In Pogba's case, however, it's become an agenda. Or rather, it began as an agenda by a few of our detractors and rivals and was then, over time, thoughtlessly adopted by so many more that it became an unexamined narrative, a kind of orthodoxy.

But also, here's the thing: I genuinely don't see the on-field issue(s) with Pogba. He might get caught dwelling on the ball a few times a season (who doesn't?), he might have a few defensive lapses, but overall, I love to watch him play, his grace and his movement, his athleticism, his technical brilliance, his defence-splitting passes, his work with the ball in tight spaces, all of it. For me, you don't discard a player of his kind of generational talent because you can't fit him into the system; you tweak the system to fit him in, find the players who will bring out the best of him.

You might think this simplistic, but he is literally the type of player I watch football for, so when a player like that plays for United, I'm doubly invested in him staying. I know this part isn't your angle, and I respect that, but I don't believe the media narrative at all. If he was as toxic as they say, his teammates wouldn't be so openly supportive of him. Within the game, he seems universally loved. I honestly do think we've been duped by a kind of snowballing narrative begun by our rivals and by hostile pundits with Liverpool ties, all of whom were terrified of our return to prominence when Pogba came back to us. The high cost of the transfer only gave them more grist for their mill, ammunition with which to ridicule and therefore undermine us and him. Over time, countless new voices have been added via media punditry and social media, but for me, the vast majority of those voices are simply repeating and amplifying a false narrative. It's been actually painful for me to see it all play out. We've been played. And Pogba if he goes will be going partly because we fans didn't rally around in sufficient numbers. Note: partly. It'll be one element of a complex situation, but any player will be affected by a sense that a significant number of his own club's fans are okay with seeing him go. I guess what I'm saying is I wish more of us had said from the start that we're not okay with seeing him go.
Good post.
 
It's a bit disrespectful for you to insinuate that our fans only turn on him because of some media circus. A lot of us are capable of making our own opinion about a player's input and attitude without needing the media to narrate a story.
This. Plus he doesnt say anything about Raiola's constant ramblings and offerings of his client to other clubs which started pretty early in his United career.
 
His defenders in this thread should be ashamed of themselves. Accusing posters they don't even know of having an agenda because they dare to question his commitment to the club. Laughable.
 
Can anyone imagine Jogba doing the gegenpress?

I'll always remember that game against Liverpool last season where he tracked Alexander-Arnold for 15 minutes before giving up.

His defenders in this thread should be ashamed of themselves. Accusing posters they don't even know of having an agenda because they dare to question his commitment to the club. Laughable.

It's a sign of their lack of ability to debate, there's a high correlation I've noticed between being a Pogba fan and using emotes as a form of argument.
 
It's a bit disrespectful for you to insinuate that our fans only turn on him because of some media circus. A lot of us are capable of making our own opinion about a player's input and attitude without needing the media to narrate a story.

It's the caf any opinion someone disagrees with is always an agenda. You know there's little to back up peoples arguments when they result to that.

Pogba has not shown this club any respect over the last few years and if he walks away costing us a transfer fee he'll be very much a villain. The fact he has some nice highlights every now and again doesn't change that.
 
I usually find those nicknames for footballers and clubs quite childish and embarrassing but I gotta say, 'Jogba' got a laugh out of me
 
If a player doesn't want to be here, then let him go. Real will take him for FREE next year anyway. We should be prepared for this and have somebody ready to take his place, or change pattern/style to suit our play without him.
 
All good points, and your perception is your own and therefore legitimate. I don't see an agenda from you, in other words; you seem thoughtful and measured. I also agree that most opinions are just that: opinions. In Pogba's case, however, it's become an agenda. Or rather, it began as an agenda by a few of our detractors and rivals and was then, over time, thoughtlessly adopted by so many more that it became an unexamined narrative, a kind of orthodoxy.

But also, here's the thing: I genuinely don't see the on-field issue(s) with Pogba. He might get caught dwelling on the ball a few times a season (who doesn't?), he might have a few defensive lapses, but overall, I love to watch him play, his grace and his movement, his athleticism, his technical brilliance, his defence-splitting passes, his work with the ball in tight spaces, all of it. For me, you don't discard a player of his kind of generational talent because you can't fit him into the system; you tweak the system to fit him in, find the players who will bring out the best of him.

You might think this simplistic, but he is literally the type of player I watch football for, so when a player like that plays for United, I'm doubly invested in him staying. I know this part isn't your angle, and I respect that, but I don't believe the media narrative at all. If he was as toxic as they say, his teammates wouldn't be so openly supportive of him. Within the game, he seems universally loved. I honestly do think we've been duped by a kind of snowballing narrative begun by our rivals and by hostile pundits with Liverpool ties, all of whom were terrified of our return to prominence when Pogba came back to us. The high cost of the transfer only gave them more grist for their mill, ammunition with which to ridicule and therefore undermine us and him. Over time, countless new voices have been added via media punditry and social media, but for me, the vast majority of those voices are simply repeating and amplifying a false narrative. It's been actually painful for me to see it all play out. We've been played. And Pogba if he goes will be going partly because we fans didn't rally around in sufficient numbers. Note: partly. It'll be one element of a complex situation, but any player will be affected by a sense that a significant number of his own club's fans are okay with seeing him go. I guess what I'm saying is I wish more of us had said from the start that we're not okay with seeing him go.
Fantastic post.

This narrative has been happening to a number of our players in particular to Lingard, Shaw, Martial and now it seems Rashford and even Greenwood at his tender age getting overly criticised by our own fans forums. Those pointing fingers at Pogba for what's said and done by Raiola he's been given the mandate to get him the best deal. He's not there to be liked by us fans or the club.
 
His defenders in this thread should be ashamed of themselves. Accusing posters they don't even know of having an agenda because they dare to question his commitment to the club. Laughable.

Not all of them. But yeah some of them really need to feck off with him when he leaves tbh. Embarrassing.
 
If true that he was open to going to City and now Liverpool why are the club even bothering to offer a new contract to an inconsistent performing player, who is only here for the money anyway? The club should be bigger than this, swallow their pride and sell him or failing a buyer let him go at the end of the season. We should only want players who are happy with the salary they have, want to perform and be here, not keep seeking a way out or a mega higher salary all the while.
 
But also, here's the thing: I genuinely don't see the on-field issue(s) with Pogba. He might get caught dwelling on the ball a few times a season (who doesn't?), he might have a few defensive lapses, but overall, I love to watch him play, his grace and his movement, his athleticism, his technical brilliance, his defence-splitting passes, his work with the ball in tight spaces, all of it. For me, you don't discard a player of his kind of generational talent because you can't fit him into the system; you tweak the system to fit him in, find the players who will bring out the best of him.

I agree that there is an agenda against him. First, he left, then he came back and "cost us" a giant fee, people are expecting ballon d'or type performances for 100 million, his agent is a cnut and that reflects poorly on him. All these things piss a lot of people off, but that doesn't change the fact that he:
  • Loses possession stupidly too often in CM
  • Is defensively shaky in CM
  • Is not productive enough in a more forward role
Which other top midfielder in the world has all 3 of these flaws?

Ole rightfully doesn't trust him in CM against proper teams. His best use for us would be against a parked bus and from the bench in all other games. He's not gonna accept that, he's not gonna take wages that reflect that and his agent will put up a massive stink.

For the star role that he wants to have, he just doesn't fit the EPL. He'll tear up L1 where he gets to play against 2 parked buses every game.

If you love to see him play, watch a youtube comp or watch him at his next club, if you want to win things then you acknowledge that he's a flawed player and move on.

For anyone that wants to keep Pogba at all costs, I have 2 questions:
  1. Are you looking forward to next season with Pogba LW, Rashford RW and Sancho + Greenwood on the bench in big games?
  2. Do you expect Ole to suddenly trust Pogba in midfield against pressing teams?
 
Fantastic post.

This narrative has been happening to a number of our players in particular to Lingard, Shaw, Martial and now it seems Rashford and even Greenwood at his tender age getting overly criticised by our own fans forums. Those pointing fingers at Pogba for what's said and done by Raiola he's been given the mandate to get him the best deal. He's not there to be liked by us fans or the club.
Raiola acts as a spokesperson for the player, and if he's given Raiola free reign to get him the best deal at whatever cost, including chronic disrespect to his employer, then that's a huge problem. And it's a problem that's not exactly the norm among top players.
 
Fantastic post.

This narrative has been happening to a number of our players in particular to Lingard, Shaw, Martial and now it seems Rashford and even Greenwood at his tender age getting overly criticised by our own fans forums. Those pointing fingers at Pogba for what's said and done by Raiola he's been given the mandate to get him the best deal. He's not there to be liked by us fans or the club.
Pogba employs Raiola. If he didnt agree with what Raiola said he could quite easily shut him up. Raiola has quite a few players on his books, but you dont hear him touting them for a move as much as he has done with Pogba.
 
If true that he was open to going to City and now Liverpool

It wasnt :lol:

But one thing that is often overlooked here, is that we can in theory offer Pogba higher value because of his immense commercial revenues for the club .

Thats probably not a way to run a football club, but in many cases it is a relevant argument for the club itself.
 
It wasnt :lol:

But one thing that is often overlooked here, is that we can in theory offer Pogba higher value because of his immense commercial revenues for the club .

Thats probably not a way to run a football club, but in many cases it is a relevant argument for the club itself.
It was with City. :lol: Pep said it himself.
 
It wasnt :lol:

But one thing that is often overlooked here, is that we can in theory offer Pogba higher value because of his immense commercial revenues for the club .

Thats probably not a way to run a football club, but in many cases it is a relevant argument for the club itself.

Oh God.

Is this the united version of the Messi "his commercial revenues pay for his salary we're paying" argument
 
Fantastic post.

This narrative has been happening to a number of our players in particular to Lingard, Shaw, Martial and now it seems Rashford and even Greenwood at his tender age getting overly criticised by our own fans forums. Those pointing fingers at Pogba for what's said and done by Raiola he's been given the mandate to get him the best deal. He's not there to be liked by us fans or the club.

Sorry, but I'm not seeing this fantastic post that everyone keeps rambling on about. It's well written, but that's where the plaudits end. The guy is blatantly accusing posters that dare question Pogba's commitment to the club of carrying an agenda. I mean, what?

It's an insulting post if anything.
 
Raiola acts as a spokesperson for the player, and if he's given Raiola free reign to get him the best deal at whatever cost, including chronic disrespect to his employer, then that's a huge problem. And it's a problem that's not exactly the norm among top players.
It's well known in the football fraternity how Raiola works. The fact is the clubs have a choice to decide if they are willing to work with Raiola or any of his clients.
 
Raiola tries to pull the wool over our eyes offering him to City first, now Liverpool. If Real wanted him badly enough they would have him by now.
As regards the Balon dor he will never win it. Sooner have a Roy Keane type on our side anytime.
 
I really don't subscribe to this theory. What from the past few trophyless years has led you to think we're more likely to succeed with him?

I actually think we're far more likely to win something without him, and to give our existing players more clearly defined roles - and ideally balance the side a bit more by bringing in a solid DM. That's football opinions though :D.

He has the ability, maybe, to win a cup - if you're lucky and he shows up a few games. I definitely don't think he has the consistency in him to win a league. Would you agree there ?
To your last question a single player doesnt win you a league, a strong squad does. My point clearly went over your head
 
Those pointing fingers at Pogba for what's said and done by Raiola he's been given the mandate to get him the best deal. He's not there to be liked by us fans or the club.

Maybe so, however there are plenty of agents out there managing to represent the best interests of their clients without completely disrespecting the clubs that their clients play for in the process.
 
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Sorry, but I'm not seeing this fantastic post that everyone keeps rambling on about. It's well written, but that's where the plaudits end. The guy is blatantly accusing posters that dare question Pogba's commitment to the club of carrying an agenda. I mean, what?

It's an insulting post if anything.
A number of posters think it's a wonderful post. If you have a different opinion or a problem and want to counter that it's your prerogative.
 
It's well known in the football fraternity how Raiola works. The fact is the clubs have a choice to decide if they are willing to work with Raiola or any of his clients.
In the context of this thread at least I am not as concerned about how Raiola works generally, I care more that Pogba has allowed him to be this uncensored. If he loved the club so much or was as invested in the project as we were led to believe, we wouldn't see Raiola speaking as much.

But it is evident as you put it, that Pogba has given Raiola the remit of getting him the best deal possible. That is not limited to our club either. So I judge our club 100% for bringing Pogba in the first place, and I also judge Pogba as a player wearing a United shirt and allowing his spokesperson to free reign.

Both are valid judgements in my opinion. It's really naïve to suggest Pogba is completely free because of the whole "I didn't say it! Don't look at me!" argument.
 
Sorry, but I'm not seeing this fantastic post that everyone keeps rambling on about. It's well written, but that's where the plaudits end. The guy is blatantly accusing posters that dare question Pogba's commitment to the club of carrying an agenda. I mean, what?

It's an insulting post if anything.

Pogba has been accused of feigning injuries, downing tools, being a negative presence in the dressing room, playing well so he could get a transfer, and countless posts over the years insulting him and calling him all kinds of names. Don't also forget his detractors believing every negative rumor about him.

Funny seeing anyone feeling hurt now because of a post calling some fans agenda-driven and easily manipulated by the media.
 
In the context of this thread at least I am not as concerned about how Raiola works generally, I care more that Pogba has allowed him to be this uncensored. If he loved the club so much or was as invested in the project as we were led to believe, we wouldn't see Raiola speaking as much.
Raiola hasn’t really said much about Pogba since November. In fact he was moaning about not being allowed to talk about Pogba a few weeks ago when he suggested his hypothetical Hazard Pogba swap. He’s definitely been gagged - whether that’s from our side telling him we won’t negotiate if he doesn’t shut up or Pogba’s side who knows.
 
Raiola hasn’t really said much about Pogba since November. In fact he was moaning about not being allowed to talk about Pogba a few weeks ago when he suggested his hypothetical Hazard Pogba swap. He’s definitely been gagged - whether that’s from our side telling him we won’t negotiate if he doesn’t shut up or Pogba’s side who knows.
It will be from Pogba he doesn’t care about what the club says
 
In the context of this thread at least I am not as concerned about how Raiola works generally, I care more that Pogba has allowed him to be this uncensored. If he loved the club so much or was as invested in the project as we were led to believe, we wouldn't see Raiola speaking as much.

But it is evident as you put it, that Pogba has given Raiola the remit of getting him the best deal possible. That is not limited to our club either. So I judge our club 100% for bringing Pogba in the first place, and I also judge Pogba as a player wearing a United shirt and allowing his spokesperson to free reign.

Both are valid judgements in my opinion. It's really naïve to suggest Pogba is completely free because of the whole "I didn't say it! Don't look at me!" argument.
Don't let most professionals fool us about their love of the clubs, badge kissing ad chest-thumping. Financial gains matter in most cases and Pogba is no different to the majority.

As a fan of the club, my only consideration is wanting the best players to be playing which gives us the best chance of winning. If that includes Pogba in the squad that's well and good.
 
Pogba has been accused of feigning injuries, downing tools, being a negative presence in the dressing room, playing well so he could get a transfer, and countless posts over the years insulting him and calling him all kinds of names. Don't also forget his detractors believing every negative rumour about him.

Funny seeing anyone feeling hurt now because of a post calling some fans agenda-driven and easily manipulated by the media.

Yeah, I'm not one of those, and I dare say the vast majority of posters on this forum aren't either. So, in future, feel free to single out those posters who have proven themselves to be carrying this agenda. You know, rather than generalise an entire fanbase who only want what's best for the club.
 
Yeah, I'm not one of those, and I dare say the vast majority of posters on this forum aren't either. So, in future, feel free to single out those posters who have proven themselves to be carrying this agenda. You know, rather than generalise an entire fanbase who only want what's best for the club.
I think its likely more posters than you believe
 
People are accusing Pogba now for not turning up for training. That's the level of hatred that post pointed out. From accusing him of feigning injury to creating bad atmosphere in dressing room ( which they have no clue of ) , questioning his mental state for the haircuts he has and to just flat out deny his performance for us, it does seem like we have gone past the point of "fair criticism".

He hasn't been great for us ( in terms of not fulfilling his potential) , this is something even I agree with. But he has been far from what some has been suggesting in this thread. I remember how Rio was public enemy number one when he refused contract extension. To suggest Pogba is the only player who might look for a better deal is laughable suggestion
 
In the context of this thread at least I am not as concerned about how Raiola works generally, I care more that Pogba has allowed him to be this uncensored. If he loved the club so much or was as invested in the project as we were led to believe, we wouldn't see Raiola speaking as much.

But it is evident as you put it, that Pogba has given Raiola the remit of getting him the best deal possible. That is not limited to our club either. So I judge our club 100% for bringing Pogba in the first place, and I also judge Pogba as a player wearing a United shirt and allowing his spokesperson to free reign.

Both are valid judgements in my opinion. It's really naïve to suggest Pogba is completely free because of the whole "I didn't say it! Don't look at me!" argument.
Changing subject but quite relevant to employment and the success of a particular business. Many companies have employees who are disliked but are very good at their jobs and bring success. Does Pogba give us a better team, and more chances of success despite the antics? That is what the coaches and the club owners will be evaluating.
 
People are accusing Pogba now for not turning up for training. That's the level of hatred that post pointed out. From accusing him of feigning injury to creating bad atmosphere in dressing room ( which they have no clue of ) , questioning his mental state for the haircuts he has and to just flat out deny his performance for us, it does seem like we have gone past the point of "fair criticism".

He hasn't been great for us ( in terms of not fulfilling his potential) , this is something even I agree with. But he has been far from what some has been suggesting in this thread. I remember how Rio was public enemy number one when he refused contract extension. To suggest Pogba is the only player who might look for a better deal is laughable suggestion
All this happens in every club. I remember Rooney getting roasted, and he is our leading goalscorer of all time. Fans will always pick on someone.
 
I would rather sell him than lose him on a free, but PSG might not stump up $$$ to meet our valuation.

I could see him staying and playing well and then it's 50-50 if he stays or not.
 
I dont mean to be rude but like if this guys goes doesn't sign another contract and plans to go on a free a second time at United- surely we cant let him feel comfortable as a human being anymore.

He is being extremely selfish. We are a a team followed by the biggest number of fans - we should be able to make a player feel intimidated.

A 90 million pound player who we bought but also helped grow in the first place is planning to leave us on a free. That is not right. Sign a contract and leave.
 
I would rather sell him than lose him on a free, but PSG might not stump up $$$ to meet our valuation.

I could see him staying and playing well and then it's 50-50 if he stays or not.
The club will get around the same amount as Varane if there is a buyer out there this summer.
 
I dont mean to be rude but like if this guys goes doesn't sign another contract and plans to go on a free a second time at United- surely we cant let him feel comfortable as a human being anymore.

He is being extremely selfish. We are a a team followed by the biggest number of fans - we should be able to make a player feel intimidated.

One of these things is not like the other