I may have been here for only one month but I've been watching United since the sixties. I've seen both good and very bad throughout those years. Never have I seen United fans not give a new manager some sort of chance to make the changes they want and the constant running down of Ole by Mourinho and Pochettino "fans" is, imo, disgusting. No one will know whether Ole is a good or bad Man United manager until he's been given a chance, nor would we know that about any other manager who may have been appointed. Unfortunately, a lot of that will depend on whether Ole (or even another manager) is backed by Ed/the board over the players. The manager must have full control over any player and if the player(s) doesn't like it then you get rid. It's time to stop this player power once and for all.
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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He’s tactically inept. Our squad isn’t up to standard but come on, you don’t go on a run like this as a United manager, it’s atrocious whatever way you look at it.
Eddie Howe!?
And what the feck has he done throughout his career that suggests he could ever make us succesful again? Things look horrendous right now but don't panic yet. If by the start of next season we are still in this same situation with the likes of Smalling Jones Lingard and other crap still starting games then by all means panic but until then we need to show some faith. Also remember that Ole is just like you, me and any other person on this forum a fan and someone who wants what is best for the club. If things keep going bad he will leave by mutual consent.
Eddie Howe!?
And what the feck has he done throughout his career that suggests he could ever make us succesful again? Things look horrendous right now but don't panic yet. If by the start of next season we are still in this same situation with the likes of Smalling Jones Lingard and other crap still starting games then by all means panic but until then we need to show some faith. Also remember that Ole is just like you, me and any other person on this forum a fan and someone who wants what is best for the club. If things keep going bad he will leave by mutual consent.
Howe is a superior manager to Solskjaer.
And has shown that he can play decent PL footy while not being relegated - he deserves the shot more than OGS does as a manager.
Obviously I don't think Howe is the best person for the job - that was essentially the point, but yeah.
Thought he set us out rather well again today. Every manager will make mistakes, but he's in an extremely tenuous situation. Our senior players aren't even performing at a level where he's comfortable bringing our younger players into the team.
Not sure what else he's supposed to do right now.
Huge summer incoming.
Great, not being relegated. That's an excellent case for the United job..
Yeah, the point is that Howe, for example, has done what Ole failed to do...
Ole was relegated while playing crap footy.
Howe plays decent footy and has not been relegated.
The point isn't that Howe should be given the job - the point is that even Howe would be, in my opinion, a better appointment.
Essentially we're gambling on who Solsjkaer signs in the summer. It's a huge gamble to make on someone so unproven at the top level.
I also feel like not having a DOF in place increases our risk too much, we let Van Gaal and Mourinho have a free reign over transfers and I think it hindered us more then anything, we now have a mishmash of players that don't really fit together.
What's also worrying me is that Oles talking about the same players coming in after the summer and having better fitness. If he thinks this group of players with more running will win anything, he's lost before he's even begun. We need quality in the summer.
I also feel like not having a DOF in place increases our risk too much, we let Van Gaal and Mourinho have a free reign over transfers and I think it hindered us more then anything, we now have a mishmash of players that don't really fit together.
What's also worrying me is that Oles talking about the same players coming in after the summer and having better fitness. If he thinks this group of players with more running will win anything, he's lost before he's even begun. We need quality in the summer.
That same exact thing applied for Moyes as well and look how that turned out. Fair enough you don't think he's the best person for the job but managers like that should never come anywhere near this club. At least one advantage Ole has is that he knows the club inside out. I'm all for hiring people who have won nothing but they must have shown that they can bring stability and for me it would have to be someone from a top 4 club. Poch would have been a good fit I think but that didn't happen so there's really no way out now for good or for the worse I'm afraid.
They're never going to sack Ole this early and rightfully so. He must be given time to try and put together his own team and I have to say I sure as feck hope he takes that opportunity and gets rid of some of the dross that's been burdening this club for so many years. To be quite frank if he fails to do this and we go into next season with the likes of Jones, Smalling, Young, Lingard etc featuring then he will lose me as well. This summer will be absolutely crucial and I can't really say my confidence is very high when it comes to Ole and transfers but I hope it goes well..
I was with yer right up until the Howe bit. If we can’t have Poch (which seems the case now) I’d be keen to give it to Nuno Santo.
Would love Santo here.
That's the type of gamble that would be worth taking in my opinion.
Absolutely mate, but unfortunately he’s never played for Utd so he’s got no fecking chance.
Its pretty clear that some player aren't really trying at all
My only concern is he's definitely not the offensive manager people kept asking for. As I said in other post, looks very defensive and pragmatic for me. He has put some formations and tactics that would have been described as bus parking under Mourinho. I thought that was just 1 or 2 games and not his style but starting to come to conclusion that he actually wants to set back and counter attack anyway. You don't put 5 defenders and 3 midfielders if you aren't planning to actually defend and counter.
Think of it as a more competitive pre season and a chance to get the lads confidence up heading into the first day of the season. I feel you lot sleep on the benefits of the Europa League. It is a good competition. Allows United the chance to give valuable game time to talented youth players as well as allowing the squad to really practice and refine offensive and defensive movements against teams who will give it their all.Europa League qualifiers
So its Mourinho all over again. Playing crap defensive football and publicly blaming the players for bad results.
We saw what the players are capable of when Ole first came in. They just got too comfortable again. We need some good old fashioned decimation at this point to kick the bastards into gear.
I fear the same.
That early surge we had might have been down to McKenna and Carrick's influence with the training sessions and so on.
More time under Ole and Phelan and we've perhaps played more to their tune now.
I don't want Phelan at the club in any role. SAF's United teams started playing much worse once Quieroz left and Phelan started leading the training sessions and was the main assistant manager.
We need to move on.
Was just checking stats.
Before he got appointed he managed 14 wins out of 19 games, 73% win percentage.
After he got appointed permanently , he managed only 2 wins out of 7, hilarious 28% win percentage.
The job is well and truly cursed. Maybe we should just hire interim manager after interim manager ?
Before he got appointed he managed 14 wins out of 19 games, 73% win percentage.
After he got appointed permanently , he managed only 2 wins out of 7, hilarious 28% win percentage.
The job is well and truly cursed. Maybe we should just hire interim manager after interim manager ?
Bingo. At least somebody else can see what's actually happening here.
This is very worrying. We've lost, what, 7 in 9 now? I know we have to be patient but this is an alarming run and hopefully not a sign of what's to come next season.
The early games were probably just the players wanting to prove Mourinho was wrong. Now that the honeymoon period is over everything is back to the routine, players back to being shite and Ole's style is getting more exposed. Though I think most of blame is on the spineless players, every thing points to Ole being another defensive counter attacking manager.
He shouldnt complain much, putting on side him picking certain players in first XI, he said himself that after 6 games, he basically traded performances for results.
Potentially, but there were reports of Ole letting Carrick/McKenna give him some input for the first few games. Obviously the players were fired up after Jose left, but there was some undeniable 'structure' to our play at the very least.
We looked better coached.
Total nonsense.
Came out and took the game to Barca. Had City on the back foot today but yet again our finishing and DDG let us down.
And OGS talking about assessing player attitudes and that affecting who will be in his plans next season is nowhere near Mourinho and his antics.
We’re in a state but in with a shout of top four thanks to Ole and his optimism.
Did we watch the same game today?
We took the game to Barcelona? We had zero shots on target vs them.
The standards in here have dropped massively.
They might have had a role yeah.
Anywa now it's 100% Ole's style as we are 5 months in his reign, more than enough time to show they way of football you play regularly and the signs aren't good tactically wise. Yeah the players are shite but you don't go 5 defenders, 3 midfielders and 2 forwards only if you aren't planning to defend and he has used this formation several times not just today. Excuses of fitness and so don't work for me.
Obviously the blame is more on the players at this point but it's also obvious his intent in big games is to set and counter. We also defended for our lives at home against small teams. Nothing indicating he's an offensive manager if that was what people wanted.
I think it's fair to have question marks right now. 5 months in, and we're seeing no real attacking style other than 'be quick' in attack. We have to give Ole next season but I don't blame anyone for being worried. Were just hoping he has great ideas and they click next year. Right now I'm not seeing an identity forming. At least not a good one.
The question that's never been answered by the club (via media or leaks etc) is why did we change the plan?
For the first time since SAF left, i thought the club actually made a sound decision after removing a manager. We said, "it's not working, will get an interim manager for the rest of the season, and use that time and the offseason to conduct a thorough search".
Ole was a good choice as interim because of many dynamics and honestly who was available? However why did a sensible approach turn into either fan appeasement or boot room appointment of our manager?
Why did we go all in for no reason? We went from sensible planning to winging it based off a good run after a crap season? WTF is that?
Ole could be the right choice. However, why did we make that choice after a handful of "dead-cat bounce" games? Ole's had to go from just steadying a ship to making club-defining choices in a matter of weeks because we beat a choking PSG? You don't set up a manager like that for success.
For the first time since SAF left, i thought the club actually made a sound decision after removing a manager. We said, "it's not working, will get an interim manager for the rest of the season, and use that time and the offseason to conduct a thorough search".
Ole was a good choice as interim because of many dynamics and honestly who was available? However why did a sensible approach turn into either fan appeasement or boot room appointment of our manager?
Why did we go all in for no reason? We went from sensible planning to winging it based off a good run after a crap season? WTF is that?
Ole could be the right choice. However, why did we make that choice after a handful of "dead-cat bounce" games? Ole's had to go from just steadying a ship to making club-defining choices in a matter of weeks because we beat a choking PSG? You don't set up a manager like that for success.
Yes. Same as City in the first half today, Barca looked shaky and were making uncharacteristic errors due to our pressing before Ashley Young gifted them the first goal.
The number of chances we’ve wasted and individual errors which have led directly to opposition goals the past few weeks has been too much for any team to overcome, especially when it’s our supposed world class keeper making the majority of them.
Or alternatively, he’s now finally implementing his ideas and he’s naturally defensive and not really want we want.
The team is tumescent, there’s no questioning that, but I have no reason to think such an inexperienced manager will ever be good enough for us.
I don't think he wants to sit back and play defensively all game. I just think he may not be tactically capable of sustaining possession against certain teams. These days even the Evertons, Bournemouths and Wolves play technical stuff on the ball. The stuff Lampard had Derby playing when we went there was also very progressive. Running 20% faster and trying 20% harder is no longer a tactical philosophy
People are overreacting. Theres plenty to be positive about with Ole, and it's looking very likely that we'll have big changes this summer which is a good sign. No manager can come in and get us competing for the title right away, there will be bad runs of form but we want to see long term improvement and direction once he has time to shape the squad. The squad is currently a mess and we need a massive turnover. We'll see how it goes, but I personally cant wait and am far more excited for next season compared to this season. If we get top 4, all the better for it, but it was always a long shot given where we were when he took over so it's not the end of the world if we dont.
He, like any manager that wouldve taken over last December, had pretty much a free go of it for this half season, and only next season can be fairly judged. Weve seen 2 extremes this season, on the whole a pretty decent output still. We'll see if we can make something out of the season in the last 3 games, but we need to get behind him for a reasonable amount of time, not everyone flip out because of 1 bad month.
He, like any manager that wouldve taken over last December, had pretty much a free go of it for this half season, and only next season can be fairly judged. Weve seen 2 extremes this season, on the whole a pretty decent output still. We'll see if we can make something out of the season in the last 3 games, but we need to get behind him for a reasonable amount of time, not everyone flip out because of 1 bad month.
Stop obsessing over experience. It's not that important as we know all too well.
Eh? Because Jose didn’t work out? It bloody helps and is a bit of a bonus to have, denying that is bizarre.
The lengths people will go to try and make out people are worried for no reason.
What I hope does ensure other than coaching the team well and buying well is being ruthless with his decisions. I really hope he's not soft and willing to give players who should and can be replaced, another chance unless he's absolutely sold on them being very gifted.
Becuase were in that strange position where we have a number of players who are decent to good. And keeping most of them will leave us with a team that remains decent to good. I'm not sure he can have the coaching impact that somebody like Klopp did of improving players hugely. So he has to ensure he has the quality to make up the ground
Becuase were in that strange position where we have a number of players who are decent to good. And keeping most of them will leave us with a team that remains decent to good. I'm not sure he can have the coaching impact that somebody like Klopp did of improving players hugely. So he has to ensure he has the quality to make up the ground
Tbh I wouldn't have hired Ole in the first place, but I don't think you can sack him before even giving him any chance to shape the squad himself. It would show a total lack of forward thinking at all if we sack him before the summer, and would really worry you over what direction we're going if that doesn't already worry you anyway.
The real thing that's changed is you can lose games, and our recent record is dreadful, but in the early weeks we looked full of creativity, now there is zero creativity in these games, and that's why we're not scoring goals, because we are a lot of the time creating absolutely zero, especially vs better teams where we simply seemed to have no idea. The one exception on paper for that was PSG, but even then they gifted us 3 goals, outside of that we didn't really look like scoring there either.
This is a huge job now, and it's going to take more than 1 window to get us anywhere near where we want to be. Our squad is probably about on par with the Liverpool squad that Klopp inherited, and it took him like 2 years to get them anywhere near where he wanted to be, and they still haven't actually converted that into anything yet. Man Utd will have more money than Liverpool, but at same time does anyone really trust us to use it well, we have have wasted a frightening amount of money, we're not even heading in the right direction yet, and it's anyone's guess at this point if Ole really is good enough.
The real thing that's changed is you can lose games, and our recent record is dreadful, but in the early weeks we looked full of creativity, now there is zero creativity in these games, and that's why we're not scoring goals, because we are a lot of the time creating absolutely zero, especially vs better teams where we simply seemed to have no idea. The one exception on paper for that was PSG, but even then they gifted us 3 goals, outside of that we didn't really look like scoring there either.
This is a huge job now, and it's going to take more than 1 window to get us anywhere near where we want to be. Our squad is probably about on par with the Liverpool squad that Klopp inherited, and it took him like 2 years to get them anywhere near where he wanted to be, and they still haven't actually converted that into anything yet. Man Utd will have more money than Liverpool, but at same time does anyone really trust us to use it well, we have have wasted a frightening amount of money, we're not even heading in the right direction yet, and it's anyone's guess at this point if Ole really is good enough.
Who do you want to take over? Pochettino? He doesn't even want to leave Spurs anyway so that's a non-starter. Someone like Mourinho or Van Gaal? Bags of experience, champions league titles, league titles, managers who will go down in history yet managers who were absolutely the wrong choices for this club. There are 2 outstanding managers right now with Pep and Klopp, after them? Nobody who we would want is hugely experienced. So complaining about needing experience is pointless. Freaking out over a fear that you don't know if it will or won't happen is pointless. There are legitimate fears, I'm not saying that, but people need to put some fecking faith in Ole given that he now has the job and will have it next season, and will have time to make some changes.
People are overreacting and freaking out and getting all depressed when Ole hasn't even had a summer to do any real moves. Look at our defensive options. It's literally worse man for man than the defense that Leicester can put out, worse than Wolves' back 4, worse than Everton's, worse than Watfords. We have a more unbalanced side then literally half of the league. We have some quality players of course, but it's just horrifically balanced. A midtable back 4, a midtable midfield + Pogba, and then a promising attack. That's our team right now. Some quality players that don't suit the side, a squad put together by multiple managers with different styles and preferences, and one that has a fragile mentality. So what exactly do people expect? Do people think we'll be consistent? Literally impossible with our squad.
Mourinho will go down in history with everything he's won over the years, yet after 2 full seasons, the squad collapsed and he wanted to do a massive turnover. The problem with that was that he was a big reason for it being a problem in the first place, so that's why he had to go. Just because he got sacked, that never meant that big changes didn't have to happen anymore.
People were almost unanimously ready to hand him the keys after ten games, and many are now ready to get rid of him after another ten. Can anyone seriously say that we've seen enough to have been correct about one assessment or the other? Doesn't anyone remember that SAF, widely regarded as the best manager of all time, floundered for six years and was nearly sacked? Sure, the circumstances are different, but not that different after all. Sometimes a football club's culture can be so rotten that it takes years of work to sort out. If we keep rifling through managers like this, it'll never be sorted out.
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