Couldn't agree more...Some of you guys are absolute buffoonssuch an agenda it's unreal.
Every player get's tackled once in a while, that's football. Yes Pogba likes to take the ball when he's got people around him, 9/10 he usually holds them off and rolls passed them. On that occasion you've got to say it was a risky slide tackle but it paid off for the Wolves player.
There was about 10 seconds after that tackle for the team to recover the ball, everybody else failed also.
You have to have players that aren't scared of taking the ball under pressure, otherwise you end up with a bunch of backwards/sideways passing crabs like under LVG.
6
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Agreed. He was brilliant in the 2 man midfield again. Was a huge influence in the second half.
When Herrera came on, he should have been pushed into the 10 role. He would have been a huge threat on the break.
Him, Martial and the like are fecking Casual FC
Turn up when they, want whenever they want,
Turn up when they, want whenever they want,
Great second half again. When the shackles are off he is truly brilliant and runs the whole team.
Not sure what happened for the first goal. From his reaction I don't think its as simple as he just lost his man, but we'll probably never know.
Not sure what happened for the first goal. From his reaction I don't think its as simple as he just lost his man, but we'll probably never know.
In the build up to the first goal he did this spin, please tell me someone has a clip.
He can feck off the way he tried to have a go at Lindelöf after losing Rüdiger for the goal. It was pathetic and I'm honestly getting tired of his shit.
Reading between the lines @11101 I think he's telling Lindelöf to switch man at the very last second. Can't blame Lindelöf there though.
Pogba made up for it in the second half.
Yeah that’s what I saw too.
The first Chelsea goal was reminiscent of a ‘pick and roll’ play that’s used in basketball, where a big guy screens off two defenders and allows his teammate to get open.
The best way to defend that play in basketball is for the players to switch who they’re marking just as the big guy sets the screen.
Pogba is a big fan of basketball, so I’m sure he noticed it as it was happening, and tried to tell Lindelof. That’s probably why he reacted so angrily too.
Chelsea executed it well, but had we read the play it would’ve been easy to defend.
Brilliant second half today. Such a shame he doesn't do it for 90
Did you actually watch the game?Him, Martial and the like are fecking Casual FC
Turn up when they, want whenever they want,
No coincidence that the team only plays well when he does, he's the heart of this time. I don't know what we should do but if we can get him playing well for 90 minutes every week then we're more than capable of beating anyone. That being said I do think he's had a good start to the season, one of our best players barring a horror show or two. He's got so much quality.
Weirdly enough I think he's become more of a leader since he lost the armband, maybe freeing himself from the mental shackles helped somewhat, he's not always the most vocal but does tend to lead by example when he has the chance. Shit mistake for the goal but it happens.
Weirdly enough I think he's become more of a leader since he lost the armband, maybe freeing himself from the mental shackles helped somewhat, he's not always the most vocal but does tend to lead by example when he has the chance. Shit mistake for the goal but it happens.
Yes
That was a phenomenal performance from him after his mistake. Brilliant!
That's how you saw it ? I thought he was annoyed with himself.
My god he’s good when he’s on.
Very good performance, fell asleep on the corner of course but still a very good performance. On the whole has had a very good season, and showing his quality regardless of any off field shite going on.
Yup, think it he was even waving at Lindelöf there.
Bossed all the ball playing ‘inhos like little kids.
Negative tactics first half: Pogba - Bad performance
Positive tactics second half: Pogba - Commanding performance
Positive tactics second half: Pogba - Commanding performance
Lost Rudiger for their first goal despite his protestations towards Lindelof, but he was at the forefront of the second half performance along with Mata once we played more progressively, good performance overall.
When he plays well, we play well.
He had very good game except one moment of lapse. He can retain possession even when he 2-3 players are on him. He loses it now and then but most times he turns the situation to our advantage.
Pretty much
He costs us goals too often. No surprise when opposing teams target Pogba at a corner.
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This is such hyperbole. It was clearly a communication problem between him and Victor. But get off Pogbas back plz.
I (guess, because I dont know, but Mourinho usually has 2-3 players man marking) Victor and Pogba was two of three players that were picking up specific players for that corner.
While the rest where playing zone.
Perfectly normal.
Pogba actually ended up with Luiz screening him just before the corner was struck and he wanted Victor to switch to Rudiger. Its not so easy as to say that Pogba was going to mark Rudiger (which was probably the case to begin with) and we should blame him for everything.
You need to be flexible in these type of situations and its actually a good thing that Pogba and Lindelof had a discussion about this after. It was a good play by Chelsea and both of our players will learn from it.
It is also not so fecking easy to man mark on dead balls/or corners. You get screened for half a second and you are 5 meters behind your man. Communication is essential in this type of situations.
This happened in half a second and to call it pathetically by Pogba to discuss this with Victor afterwards is what is pathetic tbh.
EDIT
This is a good shot. And who knows, maybe it was Victor that was supposed to have Rudiger from the start? Do you really know?
DOUBLE EDIT
I also think that Pogba was quite frustrated with Douchie Dean who let this happen. Luiz was screening him in what was close to an NBA play.
Well played by Chelsea and again: get off Pogbas fecking back plz!
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It's the most basic thing to do and a thing that any players should have learn since they were kid, stay tight to your man during corner, and Pogba didn't do that before Rudiger even made his run. Even the Barkley goal, both him & Matic were just ball watching instead of marking Rudiger & Barkley, although I'm not trying to scapegoat him, I also think Sanchez should have close down Azpi.
But on the positive side Pogba did much better in 2nd half. He was one of the key player for our counter attack in 2nd half.
But on the positive side Pogba did much better in 2nd half. He was one of the key player for our counter attack in 2nd half.
That moment where he got out of a tight marking on the touchline was class. Was it in the build up for the 2nd goal? I think it was. He drove the team forward at every opportunity and Chelsea couldn't stop it.
If we want to be great, Pogba is our best chance. We don't have many if any players on his level at the club. He still frustrates the hell out of me though, as he just doesn't do it consistently. He was very good in the second half, but couldn't get involved in the first at all. The Chelsea midfield were in full control, and he couldn't get close to getting the ball of them in that first half. But when he is good, he is very good.
This is such hyperbole. It was clearly a communication problem between him and Victor. But get off Pogbas back plz.
I (guess, because I dont know, but Mourinho usually has 2-3 players man marking) Victor and Pogba was two of three players that were picking up specific players for that corner.
While the rest where playing zone.
Perfectly normal.
Pogba actually ended up with Luiz screening him just before the corner was struck and he wanted Victor to switch to Rudiger. Its not so easy as to say that Pogba was going to mark Rudiger (which was probably the case to begin with) and we should blame him for everything.
You need to be flexible in these type of situations and its actually a good thing that Pogba and Lindelof had a discussion about this after. It was a good play by Chelsea and both of our players will learn from it.
It is also not so fecking easy to man mark on dead balls/or corners. You get screened for half a second and you are 5 meters behind your man. Communication is essential in this type of situations.
This happened in half a second and to call it pathetically by Pogba to discuss this with Victor afterwards is what is pathetic tbh.
EDIT
This is a good shot. And who knows, maybe it was Victor that was supposed to have Rudiger from the start? Do you really know?
DOUBLE EDIT
I also think that Pogba was quite frustrated with Douchie Dean who let this happen. Luiz was screening him in what was close to an NBA play.
Well played by Chelsea and again: get off Pogbas fecking back plz!
If anything is a hyperbole it's this post. Pogba's lapse of concencration cost us the first goal which then set the tone, which makes the 'negative tactics - Pogba shit, positive tactics - Pogba good' even funnier. As @kundalini said before: he costs us goals too often. And today's game is in line with the criticism he's been getting for the last three seasons here: he's doing brilliant stuff just to make a schoolboy error that makes him look like an idiot. Problem is, it's the third season running of this shit, meaning he's learnt very little in that time if anything.
And no, I'm not deluded enough to think that Rüdiger was supposed to be picked up by Lindelöf on this particular corner, as contrary to every other set piece there was in this game. It was not a discussion either, it was Pogba throwing a hissy fit at Lindelöf. Not sure how you arrived at the conclusion about the 'usually 2-3 man marking' when even in this screenshot you've got 5 people man marking with Lukaku being on the front post. There was nothing NBA about the screenplay, Jesus, Luiz was hardly even active there, it was Pogba who let Rüdiger off there with a free header, nothing particulary special about Chelsea's routine nor anything to give them credit for. It was a good healer only because there was nobody near Rüdiger.
I'll be the first one to jump on Souness' back for constant criticism of Pogba, but with plays like this one or the one against Wolves, he's giving idiots like Souness bullets to fire and a reason for other people to question him. And with him being fine with Raiola running his whore mouth about our club, there'll always be question marks over his head as to whether he's really worth all the hassle.
Wasn't a lapse of concentration. There are 3 ways to defend a screen, go over it, go under it, switch with your man. He opts for the third and points to Lindelof to switch but Lindelof either doesn't hear him or doesn't pick up on what's happening and sticks to Luiz. Pogba stops expecting a switch but no switch happens. Breakdown in communication. The discussion with Lindelof is them lamenting the breakdown
Either you're a wum, or you're the worst poster on this forum.Him, Martial and the like are fecking Casual FC
Turn up when they, want whenever they want,
Yeah nah, it's still the lapse of concencration for me, this wasn't a quick corner, Pogba saw how they are set-up, their set pieces surely were analysed by us so unless one of them doesn't speak English (Pogba or Linde that is) I don't think this was a breakdown in communication. Every other corner he was chasing Rüdiger around after that but I presume I'll be told it's because he couldn't trust Lindelöf anymore.
Mourinho in the pre-match interview said that the emphasis in the trainings prior to this match was on the tactics due to international break anyway so I'm sure set pieces were done to death.
Where do I call you deluded? Or even your post being that. But this one might be closer to delusion tbf.
I was trying to make a valid tactical point here.
What we are seeing are us defending with 8 people, which is one or even two less than Mourinho usually does. Might be because we were one down here. So we stay with Mata and Young high outside the penalty area
We have Smalling, Pogba and Lindelof man marking. Smalling goes with his man and Victor and Pogba fecks up their communication and Rudiger gets free. Not good. They should communicate better.
Matic, Shaw, Rashford and Martial are playing zonal defense (Martial being dragged out because Chelsea moves out another player towards the corner). ITs not less of zonal defense because they follow their man in their zone. Duh)
Lukaku is the free player and is supposed to just go for the ball. But he is way too low and as much to blame (if that what is you want to do) as Pogba and Victor for what happens after.
Cred to Chelsea for noticing that we left two players outside the area. They got rid of another one by dragging Martial out which left way to much space in the area to begin with. Then Luiz and Rudiger outsmarted Victor and Pogba. Well played by them.
Its just to easy to blame Pogba for this and I dont get why you are being so aggressive?
I don't think you know what I mean. Football has recently started using screens on set pieces more and more ie where one attacking player obstructs the defender of another to set his teammate free from said defender. Very popular in basketball and other American sports and Sarri has been running this with Chelsea. The common counter to this is to have the screener's defender switch on to the freed up man. It's fairly common and fairly easy to execute but a breakdown in communication or poor awareness of one person can be disastrous. Rudiger even gave this very explanation of events after the match
No, I perfectly do understand what you mean, it's not a new tactic either. In case I wasn't clear enough: I'm pretty sure that thanks to our analysts our players were aware of their tactics during set pieces too so we'd have figured our ways how to counter it. That's why I don't think it was due to breakdown in communication, rather Pogba's lapse in concentration, he either forgot what might/will happen or just switched off for a second, neither of which would be surprising or Pogba-exclusive.
I'm not aggressive, by the looks of your post and all the 'pls leave pogba alone' you sound like you take it personally for some reason. Surely it's not you Paul, is it? You trying to blame Lukaku as much as Pogba for this one either makes me assume that you either have no idea what you are talking about or you're pro-Pogba agenda driven though so just let me leave it here.
Yeah, seems exactly what happened. They should have left it to the dressing room, but you cant aor should blame them to speak about the situation while its fresh. Im sure they will both learn from it.
Tbh anybody could see this was about to happen. Why would they put Luiz like that if he wasn’t about to screen? It was well executed but still it’s on Pogba. He should see and know that this is going to happen and prepare for it. Now he reacted very late.
Thing is you can clearly see him telling Lindelöf something when he sees Luiz coming, most likely to switch. Is it really easier to say he was arguing with Lindelof afterwards over nothing? They were discussing the miscommunication. Rudiger said as much in the interview and he was actually there when it happened
I tend to agree. They need much more focus and consistency. More so from Pogba. Martial I think has suffered from terrible man management.Him, Martial and the like are fecking Casual FC
Turn up when they, want whenever they want,
Pogba is just inherently easily distracted I think.
Ah, I so dont have a pro-Pogba agenda. I do have an agenda against simplifying things and blaming one particular player for a goal that obviously is a component of several individual "errors". Rashford is to far out from his zone as well. And Lukaku cant be behind the line there. He just cant.
In the end it was a good play and if you do concede so much space in the area on dead ball situations this can happen if just one split second of an opponents screen is successful.
But I made my point so I will leave this here as well.
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