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2016-17 Performances

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6.3 Season Average Rating
Appearances
51
Goals
9
Assists
6
Yellow cards
10
Status
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The analysis of Pogba from the 'experts' is so mediocre I don't bother paying attention to it.

I started reading a piece today, from the Telegraph I think, about how our season had turned around. In one paragraph the author said Zlatan had started scoring, in the next it said Pogba had started assisting. Totally missing the link between the two things e.g. had Zlatan not gone two months without converting his chances, Pogba would have loads more assists. Needless to say I stopped reading right there.

Its clear a lot of the pundits and press don't even watch our games. The fuss made about how Pogba played at Palace was justified, in its own way. The press were making out that it was his best game for United though. Apparently because he scored a goal and assisted! He did not do that in the Southampton home game but he literally ran the show all night. The media want me to believe Pogba was worse that night than at Palace? What about Leicester home etc?

Pogba hasn't suddenly 'clicked' into the United team. The main difference now is that before, like against Stoke at home, Pogba was doing cheeky flicks that put Zlatan through on goal and Zlatan was missing them. Now though Pogba is teeing Zlatan up and he's knocking them in. Pogba has been playing very, very well for at least three months. The column fillers at the papers, and the talking heads on the TV and radio, would have noticed this if they actually watched him. Rather than insisting that if he's not scoring/assisting regularly he's not worth £89 million. :rolleyes:
 
Infordin said:
The only area where he lacks (IMO) is his positioning when the opposing team is in possession. Otherwise he is a complete midfielder, what a player all around.

I would swap him for any Barcelona player apart from Messi, Neymar or Busquets.
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So you'd take any other Barca player over Pogba beside Messi, Neymar and Suarez :angel:
 
#07 said:
The analysis of Pogba from the 'experts' is so mediocre I don't bother paying attention to it.

I started reading a piece today, from the Telegraph I think, about how our season had turned around. In one paragraph the author said Zlatan had started scoring, in the next it said Pogba had started assisting. Totally missing the link between the two things e.g. had Zlatan not gone two months without converting his chances, Pogba would have loads more assists. Needless to say I stopped reading right there.

Its clear a lot of the pundits and press don't even watch our games. The fuss made about how Pogba played at Palace was justified, in its own way. The press were making out that it was his best game for United though. Apparently because he scored a goal and assisted! He did not do that in the Southampton home game but he literally ran the show all night. The media want me to believe Pogba was worse that night than at Palace? What about Leicester home etc?

Pogba hasn't suddenly 'clicked' into the United team. The main difference now is that before, like against Stoke at home, Pogba was doing cheeky flicks that put Zlatan through on goal and Zlatan was missing them. Now though Pogba is teeing Zlatan up and he's knocking them in. Pogba has been playing very, very well for at least three months. The column fillers at the papers, and the talking heads on the TV and radio, would have noticed this if they actually watched him. Rather than insisting that if he's not scoring/assisting regularly he's not worth £89 million. :rolleyes:
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Well said.
 
Santoryo said:
So you'd take any other Barca player over Pogba beside Messi, Neymar and Suarez :angel:
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What I meant is that I want him at Barcelona, :D and I'd have him there at the expense of just about any player apart from Messi, Neymar and Busquets (not Suarez)
 
Santoryo said:
Jesus Christ.

There is nothing anti English or whatever conspiracy you're trying to come up with. Are you serious right now with your "anti English" bit you just wrote?
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Santoryo said:
The obsession with midfielders and goals is something narrated often in England mostly because some just want to mask other deficiencies.

It's only here in this league where goals and stats is often used to rate midfield players when their skills on the ball doesn't get given much thought.

Lampard and what the PL want: score goals and stats friendly but okeish to mediocre ball skill(compared to your midfield maestros in Iniesta, Pirlo etc).
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Santoryo said:
And my point about English obsession with goals rather than skills stand. A player like Scholes possessing tremendous ball skills get shafted aside(to the left to be precise) in favor of stats men like Gerrard and Lampard.

It's only in England that they'd choose to shaft the player with the skills and pedigree to actually control games in midfield for your goalscoring type midfielder who lack the skills to control games properly.
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Santoryo said:
A Swedish coach with the English media behind his back, how do you think that'll work out?

If there is one thing to learn about the English media is that they have the ability to pressure foreign managers to do things the way they want to see.

You have previously ruthless coaches like LVG failing to displace Rooney mostly due to the media pressure and backlash that would have ensued. Even Mou had to be strategic about his shafting of Rooney.

Lampard and Gerrard being more of media darlings compared to Scholes would have been an almost impossible task to displace one without the media spiralling things out of control.

Again this shows the mentality I'm talking about.
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Santoryo said:
This persistence with goals you're on about is just serving to highlight my point. It's only in this league you see people being obsessed with goals from midfielders but everywhere else in the world people are just content with their midfielders being maestros and delivering pure art form with the ball, not goals and stats.

This is why someone like Glaston or dippers can come here and try to make argument about your Allis and Hendersons over Pogba using stats when in reality the gulf in quality is ridiculously large.
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All a bit long winded but I don't think I was out of line I suggesting there was an anti English flavour to your posts.

Nowhere have I said you have to score goals to be a top midfielder. You're misrepresenting my view again so at that point I'll leave it there.
 
JPRouve said:
Who said that he wasn't allowed to try to score? I mean, Rojo tries to score too but you are not going to judge him on that.
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Comparing the odd pot shot from Rojo to Pogba consistently getting into goalscoring positions? Come on you're a better poster than that.

It was yourself who said it isn't part of Pogba's role to get the goals we're missing. Unless I've misunderstood? That doesn't make sense does it given how often he shoots and gets into positions score. With more luck he would be in double figures now. Given all that it's clear Mourinho has asked him to get plenty of goals. It's also clear Pogba wants to score plenty. The desire is evident.
 
I love him, just thought I'd post that before going to sleep :D

Still can't believe he is back home. Can't wait for the weekend to watch him tear it up again. The excitement and swagger he brings is uplifting :devil:
 
Dobbs said:
Comparing the odd pot shot from Rojo to Pogba consistently getting into goalscoring positions? Come on you're a better poster than that.

It was yourself who said it isn't part of Pogba's role to get the goals we're missing. Unless I've misunderstood? That doesn't make sense does it given how often he shoots and gets into positions score. With more luck he would be in double figures now. Given all that it's clear Mourinho has asked him to get plenty of goals. It's also clear Pogba wants to score plenty. The desire is evident.
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I said he wasn't the problem not that he couldn't contribute, he is just not the first player I will look at. Especially when he scored 6 goals in all competitions which makes him our second best goalscorer. If you want to complain about a lack of goals besides Ibrahimovic look at the other attackers not one of our center midfielders.
 
JPRouve said:
I said he wasn't the problem not that he couldn't contribute, he is just not the first player I will look at. Especially when he scored 6 goals in all competitions which makes him our second best goalscorer. If you want to complain about a lack of goals besides Ibrahimovic look at the other attackers not one of our center midfielders.
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It didn't come across like that in your initial post, that one said the system is set up in such a way that Pogba isn't supposed to provide goals. However I agree with you, I haven't said anything different. I haven't complained about Pogba in this discussion.
 
But what does this donkey-cum-elephant actually do?

He may make the Spurs bench if he keeps improving. Not on the same level as Hendo, Xhaka or Alli though.

For £120 million he needs to end the season with minimum 30 goals and 15 assists. One can't argue he isn't a flop, or disappointment at best, if this does not happen.
 
Even when he is not having his best game, he always looks (to me) like the best player on the pitch.
He's been quality for so many games that it hasn't happened very often, but when I've rated him less than 7 (very very rare), I still think he just looks like the best player on the pitch just having an off day. Largely because technically he is so gifted and his game presence and time on the ball is so significant.

A lot of my mates are liverpool fans (a reflection of the times we grew up in), and they all comment about how signing pogba immediately changed their fear factor of united, and how he makes them very nervous of united becoming dominant again in the future.
He's the totem around which all good things will and should be built. I couldn't be happier with him.
 
23 year old midfielder in his first full year in the Premier League. Still adapting, still learning about opponents, the league, etc. He's going to get better. He has to learn how to control himself in the big games and influence those games when it's clear the opposition is restricting his normal influence.
 
I've read some utter drivel these last few pages; but one poster that has been spot on is @Santoryo

The English obsession with goal scoring midfielders is ridiculous, always has been. The treatment of Scholes by successive managers is the perfect example of this. A player the team should be built around, but eschewed in favour of Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard. Two highlight players, who scored lots of goals but lacked tactical sophistication and match control. Zinedine Zidane only scored 10 league goals once in his entire career. For Bordeaux. I imagine he is thinking he could have achieved so much more if he'd matched the goal output of Mark Noble.
 
He is an awesome player. When used right. He was not ready for a midefield 2 especially alongside Fellaini.

He is now looking the business and despite being further forwards his positional discipline and defensive work rate are much improved. Carrick and Herrera are great partners.

The goals will flow at some point but in the mean time he is bossing games.
 
simonhch said:
I've read some utter drivel these last few pages; but one poster that has been spot on is @Santoryo

The English obsession with goal scoring midfielders is ridiculous, always has been. The treatment of Scholes by successive managers is the perfect example of this. A player the team should be built around, but eschewed in favour of Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard. Two highlight players, who scored lots of goals but lacked tactical sophistication and match control. Zinedine Zidane only scored 10 league goals once in his entire career. For Bordeaux. I imagine he is thinking he could have achieved so much more if he'd matched the goal output of Mark Noble.
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Well said. There are many different roles in the team and Lampard/Gerrard were the best at what they did, but they did not hold midfields and teams together. Playing them in a midfield 2 was moronic.
 
simonhch said:
I've read some utter drivel these last few pages; but one poster that has been spot on is @Santoryo

The English obsession with goal scoring midfielders is ridiculous, always has been. The treatment of Scholes by successive managers is the perfect example of this. A player the team should be built around, but eschewed in favour of Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard. Two highlight players, who scored lots of goals but lacked tactical sophistication and match control. Zinedine Zidane only scored 10 league goals once in his entire career. For Bordeaux. I imagine he is thinking he could have achieved so much more if he'd matched the goal output of Mark Noble.
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That's why Blackburn Rover president turned down the chance to buy Zidane saying he was as good as Tim Sherwood!

http://www.blackburn.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=47576
 
Dobbs said:
Lampard was runner up for World Player of the Year as well wasn't he?

If Pogba scored 20 league goals this season I'm sure he'd be voted in the top three.

I think at some point he will. From set pieces alone you can see him getting five.
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Pogba comes very close to scoring each and every game. He either fluffs it or the post gets in his way. But he always gets himself into a position from where he can score. If he can consistently get into these positions, he'll eventually start scoring more. I expect him to get around 12 goals this season but build on it from next season. As far as free-kicks go, Zlatan needs to realise that Pogba is better at it and move aside. Even in the last game, Pogba pleaded with Zlatan to let him take the free-kick but Zlatan pulled rank.
 
#07 said:
The analysis of Pogba from the 'experts' is so mediocre I don't bother paying attention to it.

I started reading a piece today, from the Telegraph I think, about how our season had turned around. In one paragraph the author said Zlatan had started scoring, in the next it said Pogba had started assisting. Totally missing the link between the two things e.g. had Zlatan not gone two months without converting his chances, Pogba would have loads more assists. Needless to say I stopped reading right there.

Its clear a lot of the pundits and press don't even watch our games. The fuss made about how Pogba played at Palace was justified, in its own way. The press were making out that it was his best game for United though. Apparently because he scored a goal and assisted! He did not do that in the Southampton home game but he literally ran the show all night. The media want me to believe Pogba was worse that night than at Palace? What about Leicester home etc?

Pogba hasn't suddenly 'clicked' into the United team. The main difference now is that before, like against Stoke at home, Pogba was doing cheeky flicks that put Zlatan through on goal and Zlatan was missing them. Now though Pogba is teeing Zlatan up and he's knocking them in. Pogba has been playing very, very well for at least three months. The column fillers at the papers, and the talking heads on the TV and radio, would have noticed this if they actually watched him. Rather than insisting that if he's not scoring/assisting regularly he's not worth £89 million. :rolleyes:
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I sensed that media narrative simply from reading the Caf, I have only read 2 or 3 pieces about United all season and zero pieces that concern Pogba specifically, and those few I read were only to confirm my suspicion. Pogba has only started playing well after we switched to a midfield 3 has to be another one, I've seen that nonsense around here so much. The switch gave us more control and stability, but Pogba has been creating all season. Leave it to the media for alternate realities though, it's what they do best.
 
He's fecking brilliant! I dont care what others say or think but I wouldnt swap him for any other midfielder. He's still very young and if he keeps developing at this pace, my god!
 
simonhch said:
I've read some utter drivel these last few pages; but one poster that has been spot on is @Santoryo

The English obsession with goal scoring midfielders is ridiculous, always has been. The treatment of Scholes by successive managers is the perfect example of this. A player the team should be built around, but eschewed in favour of Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard. Two highlight players, who scored lots of goals but lacked tactical sophistication and match control. Zinedine Zidane only scored 10 league goals once in his entire career. For Bordeaux. I imagine he is thinking he could have achieved so much more if he'd matched the goal output of Mark Noble.
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Some post, spot on!
 
simonhch said:
I've read some utter drivel these last few pages; but one poster that has been spot on is @Santoryo

The English obsession with goal scoring midfielders is ridiculous, always has been. The treatment of Scholes by successive managers is the perfect example of this. A player the team should be built around, but eschewed in favour of Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard. Two highlight players, who scored lots of goals but lacked tactical sophistication and match control. Zinedine Zidane only scored 10 league goals once in his entire career. For Bordeaux. I imagine he is thinking he could have achieved so much more if he'd matched the goal output of Mark Noble.
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Who were the successive managers that treated Scholes poorly? Can you list them?
 
simonhch said:
I've read some utter drivel these last few pages; but one poster that has been spot on is @Santoryo

The English obsession with goal scoring midfielders is ridiculous, always has been. The treatment of Scholes by successive managers is the perfect example of this. A player the team should be built around, but eschewed in favour of Frank Lampard and Steven Gerrard. Two highlight players, who scored lots of goals but lacked tactical sophistication and match control. Zinedine Zidane only scored 10 league goals once in his entire career. For Bordeaux. I imagine he is thinking he could have achieved so much more if he'd matched the goal output of Mark Noble.
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Scholes scored at a similar rate to Gerrard for United so it's unlikely to be so simplistic.
 
Fridge chutney said:
But what does this donkey-cum-elephant actually do?

He may make the Spurs bench if he keeps improving. Not on the same level as Hendo, Xhaka or Alli though.

For £120 million he needs to end the season with minimum 30 goals and 15 assists. One can't argue he isn't a flop, or disappointment at best, if this does not happen.
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Are we even sure he is a football player? Not convinced just yet.
 
Awesome home grown gem who will get better and better. Really unique midfielder with bags of talent.

So glad he's back at the club he loves. He'll be here for a long time.
 
TheReligion said:
Awesome home grown gem who will get better and better. Really unique midfielder with bags of talent.

So glad he's back at the club he loves. He'll be here for a long time.
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If we return as a force I actually think he will stay with us for the duration of his career.
 
I've got to say that I don't think he was as good vs Sunderland as a lot of people are suggesting. There were way too many loose or underhit passes in the first half, and not from him trying difficult ones.

Which isn't to say he was "bad", I just don't think he was great.
 
George Beast said:


The replies to this tweet :wenger: Do these people genuinely believe he's been terrible?
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Just read this thread and you can see other club fans don't even watch him but post about him based on some stats.
 
George Beast said:


The replies to this tweet :wenger: Do these people genuinely believe he's been terrible?
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You shouldn't take most opposition fans seriously.Especially on the internet.A lot of them are simply blinded by hate.


I bet you if Pogba left United tomorrow, he'd become world class again in their eyes.

These are the same morons that berated Welbeck for years as a donkey when he played for us, then the second he left , they were universal in their praise for him and declared him the best thing since sliced bread.

They can keep their Henderson's and Ali's, I'm happy with Pogba. Once upon a time these same fans thought Le Tallec was better than Ronaldo.
 
Paul Pogba! :drool:

Feels like cheating, because you know he'll lead us back to the top within a couple of years.
 
Almost surreal that he plays for us. This is the sort of player you have a depressed cry wank over watching them playing for Real, Barca, Bayern and think "if only".
 
George Beast said:


The replies to this tweet :wenger: Do these people genuinely believe he's been terrible?
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It's just opposition fans who wanted Pogba at their club and thought they were getting him for the last three summers only for him to come back here so instead of admitting that he's a class player and has played well for United they bury their heads in the sand and just say he's been shit for the sake of it. It's not just football twitter, you would struggle to get any genuine praise from any of the oppo fans on here. Bitter people.
 
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