Paul Pogba racially abused on social media

amolbhatia50k said:
Not at all. I criticise Pogba when he deserves it. But it's clearly wrong when you do it for an agenda. And Neville, despite surprisingly eloquent and someone I do enjoy listening to, has always had his agendas. He has always A) defended dedended against criticism/calls of sacking regardless of rational and logic because time is everything apparently B) Favoured and molley codded British players while holding near grudges against foreign ones C) favoured your old school type players over the modern ones who are born out of the current/recent generations.

So sure Neville can "say what he likes". But when it's bullshit he'll get called out on it. And regardless of right and wrong, he is influencial. We cannot deny that.
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You might well be right about all of that, but I don’t see how any of that is related to the issue at hand though. Why were racists on the internet suddenly emboldened because of something Gary Neville said? When they held those views years before Gary was even a pundit, and they were posting them while the game was still being played?

Blaming him for any part in the whole fiasco is baffling in the least, and actually let’s those responsible off the hook a bit to be honest.
 
I feel there is a huge media agenda against Pogba. The media often call his performances lazy and half hearted and have even complained about his hair cuts. Beckham had many hairstyles but it was often considered as trendy. Paul Gascoine burped into microphones, told Norway to f off and couldn't even be bothered to stay in shape and was affectionately considered as "daft as a brush". If Pogba was white and playing for England he wouldn't get half of this negative media coverage. Pogba is arguably in the top ten of footballers but he's black and plays for france.
 
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sammsky1 said:
You guaranteed that 'I've never been racially abused' and challenged me to 'Try and walk in the shoes of a minority for just one day' because I'd 'crumble'.

I'm asking you again, what is your guarantee worth?
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He also called you an actual clown which implies you already walk in giant clown shoes. If I was you I'd be getting paranoid about my choice in footwear about now.
 
2 man midfield said:
You might well be right about all of that, but I don’t see how any of that is related to the issue at hand though. Why were racists on the internet suddenly emboldened because of something Gary Neville said? When they held those views years before Gary was even a pundit, and they were posting them while the game was still being played?

Blaming him for any part in the whole fiasco is baffling in the least, and actually let’s those responsible off the hook a bit to be honest.
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Whether that's true not, it's certainly how I felt reading the Neville stuff, and why I take issue.
 
This thread has gone well. I have a question though, is racist abuse on twitter a new thing? Twitter has been a cesspool of racism for a good while now. Why do you think the BBC is covering it more now?
 
Art Vandelay said:
He also called you an actual clown which implies you already walk in giant clown shoes. If I was you I'd be getting paranoid about my choice in footwear about now.
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Our friend @OL29 doesn't seem to understand that it's possible to belong to a 'minority group' and be abused and discriminated against for being so AND AT THE TIME dislike Pogba because he is often selfish, inconsistent, and not committed to the club, and also believe that Gary Neville doesn't have any racist inclinations whatsoever.

This entire conflation between racist tweets aimed at Pogba with Neville's post match Pogba criticism is totally false.
 
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Jimmy_Bond said:
I cannot believe people are blaming Gary Neville for Pogba being racially abused.

Simplistic nonsense. The reason why Pogba got racially abused is because the internet is full of faceless racist morons, not because Gary Neville criticised a player on Sky Sports.

This place is far more toxic than Gary Neville.
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This. Whatever racist scumbag posted the abuse was a racist scumbag before Neville made his comments.
 
It could be anyone, a fan of any club just being mischievous. When people have profiles online, it can happen. It could be a disgruntled United fan or someone wumming or just a racist. Who knows.
 
Anonymity is social media is only encouraging people to be cnuts for a giggle without consequences.

I can accept that there will be corners of the internet where there will be anonymity (chat servers, private forums etc.) but social media is too mainstream for that now. The way it is, it's like anyone knowing your phone number so they can send abuse to you. Even worse it's all public. And social media is also part a lot of peoples businesses now, can't exactly switch them off without financial harm.

There needs to be a concept of Main Stream Social Media (MSSM), under stricter regulation and for which accounts need to be named and verified. Unverified accounts not only lead to abuse, they also lead to a lot of bots which are used to influence opinion on things. LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Snapchat need to be regulated better.
 
Striker10 said:
It could be anyone, a fan of any club just being mischievous. When people have profiles online, it can happen. It could be a disgruntled United fan or someone wumming or just a racist. Who knows.
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This! Kind of... My money is on being able to trace back the majority of these to an offsite Real Madrid office.
 
MadMike said:
Anonymity is social media is only encouraging people to be cnuts for a giggle without consequences.

I can accept that there will be corners of the internet where there will be anonymity (chat servers, private forums etc.) but social media is too mainstream for that now. The way it is, it's like anyone knowing your phone number so they can send abuse to you. Even worse it's all public. And social media is also part a lot of peoples businesses now, can't exactly switch them off without financial harm.

There needs to be a concept of Main Stream Social Media, for which accounts need to be named and verified. Unverified accounts not only lead to abuse they also lead to a lot of bots which are used to influence opinion on things. LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Snapchat need to be regulated better.
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100% agreed. And I'm really surprised it hasn't happened since 2 or 3 years ago, especially after the BrExit/US Elections Facebook scandal.

Oddly, there doesn't seem to be any momentum behind such a legislation right now either.
 
Funny how I was actually thinking the exact same thing Maguire just proposed. Maybe a separate twitter for serious people and leave the existing one as it is for the people who need their anonymity for whatever reasons. Guarantee the former will eliminate vile trolls by 99%
 
Wasn't the entire point of social media is that you could find an outlet when it wasn't safe to speak up under your real identity? Stuff like whistleblowing, investigative journalism, etc. requires a degree of anonymity to be effective. This idea of attaching a real world ID of social media accounts is something authoritarians would really like.
 
MadMike said:
Anonymity is social media is only encouraging people to be cnuts for a giggle without consequences.

I can accept that there will be corners of the internet where there will be anonymity (chat servers, private forums etc.) but social media is too mainstream for that now. The way it is, it's like anyone knowing your phone number so they can send abuse to you. Even worse it's all public. And social media is also part a lot of peoples businesses now, can't exactly switch them off without financial harm.

There needs to be a concept of Main Stream Social Media (MSSM), under stricter regulation and for which accounts need to be named and verified. Unverified accounts not only lead to abuse, they also lead to a lot of bots which are used to influence opinion on things. LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Snapchat need to be regulated better.
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Whilst I sort of agree, it can be dangerous as anonymity has been a big driver of activism and speaking out against regimes across the world. Of course its also allowed some not very good things too.

Social media companies can always and easily filter racist content in my opinion it is not hard technical problem to solve. I don't think they want to solve it for their own selfish reasons.

In this sense I think the law needs to enforce companies to be responsible for the content they distribute more clearly
 
sammsky1 said:
100% agreed. And I'm really surprised it hasn't happened since 2 or 3 years ago, especially after the BrExit/US Elections Facebook scandal.

Oddly, there doesn't seem to be any momentum behind such a legislation right now either.
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Probably because the various politicians all think they can manipulate it for their own benefit. And the people who grasped the idea first and manipulated it for their electoral wins... they are currently in government. So they're unlikely to legislate against the means of their ascension.
 
Cassidy said:
Whilst I sort of agree, it can be dangerous as anonymity has been a big driver of activism and speaking out against regimes across the world. Of course its also allowed some not very good things too.

Social media companies can always and easily filter racist content in my opinion it is not hard technical problem to solve. I don't think they want to solve it for their own selfish reasons.

In this sense I think the law needs to enforce companies to be responsible for the content they distribute more clearly
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I disagree. It is an extremely hard thing to solve technically as its very complicated to gather context from a statement that can clearly tell apart malicious racism from stuff like irony, parody, educational, etc. The only thing they can do is very simplistic rules like you can't use racially charged words like "black" or "asian" etc. but that would be very wide ranging and a lot of innocent people will get caught up. For example a lot of history teachers got caught in the most recent wave of filtering because they happened to use nazi related words while teaching about WW2.
 
Would be interesting to see where in the world the majority of the racist twitter comments come from via ISP data. I will bet my life it's from a non anglo saxon country.
 
sammsky1 said:
Our friend @OL29 doesn't seem to understand that it's possible to belong to a 'minority group' and be abused and discriminated against for being so AND AT THE TIME dislike Pogba because he is often selfish, inconsistent, and not committed to the club, and also believe that Gary Neville doesn't have any racist inclinations whatsoever.

This entire conflation between racist tweets aimed at Pogba with Neville's post match Pogba criticism is totally false.
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I just posted a page ago. A guy in a pub I was just in came in saying Neville was right pogba and those people ie black people are disrespectful and should feck off. In real life someone just said that not behind twitter. So for sure it would have influenced a few who can hide behind a computer.

Luckily he got hit by the bartender. This is how it works people feel emboldened by the abusive language.
 
Cassidy said:
Whilst I sort of agree, it can be dangerous as anonymity has been a big driver of activism and speaking out against regimes across the world. Of course its also allowed some not very good things too.

Social media companies can always and easily filter racist content in my opinion it is not hard technical problem to solve. I don't think they want to solve it for their own selfish reasons.

In this sense I think the law needs to enforce companies to be responsible for the content they distribute more clearly
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Disagree. Muchly.

Activism against oppressive regimes is a bogus argument as such regimes can create complete internet blackouts anyway. I mean India cut off internet from Kashmir no problems and people outside of Pakistan/Kashmir don't even call them particularly oppressive. And local activism can be organised online outside of mainstream social media, that's what chat servers and forums are for. The fact they are not social media, doesn't seem to pose problems to 4chan/8chan muppets from organising for muppetry. Or Tumblr.

Also racist comments are not the only thing. You didn't counter the argument of bots influencing opinion. Of fake news being spread from fake accounts. Of graphic, violent content being uploaded from anonymous accounts that human moderators then have to sift through (because video image recognition is not that advanced yet) and the harm that causes. I could go on and on...

If you think all of those are simple to control by simply telling the companies to be "more responsible" then good luck.
 
MackRobinson said:
Who said Neville incited the racists? The point was what he said COULD have. His rant was unneeded vitriol that served no purpose.
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You either incite racial hatred or you don't. There's no maybe. At least not when you're just giving an opinion on a football match.
 
comlag said:
Would be interesting to see where in the world the majority of the racist twitter comments come from via ISP data. I will bet my life it's from a non anglo saxon country.
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Really? I wouldn't.
 
mancan92 said:
I just posted a page ago. A guy in a pub I was just in came in saying Neville was right pogba and those people ie black people are disrespectful and should feck off. In real life someone just said that not behind twitter. So for sure it would have influenced a few who can hide behind a computer.

Luckily he got hit by the bartender. This is how it works people feel emboldened by the abusive language.
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He was just a racist twat making a conflation.

Gary Neville is not the cause, reason or inspiration for racists against Pogba. Not having it.
 
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Disgusted to hear about this but sadly not surprised. The hate for Pogba has been growing for a while and the press and Neville also don't help by inciting anger amongst the gullible. Neville has always picked his targets and they're mostly the foreign lads. When his brother was on the Coaching staff under Moyes he defended them blindly but showed no mercy to Van Gaal. Neville was never a great player but some who never watched him play seem to think he was our RB version of Cafu.
 
Adnan said:
Disgusted to hear about this but sadly not surprised. The hate for Pogba has been growing for a while and the press and Neville also don't help by insighting anger amongst the gullible. Neville has always picked his targets and they're mostly the foreign lads. When his brother was on the Coaching staff under Moyes he defended them blindly but showed no mercy to Van Gaal. Neville was never a great player but some who never watched him play seem to think he was our RB version of Cafu.
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What??
 
mancan92 said:
So even though I've given an example in real life where someone actually cited neville as someone that supports his belief
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It's the choice of that somebody to conflate with Neville.

Not much Neville can do about that, except never ever criticise Pogba again, which he cant, as that's Neville's job, and Pogba is often crap.

I'm not sure why you cant understand that?
 
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Adnan said:
You're clutching at straws here lad..
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Im clutching at straws in laughing at you because you claimed that 'Neville was never a great player'. Hmm.

It's clear you're just a Pogba fanboy troll.
 
Red Dreams said:
he absolutely was a great player for Manchester United. And I have seen him and the other class of 92 come through and help lay the foundation for all our great title wins.
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He was never a great RB and he's even admitted that just last week by saying he was among 5 or 6 players that were expendable. Cafu was a 'great' RB and Neville doesn't even come close in comparison.
 
sammsky1 said:
It's the choice of that somebody to conflate with Neville. Not much Neville can do about that, except never ever criticise Pogba again, which he cant, as Pogba is often crap and that's Neville's job.

I'm not sure why you cant understand that?
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He can not be so overly aggressive about his dislike towards pogba he was talking like he was a criminal and its not the first time. In fact he's done it publicly many times not normal complaints but to the point that its clear he has a deep issue with him.
 
Adnan said:
He was never a great RB and he's even admitted that just last week by saying he was among 5 or 6 players that were expendable. Cafu was a 'great' RB and Neville doesn't even come close in comparison.
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Why are you bringing Cafu into this?

I only remember seeing Cafu in some world cup matches.

I have seen enough football in my life to know Gary Neville was among the best Right Backs to have ever worn our shirt.

Just leave it now.
 
mancan92 said:
He can not be so overly aggressive about his dislike towards pogba he was talking like he was a criminal and its not the first time. In fact he's done it publicly many times not normal complaints but to the point that its clear he has a deep issue with him.
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Probably similar to my deep issues with Pogba, shared by many other United fans.

Because he is not committed and openly flirts with Madrid, because he has not come close to justifying his record fee, because he seems selfish on the pitch, because he only turns it on when he can be arsed, because he constantly gives away possession, because he is so difficult to accommodate with his left side 3-man midfield nonsense, because he took a penalty and missed costing us 2 points .... should I go on?

Does that also make make me and all the others racist too?
 
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